1 INFO-VAX	Thu, 30 Nov 2000	Volume 2000 : Issue 668       Contents:
 'set time' Re: 'set time' Re: 4mm tape drive not working Re: 4mm tape drive not working? Re: BIND/DNS Client asking BIND/DNS Server on non-standard port 3 Re: Charon-VAX Hobbyist Edition - Printout problems P Consultant wanted for port of Macro-32 device driver from VAX/VMS toAlpha OpenVM' Re: generate a shareble image with DECC G Re: Help required - Configure NFS server (VMS) and NFS Client (Unix/NT)  How to make PAGFIL.SYS bigger?" Re: How to make PAGFIL.SYS bigger? Microvax to PC woes  Re: Microvax to PC woes  Re: Mozilla M18 i005 Need help, thanks in advance  Re: Need help, thanks in advance  Re: Need help, thanks in advance  Re: Need help, thanks in advance  Re: Need help, thanks in advance  Re: Need help, thanks in advance  Re: Need help, thanks in advance  Re: Need help, thanks in advance  Re: Need help, thanks in advance Re: OpenVMS CBT 6 Re: PCSI files (was: Re: Need help, thanks in advance)6 Re: PCSI files (was: Re: Need help, thanks in advance)6 Re: PCSI files (was: Re: Need help, thanks in advance)> Plextor SCSI drive vs OpenVMS 6.1-1H1 on AlphStation 200 4/233B Re: Plextor SCSI drive vs OpenVMS 6.1-1H1 on AlphStation 200 4/233B Re: Plextor SCSI drive vs OpenVMS 6.1-1H1 on AlphStation 200 4/233B Re: Plextor SCSI drive vs OpenVMS 6.1-1H1 on AlphStation 200 4/233B Re: Plextor SCSI drive vs OpenVMS 6.1-1H1 on AlphStation 200 4/233 Re: SW Raid 310 and VMS  Tape Drive replacement options" Re: Tape Drive replacement options" Re: Tape Drive replacement options" Re: Tape Drive replacement options Re: TPU bug ? (cut large part) Re: UCX question. Re: VMS Apache and CGI - still having problems VMS System Backup ' Re: What happened to www.graysoft.com?! - Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs? - Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs? - Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs? - Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs?   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 19:14:39 GMT  From: byatesiii@my-deja.com  Subject: 'set time' ) Message-ID: <903kin$ct5$1@nnrp1.deja.com>   A After setting the system time ala 'set time="14:07"', I am told I F should do a second 'set time' to set "time-of-year" clock (as VMS Help briefly describes it.  What does this do?    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.    ------------------------------   Date: 29 Nov 2000 19:34:10 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) Subject: Re: 'set time' 6 Message-ID: <903lni$12v$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  G In article <903kin$ct5$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, byatesiii@my-deja.com writes: B :After setting the system time ala 'set time="14:07"', I am told IG :should do a second 'set time' to set "time-of-year" clock (as VMS Help  :briefly describes it. :What does this do?   H   The OpenVMS FAQ section "TIME9. Why does VAX need a SET TIME at least $   once a year?" will be of interest.  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 23:13:25 +0100 " From: "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl>' Subject: Re: 4mm tape drive not working ( Message-ID: <903v17$ose$1@news.IAEhv.nl>  @ Remove the tape drive and get it repaired. Unless there are more@ devices on the back of the 4mm drive you don't need to shut downE VMS. I would recommend that you cool down user activity somewhat ;-).   
 Hans Vlems  4 babiarz at endor dot com heeft geschreven in bericht! <9030ls012ng@edrn.newsguy.com>... E >I have a 4mm tape drive that refuses to allow a tape to be inserted. < >It was working fine last week, yellow light is now flashing > 3 >alpha 1000a, vms 7.2-1 current uptime is 159 days. # >tape drive is ARCHIVE PYTHON 04106  > H >I hate to take down the system for tape drive, but is there something I< >can do to "reset" the drive without taking the system down. >  >tia >  >john  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 14:51:33 -0800 + From: "richard n. frank" <rnfrank@llnl.gov> ' Subject: Re: 4mm tape drive not working > Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.20001129144553.00b13480@poptop.llnl.gov>  I Since there is power to the scsi bus, there is always a risk of damaging  L some part of the scsi chain unless you shut all the power off, or have some  sort of hot swap-able adapter.K You can power cycle the drive without worry, just don't unplug it. You can  F "io autoconfigure all" to reset the devices from VMS. (I don't have a ; system up at close hand - I think it's a subset of sysman.) #                                rich   @ DISCLAIMER: This is not the opinion of the U.S. Government, DOE,2 UC, or LLNL. It may not even really be my opinion.N ------------------------------------------------------------------------------    - At 11:13 PM 11/29/00 +0100, Hans Vlems wrote: A >Remove the tape drive and get it repaired. Unless there are more A >devices on the back of the 4mm drive you don't need to shut down F >VMS. I would recommend that you cool down user activity somewhat ;-). >  >Hans Vlems  > 5 >babiarz at endor dot com heeft geschreven in bericht " ><9030ls012ng@edrn.newsguy.com>...G > >I have a 4mm tape drive that refuses to allow a tape to be inserted. > > >It was working fine last week, yellow light is now flashing > > 5 > >alpha 1000a, vms 7.2-1 current uptime is 159 days. % > >tape drive is ARCHIVE PYTHON 04106  > > J > >I hate to take down the system for tape drive, but is there something I> > >can do to "reset" the drive without taking the system down. > >  > >tia > >  > >john  > >  >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 12:41:41 +1000 4 From: "Matt Muggeridge" <Matt.Muggeridge@compaq.com>H Subject: Re: BIND/DNS Client asking BIND/DNS Server on non-standard port6 Message-ID: <904elt$4mm$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  	 Hi Peter,   G TCP/IP V5.0 uses the BIND server from ISC.  The version is 8.2.1.  This L server is highly configurable, and there is much documentation available forF this version of the BIND server.  Without ever having tried it, I'm am/ confident you will be able to specify the port.   7 Also, to get access to nslookup under V5.0, you can run I SYS$MANAGER:TCPIP$DEFINE_COMMANDS.COM, which I recommend is added to your 4 login.com.  nslookup, does support the -port option.   Matt.   7 "Peter LANGSTOEGER" <eplan@kapsch.net> wrote in message " news:3a1a88bc@news.kapsch.co.at...L > A BIND/DNS Server (NAMED V8) can be configured to listen on a non-standard? > port (TCP/UDP 53) via options statement "listen-on port xxx".  > L > Every NSLOOKUP can query a nameserver listening on a non-stardard port via- > "$ NSLOOKUP -port=xx" or via ">set port=xx"  > K > Do you know, how to configure the UCX, TCPIP and TCPware BIND/DNS Clients G > to query a BIND/DNS Server listening on a non-standard port ? I found  nothing C > so far in HELP or the manuals (so maybe unsupported but hopefully 	 possible)  >  > TIA  > L > PS: Even the NT4 (SP4 and up) can do it (via registry key SendOnNonDnsPortL > in HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Services\DNS\Parameters) !! >  > --> > Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER           Tel.    +43 1 81111-2651= > Network and OpenVMS system manager  Fax.    +43 1 81111-888 > > <<< KAPSCH AG  Wagenseilgasse 1     E-mail  eplan@kapsch.netJ > A-1121 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              "I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist"   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 22:52:28 +0100 " From: "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl>< Subject: Re: Charon-VAX Hobbyist Edition - Printout problems( Message-ID: <903tq2$kpp$1@news.IAEhv.nl>  > We're dealing with the real stuff here, not emulations ....,g>  
 Hans Vlems  - Timothy Stark heeft geschreven in bericht ... 
 >Hello folks:  > K >I just upgraded to latest version of Charon-VAX on Windows 2000 and Linux. G >I ended up some problems with serial lines. Now I discovered that this F >version has only two serial lines enabled.  That's why I tried to setH >vaxprint on TXA7: but this emulator complaint about that.  When I movedI >it to TXA1:, a problem disappeared.  I learned that this version is more F >crippled than before! I am not happy with that.  Be warned with that. > H >Also, I figured out how to set up print queues on OpenVMS 7.2.  I askedK >you for help but no one responsed my pervious postings!  I finally figured : >out when I read comments in SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM. I executedC >'START/QUEUE/MANAGER/NEW' to run queue manager daemon sucessfully. ; >Then I executed 'INIT/QUEUE/START/ON=TXA1: TXA1_PRINT' and C >'INIT/QUEUE/START/GENERIC=TXA1_PRINT SYS$PRINT' successfully. Then 7 >I executed 'PRINT <file>' and it worked so well but...  > E >I have a problem with printouts but they seems messed up.  They were 8 >printed double-spaced.  I want single-spaced printouts. > I >My printer is HP Deskjet 970Cxi.  Does anyone have experience with that?  >  >Thank you!  > 
 >-- Tim Stark  >  >-- - >Timothy Stark <>< Inet: sword7@speakeasy.org K >-------------------------------------------------------------------------- F >"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, thatI >whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. / >Amen." -- John 3:16 (King James Version Bible)    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 16:50:46 -0500 & From: Scott Galuska <sgaluska@hns.com>Y Subject: Consultant wanted for port of Macro-32 device driver from VAX/VMS toAlpha OpenVM ' Message-ID: <3A257A36.E6A5EFD4@hns.com>   A My name is Scott Galuska, and I am a software engineer for Hughes  Network Systems F in Germantown, MD.  Currently, I am porting a device driver written in Macro-32 from G VAX-VMS 5.5-2H4 to Alpha OpenVMS 7.2-1.  This is a driver that sends to 
 and receives  E packets from a DECServer (we use the 700 model) and passes them on to  applications .  D While I have ported and tested about 80% of the functionality of the driver myself,  F I am at a point where I need to bring in an outside consultant to help finish the  B job, since the remaining 20% appears to be outside of my immediate domain knowledge.  (Basically, I'm stuck! :-))   D We are looking to hire a consultant that can help finish the port of this driver.> If anyone is interested, or can recommend someone (Washington, DC/Baltimore area @ preferable), please e-mail me at sgaluska@hns.com, or call (301)	 212-2054.    --  
 Scott Galuska  Senior Member Technical Staff F Hughes Network Systems                   "'Scuse me while I boogaloo!" 11717 Exploration Lane Germantown, MD  20876  (301) 212-2054 sgaluska@hns.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 10:52:36 +1100 / From: "Phil Howell" <phowell@snowyhydro.com.au> 0 Subject: Re: generate a shareble image with DECC3 Message-ID: <vDgV5.48912$SF5.904047@ozemail.com.au>   B Thomas Hahnemann <Thomas.Hahnemann@nospam_s-t.de> wrote in message* news:Oozvf8elmJpy-pn2-vD0exl5ZdN8R@Tom2...0 > I'am using OpenVMS 7.1 on a VAX 3100 model 76.9 > I want to build a shareable image with DECC. I'am using 9 > a macro source to create the transfer vector. Also some 9 > global variable should be exported.  If I try to export  > them I get the warning :< > reference to psect TEST_COUNT (my varname) is not position > independent.9 > In the case I declare it in the macro file as external, < > I get undefined Symbol TEST_COUNT during link. Has anybody > an example or an address ? >  >  > Thanks in advance  >   Thomas Hahnemann > 6 For VAX linking you define these symbols as UNIVERSAL=   refer toL http://www.openvms.compaq.com/doc/72final/4548/4548pro_008.html#vax_declare_ univ_sec Phil   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 13:06:34 +1000 4 From: "Matt Muggeridge" <Matt.Muggeridge@compaq.com>P Subject: Re: Help required - Configure NFS server (VMS) and NFS Client (Unix/NT)6 Message-ID: <904g4k$4to$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  J You need to take a look in your log file for the errors.  They are usually very suggestive of the problem.   I Take a look in: sys$sysdevice:[tcpip$nfs]tcpip$nfs_<hostname>_logfile.log   H Other obvious things to check are that it is enabled and running.  TCPIPE SHOW SERV.  You should see NFS, PORTMAPPER, and PCNFS services in the  ENABLED state.   Matt.   9 "Shiv" <Sivakumar.Thangavelu@oracle.com> wrote in message $ news:3A24F0CA.F9CBE81B@oracle.com... > Hi,  > K > I'm trying to access a VMS Disk on my NT machine thru NFS, but i'm unable  to > succeed in it. > - > NFS Server : VMS machine running OS ver 7.2 < > Client    : WinNT M/c running Hummingbird NFS Maestro Solo >             : Sun Solaris 2.6  > $ > I did the following on the VMS box > 9 > ADD MAP "<unix_Style_dir_name>" <VMS_disk_or_directory> , > ADD export "<unix_Style_dir_name>" /host=*@ > ADD proxy <vms_username> /uid=<vms_uid> /gid=<vms_gid> /host=* > /nfs=(outgoing,incoming) >  > J > The exported dir/disk is visible in the Windows explorer of PC (NT m/c). WhenJ > i try to access it, i get an authentication error. The same applies with the 0 > Solaris client too, when i try to nfs_mount it > K > I'll appreciate any inputs/suggestions/documents regarding this. (pointer  toC > step by step action for an NFS server setup on VMS will be great)  > ( > Get back to me if further info's reqd. >  >  > TIA, > Shiv >  >    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 05:08:13 GMT 0 From: Timothy Stark <sword7@grace.speakeasy.org>' Subject: How to make PAGFIL.SYS bigger? 7 Message-ID: <%glV5.23299$IP1.736973@news1.giganews.com>    Hello folks:  C Help! I tried to compile C-Kermit v7.0 on uVAX II with 16MB memory. 0 It has a 11,000-block PAGFIL.SYS in SYS$SYSTEM:.  E During its compilation, I was told that page file space is not enough E and was asked to increase space.  Then system had been slowed down to B a crawal.  When I checked memory status by using SH MEM, I noticed< that free is zero with large negative number (in-use)!  WhenJ I tried to abort compilation but everything crashed and locked up forever.  2 How do I increase PAGFIL.SYS to 50000 blocks? etc.  
 Thank you!   -- Tim Stark   --  , Timothy Stark	<><	Inet: sword7@speakeasy.orgJ --------------------------------------------------------------------------F "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that H whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.. Amen." -- John 3:16 (King James Version Bible)   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 00:38:26 -0500 , From: Howard S Shubs <hshubs@mindspring.com>+ Subject: Re: How to make PAGFIL.SYS bigger? > Message-ID: <hshubs-3BA806.00382630112000@news.mindspring.com>  F In article <%glV5.23299$IP1.736973@news1.giganews.com>, Timothy Stark # <sword7@grace.speakeasy.org> wrote:   3 >How do I increase PAGFIL.SYS to 50000 blocks? etc.    First, it's PAGEFILE.SYS.   O You increase it with SYS$UPDATE:SWAPFILES.COM or you can expand it or create a  O new one on another disk with SYSGEN IIRC, then install it for use with INSTALL.   L Note: changing the size of an existing page file will not make an immediate O difference.  A reboot is required first, basically.  OTOH, if you need it NOW,  O you can create a -new- pagefile and install it.  After a reboot, if you didn't  - install the new one again, you can delete it.  --   Howard S ShubsD "Run in circles, scream and shout!"  "I hope you have good backups!"   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 14:45:02 -0600 % From: "Arioch" <Arioch@cityscape.net>  Subject: Microvax to PC woes/ Message-ID: <t2aqu6nsl9se2d@corp.supernews.com>   I I have recently acquired a MicroVAX 3100 Model 40 from my old company and L installed the hobby license Vax-VMS 7.2 on it. My next step was to hook up aH PC to it, so I can use the Vax as a file server (not that I need to, I'mL just messing around). I thought a serial connection should be easy, I have aL 9 pin rs232 port on my PC (running win98) and I have the option of the funkyJ MMJ ports on the 3100 or even two 4 port octopus looking 25pin cable TXAx:K ports hanging off of it. I've seen the WIRE1 faq concerning doing this kind I of crap, but all I get when I use my emulator (E-term 32) to look at this F port is garbage. It doesn't seem to be speed - stop bit - flow controlJ related. It is entirely possible I am messing up the pinout's on my cable,I since I don't know for sure what they should be. Can someone confirm whatlE they should be or point me to a possible solution other than suicide?  Thanks in advance,
 Steve Baldocke   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 18:07:35 -0500S- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>e  Subject: Re: Microvax to PC woes, Message-ID: <3A258C2F.C820D27D@videotron.ca>  
 Arioch wrote:lN > just messing around). I thought a serial connection should be easy, I have aN > 9 pin rs232 port on my PC (running win98) and I have the option of the funkyL > MMJ ports on the 3100 or even two 4 port octopus looking 25pin cable TXAx: > ports hanging off of it.  > If you do a SHOW DEV from the VAX, which TX ports do you see ?  N If your PC software insists on sending characters to the VAX port other than aJ CR, and the VAX has that terminal setup as AUTOBAUD, then the VAX terminal& port will autobaud to the wrong speed.  L For instance, if your PC software starts up by sending an AT<CR> to the VAX,* you'll never get the right autobaud speed.  G What you might wish to try is SET TERM TXAn:/PERM/NOAUTOBAUD/SPEED=9600nE This will force that port to a specific speed so no matter what first ; character your PC sends, the port will remain at 9600 baud.a   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Nov 2000 14:09:22 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)o Subject: Re: Mozilla M18 i005e+ Message-ID: <w7rXxTuFK5E5@eisner.decus.org>C  i In article <3A25266C.BA912A11@gtech.com>, Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> writes:t > Theo Jakobus wrote:sH >> I'm using MOZILLA every day. I have JAVA in "Preferences disabled". IA >> get JAVA Script errors so there is still some work to be done.o > A > You are aware of that Java nd JavaScript have nothing in common-, > except the first 4 letters in their name ?  D The other thing they have in common is long histories of introducingB security vulnerabilities to machines where they are enabled in Web	 Browsers.'  < Of course for Java it is the bytecode scheme that introduces9 the vulnerabilities, not the programming language itself.h   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 11:09:43 -0800-, From: Jennifer Tran <jtran@bms.calstate.edu>% Subject: Need help, thanks in advanceo0 Message-ID: <3A255477.6931080F@bms.calstate.edu>  
 Hello All:  D Just to let you know, I am very interested in getting more knowledge* about the legacy system (i.e. VAX/VMS...).  D 1./   I am trying to get a better understanding of the VMS system on8 VAX. I found those files in SYS$SYSROOT node . They are:  8 DEC-AXPVMS-DWMOTIF-V0102-5-1.REFERENCE_PCSI$DESCRIPTION;  1 DEC-AXPVMS-DWMOTIF-V0102-5-1.REFERENCE_PCSI$TLB;1n  / DEC-AXPVMS-OPENVMS-V0702-1-5.PCSI$DESCRIPTION;1f  ' DEC-AXPVMS-OPENVMS-V0702-1-5.PCSI$TLB;1p  + DEC-AXPVMS-VMS-V0702-1-2.PCSI$DESCRIPTION;1-  # DEC-AXPVMS-VMS-V0702-1-2.PCSI$TLB;1n  H  Can someone please give me a grief tutorial description as what each ofG the file is and its functions, how it can be run (or it is in effect at> time of installation...?)v  ; 2./ Scope bootstrap : what will be done if this is defined?o  H 3./ Any suggestion where I should start and steps I should take to learn- this environment more systematically, please?o   Thanks in advance...   Regards,   J.T.    C P/S. I DO want to learn. If you think you are too much of a guru tohG provide information to a dummy, then don't bother. Bring your judgement + somewhere else or apply it into good use...o   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 15:10:42 -0500g# From: Jim Agnew <agnew@hsc.vcu.edu> ) Subject: Re: Need help, thanks in advanceE+ Message-ID: <3A2562C2.9CED8EA1@hsc.vcu.edu>s   one thing you should realize...  you DON't post to a newsgroup, asking for free help, and call their system a legacy os.... ;-) that is asking for flames..   now, pcsi means that it is connected to pathworks somehow, in other words, your legacy system is running as an NT fileserver, io@ think... with no other details to go on, that's all i can offer.   Jennifer Tran wrote: >  > Hello All: > F > Just to let you know, I am very interested in getting more knowledge, > about the legacy system (i.e. VAX/VMS...). > F > 1./   I am trying to get a better understanding of the VMS system on: > VAX. I found those files in SYS$SYSROOT node . They are: > : > DEC-AXPVMS-DWMOTIF-V0102-5-1.REFERENCE_PCSI$DESCRIPTION; > 3 > DEC-AXPVMS-DWMOTIF-V0102-5-1.REFERENCE_PCSI$TLB;1  > 1 > DEC-AXPVMS-OPENVMS-V0702-1-5.PCSI$DESCRIPTION;1n > ) > DEC-AXPVMS-OPENVMS-V0702-1-5.PCSI$TLB;1I > - > DEC-AXPVMS-VMS-V0702-1-2.PCSI$DESCRIPTION;1- > % > DEC-AXPVMS-VMS-V0702-1-2.PCSI$TLB;1- > J >  Can someone please give me a grief tutorial description as what each ofI > the file is and its functions, how it can be run (or it is in effect ath > time of installation...?)o > = > 2./ Scope bootstrap : what will be done if this is defined?u > J > 3./ Any suggestion where I should start and steps I should take to learn/ > this environment more systematically, please?g >  > Thanks in advance... > 
 > Regards, >  > J.T. > E > P/S. I DO want to learn. If you think you are too much of a guru totI > provide information to a dummy, then don't bother. Bring your judgements- > somewhere else or apply it into good use...    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 15:19:08 -0500I, From: Steve Lionel <Steve.Lionel@compaq.com>) Subject: Re: Need help, thanks in advancej8 Message-ID: <bsoa2t8p2rh0f6nkiptkcndkiu4s11r78t@4ax.com>  1 On Wed, 29 Nov 2000 11:09:43 -0800, Jennifer Trang <jtran@bms.calstate.edu> wrote:o    E >1./   I am trying to get a better understanding of the VMS system ont9 >VAX. I found those files in SYS$SYSROOT node . They are:  >P9 >DEC-AXPVMS-DWMOTIF-V0102-5-1.REFERENCE_PCSI$DESCRIPTION;e >o2 >DEC-AXPVMS-DWMOTIF-V0102-5-1.REFERENCE_PCSI$TLB;1 >t0 >DEC-AXPVMS-OPENVMS-V0702-1-5.PCSI$DESCRIPTION;1 >n( >DEC-AXPVMS-OPENVMS-V0702-1-5.PCSI$TLB;1 >e, >DEC-AXPVMS-VMS-V0702-1-2.PCSI$DESCRIPTION;1 >f$ >DEC-AXPVMS-VMS-V0702-1-2.PCSI$TLB;1 >lI > Can someone please give me a grief tutorial description as what each ofhH >the file is and its functions, how it can be run (or it is in effect at >time of installation...?)  	 Jennifer,R  D The particular files you list are part of how OpenVMS keeps track ofF what software is installed.  The current OpenVMS software installationD procedure is often referred to as "PCSI", which originally stood forF PolyCenter Software Installation, but the PolyCenter name is no longer in common use.  D You do not do anything with these files - they are referenced duringD installation of other software to tell the installation process what; is installed and what inter-product dependencies there are.   ) If you want to learn more about PCSI, see < http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/72final/5952/5952pro.html   > < >2./ Scope bootstrap : what will be done if this is defined?  D I gather you found this in one of the above files.  See the manual ID pointed to above for a description of this, but my advice is to justB ignore these files - you don't need to understand them in order to  manage or use an OpenVMS system.  I >3./ Any suggestion where I should start and steps I should take to learn . >this environment more systematically, please?  B I'd start with http://www.openvms.compaq.com/ - look at the FAQ in particular.     - Steve Lionel (mailto:Steve.Lionel@compaq.com)b Fortran Engineeringu& Compaq Computer Corporation, Nashua NH  6 Compaq Fortran web site: http://www.compaq.com/fortran   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 15:44:14 -0500i# From: Jim Agnew <agnew@hsc.vcu.edu> ) Subject: Re: Need help, thanks in advance + Message-ID: <3A256A9E.C3EF0FF2@hsc.vcu.edu>o  b oops... got scrambled between pathworks and the new installer stuff.. sorry guys for the bad info.   Thanks Hoff, for stepping in.    jim:   Jim Agnew wrote: >  > one thing you should realize...  you DON't post to a newsgroup, asking for free help, and call their system a legacy os.... ;-) that > is asking for flames.. >  > now, pcsi means that it is connected to pathworks somehow, in other words, your legacy system is running as an NT fileserver, ieB > think... with no other details to go on, that's all i can offer. >  > Jennifer Tran wrote: > >T > > Hello All: > >'H > > Just to let you know, I am very interested in getting more knowledge. > > about the legacy system (i.e. VAX/VMS...). > >NH > > 1./   I am trying to get a better understanding of the VMS system on< > > VAX. I found those files in SYS$SYSROOT node . They are: > >s< > > DEC-AXPVMS-DWMOTIF-V0102-5-1.REFERENCE_PCSI$DESCRIPTION; > >w5 > > DEC-AXPVMS-DWMOTIF-V0102-5-1.REFERENCE_PCSI$TLB;1k > >73 > > DEC-AXPVMS-OPENVMS-V0702-1-5.PCSI$DESCRIPTION;1T > >y+ > > DEC-AXPVMS-OPENVMS-V0702-1-5.PCSI$TLB;1S > ></ > > DEC-AXPVMS-VMS-V0702-1-2.PCSI$DESCRIPTION;1- > >-' > > DEC-AXPVMS-VMS-V0702-1-2.PCSI$TLB;1- > >-L > >  Can someone please give me a grief tutorial description as what each ofK > > the file is and its functions, how it can be run (or it is in effect atA > > time of installation...?)V > >n? > > 2./ Scope bootstrap : what will be done if this is defined?0 > >:L > > 3./ Any suggestion where I should start and steps I should take to learn1 > > this environment more systematically, please?t > >a > > Thanks in advance... > >. > > Regards, > >  > > J.T. > >oG > > P/S. I DO want to learn. If you think you are too much of a guru tonK > > provide information to a dummy, then don't bother. Bring your judgement2/ > > somewhere else or apply it into good use...T   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 12:39:48 -0800e, From: Jennifer Tran <jtran@bms.calstate.edu>) Subject: Re: Need help, thanks in advancet0 Message-ID: <3A256994.F51D6087@bms.calstate.edu>  . Ohhhh, thanks for the advice about my message.   In my mind, I mean well when using the word  legacy system.   I rarely hear anyone using the word "legacy" without respect .....isn't it true that precious things are  "legacy" in some way? Furthermore,  things were built years ago are much more durable and reliablee7 (that's my view and it stands true in all cases...)....e   So, please accept my sincere apology if I offend any of you...If I don't have the respect for this so-call "legacy system", I won't getub the courage to post my message asking for help, and willingly want to learn more about the system.   Regards,   J.T.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 16:35:44 -0500h# From: Jim Agnew <agnew@hsc.vcu.edu> ) Subject: Re: Need help, thanks in advance + Message-ID: <3A2576AF.3CED8490@hsc.vcu.edu>E   sey hey!!! no offense taken.. i was basically trying to warn you, and unintentionally lead you astray..  ;-) alas, to lots of phb'szC legacy is old, reliable, but not looked at well by the trade rags.     Jimd   Jennifer Tran wrote: > 0 > Ohhhh, thanks for the advice about my message. >  > In my mind, I mean well when using the word  legacy system.   I rarely hear anyone using the word "legacy" without respect .....isn't it > true that precious things are  "legacy" in some way? Furthermore,  things were built years ago are much more durable and reliable 9 > (that's my view and it stands true in all cases...)....  >  > So, please accept my sincere apology if I offend any of you...If I don't have the respect for this so-call "legacy system", I won't get d > the courage to post my message asking for help, and willingly want to learn more about the system. > 
 > Regards, >  > J.T.   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 22:01:06 +0000 (   )u3 From: Christopher Smith <chriss@Mufasa.pubserv.com>n) Subject: Re: Need help, thanks in advancexJ Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.05.10011292159220.32744-100000@Mufasa.pubserv.com>  % On Wed, 29 Nov 2000, Jim Agnew wrote:r   > sey hey!!! no offense taken.. i was basically trying to warn you, and unintentionally lead you astray..  ;-) alas, to lots of phb'stE > legacy is old, reliable, but not looked at well by the trade rags.    E I'd differ here slightly.  I think that PHBs don't know or care aboutN reliability, so that would be:  G "Legacy is old(er than whatever the trade rags are into this week), andB& not looked at well by the trade rags."   Regards,   Chris   O ===============================================================================:@ "My two cents"			(http://rootworks.com/twocentsworth.cgi?128562)= Christopher Smith(chriss@pubserv.com)			Prgramer^W Programmer  Prime Synergy of Champaign, IL.V% -------------------------------------nI "Where a calculator on the ENIAC is equipped with 18,000 vacuum tubes and*H weighs 30 tons, computers in the future may have only 1,000 vacuum tubes; and weigh only 1.5 tons." -- Popular Mechanics, March 1949 bO -------------------------------------------------------------------------------a   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 18:22:59 -0800n! From: Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.coma) Subject: Re: Need help, thanks in advancerD Message-ID: <OF2B11ABFE.2D93EE70-ON882569A7.000C61DA@foundation.com>   Legacy (Leg-ah-see):J      1 - The salesman you are currently talking to can't make any money on it. J      2 - Doesn't involve enough buzzwords so your PHBs can't brag to other PHBs about it.#      3 - Something you can rely on.j      4 - Not Microsoft.Y  I Note, 3 and 4 are almost the same thing, but not quite. Microsoft doesn't I have the market cornered in unreliability yet, but they're working on it.y   Shanes .1        G Christopher Smith <chriss@Mufasa.pubserv.com> on 11/29/2000 02:01:06 PM    To:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com  cc:a  * Subject:  Re: Need help, thanks in advance    % On Wed, 29 Nov 2000, Jim Agnew wrote:e  G > sey hey!!! no offense taken.. i was basically trying to warn you, andg= unintentionally lead you astray..  ;-) alas, to lots of phb'seD > legacy is old, reliable, but not looked at well by the trade rags.  E I'd differ here slightly.  I think that PHBs don't know or care aboutt reliability, so that would be:  G "Legacy is old(er than whatever the trade rags are into this week), and-& not looked at well by the trade rags."   Regards,   Chrise  O ===============================================================================f  H "My two cents"           (http://rootworks.com/twocentsworth.cgi?128562)H Christopher Smith(chriss@pubserv.com)              Prgramer^W Programmer Prime Synergy of Champaign, IL.R% -------------------------------------sI "Where a calculator on the ENIAC is equipped with 18,000 vacuum tubes andgH weighs 30 tons, computers in the future may have only 1,000 vacuum tubes: and weigh only 1.5 tons." -- Popular Mechanics, March 1949O -------------------------------------------------------------------------------:   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 21:39:30 -0600i7 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> ) Subject: Re: Need help, thanks in advance - Message-ID: <3A25CBF2.8D9E778C@earthlink.net>A   Jennifer Tran wrote: >  > Hello All: > F > Just to let you know, I am very interested in getting more knowledge, > about the legacy system (i.e. VAX/VMS...). [snip]  > Well, I don't know if you ever actually got a usable answer...  D If you have the documentation set, start with anything pertaining toD system management. That will explain most of the operational issues.D Then, any book that mentions anything about a user's guide (not sureA what that book is entitled these days) would be a good next step.c  B Once you've read some of that, the FAQ will make a bit more sense.  A Otherwise, post again with specific questions. Someone's bound toc respond.   --   David J. Dachterat dba DJE Systemsm http://www.djesys.com/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/8  F This *IS* an OpenVMS-related newsgroup. So, a certain bias in postings is to be expected.  @ Feel free to exercise your rights of free speech and expression.  F However, attacks against individual posters, or groups of posters, are strongly discouraged.t   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 23:50:20 -0500r% From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian>a Subject: Re: OpenVMS CBT$ Message-ID: <3a25dbd5$1@news.si.com>  9 >AcerSoft provides OpenVMS CBT. Please visit the Web sitel; >http://www.acersoft.com for a complete listing of courses.   + Yea, but you have to run it on a Billy box.- -- -A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comMA Smiths Industries, Inc.                   tillman at swdev.si.como= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevente< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------   Date: 29 Nov 2000 20:01:32 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)? Subject: Re: PCSI files (was: Re: Need help, thanks in advance),6 Message-ID: <903nas$1a1$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  _ In article <3A255477.6931080F@bms.calstate.edu>, Jennifer Tran <jtran@bms.calstate.edu> writes:A  C   Um, "legacy" tends to have a derogatory context, and would not be @   wording I would choose, particularly when seeking information.  @   Please also consider including the OpenVMS VAX version and theD   platform when posing a question, and please also pick a title thatF   is relevent to the question -- these details will make it easier to B   answer questions, and the choice of a clear and relevent subjectB   can attract the attention of folks that know the answer and thusF   can get you the answer to your question more quickly -- most anyone G   posting a question is seeking help, and will also likely be thankful A4   for (constructive) answers.  Well, hopefully.  :-)  E :Just to let you know, I am very interested in getting more knowledgei+ :about the legacy system (i.e. VAX/VMS...).n : E :1./   I am trying to get a better understanding of the VMS system onb9 :VAX. I found those files in SYS$SYSROOT node . They are:v :o9 :DEC-AXPVMS-DWMOTIF-V0102-5-1.REFERENCE_PCSI$DESCRIPTION;e : 2 :DEC-AXPVMS-DWMOTIF-V0102-5-1.REFERENCE_PCSI$TLB;1 : 0 :DEC-AXPVMS-OPENVMS-V0702-1-5.PCSI$DESCRIPTION;1 :w( :DEC-AXPVMS-OPENVMS-V0702-1-5.PCSI$TLB;1 :f, :DEC-AXPVMS-VMS-V0702-1-2.PCSI$DESCRIPTION;1 :n$ :DEC-AXPVMS-VMS-V0702-1-2.PCSI$TLB;1    @   These are files related to the Product Installation mechanism.@   OpenVMS VAX does not itself use PCSI for its installation, butB   it does register itself with PCSI for products that do use PCSI.  A   DECwindows Motif and OpenVMS V7.2 -- the latter having two PCSIo4   product names -- are the products involved here.    C   These are also clearly OpenVMS Alpha PCSI files, and the presencet<   of these files is rather unusual on an OpenVMS VAX system.  E   "SYS$SYSROOT" is itself a construct -- a concealed, rooted logical R1   name -- that you will want to learn more about.1  I : Can someone please give me a grief tutorial description as what each of;H :the file is and its functions, how it can be run (or it is in effect at :time of installation...?)    ?   Please leave the various PCSI files alone, most PCSI files ine# they are part of the PCSI database.f    < :2./ Scope bootstrap : what will be done if this is defined?  B   "Scope bootstrap" is PCSI syntax (PCSI is an acronym refering toC   the POLYCENTER Software Installation Utility) for files relevent tD   to the OpenVMS bootstrap.  For details on PCSI syntax, please see:  L   http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/72final/5952/5952pro_005.html#scope_appH   http://www.openvms.compaq.com:8000/72final/5952/5952pro_012.html#scope    I :3./ Any suggestion where I should start and steps I should take to learnt. :this environment more systematically, please?    B   Please see the OpenVMS FAQ for various tutorial information, andC   pointers to the OpenVMS documentation, and pointers to available  B   training and related technical reading material.  For details of?   the PCSI environment, please see the PCSI developer's manual.e    D :P/S. I DO want to learn. If you think you are too much of a guru toH :provide information to a dummy, then don't bother. Bring your judgement, :somewhere else or apply it into good use...  K   Please also consider the inferences that a reader can draw from what you  K   write, too -- written communications are particularly prone to "problems" H   around intended (or entirely unintended) implications (of the writer) G   or inferences (of the reader).  Effective communications is (are?) a  -   task that is (are?) surprisingly difficult.T     No offense is intended.M  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 14:10:29 -08002, From: Jennifer Tran <jtran@bms.calstate.edu>? Subject: Re: PCSI files (was: Re: Need help, thanks in advance)o0 Message-ID: <3A257ED5.8F012E20@bms.calstate.edu>   Hello:  a  Thanks very much for your comments. I guess I really prove I am a dummy in many things! So, I 'dt^ like to apologize in advance for what I am about to write, just in case it confuse/offend you.< Please keep in mind that I don't and NEVER  intend to do so.   Hoff Hoffman wrote:   a > In article <3A255477.6931080F@bms.calstate.edu>, Jennifer Tran <jtran@bms.calstate.edu> writes:  > E >   Um, "legacy" tends to have a derogatory context, and would not be.B >   wording I would choose, particularly when seeking information. > c > First of all, let me start by saying that every technology has its use and I am grateful to those.' > who have contributed to the IT world.p  a > I have had the opportunity to work with different platforms, VAX, IBM mainframe and the "thing" c > people call client/server. I tend to find the older technologies are more reliable with much moretb > functionalities when I gain more knowledge about these technologies..  when someone told me witha > the tongue-in-cheek tone of voice "hey, you're working with the legacy technology!", my respondEa > to them is "yes, and I don't have to reboot the darn machine many times a day as I have to with0[ > the not-so-legacy technology!".  Other than that, I never feel offend but proud. My wrong0] > assumption is if I am not offended by that term, others might not eitheir. This is a lessonh > well-learnt.  F > :P/S. I DO want to learn. If you think you are too much of a guru toJ > :provide information to a dummy, then don't bother. Bring your judgement. > :somewhere else or apply it into good use... > b >   I posted a question in this forum (or maybe a similar one) many years back when I was still in^ > school. It got deleted after a nasy respond coming back to me, the context implied that thisb > usergroup is a forum for the IT people who have certain level of competency . It bugged me untila > now. That was the reason for the P/S message...Never intend to irritate or offend anyone..If iteU > did, then I guess I owe you all another apology.....it's paid: I am truly sorry....0  ? Special thanks to you, Stephen, for pointing my mistakes out...l  # Have a great afternoon, everyone...r   Regards.   J.T.   >  > P >  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------N >    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------   Date: 29 NOV 2000 23:29:32 GMT+ From: Dave Greenwood <greenwoodde@ornl.gov>e? Subject: Re: PCSI files (was: Re: Need help, thanks in advance) 2 Message-ID: <29NOV00.23293282@feda34.fed.ornl.gov>  3 hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) wrote:e >  pa > In article <3A255477.6931080F@bms.calstate.edu>, Jennifer Tran <jtran@bms.calstate.edu> writes:h [snip]G > :Just to let you know, I am very interested in getting more knowledgeo- > :about the legacy system (i.e. VAX/VMS...).h > :uG > :1./   I am trying to get a better understanding of the VMS system on.; > :VAX. I found those files in SYS$SYSROOT node . They are:o > :n; > :DEC-AXPVMS-DWMOTIF-V0102-5-1.REFERENCE_PCSI$DESCRIPTION;h > :H4 > :DEC-AXPVMS-DWMOTIF-V0102-5-1.REFERENCE_PCSI$TLB;1 > :n2 > :DEC-AXPVMS-OPENVMS-V0702-1-5.PCSI$DESCRIPTION;1 > :o* > :DEC-AXPVMS-OPENVMS-V0702-1-5.PCSI$TLB;1 > : . > :DEC-AXPVMS-VMS-V0702-1-2.PCSI$DESCRIPTION;1 > : & > :DEC-AXPVMS-VMS-V0702-1-2.PCSI$TLB;1 >  h >   B >   These are files related to the Product Installation mechanism.B >   OpenVMS VAX does not itself use PCSI for its installation, butD >   it does register itself with PCSI for products that do use PCSI. >  tC >   DECwindows Motif and OpenVMS V7.2 -- the latter having two PCSI 6 >   product names -- are the products involved here.   >   E >   These are also clearly OpenVMS Alpha PCSI files, and the presenceI> >   of these files is rather unusual on an OpenVMS VAX system.  E Even after replacing most of our VAXes with alphas 6 or so years ago,VE we still have a number of people who call our VMS systems "VAXes".  ISA only correct them when I'm feeling picky.  My guess would be that1C Jennifer's in that group at this point (given the presence of those-+ Alpha PCSI files).  But we can fix that ;-);  C Jennifer - try the following commands to show what type of hardwarea you actually have:  *   $ write sys$output f$getsyi("arch_name")(   $ write sys$output f$getsyi("hw_name")  D The first command will tell you whether you have a "VAX" or "Alpha".C The second will give more info about the specific system type.  Forn( more info on "f$getsyi", try the command     $ help lexicals f$getsyi   Dave --------------9 Dave Greenwood                Email: Greenwoodde@ORNL.GOVoH Oak Ridge National Lab        %STD-W-DISCLAIMER, I only speak for myself   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 19:57:18 GMTm From: linuxmtl@my-deja.comG Subject: Plextor SCSI drive vs OpenVMS 6.1-1H1 on AlphStation 200 4/233,) Message-ID: <903n2p$f58$1@nnrp1.deja.com>r  	 Good day,b  F I have an AlphaStation 200 4/233 with OpenVMS 6.1-1H1 with an external SCSI-2 CD drive.  ) The CD is a Plextor Plexwriter RW 4/2/20.d   >>> show deviceg  F returns the device under DKA400 (which concur with the settings on theB drive which is port 4). It also returns the brand and model of theE drive. So, the AlphaStation see clearly what's on the end of the SCSIi cable.  ( I boot the AlphaStation with no problem.  
 $ SHOW DEVICE   9 returns the CD under DKA400: (where it's supposed to be).e  C When doing a mount (mount/over=id or mount/fore/over=id) it returns  always a Fatal Drive Error.a  
 Any clues?   Regards,      & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.a   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 21:32:17 GMT-= From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-) K Subject: Re: Plextor SCSI drive vs OpenVMS 6.1-1H1 on AlphStation 200 4/233e0 Message-ID: <009F3DAA.66CA3F19@SendSpamHere.ORG>  F In article <903n2p$f58$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, linuxmtl@my-deja.com writes:
 >Good day, >uG >I have an AlphaStation 200 4/233 with OpenVMS 6.1-1H1 with an externall >SCSI-2 CD drive.e >a* >The CD is a Plextor Plexwriter RW 4/2/20. >  >>>> show device >hG >returns the device under DKA400 (which concur with the settings on thewC >drive which is port 4). It also returns the brand and model of thetF >drive. So, the AlphaStation see clearly what's on the end of the SCSI >cable.? >r) >I boot the AlphaStation with no problem.m >  >$ SHOW DEVICE >l: >returns the CD under DKA400: (where it's supposed to be). >.D >When doing a mount (mount/over=id or mount/fore/over=id) it returns >always a Fatal Drive Error. >  >Any clues?" >a	 >Regards,  >o >  > ' >Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/  >Before you buy.  I Many of the CD writers report themselves as writable devices in a fashion-I that the DKDRIVER cannot interpret.  The MOUNT command too, because it is ? a writable device, wants to modify the drive in ways it cannot.:  I If you want to use your device to burn CDRs and CDRWs, go ahead.  Get the4I appropriate software and you can use the device to create CDs but you are > likely going to need a simple CDrom to read the CD you create.   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMr            nO city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after them.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 14:38:04 -0800s+ From: "richard n. frank" <rnfrank@llnl.gov> K Subject: Re: Plextor SCSI drive vs OpenVMS 6.1-1H1 on AlphStation 200 4/233 > Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.20001129143730.00acbda0@poptop.llnl.gov>  % Have you tried mounting it read-only?t=                                                          rich(B ------------------------------------------------------------------  @ At 09:32 PM 11/29/00 +0000, Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman- wrote:G >In article <903n2p$f58$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, linuxmtl@my-deja.com writes:s > >Good day, > >fI > >I have an AlphaStation 200 4/233 with OpenVMS 6.1-1H1 with an externalr > >SCSI-2 CD drive.9 > >-, > >The CD is a Plextor Plexwriter RW 4/2/20. > >- > >>>> show device > >aI > >returns the device under DKA400 (which concur with the settings on thenE > >drive which is port 4). It also returns the brand and model of the H > >drive. So, the AlphaStation see clearly what's on the end of the SCSI	 > >cable.a > >e+ > >I boot the AlphaStation with no problem.r > >  > >$ SHOW DEVICE > >n< > >returns the CD under DKA400: (where it's supposed to be). > > F > >When doing a mount (mount/over=id or mount/fore/over=id) it returns > >always a Fatal Drive Error. > >o
 > >Any clues?  > >t > >Regards,n > >t > >q > > ) > >Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/d > >Before you buy. >bJ >Many of the CD writers report themselves as writable devices in a fashionJ >that the DKDRIVER cannot interpret.  The MOUNT command too, because it is@ >a writable device, wants to modify the drive in ways it cannot. >9J >If you want to use your device to burn CDRs and CDRWs, go ahead.  Get theJ >appropriate software and you can use the device to create CDs but you are? >likely going to need a simple CDrom to read the CD you create.l >y >--t+ >VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: i& >AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM >iK >city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after a >them.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 23:58:42 GMTh= From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-)=K Subject: Re: Plextor SCSI drive vs OpenVMS 6.1-1H1 on AlphStation 200 4/233o0 Message-ID: <009F3DBE.DAF0D609@SendSpamHere.ORG>  l In article <4.2.0.58.20001129143730.00acbda0@poptop.llnl.gov>, "richard n. frank" <rnfrank@llnl.gov> writes:& >Have you tried mounting it read-only?    Are you disputing what I said?      . $ MOUNT/NOWRITE/OVERRIDE=IDENTIFICATION DKA500% %MOUNT-F-FORMAT, invalid media formatg   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM-            -O city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after them.    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 00:44:08 GMTi( From: Terry Kennedy <terry@gate.tmk.com>K Subject: Re: Plextor SCSI drive vs OpenVMS 6.1-1H1 on AlphStation 200 4/233r' Message-ID: <G4tBDK.Fzw@spcuna.spc.edu>    linuxmtl@my-deja.com writes:+ > The CD is a Plextor Plexwriter RW 4/2/20.sE > When doing a mount (mount/over=id or mount/fore/over=id) it returnsa > always a Fatal Drive Error.f  I   1) make sure you have the sector size set to 512 bytes (jumper 7 ON forn7      internal drives; switch 4 ON for external drives)..1   2) give the /nowrite option when mounting mediarI   3) have the latest SCSI driver update for your VMS version, apparently:nP      http://ftp1.support.compaq.com/public/vms/axp/v6.1-1h1/alpscsi04_061.README  I   While I haven't used your specific combination of products, I have used.J a Plextor reader (only) on VMS 7.0, as well as other writers on a CMD con-+ troller, and I've seen these errors before.s  4         Terry Kennedy             http://www.tmk.com5         terry@tmk.com             Jersey City, NJ USAo   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 19:04:58 -0600e7 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net>   Subject: Re: SW Raid 310 and VMS- Message-ID: <3A25A7BA.D7F355C3@earthlink.net>-   Mike Price wrote:e > H > > I don't think HSZTERM is supported any longer. As I wrote in anotherG > > reply, I beleive Dave Gudewicz does not have a RA310, but a RA3000.v& > > That one does not run HSOF or ACS. > >  > > > [snip] > > >c- > > > I don't think there's much to it beyondb  > SYS$SYSTEM:HSZTERM$SCSIPAD.EXE? > > > and possibly HSZTERM_USER_GUIDE.PS, but I could be wrong.a > >sC > > I haven't looked in the kit, but I'd expect a .CLD, too because.F > > OpenVMS Alpha V6.2-1H3 (at least, my system :-) doesn't understand > > '$ SET HOST/SCSI'. > >  >  > General warning to all6 > Do not try to use SWCC at the same time as HSZTERM.   $ Do not try to us SWCC - *PERIOD* !!!   > HSZTERm is not > offically supported   G As are all of the known ways to communicate with HSx controllers from adE batch job. Not sure why that is, or what can be done about it, but itcH remains one of the many obstacles to getting OpenVMS + StorageWorks into more sites, IMO.  4 > anyway but if you try to use the 2 together soonerH > ofr later the 2 will send requests to the controller at the same time.  , May also happen with HSDSA and SET HOST/DUP.   -- c David J. DachteraV dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/w  F This *IS* an OpenVMS-related newsgroup. So, a certain bias in postings is to be expected.  @ Feel free to exercise your rights of free speech and expression.  F However, attacks against individual posters, or groups of posters, are strongly discouraged.k   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 02:32:32 GMTs/ From: "Robert Meyer" <meyerra@worldnet.att.net>,' Subject: Tape Drive replacement optionswF Message-ID: <4%iV5.2579$Ei1.159309@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>  J Our Alpha server is on it's 3rd tape drive from Compaq. The tapes are new,J and Compaq sends a Digital service person.   I have an external 4mm HP DATI DDS II tape drive.  Does the Alpha recognize an HP, and if it does, can IIL get drivers to connect, or am I limited to only Compaq/Digital.  I also haveI an older DLT III.  If I connect this onto a SCSI Channel, will the systemNL recognize, if not are drivers available?  Thank you in advance for your time
 and patience.s   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 22:10:44 -0500l, From: Howard S Shubs <hshubs@mindspring.com>+ Subject: Re: Tape Drive replacement optionso> Message-ID: <hshubs-25A38E.22104429112000@news.mindspring.com>  G In article <4%iV5.2579$Ei1.159309@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>, O0 "Robert Meyer" <meyerra@worldnet.att.net> wrote:  K >Our Alpha server is on it's 3rd tape drive from Compaq. The tapes are new,sK >and Compaq sends a Digital service person.   I have an external 4mm HP DATtJ >DDS II tape drive.  Does the Alpha recognize an HP, and if it does, can IM >get drivers to connect, or am I limited to only Compaq/Digital.  I also have J >an older DLT III.  If I connect this onto a SCSI Channel, will the systemM >recognize, if not are drivers available?  Thank you in advance for your time  >and patience.  L All the above should work.  The HP device may not show up perfectly, so you L might have to specify certain attributes using documentation provided by HP. -- i Howard S ShubsD "Run in circles, scream and shout!"  "I hope you have good backups!"   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 21:51:22 -0600t7 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net>l+ Subject: Re: Tape Drive replacement optionsg- Message-ID: <3A25CEBA.EF25D174@earthlink.net>    Robert Meyer wrote:n > L > Our Alpha server is on it's 3rd tape drive from Compaq. The tapes are new,L > and Compaq sends a Digital service person.   I have an external 4mm HP DATK > DDS II tape drive.  Does the Alpha recognize an HP, and if it does, can I N > get drivers to connect, or am I limited to only Compaq/Digital.  I also haveK > an older DLT III.  If I connect this onto a SCSI Channel, will the systemiN > recognize, if not are drivers available?  Thank you in advance for your time > and patience.n  H Well, you don't mention which operating system you have, so we'll assume& it's OpenVMS ("comp.os.vms", get it?).  B You also don't mention what trouble you're having. So, pardon, the broad-focus response.t  C In the first place, I don't recommend 4mm. The media is fragile and C lacks stamina, IMO. Experience of a former disaster recovery site'si8 personnel with 4mm is less than ideal, to say the least.  G In the second place, make sure the SCSI id.'s don't clash. Refer to theH< device documentation to see how to set that. With the deviceD disconnected, issue the "show devices" command at the console promptE (">>>") to what SCSI id.'s are currently in use. Choose an unused id.:D for the tape drive. Then, power down the machine, connect the drive,H power up the drive then the machine and issue the console command again,H "show devices" and see if the device appears. If not, make sure the SCSI' interface is compatible with the drive.   F Once the device shows up at the console, then boot up the o.s. and seeC if it appears there. In VMS, you're looking at the "SHOW DEVICE MK" 6 display. Other o.s.? You'll need someone else's input.   -- n David J. Dachterae dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  : Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page and Message Board: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   F This *IS* an OpenVMS-related newsgroup. So, a certain bias in postings is to be expected.  @ Feel free to exercise your rights of free speech and expression.  F However, attacks against individual posters, or groups of posters, are strongly discouraged.h   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 00:35:28 -0500i, From: Howard S Shubs <hshubs@mindspring.com>+ Subject: Re: Tape Drive replacement optionse> Message-ID: <hshubs-9D3902.00352830112000@news.mindspring.com>  B In article <3A25CEBA.EF25D174@earthlink.net>, "David J. Dachtera" $ <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> wrote:  D >In the first place, I don't recommend 4mm. The media is fragile andD >lacks stamina, IMO. Experience of a former disaster recovery site's9 >personnel with 4mm is less than ideal, to say the least.d  O Interesting.  I've been using DAT and DDS2 tapes since the TLZ04 10 years ago, PN and I've never yet lost data from a tape.  Maybe I'm just lucky.  I also have ( a 17 year old 9-track which still works. --   Howard S ShubsD "Run in circles, scream and shout!"  "I hope you have good backups!"   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 06:02:18 GMTt) From: "Rob Brown" <robbrown@shaw.wave.ca>s' Subject: Re: TPU bug ? (cut large part)iJ Message-ID: <01c05a93$53450b20$bf0c4018@cs918188-a.edmw1.ab.wave.home.com>  8 JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote in article# <3A19C28B.7586B6CE@videotron.ca>...iI > Editing a postscript file which hexadecimal data. Maximum record lengthl of 76e& > bytes. File is variable length file. >  > K > So, I select a whole bunch of that hexadecimal text, and try to CUT it. Ig geta > the message: > * > 				"Line truncated to 65535 characters" >  >  ...J > I don't ever recall seing such a limit in how much one can cut/paste. Is that@ > something about my process quota, or a hard limit in TPU/EVE ?   I've always seen this limit.  ! After making your selection, try:e  $ <DO>TPU ERASE (SELECT_RANGE)<RETURN>   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 17:23:37 +130029 From: "Antony Wardle" <antony.wardle@nnnoospam.met.co.nz>d Subject: Re: UCX questiono3 Message-ID: <_AkV5.49067$SF5.907095@ozemail.com.au>a   So is that a different way of doing   @sys$update:ucx$config     Antony      J "Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-" <system@SendSpamHere.ORG> wrote in message* news:009F3C8E.E3A60EA9@SendSpamHere.ORG...@ > In article <3A234338.48E5C467@yahoo.com>, jkim@dpc.com writes:H > >I am unfamiliar with VMS and guyshy about manking changes for fear of4 >                               ^^^^^^       ^^^^^^^ >H> > Gee Jean, I hope these were typos and not freudian slips. :) >CI > >messing things up beyond recognition.  That said, I need to change the0B > >default gateway on our DEC Alpha system.  Can someone help out? >1 >  > If you're using UCX, issue:. >I > $ UCX  > UCX> SET NOROUTE/DEFAULT$ > UCX> SET NOROUTE/DEFAULT/PERMANENT. > UCX> SET ROUTE/DEFAULT/GATEWAY=<##.##.##.##>8 > UCX> SET ROUTE/DEFAULT/GATEWAY=<##.##.##.##>/PERMANENT >i > --4 > VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001 VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM >eK > city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after. them.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 00:10:44 -0500 % From: "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian>n7 Subject: Re: VMS Apache and CGI - still having problemsV" Message-ID: <3a25e2fb@news.si.com>  ) >The latest updates can be obtained from:uF ><http://www.openvms.compaq.com/openvms/products/ips/apache/csws.html>   But it won't unpack on my VAX! -- hA Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comlA Smiths Industries, Inc.                   tillman at swdev.si.coma= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to preventr< Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 22:14:57 +0000e( From: Alan Fay <alan.fay@btinternet.com> Subject: VMS System Backup1 Message-ID: <903r7n$ial$1@uranium.btinternet.com>   B     Before I say anything, I would just  like  to  say  I  am  the/     author of the VERITAS NetBackUp VMS Client.a  B     The original design implementation was from Solaris  UNIX.  ItB     contained a large number of  UNIX  style  command  lines  with0     associated '-options' and other 'UNIX-isms'.  B     I modified as many of these 'UNIX-isms'  as  I  could  to  useB     proper VMS command syntax with /QUALIFIERS and VALUES. I  alsoB     supported only native OpenVMS file specifications and  logicalB     names wherever I could. The VMS Client also backs up  100%  of     the VMS file attributes.  B     I tried to make the implementation as  VMS  like  as  possible>     (yes I like VMS and have worked with VMS for a long time).  B     The VMS client can (and does) backup and  restore  very  largeB     'user-data' disk arrays. The NetBackUp Robots and medis stocksB     can be very large and very expensive. It makes sense to  shareB     this cost with UNIX users in the same organization. Often  VMS6     users get access to these vast resources for free.  B     VMS system disks are usually small (2 to 4G) and  are  usuallyB     kept separate from large 'user-data'  databases.  Sharing  the6     system disk with large databases is not efficient.  B     I have a number of 36G disks but none of  them  are  a  systemB     disk. These are the disks I work on. The largest system disk I     have is 4G on an Alpha.t  B     I use the VMS Client to backup all my 36G disks. Why?  BecauseB     those backups will efficiently use every inch of the DLT tapesB     that I possess without me taking  any  special  steps,  and  I     backup daily.d  B     For disaster recovery I use VMS BACKUP  to  backup  my  systemB     disks. I have twelve system disk backups on my bookshelf. EachB     DLT tape is a single /IMAGE backup of  the  system  disk.  TheB     most recent system disk backup is two months  ago.  My  oldest)     system disk backup is nine years old.=       alan      '     ,---------------------------------. '     |         O p e n V M S           | '     |          Programming            |.'     |           Alan Fay              |h'     |     Author of the VERITAS       |e'     |    NetBackUp OpenVMS Client     | '     |    Phone (0044) 1264 771678     | '     | Nr. Andover, Hampshire, England |t'     |  Email alan.fay@btinternet.com  | '     `---------------------------------'R   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 12:28:03 -0800d1 From: "Randy Park" <rjpark@mindspring.com.nospam>e0 Subject: Re: What happened to www.graysoft.com?!2 Message-ID: <903ou4$krp$1@slb7.atl.mindspring.net>  6 I just connected to their web page.  The page appeared7 but with a broken link to an image. I then followed onef4 of their links successfully. When I went back to the! previous page the image appeared.r  2 So, it looks like their web pages are still there.  ; Timothy Stark <sword7@grace.speakeasy.org> wrote in message32 news:zB7V5.61968$DG3.1190377@news2.giganews.com... > Hello folks: >aI > Yesterday and today, I tried to access (surf) GrayMatter's web site for J > VAX printing software but it is down.  Yesterday, I received that serverE > is not found or so.  Today I tried that again but my web browser isA  > waiting for responses forever. >$7 > Does anyone have access to its web site successfully? & > Its web address is www.graysoft.com. >/ > Thank you! >6 > -- Tim Stark >r > --. > Timothy Stark <>< Inet: sword7@speakeasy.orgL > --------------------------------------------------------------------------G > "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that J > whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.0 > Amen." -- John 3:16 (King James Version Bible)   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 23:29:15 GMT * From: Alan E. Feldman <alan48@my-deja.com>6 Subject: Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs?) Message-ID: <9043g3$q4p$1@nnrp1.deja.com>e  ! -- (Font-fixer for deja readers!)r  - First of all, thanks to all respondents(sp?).s  + In article <9m$Y0lDYuRX$@eisner.decus.org>,:/   koehler@eisner.decus.org (Bob Koehler) wrote:fG > In article <901bj8$id8$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, Alan E. Feldman <alan48@my-  deja.com> writes: A > > Why does it take so much virtual memory to run this tiny job?e > >t > > $ type show-work.com > > $    SHOW WORK > > $   > > $    SHOW PROCESS/ACCOUNTING > > $C
 > > $    EXIT  > >t7 > > Here is the part of the log file after SYLOGIN.COM:r > >C >b > [...]e >lE > >  Direct I/O count:          26  Peak virtual size:           3077t >VE > Probably depends very much on what is in SYLOGIN.COM and LOGIN.COM.S  C I included these two files at the end of this post. As you can see,e% they're pretty much just vanilla VMS.-  ; > Any one image activation could easily map the 3077 pages.   E Just what is this mapping (read on)? I thought image activation readsRG pages into physical memory, in which case they'd be part of the workinggB set. No? How else can the image run if it's not read into physical memory?3   >0> > Unless the virtual map becomes so big it causes you to raiseH > VIRTUALPAGECNT on a VAX (obsolete on Alpha), what do you care?  MemoryC > utilization and page file utilization are most likely much lower.F  F I only care because I want a better understanding of how VMS uses, and; reports use of, virtual memory. (I'd also like to get theseiG inconsistently-named terms straightened out. Pick a name for a quantityhD and stick with it!) The Performance Manual makes no mention of whereE these "extra" pages come from. I thought that virtual memory includedrF the pages in physical memory (process-private pages plus global pages)G *plus* any pages owned by the process in the modified page list and the E page file. Since the process never exceeded WSDEFAULT, it should havemF no pages in either the modified page cache or the page file. So that'sB why I was wondering where the extra pages in "peak page file" cameD from. Apparently, there is more than that to virtual memory. I guess; this "mapping" mentioned above has something to do with it.t  D Another repsonse said "I would think that the pages in the VA not inE the WS would be address space that has been created but not used.  IfhG LIB$GETVM is called such that it just allocates a bunch of VA space but @ this space doesn't get touched by the process it will never haveC physical memory allocated to it and thus not show up in the working  set."    Why is VA created but not used?    Another response:   = "It's a feature of using shared rather than statically linked G libraries. You get to map a whole load of pages that you don't need but.> it's a cheap operation and saves real memory. And with a batchF file, you get to map the DCL interpreter too. Unless I am mistaken all7 these count to the total, which is only ~1.5MB anyway."   E How does this save "real memory"? I don't know what this "linking" of G libraries is. And isn't a copy of DCL already living as global pages in G physical memory? According to WORKSET.COM, global pages are part of theMC working set. And DCL is only about 200 pages/blocks big. What's thee deal here? TIA.    $ type sylogin.com $!B $! This command procedure is always run when anybody on the entire systemF $! logs in. It is equivalent to LOGIN.COM except that the instructionsC $! contained herein are executed everytime anyone on the VMS systems $! logs in to their account. $!E $! For interactive processes, turn on Control T, and set the terminala type $!6 $ IF (F$MODE() .EQS. "INTERACTIVE") THEN SET CONTROL=T> $! IF (F$MODE() .EQS. "INTERACTIVE") THEN SET TERMINAL/INQUIRE $!= $! For MicroVAX systems only, use the command MOUNT/NOASSIST.a $!G $! IF (.NOT. F$TRNLNM("SYS$MICROVAX")) THEN GOTO SKIP_MICROVAX_COMMANDSe $ MOU*NT :== MOUNT/NOASSISTi $SKIP_MICROVAX_COMMANDS: $!0 $! Place your site-specific LOGIN commands below $type sys$manager:welcome.txta $    $ type login.com $!C $! This command procedure is a framework for building an individualPB $! login command procedure. It is executed every time that you log $! into your account.w $!5 $  IF F$MODE() .NES. "INTERACTIVE" THEN GOTO ENDINTER  $!C $! Put commands that you want executed only on an interactive logine3 $! between this comment and the "ENDINTER:" symbol.  $! $ set term/dev=vt200E $ SHUTDOWN  == "@SYS$SYSTEM:SHUTDOWN 0 SHUTDOWN YES NO LATER NO NONE"0C $ REBOOT == "@SYS$SYSTEM:SHUTDOWN 0 SHUTDOWN YES NO LATER YES NONE"c% $ SHUTDOWN1 == "@SYS$SYSTEM:SHUTDOWN"s $ set control=(y)$ $.
 $ENDINTER:/ $  IF F$MODE() .NES. "BATCH" THEN GOTO ENDBATCHr $!A $! Put commands you want executed only in batch mode between thiss commentg $! and the "ENDBATCH:" symbol. $! $a
 $ENDBATCH: $!B $! Put commands that you want executed in any mode of login below. $! $e  E If you wish to e-mail me, please do not use the deja address; it doeseG not work (well, most of the time, anyhow; it did work once). Please useeH either of the addresses given below, removing the long wrong part first.   -- Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldman  &-)/ w: afeldman@gfigroup.BorisYeltsinCooksCajun.com05 h: alan48@dellnet.YouCantBelieveEverythingYouRead.comc    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.5   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 23:51:22 GMT9* From: Alan E. Feldman <alan48@my-deja.com>6 Subject: Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs?) Message-ID: <9044po$r6v$1@nnrp1.deja.com>m  ! -- (Font-fixer for deja readers!)m  1 In article <3A250E10.1AA7725@clarityconnect.com>,n4   "Mark D. Jilson" <jilly@clarityconnect.com> wrote:A > Yes Peak Virtual & Peak Pagefile are actually Peak Virtual.  WemH > documented this in a DSNLink article.  I would think that the pages inG > the VA not in the WS would be address space that has been created buteG > not used.  If LIB$GETVM is called such that it just allocates a bunch  ofD > VA space but this space doesn't get touched by the process it will neveriB > have physical memory allocated to it and thus not show up in the working-  3 Why is the system creating VA that never gets used?   H > set.  You really need to get a better look at the process and see whatF > the PPGCNT, GPGCNT, WSSIZE.  The following is my modification of the' > command procedure in the VMS doc set.v  6 Okay, I assume the new functions from WORKSET1.COM are  E > $ ! WORKSET1.COM - Command file to display working set information.rB > $ !       Requires 'WORLD' privilege to display other processes. > [...]r* > $ pagfilcnt = F$GETJPI('pid,"PAGFILCNT")( > $ virtpeak = F$GETJPI('pid,"VIRTPEAK") > [...]   G Well, I ran pagfilcnt and got a really huge number. Okay. I expect thatlD since the system account's page file quota is slightly larger. But I) think virtpeak is the important one here.e  # Results from an interactive sesion:   $ $ virtpeak = F$GETJPI("","VIRTPEAK") $ sh sym virt*7   VIRTPEAK = 3205   Hex = 00000C85  Octal = 00000006205s $e $ show proc/accO  G 29-NOV-2000 18:37:21.34   User: SYSTEM           Process ID:   000019C5'G                           Node: IDS08            Process name: "_RTA1:"    Accounting information:mA  Buffered I/O count:       110  Peak working set size:        442sA  Direct I/O count:          23  Peak virtual size:           3205aA  Page faults:              640  Mounted volumes:                0   Images activated:           5)  Elapsed CPU time:          0 00:00:00.18 )  Connect time:              0 00:03:20.42e $ show work >   Working Set      /Limit= 895   /Quota= 1790    /Extent= 2048G   Adjustment enabled    Authorized Quota= 1790  Authorized Extent= 2048i $   A Same issue. Why is the peak virtual space so much larger than the + working set which never exceeded WSDEFAULT?e  D At the last minute, I decided to run the whole workset.com I already have:h  1                           Working Set Informationl  D                                    WS    WS    WS    WS  Pages  PageE Username    Processname   State  Extnt Quota Deflt  Size in WS faultse Image E SYSTEM      _RTA1:         CUR    2048  1790   895   895   359   1240.  E NOTE: *If* you wish to e-mail me, note that the deja address does not/B work; use one of the two below (omitting the wrong part!) instead.
 Thank you. -- Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldman  &-)/ w: afeldman@gfigroup.BorisYeltsinCooksCajun.coma5 h: alan48@dellnet.YouCantBelieveEverythingYouRead.como    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.-   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2000 00:27:35 GMTr* From: Alan E. Feldman <alan48@my-deja.com>6 Subject: Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs?) Message-ID: <9046tg$t1k$1@nnrp1.deja.com>r  ! -- (Font-fixer for deja readers!)D  + In article <9033p4$m20@newton.cc.rl.ac.uk>,y-   "Richard Brodie" <R.Brodie@rl.ac.uk> wrote:  >cE > "Alan E. Feldman" <alan48@my-deja.com> wrote in message news:901bj8. $id8$1@nnrp1.deja.com... >tA > > Why does it take so much virtual memory to run this tiny job?tE > >  Direct I/O count:          26  Peak virtual size:           3077e >Z> > It's a feature of using shared rather than statically linked
 libraries.> > You get to map a whole load of pages that you don't need but@ > it's a cheap operation and saves real memory. And with a batchD > file, you get to map the DCL interpreter too. Unless I am mistaken< > all these count to the total, which is only ~1.5MB anyway.   Thanks for your response.U  E So I guess that what you're saying is that the process is "mapping" a8F large chunk quickly which for some reason is faster than "digging" forF the small chunk you need. And I guess that statically linked librariesF are linked at compile time, but shared ones are sitting around, linkedG at run time. OK. But where is this mapping mentioned in the Performance D Manual? It is based on my reading of that that this question arises.C (Hey, "that that this" without punctuation!) So I guess the "extra"v@ pages are those that were mapped to, but not actually read into,D physical memory. So the process makes a map of some stuff on disk itA might need, and that stuff is part of virtual memory? Why is thate considered part of VM? TIA.G   >T >>   -- Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. Feldman  &-)/ w: afeldman@gfigroup.BorisYeltsinCooksCajun.comd5 h: alan48@dellnet.YouCantBelieveEverythingYouRead.comU    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy..   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2000 19:29:11 -0600 / From: Chris Scheers <chris@applied-synergy.com>s6 Subject: Re: Why so much virtual memory for tiny jobs?O Message-ID: <0AB23D7B87891B6B.01972E4BDE9ECF1E.D6B468438FFED815@lp.airnews.net>c   "Alan E. Feldman" wrote: > # > -- (Font-fixer for deja readers!)g > / > First of all, thanks to all respondents(sp?).^ > - > In article <9m$Y0lDYuRX$@eisner.decus.org>,y1 >   koehler@eisner.decus.org (Bob Koehler) wrote:gI > > In article <901bj8$id8$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, Alan E. Feldman <alan48@my-w > deja.com> writes:yC > > > Why does it take so much virtual memory to run this tiny job?  > > >  > > > $ type show-work.com > > > $    SHOW WORK > > > $T" > > > $    SHOW PROCESS/ACCOUNTING > > > $< > > > $    EXITC > > >R9 > > > Here is the part of the log file after SYLOGIN.COM:A > > >p > > 	 > > [...]c > > G > > >  Direct I/O count:          26  Peak virtual size:           3077e > >eG > > Probably depends very much on what is in SYLOGIN.COM and LOGIN.COM.- > E > I included these two files at the end of this post. As you can see,n' > they're pretty much just vanilla VMS.h > = > > Any one image activation could easily map the 3077 pages.o > G > Just what is this mapping (read on)? I thought image activation reads.I > pages into physical memory, in which case they'd be part of the working!D > set. No? How else can the image run if it's not read into physical	 > memory?s  G Actualy, image activation just maps images into memory, it doesn't loadn them.E  A Mapping an image into memory consists (simplisticly) of reserving B virtual memory for the image and pointing the information for that! virtual memory back to the image.-  G When the image activator jumps to the starting address for the image, aFC fault occurs (because the virtual memory does not yet exist in real D memory).  The fault handler then causes the page to be read from theF image into memory.  At this point, the page exists both in the workingA set (real memory) and in virtual memory.  The instruction is then - retried and the application starts executing.r  A This continues during the execution of the image.  The only pages F actually brought into the working set are the pages that are "touched" by the program.   B Basically, virtual pages are those pages that are reserved for theF process and might be used.  Working set pages are those pages that are currently in real memory.M  C Note: There are various mechanisms in VMS that can trim the working A set.  This removes pages from a process's working set, making theyG physical memory used by these pages available to other processes.  As alH result, the working set can actually shrink while a process is running. / Thus the importance of "peak" working set size.    > >e@ > > Unless the virtual map becomes so big it causes you to raiseJ > > VIRTUALPAGECNT on a VAX (obsolete on Alpha), what do you care?  MemoryE > > utilization and page file utilization are most likely much lower.l > H > I only care because I want a better understanding of how VMS uses, and= > reports use of, virtual memory. (I'd also like to get thesesI > inconsistently-named terms straightened out. Pick a name for a quantityrF > and stick with it!) The Performance Manual makes no mention of whereG > these "extra" pages come from. I thought that virtual memory includedkH > the pages in physical memory (process-private pages plus global pages)I > *plus* any pages owned by the process in the modified page list and theeG > page file. Since the process never exceeded WSDEFAULT, it should havesH > no pages in either the modified page cache or the page file. So that'sD > why I was wondering where the extra pages in "peak page file" cameF > from. Apparently, there is more than that to virtual memory. I guess= > this "mapping" mentioned above has something to do with it.o > F > Another repsonse said "I would think that the pages in the VA not inG > the WS would be address space that has been created but not used.  If I > LIB$GETVM is called such that it just allocates a bunch of VA space but B > this space doesn't get touched by the process it will never haveE > physical memory allocated to it and thus not show up in the working  > set."a > ! > Why is VA created but not used?-  E LIB$GETVM is called to get a "chunk" of memory.  When LIB$GETVM needs,E memory, it allocates more than it needs.  If this extra memory is not.H used, i.e., not "touched", it will not be faulted into the working set. ( It will only exist as a virtual address.  $ LIB$GETVM does this for two reasons:  G 1)  To reduce the overhead of subsequent calls to LIB$GETVM.  The extratE memory is already available to LIB$GETVM, so the overhead of a systemgF call to get more memory is avoided.  This memory is sometimes called a
 heap or pool.o  H 2)  To aid in memory reuse.  Assume that you have two calls to LIB$GETVMF that each return 1 page of memory.  Then you LIB$FREEVM these blocks. B Finally, you make another call to LIB$GETVM to allocate 2 pages of memory.   G If LIB$GETVM only allocated as much memory as it needed, the third calliH would need to allocate more memory to get a 2 page chunk.  But since the@ first call allocated multile pages, the second call to LIB$GETVMG returned the page right after the first.  When both of these pages wererE LIB$FREEVMed, they became available to the third LIB$GETVM, so it was-& not necessary to allocate more memory.  B Please be aware that this example omits a lot of details.  It is a (much) simplified example.  + I hope that this helps.  (And makes sense!)u  E PS:  If you want more information about what is going on here, please)G obtain a copy of the OpenVMS I&DS (Internals and Data Structures) book.   G -----------------------------------------------------------------------u$ Chris Scheers, Applied Synergy, Inc.  C Voice: 817-237-3360            Internet: chris@applied-synergy.com     Fax: 817-237-3074t   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2000.668 ************************