1 INFO-VAX	Thu, 16 Nov 2000	Volume 2000 : Issue 640       Contents: RE: COBOL F$EDIT Directory output by Size???  Re: Directory output by Size???  Re: Directory output by Size???  Re: Directory output by Size???  Re: Directory output by Size???  Re: educational licenses5 Forcasting the Tropical Year - the Laskar expression? 5 Re: FREE OpenVMS Windows NT intergration book *NOT*!!  Re: Good BYTE article on VMS Re: Good BYTE article on VMS Re: Good BYTE article on VMS Help! How to setup SYS$PRINT. & Re: How can I watch RealPlayer movies? Re: How to Obtain VMS 6.2-1H3  Re: how to sign off?) Re: Looking for RJ45-to-ThinWire adapter. ) Re: Looking for RJ45-to-ThinWire adapter. ) Re: Looking for RJ45-to-ThinWire adapter. ) Re: Looking for RJ45-to-ThinWire adapter. ) Re: Looking for RJ45-to-ThinWire adapter. ) Re: Looking for RJ45-to-ThinWire adapter. ) Re: Looking for RJ45-to-ThinWire adapter. ) Re: Looking for RJ45-to-ThinWire adapter.  Re: Malloc + debug question $ NETSCAPE V6 is out (but not for VMS)( Re: NETSCAPE V6 is out (but not for VMS)* Re: No doubts here (Was: Re: Galaxy doubt)+ Re: open VMS backdrop for motif or xwindows + Re: open VMS backdrop for motif or xwindows . Re: OpenVMS website GALCULTATOR link is broken' Pascal calling convention from C++ code  Re: Printing blank page ; Re: RMS way to get long sequential records in multiple $GET ; Re: RMS way to get long sequential records in multiple $GET 
 SAMBA and VMS  Re: SAMBA and VMS  Re: SAMBA and VMS  Re: SAMBA and VMS  Re: SAMBA and VMS . Re: Severity of eBay's ecache problem detailed. Re: Severity of eBay's ecache problem detailed SHOW PROC (Peak virtual size) ! Re: SHOW PROC (Peak virtual size) ! Re: SHOW PROC (Peak virtual size)   Still looking for JNET software. Re: Sun "uptime" belly laugher RE: Technology of US Elections Re: Technology of US Elections Re: Technology of US elections Re: Technology of US Elections Re: Technology of US Elections Re: Technology of US Elections Re: Technology of US Elections Re: Technology of US Elections Re: Technology of US Elections4 Re: Technology of US elections x Brazilian elections Thanks: Re: Two Phase Commit (2PC) on VMS - the nature of the fuss Using PIPE for UCX% [Fwd: RE: Technology of US elections]   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 13:46:37 -0800 / From: Terry Marosites <TMarosites@unitedad.com>  Subject: RE: COBOL F$EDIT M Message-ID: <1137A4A23A51D311B2D600105A1D5213026FDFE6@seantexch.unitedad.com>   
 Thanks all ,    H The purpose of my endeavor to use f$edit from Cobol was to do a trim and> compress. With the help of John Nogueira and Hein VandenheuvelJ I was able to get just what I needed using the DBASIC$EDIT. I noticed thatJ there are no DBASIC$ or bas$ in the help under RTL. Is there a list of all: the run times routines in help other than the RTL section.   Thanks Again Terry      ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 13:07:55 -0600 ( From: "Bill Ames" <billames@accunet.net>$ Subject: Directory output by Size???/ Message-ID: <t15n882vpjf88a@corp.supernews.com>    Directory output by Size???   H I'm looking for a way to scan directories on a drive with a criteria for size.   G I tried using the SIZE= command with DIR, but alas another no go!  Does K anyone out there have a simple solution or small routine that will do this.   2 I'm trying to find large files on specific drives.   Thanks Bill   ------------------------------   Date: 15 Nov 2000 19:11:37 GMTF From: lederman@star.enet.dec.DISABLE-JUNK-EMAIL.com (Bart Z. Lederman)( Subject: Re: Directory output by Size???* Message-ID: <8uun59$qor@usenet.pa.dec.com>  Z In article <t15n882vpjf88a@corp.supernews.com>, "Bill Ames" <billames@accunet.net> writes: >  >Directory output by Size??? > I >I'm looking for a way to scan directories on a drive with a criteria for  >size. > H >I tried using the SIZE= command with DIR, but alas another no go!  DoesL >anyone out there have a simple solution or small routine that will do this.  A Could you be a little more specific about "no go"?  Just what did > you expect to happen, and what actually happend?  And it would; probably help if you would show us the command you entered.   3 >I'm trying to find large files on specific drives.   * $ dir /sel = size = min = 1000 dkb0:[*...]  C finds all of the files with a minimum size of 1000 blocks on device F dkb0: whenever I try it.  (This assumes you have the proper privileges0 to access all of the directories on the device.)  ? It's also possible to perform an ANALYZE /DISK_STRUCTURE /USAGE < command and then read through the output file, but DIRECTORY% is usually sufficient for most needs.    --  (  B. Z. Lederman   Personal Opinions Only  8  Posting to a News group does NOT give anyone permission8  to send me advertising by E-mail or put me on a mailing  list of any kind.  5  Please remove the "DISABLE-JUNK-EMAIL" if you have a 5  legitimate reason to E-mail a response to this post.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 14:31:52 -0500 & From: Ken Robinson <ksrobin@erenj.com>( Subject: Re: Directory output by Size???7 Message-ID: <5.0.0.25.2.20001115142917.01d444c0@clmail>   . At 01:07 PM 11/15/2000 -0600, Bill Ames wrote: >Directory output by Size??? > I >I'm looking for a way to scan directories on a drive with a criteria for  >size. > H >I tried using the SIZE= command with DIR, but alas another no go!  DoesL >anyone out there have a simple solution or small routine that will do this. > 3 >I'm trying to find large files on specific drives.   L Did you try "$ dir/sel=size=min=<some number>/siz..." where "<some number>" 3 is the smallest size in blocks that you care about.   H For example, to show all files greater or equal to 1000 blocks, use the  following command:   $ dir/sel=siz=min=1000   Ken Robinson ksrobin@erenj.com    ------------------------------   Date: 15 Nov 2000 19:28:13 GMT3 From: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann) ( Subject: Re: Directory output by Size???0 Message-ID: <8uuo4d$mgt$1@n.ruf.uni-freiburg.de>  Z In article <t15n882vpjf88a@corp.supernews.com>, "Bill Ames" <billames@accunet.net> writes: >Directory output by Size??? > I >I'm looking for a way to scan directories on a drive with a criteria for  >size. > H >I tried using the SIZE= command with DIR, but alas another no go!  DoesL >anyone out there have a simple solution or small routine that will do this. > 3 >I'm trying to find large files on specific drives.   %    DIR/SIZE/SELECT=(SIZE=(MIN=10000))  or something similar   Regards,    Christoph Gartmann   H -- --------------------------------------------------------------------+H | Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452 |H | Immunbiologie                                                        |H | Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de     |H | D-79011  Freiburg, FRG                                               |H +--------- http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/english/menue.html ---------+   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 17:11:11 -0500 - From: Dave O'Brien <obrien@mail.amergent.com> ( Subject: Re: Directory output by Size???A Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20001115170846.00bab220@mail.amergent.com>   / At 02:31 PM 11/15/00 -0500, Ken Robinson wrote: / >At 01:07 PM 11/15/2000 -0600, Bill Ames wrote:  >>Directory output by Size???  >>J >>I'm looking for a way to scan directories on a drive with a criteria for >>size.  >>I >>I tried using the SIZE= command with DIR, but alas another no go!  Does M >>anyone out there have a simple solution or small routine that will do this.  >>4 >>I'm trying to find large files on specific drives. > D >Did you try "$ dir/sel=size=min=<some number>/siz..." where "<some = >number>" is the smallest size in blocks that you care about.  > I >For example, to show all files greater or equal to 1000 blocks, use the   >following command:  >  >$ dir/sel=siz=min=1000   H I like to add /size=all to that command so that it will also show files N that have more than 1000 blocks allocated, even if they don't show up as used.   Dave    @ ----------------------------------------------------------------4 Dave O'Brien                     Phone: 978-531-18004 Director, Information Technology Fax:   978-531-4451@ Amergent                         Email: obrien@mail.amergent.com9 9 Centennial Drive               http://www.amergent.com/  Peabody, MA  01960@ ----------------------------------------------------------------   ------------------------------   Date: 15 Nov 2000 20:14:42 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)! Subject: Re: educational licenses 6 Message-ID: <8uuqri$ea1$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  [ In article <8urhbh$3bm$2@info.service.rug.nl>, helbig@astro.rug.nl (Phillip Helbig) writes:   J   re: Discussion of the release of free single-user OpenVMS license vs theL       (desired) release of free multi-user OpenVMS licenses -- licenses for        use at educational sites.   J :However, I noticed that there was less than the normal input from Compaq  :employees in this thread.    H   This is quite clearly a discussion of business practices and policies,J   and is an area where I may not be able to (for various reasons) provide    cogent content contributions.   L   If you have complaints or suggestions or kudos about the free educational K   license program -- once the program is operational and fully underway --  J   then I can pass the feedback along to the OpenVMS management folks that L   are directly involved with the educational licensing program and with the     associated business decisions.  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 03:28:40 GMT & From: Jerome Fine <jhfine@idirect.com>> Subject: Forcasting the Tropical Year - the Laskar expression?* Message-ID: <3A135461.FCE5CCA@idirect.com>  > Considering the case sensitivity posts over the last few days,7 these news groups seems like a reasonable place to pose > a question about the use of the Laskar (1986) expression which+ http://astro.nmsu.edu/~lhuber/leaphist.html 6 http://www.treasure-troves.com/astro/TropicalYear.html9 provides an estimate of how the Tropical Year will change ; in the future.  In addition, the relatively new use of Leap 4 http://www.treasure-troves.com/astro/LeapSecond.html: Seconds starting about 27 years ago may also have a strongA influence in the future on the essential results of this inquiry.   : More specifically, I am requesting help on evaluating just< how the decrease in the Tropical Year from its current value4 of 365.242190 days or 365 days, 5 hours, 48 minutes,8 45.2 seconds will affect the number of leap years needed8 in the future.  In addition, the use of Leap Seconds may< also have a significant effect in future years in respect to7 how many leap years are omitted form the current Common  Era (Gregorian) calendar.   < Now, a quick simple calculation using the present difference6 of 11 minutes and 14.8 seconds per year over 400 years8 shows that 3.124 days are extra leap years in the Julian< calendar and the even with the Gregorian modification, there: are still 0.124 extra days for each 400 years or 0.62 days in 2000 years.  @ Consequently,  there will probably be insufficient drift between7 the present Common Era calendar and the actual Tropical ; Year to require any additional leap years (beyond the 3 per 9 400 years that the Gregory modification stipulates) to be : omitted for about 2000 years until 4000 C.E., so we shouldC all realize that the whole topic is not going to have an overriding   impact on our present situation.  7 Do you know of anyone who has done an actual evaluation B of the leap year situation in the future?  My initial calculations; using the Laskar expression suggest that both 4000 C.E. and = 6000 C.E. should not be leap years, but thereafter, I can see = where I have made some errors which may be quite substantial.   > Plus, it really seems unlikely that the Laskar expression will> be accurate for such a long time into the future.  If it does,9 a very rough calculation indicates that the Tropical Year 9 will reach a minimum value in about 8,900 years and start 4 to increase thereafter - around the year 10,900 C.E.  ; Still, the key question concerns the possibility of whether 8 Leap Seconds add to the drift or decrease the drift.  My5 own intuition is inclined to assume that Leap Seconds @ are a substitute for leap days and that the drift will increase,9 unless some overly capable beings in this vicinity decide 7 that just for fun the solar day should again be exactly 2 86,400 seconds, hopefully by a non-destructive and  environmentally friendly method.  : And finally, the actual goal of the exercise is to be able4 to write some code which can be used for a long time4 into the future, as opposed to calendars which still9 assume a constant Tropical Year along with the inaccurate 4 Gregorian calendar.  Based on the above information,= I feel it should be possible, at the very least, to establish 3 a minimum and maximum bound for the number of extra 6 leap years to be omitted over a limited period of time6 into the future, such as 32,000 years.  If the minimum; number over any 400 year cycle is -3 (i.e. all of the extra 4 leap years removed during the Gregorian modification: from the Julian calendar must be restored) and the maximum< number is +97 (i.e. all remaining leap years in the 400 year= cycle must be removed), then it should actually be relatively 8 straightforward to produce code which allows an accurate9 date/time to be calculated based on a specified number of 6 elapsed seconds between any other date/time within the4 target window of 32,000 years.  Obviously a table of3 actual used Leap Seconds would be needed along with > a predicted set of Leap Seconds into the future.  In addition,5 the same sort of table would be needed for leap years 5 that differ from the Common Era (Gregorian) calendar. 7 Naturally, the table for omitted leap years can only be 6 a predicted table at present.  AND, developers of code6 which predicts date/time conversions would be required6 to remind users that future date/time conversions will5 depend on the accuracy of the values predicted in the  table that the user provides.    Any ideas would be appreciated.    Sincerely yours,   Jerome Fine    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 05:02:06 GMT , From: "Jay E. Morris" <morrisj@epsilon3.com>> Subject: Re: FREE OpenVMS Windows NT intergration book *NOT*!!9 Message-ID: <iTJQ5.8732$Lx3.102701@typhoon.austin.rr.com>   : On 13-Nov-2000, fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br wrote:  G > I requested  this book a few weeks ago and I received at home (Rio de  > Janeiro / Brazil).G > I friend of mine tries to request the same book two weeks ago and the  > OpenVMS Store  > didnt answer him ....   J I had troubles with the online order form the first two times I tried it. I Maybe that's his problem.  Course I could always send him mine, it wasn't  what I was expecting.    --  # Jay E. Morris Epsilon 3 Productions  http://www.epsilon3.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 21:58:17 -0500 , From: Howard S Shubs <hshubs@mindspring.com>% Subject: Re: Good BYTE article on VMS > Message-ID: <hshubs-FD5D3E.21581715112000@news.mindspring.com>  E In article <8uuemh$den$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, mukh_sue@my-deja.com wrote:   9 >In article <8uu9bi$ea5$1@fizban.fizban.pprd.abbott.com>, 5 >  "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com> wrote: . >> http://www.byte.com/column/BYT20001109S0008 >>
 >> Dave... >>1 >> Thank you.  The article is really informative.  >  >Sue   Why?  It's a good article. --   Howard S ShubsD "Run in circles, scream and shout!"  "I hope you have good backups!"   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 21:59:00 -0500 , From: Howard S Shubs <hshubs@mindspring.com>% Subject: Re: Good BYTE article on VMS > Message-ID: <hshubs-9621DD.21590015112000@news.mindspring.com>  ? In article <t15hk79m3nltea@corp.supernews.com>, "Peter Weaver"   <peter.weaver@stelco.ca> wrote:u  ' >Wow, I thought Byte was dead and gone.-   It was.  They brought it back. -- - Howard S ShubsD "Run in circles, scream and shout!"  "I hope you have good backups!"   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 04:53:25 GMTn5 From: njc@CC47532-A.ewndsr1.nj.home.com (Neil Cherry)t% Subject: Re: Good BYTE article on VMS9> Message-ID: <slrn916q3u.no8.njc@CC47532-A.ewndsr1.nj.home.com>  9 On Wed, 15 Nov 2000 21:58:17 -0500, Howard S Shubs wrote:0F >In article <8uuemh$den$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, mukh_sue@my-deja.com wrote: >:: >>In article <8uu9bi$ea5$1@fizban.fizban.pprd.abbott.com>,6 >>  "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com> wrote:/ >>> http://www.byte.com/column/BYT20001109S0008  >>>s >>> Dave...i >>>i2 >>> Thank you.  The article is really informative. >> >>Sue  >  >Why?  It's a good article.t  F I hope you forgot the smiley, her name is Sue and her reply was "ThankF you.  The article is really informative.". It looks like it got sucked( up into the last line of Dave's message.   --  H Linux Home Automation           Neil Cherry             ncherry@home.netC http://members.home.net/ncherry                         (Text only)oB http://meltingpot.fortunecity.com/lightsey/52           (Graphics)0 http://linuxha.sourceforge.net/				(SourceForge)   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 00:29:48 GMTh0 From: Timothy Stark <sword7@grace.speakeasy.org>& Subject: Help! How to setup SYS$PRINT.5 Message-ID: <0UFQ5.7427$%j3.66365@news6.giganews.com>h   Hello folks:  H Because I have new Charon-VAX Hobbyist Edition emulator with OpenVMS 7.2I operating system, I am figuring how to set SYS$PRINT to print files on my H local printer (HP 970Cxi) via TXA terminal device within OpenVMS system.E I already set "vaxprint" to connect my local printer from Charon-VAX.uJ Does anyone know how to set it?  I am new to OpenVMS system administration) since I am Unix sys admin for many years.   
 Thank you!   -- Tim Stark   -- a, Timothy Stark	<><	Inet: sword7@speakeasy.orgJ --------------------------------------------------------------------------F "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that H whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.. Amen." -- John 3:16 (King James Version Bible)   ------------------------------   Date: 15 Nov 2000 17:51:11 GMT3 From: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann)2/ Subject: Re: How can I watch RealPlayer movies?t0 Message-ID: <8uuief$k5g$1@n.ruf.uni-freiburg.de>   Hi,o  = just a quote from a mail these guys sent me about a year ago:     L If you are interested in seeing the RealPlayer G2 ported to an operating sy=L stem other than those listed, please send your plan (via post), including t=L he amount you or your organization is willing to pay RealNetworks for this =& development, to the following address:   RealNetworks, Inc. 2601 Elliott Avenuem
 Suite 1000 Seattle, WA 98121o/ Attn: Dave Hardwick, Customer Relations Managero      Now, who is willing to pay what?   Regards,    Christoph Gartmannv  H -- --------------------------------------------------------------------+H | Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452 |H | Immunbiologie                                                        |H | Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de     |H | D-79011  Freiburg, FRG                                               |H +--------- http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/english/menue.html ---------+   ------------------------------   Date: 15 Nov 2000 21:42:12 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)& Subject: Re: How to Obtain VMS 6.2-1H36 Message-ID: <8uuvvk$f99$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  ^ In article <20001115094931.03886.00000493@ng-ch1.aol.com>, briannfo@aol.com (BrianNFO) writes:K :I'm converting an Alpha 4100 from NT to VMS, and it dawned on me from pasteM :experience that the minimum version of VMS I need to be running is the abovee :mentioned version.   G   I will assume the system in question is an AlphaServer 4100, and thatt@   you have the appropriate OpenVMS and layered product licenses.  E   You may well need a version more recent than OpenVMS Alpha V6.2-1H3eD   (depending on what hardware is installed), and I would definitely 6   encourage the use of OpenVMS Alpha V7.1-2 or V7.2-1.  J :Last time I did this, I borrowed a CD from a vendor, but so far am havingK :trouble getting it this time.  Is there an easy way through Compaq to get e' :this?  (and preferably for no charge.)c  H   Per the part number information in the OpenVMS FAQ, you can order the K   hardware update CD-ROM media for OpenVMS Alpha V6.2-1H3 for small change.yK   (This hardware release media generally contains OpenVMS itself and few oraL   no additional products -- the more common ("full") OpenVMS release CD-ROM K   media distributions tend to contain a number of additional product kits.)e  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------   Date: 15 Nov 2000 20:42:55 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) Subject: Re: how to sign off?06 Message-ID: <8uusgf$efb$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  ^ In article <v04220800b638812e3e59@[198.202.69.21]>, Diane Burns-Giles <burns@salk.edu> writes: : 8 :I already tried several ways and I'm still on the list.  @   Have you tried the sign-off mechanisms that are listed in the C   OpenVMS FAQ?  (At www.openvms.compaq.com, among other locations.)e  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------    Date: 15 Nov 2000 10:56:53 -0800( From: Javier Henderson <javier@kjsl.com>2 Subject: Re: Looking for RJ45-to-ThinWire adapter.- Message-ID: <86n1f183nu.fsf@cartero.kjsl.com>r  % Jim Agnew <agnew@hsc.vcu.edu> writes:o  9 > the cabletron one does not, it runs off the aui power..   ? 	The original poster was looking for RJ45 to ThinWire, however,eC so any solution to that problem will need an external power supply.s   -jav   ------------------------------    Date: 15 Nov 2000 20:17:56 +0100* From: eplan@kapsch.net (Peter LANGSTOEGER)2 Subject: Re: Looking for RJ45-to-ThinWire adapter.* Message-ID: <3a12e164$1@news.kapsch.co.at>   In article <8D2E4FCDFE47F625.D64C0C27FE9B960E.7DC900D557117A42@lp.airnews.net>, Chris Scheers <chris@applied-synergy.com> writes:iG >For the group:  What is the difference between a RJ45/Thinwire adapterp1 >and a single port RJ45 hub with a Thinwire link?q  " Hub: a word with multiple meanings0 Some mean repeaters				ISO 7-Layer-model Layer 1C Some mean switches/bridges (cut-through/store-forward) 	ISO Layer 2 M Some mean backpanels hosting modules like repeater, switches, router, serversh  N DEC (later Cabletron, now VNETEK DNPG.COM) used to mean the backpanel (DEChub)  & Adapter: a word with multiple meanings Some mean repeaters  Some mean cables  9 If you want useful answers, word your question carefully.c  J So, in this case, your advice for an external converter/adapter = repeater3 is the same advice as for an (mini-) hub = repeater<  J eg. a 3Com PCMCIA ethernet card (w/ or w/o modem) used to have a cable/box< with both BNC and UTP. In this case, this is not a repeater.H But when the ethernet adapter has only an UTP port, you need an external0 box called converter/repeater/hub or a switch...   -- e< Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111-2651; Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111-888k< <<< KAPSCH AG  Wagenseilgasse 1     E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netH A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 13:07:01 -0600 / From: Chris Scheers <chris@applied-synergy.com>a2 Subject: Re: Looking for RJ45-to-ThinWire adapter.O Message-ID: <8D2E4FCDFE47F625.D64C0C27FE9B960E.7DC900D557117A42@lp.airnews.net>.   Mike Duffy wrote:1 > 	 > Hi All,r > @ > I need to add a laptop, with RJ45 only, to a ThinWire network. > 8 > Does anyone have a favorite brand or model of adapter?: > Preferrably, it would be a device not requiring external > power. > = > I really don't want to buy a whole hub/bridge/router, sincer; > that defeats the advantage of ThinWire (not having to pope
 > for a hub).- > B > Please don't hesitate to tell me about your least favorite, too!  G Currently, it seems that the most economical approach is to get a smallo RJ45 hub with a Thinwire link.  H There are RJ45 to Thinwire repeaters (I have a Allied Telesis AT-MR12X),7 but the ones I have seen are more expensive than a hub.   @ I have not seen any solutions that don't require separate power.  F For the group:  What is the difference between a RJ45/Thinwire adapter0 and a single port RJ45 hub with a Thinwire link?  G -----------------------------------------------------------------------5$ Chris Scheers, Applied Synergy, Inc.  C Voice: 817-237-3360            Internet: chris@applied-synergy.com     Fax: 817-237-3074M   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 15:32:11 -0600G/ From: Chris Scheers <chris@applied-synergy.com>x2 Subject: Re: Looking for RJ45-to-ThinWire adapter.O Message-ID: <FBF5A040C2474F0D.6B7F75112C3CFE29.B31A845DB7068780@lp.airnews.net>m   Peter LANGSTOEGER wrote: >  > In article <8D2E4FCDFE47F625.D64C0C27FE9B960E.7DC900D557117A42@lp.airnews.net>, Chris Scheers <chris@applied-synergy.com> writes:BI > >For the group:  What is the difference between a RJ45/Thinwire adapter 3 > >and a single port RJ45 hub with a Thinwire link?  > $ > Hub: a word with multiple meaningsK > Some mean repeaters                             ISO 7-Layer-model Layer 1iE > Some mean switches/bridges (cut-through/store-forward)  ISO Layer 2rO > Some mean backpanels hosting modules like repeater, switches, router, serversy > P > DEC (later Cabletron, now VNETEK DNPG.COM) used to mean the backpanel (DEChub) > ( > Adapter: a word with multiple meanings > Some mean repeaterso > Some mean cables > ; > If you want useful answers, word your question carefully.  > L > So, in this case, your advice for an external converter/adapter = repeater5 > is the same advice as for an (mini-) hub = repeaterU > L > eg. a 3Com PCMCIA ethernet card (w/ or w/o modem) used to have a cable/box> > with both BNC and UTP. In this case, this is not a repeater.J > But when the ethernet adapter has only an UTP port, you need an external2 > box called converter/repeater/hub or a switch...  9 Apologies.  I mistyped my question.  It should have been:   F What is the difference between a RJ45/Thinwire "repeater" and a single# port RJ45 hub with a Thinwire link?u  A By "hub", I mean your el cheapo off the shelf hub.  Not a switch,gE bridge, etc.  One link connection and "n" (usually 4-12) RJ45 twistede pair connections.e  4 Is a basic hub a repeater, or is there a difference?  G ------------------------------------------------------------------------$ Chris Scheers, Applied Synergy, Inc.  C Voice: 817-237-3360            Internet: chris@applied-synergy.com o   Fax: 817-237-3074s   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 17:01:50 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>n2 Subject: Re: Looking for RJ45-to-ThinWire adapter., Message-ID: <3A12F9BA.DDDEA11B@videotron.ca>   Mike Duffy wrote:e@ > I need to add a laptop, with RJ45 only, to a ThinWire network. > 8 > Does anyone have a favorite brand or model of adapter?: > Preferrably, it would be a device not requiring external > power.  L I got a small netgear hub with 4 RJ45 and a thinwire port. Yeah, it requires
 power though.:  G For my older MAC, I had found a allied telesyn adaptor from the old mac K ethernet plug (proprietary) to thinwire. It is unpowered. Interestingly, it. does get quite warm.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 00:35:01 -0500 2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)2 Subject: Re: Looking for RJ45-to-ThinWire adapter.L Message-ID: <rdeininger-1611000035020001@user-2ive6r2.dialup.mindspring.com>  S In article <8uu8do$n56$1@bob.news.rcn.net>, "Mike Duffy" <mdduffy@erols.com> wrote:x  	 > Hi All,n > @ > I need to add a laptop, with RJ45 only, to a ThinWire network. > 8 > Does anyone have a favorite brand or model of adapter?: > Preferrably, it would be a device not requiring external > power. > = > I really don't want to buy a whole hub/bridge/router, sincen; > that defeats the advantage of ThinWire (not having to pope
 > for a hub).g  6 I've just looked into this, and can't offer good news.  ^ RJ45 to thinwire media converters are expensive, and all that I have seen need external power.  O It seems cheaper to buy an 8-port RJ45 hub with either an AUI or thinwire port.Lc 4-port hubs are also available, but they seem to cost more than the 8-port ones in the same family.d  . Of course these hubs also need external power.   -- f Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.comK   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 00:39:41 -0500t2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)2 Subject: Re: Looking for RJ45-to-ThinWire adapter.L Message-ID: <rdeininger-1611000039420001@user-2ive6r2.dialup.mindspring.com>   In article <8D2E4FCDFE47F625.D64C0C27FE9B960E.7DC900D557117A42@lp.airnews.net>, Chris Scheers <chris@applied-synergy.com> wrote:  H > For the group:  What is the difference between a RJ45/Thinwire adapter2 > and a single port RJ45 hub with a Thinwire link?   At least some of the media converters DON'T count as repeaters, so they don't use up any of your allotment of network bits on a LAN.  Allied Telesyn, in particular, has a media converter in this category, but it's around $120 IIRC.>   Also, a multi-port hub might not be quite as fast between two ports, compared to the media convert, since its "horsepower" might be shared among all the ports.eN This shouldn't really be an important issue these days for 10 Mb/sec networks.   --   Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.comn   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 00:41:41 -0500z2 From: rdeininger@mindspring.com (Robert Deininger)2 Subject: Re: Looking for RJ45-to-ThinWire adapter.L Message-ID: <rdeininger-1611000041420001@user-2ive6r2.dialup.mindspring.com>  [ In article <3A12F9BA.DDDEA11B@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:i  uI > For my older MAC, I had found a allied telesyn adaptor from the old mac M > ethernet plug (proprietary) to thinwire. It is unpowered. Interestingly, itn > does get quite warm.  K The Apple AUI is just a miniature version of regular AUI, so there is powerl available on the port.   -- r Robert Deininger rdeininger@mindspring.com-   ------------------------------   Date: 15 Nov 2000 18:34:52 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)$ Subject: Re: Malloc + debug question6 Message-ID: <8uul0c$d5p$2@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  \ In article <3A0CFCC1.12DFE90D@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes:. :I have a bug which propped up on a program... :bE :early in the message, I malloc a 21 byte string to hold a file name.-H :then, as I process the data for that message, I malloc various strings. :mM :In that processing, malloc at one point gives me an address that is equal to2I :that of the first string that was malloced. The program then effectively5( :overwrites the data of the first field.  B   Please see the various discussions of malloc-related problems in   the Ask The Wizard area.  L :Are there known problems where malloc  will reuse space that wasn't freed ?  G   An interesting assumption.  Knowing that bugs in malloc are certainlyeH   possible, but given that malloc sees extensive use across a very wide H   variety of applications and that bugs are thus likely either going to I   be rather rare or quite endemic, I'd first assume that there was a bug e-   in the application that was calling malloc.p  F :While I am at it, the DECCRTL now includes the "strdup" routine whichM :duplicates a string into newly allocated space (returning its address). Doeso2 :anyone know if strdup is compatible with "free" ?  H   As the function is documented as using malloc, yes.  For details, see:  K     http://www.openvms.compaq.com/commercial/c/5763p044.htm#strdup_functions  J   Given the comments at the end of that section, I would not use the call.K   I'd use memcpy or strcpy or strcat in conjunction with malloc or realloc.@  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------    Date: 15 Nov 2000 20:05:17 +0100* From: eplan@kapsch.net (Peter LANGSTOEGER)- Subject: NETSCAPE V6 is out (but not for VMS).* Message-ID: <3a12de6d$1@news.kapsch.co.at>  J NETSCAPE V6 is out now (what suprise, MOZILLA is growing but still a pieceH of shit comparing to the old and crappy NETSCAPE V3 we all still have toI use on VMS), but guess what, a lot of UNIX and WINTEL systems and no VMS.r  ; Does anyone know, when a (usable) VMS version will appear ?    TIAi   -- r< Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111-2651; Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111-888 < <<< KAPSCH AG  Wagenseilgasse 1     E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netH A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"   ------------------------------   Date: 15 Nov 2000 22:13:40 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)1 Subject: Re: NETSCAPE V6 is out (but not for VMS)M6 Message-ID: <8uv1qk$fiq$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  W In article <3a12de6d$1@news.kapsch.co.at>, eplan@kapsch.net (Peter LANGSTOEGER) writes:hK :NETSCAPE V6 is out now (what suprise, MOZILLA is growing but still a pieceiI :of shit comparing to the old and crappy NETSCAPE V3 we all still have tonJ :use on VMS), but guess what, a lot of UNIX and WINTEL systems and no VMS. :S< :Does anyone know, when a (usable) VMS version will appear ?  F   Under the most recent plans I am aware of, Mozilla is the target webG   browser for OpenVMS, and work will continue to track and to port the  I   releases of the Mozilla baselevels to OpenVMS as they become available.   B   Mozilla is the basis of and the core of the Netscape V6 browser.  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 20:54:18 GMT + From: Jordan Henderson <jordan@my-deja.com>a3 Subject: Re: No doubts here (Was: Re: Galaxy doubt):) Message-ID: <8uut5n$qqk$1@nnrp1.deja.com>g  H In article <OFFF2038DC.0155763F-ON80256998.004B21BE@qedi.quintiles.com>,#   steven.reece@quintiles.com wrote:o >  > Jordan Henderson wrote:nG > >>>It's DII COE (Defense Information Infrastructure, Common OperatingsC > Environment).  DII COE certification is technically separate, butoB > perhaps related, to commitments by Compaq to support OpenVMS for) > some period of time into the future.<<<l >w > It's _very_ related.E > One of the requirements of the DII COE certification is an explicit  20 year C > commitment to the operating system.  This isn't just support as Io > understand it.  " You're right.  I missed this fact.  < I heard last year that a Compaq group had to certify to some; European agency (seems like it was a EU Governmental thing, A but perhaps my memory if faulty) that OpenVMS was to be supported1
 for 25 years.   E Does anyone know what I'm talking about here, or am I misremembering?    > Steve. >  >    -- -Jordan Henderson  jordan@greenapple.comm    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.-   ------------------------------   Date: 15 Nov 2000 18:49:56 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)4 Subject: Re: open VMS backdrop for motif or xwindows6 Message-ID: <8uulsk$d5p$3@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  l In article <8umefo$1ub$1@aristotelis.cytanet.com.cy>, "Constandinos Stavrou" <sdinos@cytanet.com.cy> writes:L :Can anybody cprovide any interesting backdrops for modif or xwidnows?  I am0 :stuck with the ones that came with openVMS 6.2.  G   Well, since no backdrops came with OpenVMS...  :-)   Seriously, what ,I   version of DECwindows is in use, and are you using OpenVMS VAX V6.2 or .   OpenVMS Alpha V6.2?   J   With tools such as those in decw$utils:, you can set the root window to I   be most anything you want; decw$utils:xsetroot or similar.  Tools such AL   as xv and imagemagick can also be used to display backgrounds (backdrops).K   With recent versions of DECwindows CDE, you can add your own backdrops...t  L   There are a pile of X toys on the OpenVMS Freeware, including xphoon, etc.  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------   Date: 15 Nov 2000 19:16:51 GMTF From: lederman@star.enet.dec.DISABLE-JUNK-EMAIL.com (Bart Z. Lederman)4 Subject: Re: open VMS backdrop for motif or xwindows* Message-ID: <8uunf3$qor@usenet.pa.dec.com>  < By the way: I haven't tried this with XV, but it is possible; do run other programs that will display to the root window.o9 For example, ICO can be set to run the bouncing geometric2 figure as your root window.a  < HOWEVER: any program that subsequently tries to write to the; root window will hang.  I know from experience that various>> web browsers will not start up if you have anything using your> root window, because they try to display their 'splash screen'< and if they can't get to the root window they won't time out or proceed.s  = I haven't tried the latest Netscape or Mozilla to find out ifc= this is still a problem: but it used to occur with Mosaic andr Enhanced Mosaic.  > I just want to let people know that some programs are not well: behaved when it comes to the use of the background or root8 window, and to be on the lookout for programs failing if you use a custom backdrop.  9 (I should also mention that I've only tried this with thee6 traditional DECwindows interface, and not with the new CDE interface.)e   -- t(  B. Z. Lederman   Personal Opinions Only  8  Posting to a News group does NOT give anyone permission8  to send me advertising by E-mail or put me on a mailing  list of any kind.  5  Please remove the "DISABLE-JUNK-EMAIL" if you have a-5  legitimate reason to E-mail a response to this post.a   ------------------------------   Date: 15 Nov 2000 21:12:02 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)7 Subject: Re: OpenVMS website GALCULTATOR link is broken.6 Message-ID: <8uuu72$f28$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  o In article <8utq4p$kqe$1@reader1.imaginet.fr>, "Jean-Franois Marchal" <jean-francois.marchal@x9000.fr> writes:l: :I'm trying to following the link to the Galaxy galculator= :from the OpenVMS portal, but the link seems to be broken ...r : A :http://www.openvms.compaq.com/availability/alcV2/GALCULATOR.HTML      I will pass this along.g  d   The correct URL is:t  A http://www.openvms.compaq.com/availability/galcV2/GALCULATOR.HTMLu  J   I'd encourage the use of the feedback ("contact us") link on any of the J   OpenVMS web pages, problem reports here might or might not be seen, and ?   might or might not be passed back to the OpenVMS webmaster...e  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 12:40:57 +1100 ; From: "Paul Johnston" <pwjohnston@no_spam.dingoblue.net.au>x0 Subject: Pascal calling convention from C++ codeB Message-ID: <3a133b2b$0$19406$7f31c96c@news01.syd.optusnet.com.au>  : Can anyone help me ? I need to know the calling convention: to call a Pascal routine from a C++ module on Vax-OpenVMS.  H is it something like this ?, or do I need to specify far or near or some! other tricky calling convention ?-  & extern "C" void MyPascalFunc(int * a);   Thanks  
 Paul Johnston    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 14:44:30 -0500p1 From: "Tommy Noble" <tommydotnoble@vistacomp.com>E  Subject: Re: Printing blank page% Message-ID: <dIBQ5.141$vG.784@client>   K I think the <esc>P and <esc>\ are the 7-bit equivalents for <DCS> and <ST>,sJ and should work the same way.  In case you want to use the 8-bit versions,	 they are:    <DCS> = 144x
 <ST> = 156  D > Or, you could wait for Compaq to produce a print symbiont that can > parse PCL. . . .   Good one.  ROFLi  + -------------------------------------------l Tommy Nobles VISTA Computer Servicesu tommy.noble at vistacomp.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 18:34:17 -0400h- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>hD Subject: Re: RMS way to get long sequential records in multiple $GET, Message-ID: <3A130F5F.91D5D056@videotron.ca>   hein@eps.zko.dec.c*m wrote:t9 > Or you could simply have a 32KB buffer from the get go.h  F 32k is a huge amount of memory... on a microvax II :-) :-) :-) :-) :-)  K > Well, for it to be a valid RMS file, there would be a CR or LF terminator-E > before you hit 32K, irrespective of lines and paragraphs (that's an7F > interpretation). But it is not going to be a 'valid' RMS file right?    I No "text" files from microsoft no longer have a line delimitor. They onlyGH delimit paragraphs. So, from RMS's point of view, you can have very longJ lines.  VMSmail on decwindows has the option of flowing such text into theK window, but character cell interfaces don't, so I have to add that feature.c  H > The C RTL just uses SYS$READ. You could do that to, but you'll have to" > unpuck from blocks worth of data  G does $READ provide a data stream or a file stream ? I.E. in the case ofrN variable length files, does $READ get me just my data, or does it also include the RMS control blocks ?    K > My favourite method is to make is an UNDEFINED file. RMS will now read as 3 > many bytes as you ask for untill it hits the end.)  M But then my program has no way of know what the structure of data is (whetheroK the file is stored as variable length, cr, crlf or just lf stream etc etc).    > say 'pretty please'!     ok. "PRETTY PLEASE" !l :-)    ------------------------------   Date: 16 Nov 2000 01:12 -0400w From: hein@eps.zko.dec.c*mD Subject: Re: RMS way to get long sequential records in multiple $GET& Message-ID: <16NOV200001123741@miasys>  ^ In article <3A130F5F.91D5D056@videotron.ca>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> writes... >hein@eps.zko.dec.c*m wrote: > J >No "text" files from microsoft no longer have a line delimitor. They only >delimit paragraphs. 	 F 	And is that delimitor an RMS record terminator? Or does it correspondA 	with the end of an RMS record? I guess I'm a litte dense tonite.d    6 > So, from RMS's point of view, you can have very longK >lines.  VMSmail on decwindows has the option of flowing such text into the , >window, but character cell interfaces don't  D 	I would really have to know the attributes of the RMS file with the; 	text to advise further. Is it variable length? Stream_lf? oA 	If it is variable, then the decwindows mail must simply be using-E 	a large enough buffer. Heck, the characer cell solution might simply $ 	have too small an OUTPUT buffer no?  H >does $READ provide a data stream or a file stream ? I.E. in the case ofO >variable length files, does $READ get me just my data, or does it also includep >the RMS control blocks ?c  @ 	It would get the raw data, with record length word and optional@ 	allignment byte. That's why my test program with SYS$MODIFY had/ 	a trivial 'control-character-eliminator' loop.   N >But then my program has no way of know what the structure of data is (whetherL >the file is stored as variable length, cr, crlf or just lf stream etc etc).  = 	Well, it _could_ look at the RFM and RAT cells in the FAB to  	figure out what to do.o   >  >> say 'pretty please'!  >  >ok. "PRETTY PLEASE" !  F no, pretty please is spelled SYS$MODIFY as per example in other reply.   Cheers,. 	Hein.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 11:53:29 -0800 % From: "Jim Grossnickle" <me@vrwc.org>n Subject: SAMBA and VMS2 Message-ID: <8uupel$fuea$1@nntp6.u.washington.edu>  K I am trying to find a version of SAMBA that will accept encrypted passwordsoJ from windows NT and windows 2000 workstations.  I have two VMS servers oneB version 6.2 (multinet v 4.2) and one version 7.2 (multinet v 4.3).J Previously I have been able to serve files to NT 4.0 by making a change toI the registry that allowed non-encrypted passwords (as required by SAMBA).lK But with windows 2000 and new installs of NTon more critical computers I dovI not want to do that any longer.  Any help with a SAMBA version number, ori# configuration would be appreciated.    thanks   jime   --A "Those who would give up essential liberty for temporary securityo; deserve neither liberty nor security." -- Benjamin Franklinr   Jim Grossnickle  UW Redmond Plasma Physics Laba 425-881-7706   ------------------------------    Date: 15 Nov 2000 16:38:48 -05002 From: malmberg@eisner.decus.org (John E. Malmberg) Subject: Re: SAMBA and VMS+ Message-ID: <kt6mmAr$At9f@eisner.decus.org>-  	 Abstract:   8 SAMBA is a suite of programs that allow interoperability% with Microsoft file sharing networks.L  5 It consists of a file serving program, a NETBIOS namen8 serving program, and a command line uitility that allows4 a VMS session to read and write files to typically a8 Windows file share.  And several other utility programs.  : Samba is freeware and covered under the Gnu General Public License.  2 In article <8uupel$fuea$1@nntp6.u.washington.edu>,' "Jim Grossnickle" <me@vrwc.org> writes:t9 > I am trying to find a version of SAMBA that will accept 6 > encrypted passwords from windows NT and windows 2000 > workstations.n  : You can try http://eisner.decus.org/~malmberg/samba/ which7 also needs http://eisner.decus.org/~malmberg/frontport/   1 I built and tested these on OpenVMS ALPHA 7.2 anda OpenVMS VAX 7.1.  9 It is SAMBA 2.0.6.  Windows 2000 may work with it for youo, or may need a patch from the SAMBA UNIX site http://www.samba.org/.  7 The version of SAMBA that fixes a known problem with it-* interoperating with Windows 2000 is 2.0.7.  6 Be aware that no one has given me any feedback since I5 announced the kits being posted earlier in the month.T  6 Because this build is almost completely using the UNIX4 source code unchanged, it may not take any effort to update it to SAMBA 2.0.7.a  6 Because I am in the process of relocating, my personal# VMS systems have now been shut off.d  9 > I have two VMS servers one version 6.2 (multinet v 4.2)a' > and one version 7.2 (multinet v 4.3).t  
 VAX or Alpha?s  C I do not know if the binaries at the site will link on OpenVMS 6.2.r  > I do not know if the source will compile on OpenVMS 6.2 if the link does not work.m  < There is nothing supposed to be in the kits to prevent this.< I simply did not have the facilities to test builds on older+ versions of VMS than VAX 7.1 and ALPHA 7.2.n  , Any changes needed should be trivial though.  8 I also have not tested it on Multinet, and merely copied, what the older version of SAMBA for VMS did.  : If you choose to recompile, I would recommend DEC C 6.0 or higher.g  9 > Previously I have been able to serve files to NT 4.0 by < > making a change to the registry that allowed non-encrypted# > passwords (as required by SAMBA).o  6 > But with windows 2000 and new installs of NT on more9 > critical computers I do not want to do that any longer.v8 > Any help with a SAMBA version number, or configuration > would be appreciated.o  9 For SAMBA 2.0.6, to use encrypted passwords, you must use 8 the SMBPASSWD utility to create a database that contains% the encrypted password for each user.g  5 You also must have a guest account on the VMS system.   ; SAMBA 2.0.6 for VMS also implements Oplocks, and because ite7 is essentially the UNIX code base, most other features.s  : I have mainly tested the file serving, and the SMBCLIENT's: ability to transfer files, along with it's ability to send& win-popup messages to Windows systems.  9 Incoming net send commands directed to a SAMBA VMS server 2 are converted to Opcom messages by a command file.  ; Please read the enclosed instructions carefully.  Using thee+ new oplock features may impact performance.n  : You may also wish to search the archives of comp.os.vms on; http://www.deja.com for other hints.  I posted one recentlys; about changing the default to SAMBA to tell it to treat then2 lanman file specification as being case sensitive.  ; This eliminates some processing on SAMBA's part to simulate-: a case insensitive file system on a case sensitive one and8 VMS always will treat the file name as case insensitive.  8 And a few programs compiled and linked, but I did not do any testing on.0  2 One of these is SWAT.  It allows an web browser to; change the SAMBA configuration file.  I have not tested it,D( but there is a chance that it will work.  	 Good Luckn -Johnt wb8tyw@qsl.network" malmberg@eisner.decus.organization   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 14:17:49 -0800S% From: "Jim Grossnickle" <me@vrwc.org>N Subject: Re: SAMBA and VMS2 Message-ID: <8uv1t8$bm7k$1@nntp6.u.washington.edu>  E Thank you very much, I will give it a go from here.  just fyi, we are  running on Alphas.   jimp  ? "John E. Malmberg" <malmberg@eisner.decus.org> wrote in messagen% news:kt6mmAr$At9f@eisner.decus.org...t > Abstract:N >A: > SAMBA is a suite of programs that allow interoperability' > with Microsoft file sharing networks.5 >v7 > It consists of a file serving program, a NETBIOS nameH: > serving program, and a command line uitility that allows6 > a VMS session to read and write files to typically a: > Windows file share.  And several other utility programs. >.< > Samba is freeware and covered under the Gnu General Public
 > License. >L4 > In article <8uupel$fuea$1@nntp6.u.washington.edu>,) > "Jim Grossnickle" <me@vrwc.org> writes:l; > > I am trying to find a version of SAMBA that will acceptI8 > > encrypted passwords from windows NT and windows 2000 > > workstations.w > < > You can try http://eisner.decus.org/~malmberg/samba/ which9 > also needs http://eisner.decus.org/~malmberg/frontport/c >i3 > I built and tested these on OpenVMS ALPHA 7.2 andi > OpenVMS VAX 7.1. >M; > It is SAMBA 2.0.6.  Windows 2000 may work with it for you . > or may need a patch from the SAMBA UNIX site > http://www.samba.org/  >s9 > The version of SAMBA that fixes a known problem with it , > interoperating with Windows 2000 is 2.0.7. >o8 > Be aware that no one has given me any feedback since I7 > announced the kits being posted earlier in the month.m >e8 > Because this build is almost completely using the UNIX6 > source code unchanged, it may not take any effort to > update it to SAMBA 2.0.7.N >58 > Because I am in the process of relocating, my personal% > VMS systems have now been shut off.w >e; > > I have two VMS servers one version 6.2 (multinet v 4.2)m) > > and one version 7.2 (multinet v 4.3).r >i > VAX or Alpha?a > E > I do not know if the binaries at the site will link on OpenVMS 6.2.O >V@ > I do not know if the source will compile on OpenVMS 6.2 if the > link does not work.t >r> > There is nothing supposed to be in the kits to prevent this.> > I simply did not have the facilities to test builds on older- > versions of VMS than VAX 7.1 and ALPHA 7.2.m >e. > Any changes needed should be trivial though. >u: > I also have not tested it on Multinet, and merely copied. > what the older version of SAMBA for VMS did. >f< > If you choose to recompile, I would recommend DEC C 6.0 or	 > higher.  >w; > > Previously I have been able to serve files to NT 4.0 byt> > > making a change to the registry that allowed non-encrypted% > > passwords (as required by SAMBA).o > 8 > > But with windows 2000 and new installs of NT on more; > > critical computers I do not want to do that any longer.a: > > Any help with a SAMBA version number, or configuration > > would be appreciated.u >$; > For SAMBA 2.0.6, to use encrypted passwords, you must use1: > the SMBPASSWD utility to create a database that contains' > the encrypted password for each user.r >d7 > You also must have a guest account on the VMS system.  >u= > SAMBA 2.0.6 for VMS also implements Oplocks, and because ito9 > is essentially the UNIX code base, most other features.  >s< > I have mainly tested the file serving, and the SMBCLIENT's< > ability to transfer files, along with it's ability to send( > win-popup messages to Windows systems. > ; > Incoming net send commands directed to a SAMBA VMS server.4 > are converted to Opcom messages by a command file. >t= > Please read the enclosed instructions carefully.  Using theE- > new oplock features may impact performance.t > < > You may also wish to search the archives of comp.os.vms on= > http://www.deja.com for other hints.  I posted one recentlyi= > about changing the default to SAMBA to tell it to treat thep4 > lanman file specification as being case sensitive. >-= > This eliminates some processing on SAMBA's part to simulate < > a case insensitive file system on a case sensitive one and: > VMS always will treat the file name as case insensitive. >g: > And a few programs compiled and linked, but I did not do > any testing on.V >u4 > One of these is SWAT.  It allows an web browser to= > change the SAMBA configuration file.  I have not tested it,e* > but there is a chance that it will work. >w > Good Luck: > -Johnr > wb8tyw@qsl.network$ > malmberg@eisner.decus.organization   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 23:06:14 GMT + From: Craig A. Berry <calepine@my-deja.com>o Subject: Re: SAMBA and VMS) Message-ID: <8uv4t1$1ou$1@nnrp1.deja.com>   + In article <kt6mmAr$At9f@eisner.decus.org>,p5   malmberg@eisner.decus.org (John E. Malmberg) wrote:l  E > I do not know if the binaries at the site will link on OpenVMS 6.2.s > @ > I do not know if the source will compile on OpenVMS 6.2 if the > link does not work.    John,h  8 I haven't had a chance to try SAMBA but I've browsed the9 FRONTPORT code looking for things we might want to borrowu7 for Perl.  The code is neat, clean, well-commented, andr; generally impressive.  At first blush, though, it does look < like there will be a couple of problems building and linking9 on pre-7.x systems.  I've recently become painfully awaree= that rmdir() and truncate() tend not to be available in older ; C RTLs, i.e., those that shipped before OpenVMS 7.0.  I didL= notice that you use these routines though I haven't built thes= library on an older system.  People on 6.x who have installed < a recent C compiler or otherwise upgraded the C RTL might be7 ok, but I don't know exactly when these routines becamel
 available.   Cheers,-    Craig    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.e   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 20:03:42 -06000) From: "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.net>e Subject: Re: SAMBA and VMS/ Message-ID: <t16g0keu6bf364@corp.supernews.com>t  1 "Craig A. Berry" <calepine@my-deja.company> wrotea. in message news:8uv4t1$1ou$1@nnrp1.deja.com...- > In article <kt6mmAr$At9f@eisner.decus.org>, 0 >   wb8tyw@qsl.network (John E. Malmberg) wrote: >CG > > I do not know if the binaries at the site will link on OpenVMS 6.2.n > >aB > > I do not know if the source will compile on OpenVMS 6.2 if the > > link does not work.h >r > John,t > : > I haven't had a chance to try SAMBA but I've browsed the; > FRONTPORT code looking for things we might want to borrow-9 > for Perl.  The code is neat, clean, well-commented, and# > generally impressive.-  
 Thank you!  I The goal in it's implementation is to allow the building of UNIX programs J with out modifying the source at all.  SAMBA is a good torture test of a C RTL.  & > At first blush, though, it does look> > like there will be a couple of problems building and linking; > on pre-7.x systems.  I've recently become painfully aware ? > that rmdir() and truncate() tend not to be available in oldero= > C RTLs, i.e., those that shipped before OpenVMS 7.0.  I didn? > notice that you use these routines though I haven't built the ? > library on an older system.  People on 6.x who have installed > > a recent C compiler or otherwise upgraded the C RTL might be9 > ok, but I don't know exactly when these routines became  > available.   Yes, according ton  B http://www.openvms.compaq.com/commercial/c/5763p064.htm#depend_v70  L The rmdir() and truncate() functions are not available prior to OpenVMS 7.0.  J They are implemented in the backport library DECC$CRTL.OLB that ships with8 the DEC C compiler, otherwise alternatives can be coded.  K The FRONTPORT.MMS build script has a parameter option that will cause it toTL link against the backport library inside of it.  I am not sure that I put it" in the LINK_FRONTPORT.COM routine.  J The rmdir() can be synthisized with a delete call.  The truncate() routine: would need a bit more coding, probably using RMS routines.  I If someone else does not code up these routines, I will keep this in mindy for a potential future version.r   Regards, -John  wb8tyw@qsl.network   ------------------------------    Date: 15 Nov 2000 16:15:45 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)o7 Subject: Re: Severity of eBay's ecache problem detailedr+ Message-ID: <ledEYyZfvNan@eisner.decus.org>s  h In article <3A10EC91.15E9592@gtech.com>, Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> writes:   > This is a technical forum !s   Not in this thread.o  @ > As long as Ebay does not publicise a statement explaining what > hardware/softwareu9 > was responsible, then Robs guess is as good as anyones.'  @ It is not reasonable for eBay to discuss reliability of computer= systems, since it detracts from their main marketing message,s= which is the bidding experience.  This has nothing to do withr> what machines they use and how often they fail.  When they are? _forced_ into discussing downtime, it pushes them into a losings	 position.y  = I have made several useful purchases on eBay, but for me thateD ability is not mission-critical.  eBay's most availability-sensitiveD critics are professional vendors who use that system, but eBay would4 continue to thrive if they all gave up the practice.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 21:03:03 GMTA+ From: Jordan Henderson <jordan@my-deja.com>-7 Subject: Re: Severity of eBay's ecache problem detailedc) Message-ID: <8uutm3$rac$1@nnrp1.deja.com>e  * In article <3A12B4DA.74BCA7CB@uk.sun.com>,3   andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote:D > Fred Kleinsorge wrote: > >m > > Calling the kettle black?e > >  >i > This is Arnes Rule > F > > > Arnes rule to distinguish between technical people and marekting people:dE > > > Do they consider information about systems not shipping yet for? fact ?( > > > Yes => marketing. No => technical. > > >  >s< > I havn't made any pronouncments of "fact" about any future0 > systems. So I fail Arnes test for a Marketeer. >n* > Rob on the other hand has pronounced on. >h8 > Spiralog (when it was a lab project and a white paper) > Galaxies (ditto) > WildFire (ditto) > 21264	 (ditto) >eF > In the case of Spiralog for example all of Robs pronouncements aboutH > the performance gains to be had using Spiralog turned out to be untrueG > and his extrapolation to its effects on TPC-C performance also turned  > out to be wildly optimistic. > C > Now if Rob had prefaced all these pronouncments with a disclaimerlE > then by Arnes definition he could still claim to be technical as itpB > is he didn't and so he cannot (at least using Arnes definition).  B What an amazing thing you've been able to do, Andrew.  You've beenF able to uncover someone in comp.os.vms who is enthusiastic and perhaps5 overly optimistic about certain OpenVMS technologies.s  E Oh, we should be ashamed for fostering an atmosphere where discussion @ of future OpenVMS technologies are put in such a positive light.  E We should go back to topics of discussion that are actually pertinent'D for comp.os.vms, the US Election and fabio's request for information6 about a file system product available for Sun systems.   > 	 > Regards- > Andrew Harrison- > Enterprise IT Architecto >0   -Jordan Hendersonr jordan@greenapple.comm    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.a   ------------------------------   Date: 15 Nov 00 12:20:04 PST From: mckinneyj@cpva.saic.coma& Subject: SHOW PROC (Peak virtual size)( Message-ID: <kP3PAetSv4RI@cpva.saic.com>  & Environment is VMS 7.1-1H1 on Alpha...  $ Would someone enlighten me as to why  '   $ SHOW PROCESS/ACCOUNTING/ID=xxxxxxxxb   might yeildg  C    Direct I/O count:      196938  Peak virtual size:         382192   % the peak virtual page size seen aboven  C when the UAF record for the owner process defines the PGFLQUOTA ando WSEXTENT as seen below?M  ;   Queprio:         4  TQElm:        50  WSextent:     32768 ;   CPU:        (none)  Enqlm:      2000  Pgflquo:     100000r  G Shouldn't the peak size be limited to the sum of the pagefile usage andmD the working set use (which are limited by the UAF quotas)? Thanks...   -- 6 - Jim-   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 20:55:06 GMTm1 From: "Mark D. Jilson" <jilly@clarityconnect.com>R* Subject: Re: SHOW PROC (Peak virtual size)2 Message-ID: <3A12F992.3F686BE2@clarityconnect.com>  E Remember that all of your virtual address space is not mapped againstwG the system pagefiles.  Some of it will be mapped against image sections E and some against private backing store for global sections.  VMS does 6 not track peak page file usage on a per process basis.   mckinneyj@cpva.saic.com wrote: > ( > Environment is VMS 7.1-1H1 on Alpha... > & > Would someone enlighten me as to why > ) >   $ SHOW PROCESS/ACCOUNTING/ID=xxxxxxxxi > 
 > might yeild  > E >    Direct I/O count:      196938  Peak virtual size:         382192r > ' > the peak virtual page size seen above0 > E > when the UAF record for the owner process defines the PGFLQUOTA and/ > WSEXTENT as seen below?i > = >   Queprio:         4  TQElm:        50  WSextent:     32768 = >   CPU:        (none)  Enqlm:      2000  Pgflquo:     100000  > I > Shouldn't the peak size be limited to the sum of the pagefile usage and F > the working set use (which are limited by the UAF quotas)? Thanks... >  > -- > - Jimn   -- aD Jilly	- Working from Home in the Chemung River Valley - Lockwood, NY0 	- jilly@clarityconnect.com			- Brett Bodine fan. 	- Mark.Jilson@Compaq.com			- since 1975 or so, 	- http://www.jilly.baka.com               -   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 02:33:53 GMT  From: kparris@my-deja.coms* Subject: Re: SHOW PROC (Peak virtual size)) Message-ID: <8uvh2h$buj$1@nnrp1.deja.com>s  D Note also that the value for WSEXTENT in SYSUAF can be overridden if= there's a higher value in the SYSGEN parameter PQL_MWSEXTENT.tG -----------------------------------------------------------------------cG Keith Parris|Integrity Computing,Inc.|parris@decuserve.decus.org-nospampF VMS Consulting: Clusters, Perf., Alpha porting, Storage&I/O, Internals    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.a   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 00:35:54 GMTh0 From: Timothy Stark <sword7@grace.speakeasy.org>) Subject: Still looking for JNET software..7 Message-ID: <KZFQ5.14934$wW2.490149@news1.giganews.com>.   Hello folks:  H I still am looking for Jnet software for my Hobbyist OpenVMS 7.2 system G that allow send individual messages and/or files between users locally.bI Many years ago, I used Jnet software to send individual messages or filestJ through BITNET at Gallaudet University.  However, I was looking for it but- was told that Jnet software was discontinued.a  
 Thank you!   -- Tim Stark   -- s, Timothy Stark	<><	Inet: sword7@speakeasy.orgJ --------------------------------------------------------------------------F "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that H whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.. Amen." -- John 3:16 (King James Version Bible)   ------------------------------    Date: 15 Nov 2000 15:59:11 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)u' Subject: Re: Sun "uptime" belly laugherg+ Message-ID: <Yml40mX$wv0H@eisner.decus.org>r  ] In article <3A116281.77A9A56F@uk.sun.com>, andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes:   F >> Andrew, you should have used a VMS cluster. Then you could turn offD >> the node and kept the replication running on the other node. In aG >> properly configured cluster with a decent database like RDB you telluA >> RDB on one node to shut itself down after the last transactionb> >> conpletes and not to accept any new transactions. Once thatG >> transaction completes you do wahtever work you need to do and rebooto >> the node. >> wC > That would be fine if the whole of the replication server processmA > ran on UNIX (or VMS) it however does not, part of it runs on NTe' > making it too complicated to migrate.h  @ Andrew, that's what you get for pushing Microsoft's products :-)   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 16:22:26 -0500 ) From: "Ebinger . Eric" <EEbinger@drc.com>-' Subject: RE: Technology of US Elections B Message-ID: <7162F87E9EF4D311BA9900805FC1D3AE7A6239@and02.drc.com>  5 Sorry but you're out of touch with reality.  They are69 not counting ballots, they are counting holes in ballots.   4 There haven't been any reports of problems with the 2 number of ballots in Florida (it's New Mexico that7 can't seem to count them).  In Florida and specifically.5 in Palm Beach the problem is interperting the meaninga of incompletely punched holes.  L http://www.cnn.com/interactive/allpolitics/0011/election.glossary/link.ballo t.glossary.gif5 describes the various types.  According to the latestl3 rulings ALL of the types (including when there is ac) dent on the "chad") count as valid votes.o  1 The issue involved is more comparable to countingo  shiny coins versus dull coins.     Eric Ebinger   > -----Original Message-----A > From: John Macallister [mailto:J.Macallister1@physics.ox.ac.uk] - > Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2000 11:35 AM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Coma) > Subject: RE: Technology of US Elections  >  > H > >The comparison of bank notes to ballots is pretty absurd.  Bank notes > aren't> > >filled out by individuals and collected by people who only  > do this kind ofo" > >thing once every year, at best. > ? > On the contrary, the comparison with bank notes and coins is   > very apt and> > perhaps more so in the US where all notes are the same size  > and one has to9 > peer carefully at any note to determine its value. The i > counting of money is> > something which usually has to be 100% accurate. It doesn't  > say much for< > democracy in the US if people are prepared to accept that  > votes cannot bet > counted accurately.  > 9 > While bank employees may regularly have to count large p > amounts of cash with= > their jobs often depending on 100% accuracy there are many   > thousands of? > people in every country running voluntary events where large n > amounts of cash2H > are being counted by people not doing this for a living and where 100% > accuracy is again required.  > ? > I think the decision between Gore and Bush should be decided u > by tossing a? > quarter and a dollar bill into the air. If the quarter comes t > up heads Goreb; > wins and if it comes up tails give it to Bush but if the a > quarter hits the@ > ground before the dollar bill Bill Clinton should be asked to  > serve a thirdd > term.  >  > John > D > Name: John B. Macallister  E-mail: j.macallister1@physics.ox.ac.uk@ > Post: Nuclear and Astrophysics Laboratory, Keble Road, Oxford  > OX1 3RH,UKC > Phone: +44-1865-273388 (direct)  273333 (reception)  273418 (Fax)  >  >  >  >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 16:44:23 -0400c- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> ' Subject: Re: Technology of US Electionst, Message-ID: <3A12F5A4.525F6201@videotron.ca>   Carl Perkins wrote:nI > As a voter, you only have to declare a party affiliation if you want to K > vote in the primaries (which determine which candiate will be the party'su  > candidate on the final ballot     K Why is a political party's selection of a leader something which the statesdN mingle in or regulate ? Shouldn't this is completely internal to the political party itself ?  M In Canada, it is the political party which keeps its own list of members, andeC they decide how they will choose a leader with the state completelyEM un-involved in this process. They hold they conventions with their own funds. L And the selection of a party's leader is TOTALLY separate from a national or provincial election.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 17:47:44 -0400l- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> ' Subject: Re: Technology of US elections , Message-ID: <3A130479.2B541C1F@videotron.ca>   andrew harrison wrote:A > Now I know that more papers for Gore are likely to surface in ahB > Democratic area than a Republican area but this does not explain? > the abnormally high number of rejected ballots in some of thee > areas.  K Supposedly, the number of rejected ballots is not that unusually high. WhatiL this means is that the people of the USA have tolerated a high error rate inH counting ballots in the past, just like windows users tolerate regularlyI rebooting machines, or Sun customers tolerate being told that the type ofeI concrete used in their building is what is responsible for the Sun server  inexplicably crashing :-)o  N All of a sudden, people are awakened to the fact that you can't run a aircraftJ carrier on NT, or run elections on unreliable technology because the errorR rate is high enough that you cannot draw any conclusion when an election is close.  M There isn't much that can be done with this election because you can't changeaM the rules during the process. But this whole mess will hopefully point to notnN only the process errors but also the constitutional issues at the state level.  M Since this is a florida vote, it is the state of florida's failure to declare M who the 25 votes will go to. Perhaps Florida needs to take a lesson from NASAgL and define BEFOREHAND what the procedures are in case a problem arises. WhenL it becomes an issue of which court should rule on a request to count/recountJ ballots, it means that the whole election process in that state is failed.  N Hopefully Florida and other state will change the laws that regulate electionsK to make sure that the post election process of handling grievances is fullyiH defined and stands on its won without requiring daily lawsuits and court- judgements over which court has jurisdiction.n  I Florida had foreseen the case of a close ballot by requiring an automaticuH recount if the difference is below a certain threshold. But they have toJ define an acceptable error rate, and define rules of what happens when theN vote difference is below that rate (which statistically means there is a tie).   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 18:17:14 -0400D- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>g' Subject: Re: Technology of US Electionst, Message-ID: <3A130B61.FEF7A892@videotron.ca>   Jordan Henderson wrote:$@ > People should withold calling the popular vote just yet.  It'sE > estimated that there are still 1,000,000 uncounted absentee ballotsnF > that have yet to be tallied in the country as a whole.  It's thought( > that these will go heavily Republican.  N From a "system" point of you, it is absolutely wrong to base a decision on howI to handle recounts based on an assumption that yet-to-be-received ballotseM might all go to one side and give that side enough of a margin to be declaredoJ a winner. How many ballots are yet to be received ? And where will they be+ received from ?  Doesn't every vote count ?S   ------------------------------    Date: 15 Nov 2000 20:01:30 -0500/ From: jordan@lisa.gemair.com (Jordan Henderson)o' Subject: Re: Technology of US Electionss* Message-ID: <8uvbla$t86$1@lisa.gemair.com>  , In article <3A130B61.FEF7A892@videotron.ca>,/ JF Mezei  <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:s >Jordan Henderson wrote:A >> People should withold calling the popular vote just yet.  It'slF >> estimated that there are still 1,000,000 uncounted absentee ballotsG >> that have yet to be tallied in the country as a whole.  It's thoughtu) >> that these will go heavily Republican.b >mO >From a "system" point of you, it is absolutely wrong to base a decision on howlJ >to handle recounts based on an assumption that yet-to-be-received ballotsN >might all go to one side and give that side enough of a margin to be declaredK >a winner. How many ballots are yet to be received ? And where will they beb, >received from ?  Doesn't every vote count ?  F From a "system" point of view, it's irrelevant.  I'm talking about theD popular vote above.  The US President is elected on the basis of theF Electorial vote, which is why Florida is so important.  If either side7 gets Florida's electorial votes, they win the election.y   -Jordan Henderson  jordan@greenapple.comn   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 21:09:32 -0400e- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>o' Subject: Re: Technology of US Electionsa, Message-ID: <3A1333CB.F458B807@videotron.ca>   Jordan Henderson wrote:LH > From a "system" point of view, it's irrelevant.  I'm talking about theF > popular vote above.  The US President is elected on the basis of theH > Electorial vote, which is why Florida is so important.  If either side9 > gets Florida's electorial votes, they win the election.h  N But you cannot draw any conclusions about the Florida vote because the resultsK are too close and the number of unreceived/uncounted ballots is potentially ; greater than the difference in votes at this point in time.t  E This is why I feel that the system has broken down because it expects < "certified" vote totals before all votes have been received.   Which is more democratic:tB 	-people taking to the streets demanding a recount of THEIR votes,  K or	-lawyers arguing in courts whether votes are valid or who has or doesn'to have jurisdiction to; decide how to judge if a vote is punched correctly or not ?y    I To me, the recent elections in Yugoslavia where the people forced out thedM dictator who refused to acknowledge defeat is a far greater show of the power-L of democracy than the florida circus where it is lawyers who serve their own. interests to protect their friend's interests.   ------------------------------    Date: 15 Nov 2000 22:31:07 -0500/ From: jordan@lisa.gemair.com (Jordan Henderson) ' Subject: Re: Technology of US Elections>* Message-ID: <8uvkdr$6q7$1@lisa.gemair.com>  , In article <3A1333CB.F458B807@videotron.ca>,/ JF Mezei  <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:  >Jordan Henderson wrote:I >> From a "system" point of view, it's irrelevant.  I'm talking about thetG >> popular vote above.  The US President is elected on the basis of the I >> Electorial vote, which is why Florida is so important.  If either sidet: >> gets Florida's electorial votes, they win the election. >hO >But you cannot draw any conclusions about the Florida vote because the results L >are too close and the number of unreceived/uncounted ballots is potentially< >greater than the difference in votes at this point in time. >   ; I didn't draw any conclusions about the Florida vote above.   F >This is why I feel that the system has broken down because it expects= >"certified" vote totals before all votes have been received.e >e >Which is more democratic:C >	-people taking to the streets demanding a recount of THEIR votes,b >eL >or	-lawyers arguing in courts whether votes are valid or who has or doesn't >have jurisdiction to < >decide how to judge if a vote is punched correctly or not ? >e  F It's the lawyers on Al Gore's side who are taking to the courts tryingD to get even dimples and "pregnant" chad validated as possible votes.C George Bush wants none of this subjective fishing around for votes.o  I I see people taking to the streets in Florida demanding that the electionuH stand as is, as well as people taking to the streets demanind a recount.J It's certainly not as clear-cut as the situation in Yugoslavia where there9 were relatively few people clamoring that Milosevic stay.i   > J >To me, the recent elections in Yugoslavia where the people forced out theN >dictator who refused to acknowledge defeat is a far greater show of the powerM >of democracy than the florida circus where it is lawyers who serve their own / >interests to protect their friend's interests.R  C I agree with this.  Unfortunately, it's Al Gore who is showing the e@ greater propensity to drag this on and on through endless legal  challenges.   A Unlike in Yugoslavia, there is a clear statutory process that has ? been laid out well in advance of the election in Florida and isFA being followed.  We'll see if Al Gore and his lawyers will allow a it to go forward or not.  @ Remember it's was one of Milosevic's moves to get the YugoslaviaB Supreme Court to throw the whole election out as invalid.  Al Gore? has already tried to get the election thrown out in Palm Beach n5 due to the "Butterfly ballot" issue and was rebuffed..   -Jordan Henderson  jordan@greenapple.com-   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 00:24:43 -0400l- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>(' Subject: Re: Technology of US Elections., Message-ID: <3A136187.F7FB487C@videotron.ca>   Jordan Henderson wrote: H > It's the lawyers on Al Gore's side who are taking to the courts tryingF > to get even dimples and "pregnant" chad validated as possible votes.E > George Bush wants none of this subjective fishing around for votes.r  L But if both side were to agree on a logical and realistic and reasonable wayJ to manually count ballots, things would be much better.  A dimple is not aN clear indication of a voter's intentions. But chad is. If the recount includesM votes where the intentions are not clear, the results are just as invalid (ifs! not more) than the machine count.r    C > Unlike in Yugoslavia, there is a clear statutory process that haslA > been laid out well in advance of the election in Florida and is2B > being followed.  We'll see if Al Gore and his lawyers will allow > it to go forward or not.  N If there had been a clear statutory process, you wouldn't be seeing candidatesL suing left and right and lawyers having a field day trying to make decisionsL without any precedents. If there had been a clear process, there wouldn't beM politics involved, it would be a simple technical matter to recount the votes  after a request.  G This reminds me of Star Trek where Kirk gives some master computer thathH controls all of a planet a riddle the computer hasn't been programmed toL solve, and the computer starts to emit smoke and eventually dies with a niceI show of fireworks. Seems to me that the election process has been given a L problem it hasn't been programmed to solve and it doesn't know how to handleG this. As a result, lawyers are going nuts, producing all sorts of legalCF lawsuits left and right, suing over the right to sue, trying to get anJ injunction to prevent another one from suing, forcing the certification of incomplete results etc etc.b   ------------------------------    Date: 16 Nov 2000 00:36:30 -0500/ From: jordan@lisa.gemair.com (Jordan Henderson)e' Subject: Re: Technology of US Elections * Message-ID: <8uvrou$dfq$1@lisa.gemair.com>  , In article <3A136187.F7FB487C@videotron.ca>,/ JF Mezei  <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:O >Jordan Henderson wrote:I >> It's the lawyers on Al Gore's side who are taking to the courts tryingaG >> to get even dimples and "pregnant" chad validated as possible votes.gF >> George Bush wants none of this subjective fishing around for votes. >oM >But if both side were to agree on a logical and realistic and reasonable way K >to manually count ballots, things would be much better.  A dimple is not a-O >clear indication of a voter's intentions. But chad is. If the recount includesgN >votes where the intentions are not clear, the results are just as invalid (if" >not more) than the machine count. >o >3D >> Unlike in Yugoslavia, there is a clear statutory process that hasB >> been laid out well in advance of the election in Florida and isC >> being followed.  We'll see if Al Gore and his lawyers will allows >> it to go forward or not.d >sO >If there had been a clear statutory process, you wouldn't be seeing candidatesaM >suing left and right and lawyers having a field day trying to make decisionsoM >without any precedents. If there had been a clear process, there wouldn't beeN >politics involved, it would be a simple technical matter to recount the votes >after a request.e > H >This reminds me of Star Trek where Kirk gives some master computer thatI >controls all of a planet a riddle the computer hasn't been programmed torM >solve, and the computer starts to emit smoke and eventually dies with a nicehJ >show of fireworks. Seems to me that the election process has been given aM >problem it hasn't been programmed to solve and it doesn't know how to handle H >this. As a result, lawyers are going nuts, producing all sorts of legalG >lawsuits left and right, suing over the right to sue, trying to get an K >injunction to prevent another one from suing, forcing the certification of  >incomplete results etc etc.  ; I do believe that this is a horrible chapter in US history.o  A I'm very concerned that the foundations of US Democracy are beingt> shaken.  I sadly find myself in agreement with this editorial:  : http://www.washtimes.com/op-ed/ed-column-2000111518443.htm  = And now, I apologize to comp.os.vms for participating in thisn= extended off-topic debate.  I promise not to say another wordl= here about it again.  Perhaps many of my long-winded wranglesi9 on this forum add little but text...  If I've wasted youri time, I apologize again.   -Jordan Hendersonl jordan@greenapple.comp   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 16:33:18 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>t= Subject: Re: Technology of US elections x Brazilian elections-, Message-ID: <3A12F30C.A212A27C@videotron.ca>   Nigel Arnot wrote:K > In fact, perhaps the upgraded polling booths could be paid for by the USA H > broadcast networks, since they'd get the most benefit from instant and > accurate returns!f  N No. If elections were decided too quickly, the networks would make less money.M By having that uncertaintly, it raises the ratings and allows the networks to K speculate on winners, discuss all the various scenarios etc etc. If it werenF done electronically and without doubts, it would be less fun to watch.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 13:41:30 -0600e( From: "Bill Ames" <billames@accunet.net> Subject: Thanks / Message-ID: <t15p797hcu6837@corp.supernews.com>   K Ok, thanks, that is just what I needed.  "No Go" is a term I pickeup in the  Army, meaning - to fail.  9 I'll be using the command directory/sel=size=min=########v   Thanks!l  I Bart Z. Lederman <lederman@star.enet.dec.DISABLE-JUNK-EMAIL.com> wrote in , message news:8uun59$qor@usenet.pa.dec.com... >r= > In article <t15n882vpjf88a@corp.supernews.com>, "Bill Ames"c <billames@accunet.net> writes: > >o > >Directory output by Size??? > >0K > >I'm looking for a way to scan directories on a drive with a criteria forn > >size. > >eJ > >I tried using the SIZE= command with DIR, but alas another no go!  DoesH > >anyone out there have a simple solution or small routine that will do this.s >uC > Could you be a little more specific about "no go"?  Just what didC@ > you expect to happen, and what actually happend?  And it would= > probably help if you would show us the command you entered.c >x5 > >I'm trying to find large files on specific drives.b >R, > $ dir /sel = size = min = 1000 dkb0:[*...] >3E > finds all of the files with a minimum size of 1000 blocks on device-H > dkb0: whenever I try it.  (This assumes you have the proper privileges2 > to access all of the directories on the device.) >RA > It's also possible to perform an ANALYZE /DISK_STRUCTURE /USAGEo> > command and then read through the output file, but DIRECTORY' > is usually sufficient for most needs.t >  > --* >  B. Z. Lederman   Personal Opinions Only >t: >  Posting to a News group does NOT give anyone permission: >  to send me advertising by E-mail or put me on a mailing >  list of any kind. >e7 >  Please remove the "DISABLE-JUNK-EMAIL" if you have ao7 >  legitimate reason to E-mail a response to this post.l >c   ------------------------------    Date: 15 Nov 2000 16:26:46 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)lC Subject: Re: Two Phase Commit (2PC) on VMS - the nature of the fuss + Message-ID: <QVClRb0YI2Mo@eisner.decus.org>T  K In article <8upck0$94l$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, richard_maher@my-deja.com writes:-  / > BTW I believe that DBMS also supports DECdtm.   > Yes it does.  But one only needs two product mentions to prove the concept.  @ > This is very true and in my opinion very deliberate. But LarryI > obviously has access to the riveting read that is the DECdtm Functionali > Specification V1.2.   A I believe I recall field testing the DDTM interface years ago butgA it never got released.  Obviously there was some documentation atyB the time, subject to the standard destruction agreement.  The DataB Grater truck has long since visited LJK Software and gotten rid of> that documentation, although I doubt that it was a "FunctionalE Specification".  The only "Functional Specification" I recall getting C as documentation was the LGI-callouts, and those changed before thes final release.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 00:07:14 GMTw From: trdorr@my-deja.com Subject: Using PIPE for UCXe) Message-ID: <8uv8fd$4q6$1@nnrp1.deja.com>h  C I am trying to search for a tna device using PIPE but have not beenc successful.n The command I am using ish0 PIPE UCX SHOW DEV/FULL | SEARCH SYS$INPUT TNAnnn  3 When I issue the above, I get "no strings matched".s What am I doing wrong? Thanks,l Tomi    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.a   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 19:19:41 -0500t0 From: Glenn and Mary Everhart <Everhart@gce.com>. Subject: [Fwd: RE: Technology of US elections]' Message-ID: <3A13281D.E4675529@gce.com>h   Re Andrew's post:   7 no; retract your statement. Bush cannot "easily" demandh3 a recount of the rest due to Florida law, and therel are resource issues. w  = Besides, if any of the Gore folks gave a damn about computingd the true totals  they would > 1. be trying recounts all over, not only in areas their voters 	are concentrated in, andr@ 2. be running at least double recounts in a significant fraction; 	of the areas. You cannot even try to estimate the fractionu< 	of new ballots due to bias in the counters without at least; 	2 tries. Even then the estimate is rather model-dependent.l  > There is no reason to complain about machine errors unless you@ believe the machine is biased toward one or the other candidate.< (These machines are punched card readers...tough to build in a bias there.) -; As long as the losses are a few percent and hit all ballots ; regardless of direction, it just means your estimate of theT= result is maybe 98% of the vote instead of 100%. Won't affecto> outcome. Counties not in the news so much have had even larger< numbers of invalid ballots. However the "abnormal numbers of= rejected ballots" do not exist. They are entirely normal bothe8 historically and within this election. Palm Beach county= had 14,000 invalid ballots in 1996 with a much lower turnout.n< Another one reported this time, that Gore did not count, had> 28,000 invalid ballots. The Gore people simply have publicised> the hell out of the invalid ballots and so on in counties they: carried, but fine-toothing only those counties and not the: rest has the effect of making them more important than the; rest; it effectively disenfranchises the rest of the state.   @ Mechanical losses that are party-neutral exist across the state.  ? Try to recount everything and you need still to account for the- errors of human bias.g  5 If you recount, the new ballots could be expressed as, N(new) = N(new, real) + B(bias)o  E That is the number found is the real number plus the number found duei) to bias of judges (possibly unconscious.)t  B You can TRY to counter this by having a second recount manually by? a different group of (you HOPE) opposite bias; it might produceh    N(new2) = N(new, real) -B(bias2)  B Now if B(bias2) = B(bias), the results could be averaged to remove@ the bias part. Quite an assumption, but without dual recount you@ cannot even begin to get a measure of the magnitude of the bias.  C This kind of correction still is not as fair and unbiased as simply F accepting the machine counts in the first place, but if you use double@ recounts you at least can try to correct the human factors. ThatF has not been proposed though. It would still also need to be done overA the whole state, not just a few counties, to remove the selection E bias. Obviously the logistical problems are considerable; also, it iseE not clear how safely the ballots in counties not discussed heretoforenF have been stored over the past 1+ weeks. They may have figured no such> count would be demanded and just left them unlocked somewhere.  J If the issue were about biases or finding the true will of the people, the% recount would never have been raised.y  J The one thing I can see as useful is to recount a little in each county toF establish that error rates are comparable over the state. Here again aE double count is needed to check for human bias, but one could attemptaI a sampling correction to attempt to deal with possibly somewhat differentcG rejection rates in different machinery. Perhaps the number of different G kinds of machinery is smaller than the number of counties. This has notdD however been pursued in the way one would pursue getting the correctK result, but in the way one would pursue getting a winning result. Hopefullye) this begins to make the difference clear.m       -----Original Message-----7 From: andrew harrison [mailto:andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com]-+ Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2000 11:34 AMa To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com ' Subject: Re: Technology of US elections      Jordan Henderson wrote:y > , > In article <3A118784.2E01BB31@uk.sun.com>,4 > andrew harrison  <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote:< > >The BBC interviewed Robert Mugabe's campaign manager last9 > >week and he pointed out that if Zimbabwe had conductede> > >their vote in the way that the US had then the UN observers; > >would have said that the election was not free and fair.  > >:< > >The BBC reporter had rather reluctantly to agree with his	 > >point.T > >l > : > The important points that you, Robert Mugabe and the BBS6 > reporter are missing here is that recounts are being= > done only in areas where Gore has strong electoral support,r7 > with a process that is without standards and is being ' > overseen by rabid Democrat partisans.b > = Thats fine but the Bush camp can quite easily demand recountsa< in the other areas where Bush is stronger. But they havn't ,9 they have threatened to do so but havn't actually called .
 for recounts.c  > And the fact is that each recount has reduced the Bush margin B because it has uncovered ballot papers that were either discarded  or incorrectly counted.t  < Remember the people doing the count are not just looking for< mistakes that lost Gore votes they are looking for mistakes # that cost all the candidates votes.r  < And each voting slip that they uncover that was miss counted? or discarded incorrectly is one more voter who would otherwise p9 have been disenfranchised because of inedequacies in the t voting process.w  = Because of this it is difficult to see how Bushes position isn> other than anti-democratic because each count that his lawyers4 get stopped means more voters being disenfranchised.  < This is what I ment when I said that the democratic process  appears to be being subverted. e  D It is also difficult to see how the 17:00 deadline can be justified,C it was introduced to ensure that results were submitted in a timelyeG fashion but it was not designed to cope with an abnormal situation likes the D one today with a very close vote and big questions about the layout ; of ballot papers etc, abnormal number of spoilt papers etc.i  H To an outsider it looks very much as if the Bush campaign are attemptingE to win the election on a technicality which ignores the wishes of thef majority of the people.   C Now this may not be true but the only way out of this for the Bush  @ campaign is to agree to a full recount for the whole of Florida.    9 > As James Baker said, "machines are neither Democrat nors9 > Republican".  The point being that a machine recount ofo> > ballots that are designed to be machine read (not manually)," > is the only reasonable standard. >   C Again this is not defensible on the evidence of the manual recounts B so far which show that for what ever reasons (design of the ballot papersD etc) that in effect the machines are biased towards the Republicans ? because the manual recounts have shown up more papers for Gore d than for Bush.  @ Now I know that more papers for Gore are likely to surface in a A Democratic area than a Republican area but this does not explain o> the abnormally high number of rejected ballots in some of the  areas.   Regards0 Andrew Harrisonl Enterprise IT Architect.   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2000.640 ************************