1 INFO-VAX	Wed, 11 Oct 2000	Volume 2000 : Issue 569       Contents: Re: After RTFFAQ :-) Re: After RTFFAQ :-)6 Announcement: TCGMSG for OpenVMS/ALPHA; 64 bit Version: Re: Announcement: TCGMSG for OpenVMS/ALPHA; 64 bit Version: RE: Announcement: TCGMSG for OpenVMS/ALPHA; 64 bit Version: Re: Announcement: TCGMSG for OpenVMS/ALPHA; 64 bit Version BMC/PATROL X HEROIX ROBOMON = Re: Byte orders (Help making a project of mine more portable) = Re: Byte orders (Help making a project of mine more portable)  cd player: CDROM_AUDIO.C Re: comp.org.encompass.us  Copying Directories via DecNet" Re: Copying Directories via DecNet  DCPS and HP 8100 series printers0 get the number of files in a directory with DCL?4 Re: get the number of files in a directory with DCL?4 Re: get the number of files in a directory with DCL?4 Re: get the number of files in a directory with DCL?4 Re: get the number of files in a directory with DCL?4 Re: get the number of files in a directory with DCL?7 Re: Get Viagra at the lowest prices available anywhere! ' Re: Getting Compaq to advertise OpenVMS ( Good news from the Alpha processor front, Re: Good news from the Alpha processor front, Re: Good news from the Alpha processor front, Re: Good news from the Alpha processor front, Re: Good news from the Alpha processor front, Re: Good news from the Alpha processor front Re: heap manager? 0 Re: I'm looking for a job and offering a reward! IP Address Extraction  Re: IP Address Extraction  Re: IP Address Extraction  Re: IP Address Extraction % Re: no MMOV sound on AlphaStation 500  No System Password Re: No System Password RE: No System Password Re: nonfree Freeware Re: OpenVMS in Oil companies Re: OpenVMS Integrated products  Re: OpenVMS Integrated products  Re: OpenVMS Integrated products  Re: OpenVMS Integrated products  Re: OpenVMS Integrated products  Re: OpenVMS Integrated products  Re: OpenVMS Integrated products  Re: OpenVMS Sessions at CETS< Re: Print Queue jams if 2 print outs are queued to together? Re: Rename File Question. Restore from *.bck (backup) onto UNIX platform2 Re: Restore from *.bck (backup) onto UNIX platform" Re: Second ethernet for uVAX3180 ?& Re: Shark x Penguin : The OpenVMS Logo! Re: Sun Hardware problems persist % Support of JDK 1.2 on OpenVMS AXP 7.1 ) Re: Support of JDK 1.2 on OpenVMS AXP 7.1  Re: SYSMAN can use DECnet  tcp/ip v4 lpd problem / Re: Thinking of switching from Multinet to UCX. / Re: Trade-offs regarding Installed Known Images   VAX 4000-100 low responding time! Re: VAX Decompiler / Disassembler   VAX<>Alpha Software distribution Re: VMS databases for hobbyist?  Re: VMS databases for hobbyist? C Re: What would be your ultimate dream VMS machine (desktop/tower) ? C Re: What would be your ultimate dream VMS machine (desktop/tower) ? C Re: What would be your ultimate dream VMS machine (desktop/tower) ?   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 09:26:19 GMT % From: A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig)  Subject: Re: After RTFFAQ :-) 1 Message-ID: <39e431be.152907028@news.newsguy.com>   @ On 10 Oct 2000 21:44:21 GMT, hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) wrote:     M >:If you're on an OpenVMS Cluster, it also depends on some SYSGEN parameters. N >:If you CTL-P and wait too long to <C>ontinue, you will crash with a CLUEXIT.B >:The other nodes will have assumed the node has left the cluster. > H >  CONTINUE may or may not resume after a halt -- on upcoming platforms,L >  OpenVMS Engineering is expecting that there will be too much I/O context H >  and that reboot or similar will be required.  Once the console passesG >  control to OpenVMS, OpenVMS will not be able to pass back the system G >  console I/O environment to the console in a restart-able/re-entrant  > >  fashion.  CONTINUE will not be available, in other words.    D So no more ability to manually reset quorum from the console after a8 hang? There have been a few times I've found this handy.   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 11:50:47 +0100   From: steven.reece@quintiles.com Subject: Re: After RTFFAQ :-) H Message-ID: <OF061DCA63.9CDF358D-ON80256975.003B3819@qedi.quintiles.com>  K My immediate reaction to this would be "it depends upon what portion of the K IO context was being changed".  If the cluster is inquorate then there will F be no user processing going on, user IOs should be paused etc.  SCS isI still running since the node has to be aware of something coming along to J join the cluster and make it quorate again.  Similarly, the cluster has toH be able to check (if a quorum disk were to be available) that the quorumI disk is trusted by this cluster and does not belong to another cluster on  the same storage. J There again, is the IPC fix actually a _supported_ way of restoring quorum$ or is the supported way to use AMDS?   Steve.   Alan Greig commented/quoted : C >>>On 10 Oct 2000 21:44:21 GMT, hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff  Hoffman) wrote:     A >:If you're on an OpenVMS Cluster, it also depends on some SYSGEN  parameters. E >:If you CTL-P and wait too long to <C>ontinue, you will crash with a  CLUEXIT.B >:The other nodes will have assumed the node has left the cluster. > H >  CONTINUE may or may not resume after a halt -- on upcoming platforms,K >  OpenVMS Engineering is expecting that there will be too much I/O context H >  and that reboot or similar will be required.  Once the console passesG >  control to OpenVMS, OpenVMS will not be able to pass back the system F >  console I/O environment to the console in a restart-able/re-entrant< >  fashion.  CONTINUE will not be available, in other words.  D So no more ability to manually reset quorum from the console after a; hang? There have been a few times I've found this handy.<<<    ------------------------------    Date: 11 Oct 2000 14:45:10 +0100C From: vaxinf@chclu.chemie.uni-konstanz.de (Eberhard Heuser-Hofmann) ? Subject: Announcement: TCGMSG for OpenVMS/ALPHA; 64 bit Version - Message-ID: <39e460d6.0@news.uni-konstanz.de>  Keywords: Parallel processing    Hi,   3 I've promised to work on a crossplatform version of  tcgmsg for vms.   ' A "64bit" version now is available from   , ftp://v36.chemie.uni-konstanz.de/tcgmsg_vms/  5 you may retrieve TCGMSG_VMS.ZIP that consists of both 9 version (32/64 bit) or get tcgmsg_vms_64bit.zip directly.   5 Now this new version talks with Tru64-Alphas or other C machines with IEEE-Floating point format (little endian?). On these 1 machines one can use the original tcgmsg-version.   G To clarify the advantadge of this version: our 8 CPU GS40  UNIX-cluster  now ; starts programs and interacts with our VMScluster-Machines.   8 I have noticed that the socketshr-library, that helps to9 produced more vendor independent programs, wont't compile 8 with newer compiler versions ( DEC C V5.7-004 on OpenVMS9 Alpha V7.1). I don't know who maintains this library, but # I think it's meaningful to do that.    regards  Eberhard   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 08:17:49 -0500 ) From: "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.net> C Subject: Re: Announcement: TCGMSG for OpenVMS/ALPHA; 64 bit Version . Message-ID: <su8q0rlu37p0e@corp.supernews.com>  E "Eberhard Heuser-Hofmann" <vaxinf#chclu.chemie.uni-konstanz.de> wrote 2 in message news:39e460d6.0@news.uni-konstanz.de... > 5 > I've promised to work on a crossplatform version of  > tcgmsg for vms.  > ) > A "64bit" version now is available from  > . > ftp://v36.chemie.uni-konstanz.de/tcgmsg_vms/ > : > I have noticed that the socketshr-library, that helps to; > produced more vendor independent programs, wont't compile : > with newer compiler versions ( DEC C V5.7-004 on OpenVMS; > Alpha V7.1). I don't know who maintains this library, but % > I think it's meaningful to do that.   K The only advantage to using the socketshr library is on the VAX platform so K that your product will work with CMU-IP.  I strongly do not recommend using  it on Alpha.  = The most current socketshr sources that I am aware of are at:    ftp://ftp.qsl.net/pub/wb8tyw/    -John  wb8tyw@qsl.network   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 18:20:21 +0200 ? From: "DECHAIZE Thierry (Dir INFRA)" <thierry.dechaize@sncf.fr> C Subject: RE: Announcement: TCGMSG for OpenVMS/ALPHA; 64 bit Version @ Message-ID: <21EC2A9D83EED311A3EB0008C733892B1CEB49@S70ERTBIA11>  C 	This URL ftp://v36.chemie.uni-konstanz.de/tcgmsg_vms/ like bad ...    -----Message d'origine----- , De: John E. Malmberg [mailto:wb8tyw@qsl.net]$ Date: mercredi 11 octobre 2000 15:18 =C0: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComA Objet: Re: Announcement: TCGMSG for OpenVMS/ALPHA; 64 bit Version     E "Eberhard Heuser-Hofmann" <vaxinf#chclu.chemie.uni-konstanz.de> wrote 2 in message news:39e460d6.0@news.uni-konstanz.de... > 5 > I've promised to work on a crossplatform version of  > tcgmsg for vms.  > ) > A "64bit" version now is available from  > . > ftp://v36.chemie.uni-konstanz.de/tcgmsg_vms/ > : > I have noticed that the socketshr-library, that helps to; > produced more vendor independent programs, wont't compile : > with newer compiler versions ( DEC C V5.7-004 on OpenVMS; > Alpha V7.1). I don't know who maintains this library, but % > I think it's meaningful to do that.   A The only advantage to using the socketshr library is on the VAX =  platform so G that your product will work with CMU-IP.  I strongly do not recommend =  using  it on Alpha.  = The most current socketshr sources that I am aware of are at:    ftp://ftp.qsl.net/pub/wb8tyw/    -John  wb8tyw@qsl.network   ------------------------------   Date: 11 Oct 2000 17:07:26 GMT2 From: mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog)C Subject: Re: Announcement: TCGMSG for OpenVMS/ALPHA; 64 bit Version , Message-ID: <8s26oe$i3b@gap.cco.caltech.edu>  s In article <39e460d6.0@news.uni-konstanz.de>, vaxinf@chclu.chemie.uni-konstanz.de (Eberhard Heuser-Hofmann) writes:  >   O Thanks for this work.  Could you summarize for us briefly the status on VMS of:      PVM    MPI &   OpenMP (is that different than MPI?)   tcgmsg  = as compared to, for instance, there status on Tru64 or Linux?    Thanks,    David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu ? Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech     ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 10:06:00 -0300 ) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br $ Subject: BMC/PATROL X HEROIX ROBOMONL Message-ID: <OF24A0BE73.1F838AFF-ON83256975.0047DC2E@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>  E Do you know if these products are FULL concurrents or one product can  complement the other ????    Regards,   FC   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 09:28:17 +0200 % From: "Fred Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@KVI.nl> F Subject: Re: Byte orders (Help making a project of mine more portable). Message-ID: <8s14qg$ncs$1@info.service.rug.nl>  B "Christopher Smith" <chriss@Mufasa.pubserv.com> wrote in message =D news:Pine.LNX.4.05.10010110216330.11722-100000@Mufasa.pubserv.com... >=20 > (...)  >=20I > Lastly, what do you think about having a _standard_ byte-ordering for =  the H > file, and just adjusting the program that writes it on each platform = toI > write the file properly? (As opposed to the current strategy which is =  toH > try making the program which reads the file byte-order independant...)  1 I prefer to make the reading program independent. ? The byte re-ordering is then performed only when really needed. D In many cases the writing and the reading program live in the same = system. E If you have a standard byte-ordering, than both the writing and the =  reading H program have to do unnecessary byte ordering conversions if the standard+ byte ordering is other than the native one.    =20  > (...)  >  > Chris  >=20 > (...)    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 11:02:20 +0200 0 From: "Rudy Koetsier" <rudy.koetsier@Compaq.com>F Subject: Re: Byte orders (Help making a project of mine more portable)6 Message-ID: <8s1aa5$i3j$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  4 I'm not quite sure if it'll work for you but anyway.  G When Unix /C programms try to communicate between two computers through D streams, we're not  too sure about byte ordering either. In order toL overcome this problem there are some transformation functions that come withE socket.h. They basicly put a stream from local host presentation into & "network presentation" and vice versa.@ Different functions exist for converting char's int's longs etc.G I can't remeber the specific function names, it's something like cton()  ntoc(). H Try looking up socket programming in your manuals. I'm pretty sure these> functions exist with VMS, they just might be slightly altered.  	 Good luck    Rudy    @ "Christopher Smith" <chriss@Mufasa.pubserv.com> wrote in messageD news:Pine.LNX.4.05.10010110216330.11722-100000@Mufasa.pubserv.com... > K > Not to start any egg-cracking contest, but I'm wondering whether somebody . > can clearify an issue of byte-orders for me. > D > I ask because eventually I want to make sure this (very byte-orderI > dependant) program will build and run on as many VMS boxen as possible. 2 > (as well as whatever else might be out there) :) > L > Originally this is done for unix, so it is in C, in case anyone's curious. >  > Here's my question:  > I > My program expects to get raw (bit by bit) data out of a 4-byte numeric ) > (generally, a "long" dumped to disk...)  > < > Assuming that I have (in motorola-type MSB-first order...) >  > ABCD > J > The program will attempt to read ABCD, and DCBA. (I have a string in theJ > file header for this purpose ...)  And when it finds a match, it assumes. > that we now know the byte-order of the file. > L > Now, this is assuming that bit 0 of each byte will always contain the sameI > bit (for instance, if we left shift the byte once, and or it with 1, we H > assume that this will give us the second bit stored, in the order that > they were stored)... > J > Can somebody give an example of a system on which this wouldn't be true? > E > Also:  I've seen references to "VAX" byte order, which is (given my % > example above) something like BADC.  > 3 > DO VAXen natively store 4-byte numerics this way?  > K > Lastly, what do you think about having a _standard_ byte-ordering for the I > file, and just adjusting the program that writes it on each platform to J > write the file properly? (As opposed to the current strategy which is toH > try making the program which reads the file byte-order independant...) > L > For the curious, this is a personal project of mine.  I'm attempting to doA > variable length (1, 2, or 4 byte chunks... maybe 8 bytes later)  > huffman compression. > J > Any help would be appreciated.  I'm not as familliar with this aspect of > computing as I'd like to be. > 
 > Regards, >  > Chris  >  > L ============================================================================ === @ > "My two cents" (http://rootworks.com/twocentsworth.cgi?128562)= > Christopher Smith(chriss@pubserv.com) Prgramer^W Programmer ! > Prime Synergy of Champaign, IL. ' > ------------------------------------- K > "Where a calculator on the ENIAC is equipped with 18,000 vacuum tubes and J > weighs 30 tons, computers in the future may have only 1,000 vacuum tubes< > and weigh only 1.5 tons." -- Popular Mechanics, March 1949L > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- -----  >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 12:12:02 +0100  From: "laurie" <abd@bdc.com>! Subject: cd player: CDROM_AUDIO.C + Message-ID: <8s1hus$tsv$1@trog.dera.gov.uk>   I The motif cd player doesn't work on my system (comes up with all kinds of  vue... errors). 
 From the FAQ: I     There's also SYS$EXAMPLES:CDROM_AUDIO.C and .EXE, a non-Motif program   G I've searched the freeware cd, Compaq's website and my installation but @ can't find it. Can anyone point me to it. (The C source will do)   ------------------------------   Date: 11 Oct 2000 15:00:24 GMT1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) " Subject: Re: comp.org.encompass.us+ Message-ID: <8s1va8$rig$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>   2 In article <8roqs2$bgc$1@slb7.atl.mindspring.net>,)  "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@Killeen.cc> writes: K |> If anyone knows how to get a "comp.org.encompass.us" newsgroup created I I |> would appreciate it.  I don't have the knowledge or cycles to do it...S  ; Well, I won't be holding my breath waiting for it to exist.P   bill   -- iJ Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   a   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 11:45:16 -0400o% From: James Griffin <griffin@vol.com>i' Subject: Copying Directories via DecNetNO Message-ID: <1174331F5D53CA2A.126842B399A663C9.27D98BB153CC5BB1@lp.airnews.net>   9 This may be a dumb question, but it's driving me nuts ...e  G I have a VAXStation 4000 running VMS 5.4-2, and a DS20E running OpenVMSiE 7.2-1.  What I'm trying to do is copy a whole directory tree from they> VAX to the DS20E, including subdirectories and their contents.  D Is there a way to do this without having to do it one directory at a time?t   TIAt Jim Griffin  griffin@vol.come   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 12:02:35 -0400 (EDT)w From: quayle@infinet.com+ Subject: Re: Copying Directories via DecNetrK Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.4.10.10010111158010.2199-100000@shell.oh.voyager.net>A  I > I have a VAXStation 4000 running VMS 5.4-2, and a DS20E running OpenVMSiG > 7.2-1.  What I'm trying to do is copy a whole directory tree from theA@ > VAX to the DS20E, including subdirectories and their contents.  G You can use BACKUP to copy everything from one tree to another.  If yousB only need the highest version number of each file, you can use theD ZIP/UNZIP programs (available for VMS).  In either case, you'll needJ temporary storage somewhere big enough to hold the .ZIP or BACKUP saveset.  B If you're tight on storage, a DCL script that recurses through the8 directories would be possible (ugly, but easily doable).   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 12:44:09 -0500i1 From: "Dave Gudewicz" <david.gudewicz@abbott.com> ) Subject: DCPS and HP 8100 series printersl8 Message-ID: <8s28t3$kea$1@fizban.fizban.pprd.abbott.com>  K Discovered today that the HP 8100 is not in the 8000 series of printers and2A therefore is not supported with the latest version (1.8) of DCPS.e  K Wondered if anyone here knew of a way of getting DCPS to tell a 8100 thingsm like using paper trays, etc.  L And if Paul Anderson is reading this, any word on when this printer might be supported by DCPS.   Thanks,A   Dave...f   ------------------------------   Date: 11 Oct 2000 08:10:38 GMT* From: helbig@astro.rug.nl (Phillip Helbig)9 Subject: get the number of files in a directory with DCL?d. Message-ID: <8s179u$o2r$1@info.service.rug.nl>  D What's the easiest way to do this which is reasonably efficient and C elegant (i.e. not writing the output of dir/gra/siz to a file then - reading it in and parsing it)?   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 04:43:14 -0400r- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>e= Subject: Re: get the number of files in a directory with DCL?., Message-ID: <39E4281E.838B5C5D@videotron.ca>   Phillip Helbig wrote:l > E > What's the easiest way to do this which is reasonably efficient and D > elegant (i.e. not writing the output of dir/gra/siz to a file then  > reading it in and parsing it)?   $SET DEF MYDISK:[MYDIR]C
 $COUNT = 0 $LOOP: $MYFILE = F$SEARCH("*.*;*")u" $IF MYFILE .EQS. "" THEN GOTO DONE $COUNT = COUNT + 1
 $GOTO LOOP $! $DONE:? $WRITE SYS$OUTPUT "There are ''count' file in ''F$DIRECTORY()'"    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 11:08:50 +0100o& From: Roy Omond <Roy.Omond@Compaq.com>= Subject: Re: get the number of files in a directory with DCL?s* Message-ID: <39E43C32.E827F45F@Compaq.com>   Phillip Helbig wrote:e  E > What's the easiest way to do this which is reasonably efficient andaD > elegant (i.e. not writing the output of dir/gra/siz to a file then  > reading it in and parsing it)?   Consider using DFU.4  
 E.g. $ dfu!      DFU> dir/compress/test x.dirc  C This is orders of magnitude faster than using standard DIRECTORY or0F F$Search methods.  It's especially true for directories with more thanH 100,000 files in them which I've witnessed recently at one customer site !u  	 Roy Omondr Blue Bubble Ltd.- (certainly not squeaking on behalf of Compaq)o   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 11:43:59 +0200 : From: Karl Rohwedder <extern.karl.rohwedder@volkswagen.de>= Subject: Re: get the number of files in a directory with DCL?f- Message-ID: <39E4365F.BC7FB98F@volkswagen.de>u   May a PIPE could do the trick:  0 $ pipe direc/total | search sys$input  files | -F 	(read sys$pipe rec ; rec = F$element(2," ",rec) ; ass/job &rec files) $ files = F$trnlnm(files)h   JF Mezei wrote:u >  > Phillip Helbig wrote:e > >mG > > What's the easiest way to do this which is reasonably efficient andnF > > elegant (i.e. not writing the output of dir/gra/siz to a file then" > > reading it in and parsing it)? >  > $SET DEF MYDISK:[MYDIR]i > $COUNT = 0 > $LOOP: > $MYFILE = F$SEARCH("*.*;*")I$ > $IF MYFILE .EQS. "" THEN GOTO DONE > $COUNT = COUNT + 1 > $GOTO LOOP > $! > $DONE:A > $WRITE SYS$OUTPUT "There are ''count' file in ''F$DIRECTORY()'"V   -- n  - mit freundlichen Gruessen | with best regards/   Karl Rohwedder                C iT-Ingenieurteam     | Ellernbruch 11       | D-38112 Braunschweig nA Telefon: 0531/515521 | Telefax: 0531/515531 | Mobil: 0172/5434843IE  E-Mail: rohwedder@decus.decus.de           | iT-IngTeam@t-online.de  +          karl.rohwedder@it-ingenieurteam.ded DATEX-P: 4505018005::ROHWEDDER   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 16:01:44 +0200e0 From: Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@Easynet.fr>= Subject: Re: get the number of files in a directory with DCL?c* Message-ID: <39E472C8.5A7A1EE3@Easynet.fr>   Phillip Helbig wrote:u > E > What's the easiest way to do this which is reasonably efficient and@D > elegant (i.e. not writing the output of dir/gra/siz to a file then  > reading it in and parsing it)?  " Surprizingly (sp?:-) I tried this:  < $ sea [-]mydir.dir "xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx"/log/noout   E and I got 131 records read, but there are 132 files in the dir... :-(f   D. -- sF   --------------------------------------------------------------------F Le Pachacamac COMPAQ/DEC/APPLE 34 ave. G. Pompidou 81500 Lavaur FranceB    http://www.pachacamac.com   ** Une passion pour l'excellence **F Tl. : 05.63.58.58.63    Fax. : 05.63.58.58.33    GSM : 06.88.97.61.48   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Oct 2000 13:08:46 -0500 From: briggs@eisner.decus.orga= Subject: Re: get the number of files in a directory with DCL?m+ Message-ID: <LdaS$qCN8yb8@eisner.decus.org>l  ] In article <39E472C8.5A7A1EE3@Easynet.fr>, Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@Easynet.fr> writes:a > Phillip Helbig wrote: F >> What's the easiest way to do this which is reasonably efficient andE >> elegant (i.e. not writing the output of dir/gra/siz to a file thenh! >> reading it in and parsing it)?u > $ > Surprizingly (sp?:-) I tried this: > > > $ sea [-]mydir.dir "xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx"/log/noout  > G > and I got 131 records read, but there are 132 files in the dir... :-(   B I tried it too.  The trick is that multiple versions of a file can. be stored in a single record in the directory.  A Personally I like to search for "" rather than "xxxxxxxxx".  With + a /MATCH=NAND if desired.  But tastes vary.   % 	John Briggs		briggs@eisner.decus.orgi   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 11:40:56 GMT , From: "Jay E. Morris" <morrisj@epsilon3.com>@ Subject: Re: Get Viagra at the lowest prices available anywhere!4 Message-ID: <clYE5.8$7D1.1246@typhoon.austin.rr.com>  H Ah, but this if for those who have trouble keeping it up, so it actually" should be posted in the NT groups.     --= Jay E. Morris @ Epsilon 3 Productions http://www.epsilon3.com  Web site hosting and designs- --Extreme S&M - whip me, beat me, Windows ME!e  0 "John Vottero" <John@MVPSI.com> wrote in message> news:C15945A9D9EFCF11BA8B08002BBF1CCC0CD835@berry.mvpsi.com... > > -----Original Message-----@ > > From: jordan@lisa.gemair.com [mailto:jordan@lisa.gemair.com]7 > > In article <200010081500.KAA62106@nadal.loyno.edu>,2' > >  <cyberpharmacy1@excite.com> wrote:EA > > >Get Viagra at the absolute lowest prices available.Make yourl$ > > sex life unlike it has ever been > > >before! > > >a > > >GO TO LINK BELOW!!.3 > > >http://home.earthlink.net/~gab4ever/bulla1.htm- > > >. > > >m > >eI > > Wrong newsgroup.  You must be looking for a Eunuch's Operating Systemr > > discussion forum.n > >l >hE > Oh, I don't know about that.  People that use VMS are interested ina keeping  > it up as long as possible! :)c >s >t   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 14:24:27 GMTl+ From: rjordan@mars.mcs.net (Richard Jordan)n0 Subject: Re: Getting Compaq to advertise OpenVMS2 Message-ID: <vK_E5.213$cI6.35312@news.goodnet.com>  E > I'm curious.  Why _are_ you stuck on VAX?  Other's mentioned vendor(% > supplied code that won't be ported.1  K Quite a few of our customers are still running (small commercial/financial)dK shops on MicroVAX 3100 systems.  Our code is ported and runs fine on Alpha, G but they are small shops, a few to maybe 20 terminals running code thatoG is reasonably efficient.  So far there is not a hard reason for them tosI move (support costs will eventually change that), plus due to the overallbE reduction in pricing of peecees, they are a _lot_ more cost conscious F about computer hardware than they used to be.  Where they spent 10-15KH on that VAX setup 4-10 years ago, the current Alpha choices, even thoughG considerably less in absolute terms, still seem overpriced to them whens0 compared to that glitzy 1GHz peecee at Best Buy.  F Granted that some of the V7.3 features wouldn't have much room to workD their magic on a 3100 (32MB RAM only caches so much), it would stillE be nice to have those improvements to show the customer that they arenI being supported and enhanced, and that those _not_insignificant_ softwareqD support payments that they pay to the 'Q' to be able to upgrade are ' actually providing measurable benefits.-  F Of course if the support cost for OpenVMS on VAX were to be reduced inF some proportion to the amount of work being put into enhancing OpenVMSE VAX (not the hardware support, mind you, which will contiue to rise),y" then it would be less of an issue.   Rich Jordann rjordan@mcs.neto   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 07:04:45 -0600 (MDT)a) From: John Nebel <nebel@athena.csdco.com> 1 Subject: Good news from the Alpha processor front G Message-ID: <Pine.OSF.4.21.0010110703070.12195-100000@athena.csdco.com>$  1 http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/1/13890.htmlr   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 11:22:51 -03003) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br 5 Subject: Re: Good news from the Alpha processor frontgL Message-ID: <OF3D53F80A.E6DDDE3B-ON83256975.004EDEE1@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>  K Sometimes I think Samsung should develop their own Alphaservers in OEM withd Compaq.u They should become cheaper.....    Regi   FC                  : John Nebel <nebel@ATHENA.CSDCO.COM> em 11/10/2000 11:04:45L                                                                             L                                                                             L                                                                                 >                                                               >                                                               >                                                               >  Para:    Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com                               >                                                               >  cc:      (bcc: Fabio dos Santos Cardoso/E-P-BC/Contratada)   >                                                               >                                                               >                                                               >  Assunto: Good news from the Alpha processor front            >                                                                                 1 http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/1/13890.htmlh   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 14:31:28 GMT 4 From: "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net>5 Subject: Re: Good news from the Alpha processor fronte; Message-ID: <4R_E5.46789$tn.858847@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>n  6 <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br> wrote in messageF news:OF3D53F80A.E6DDDE3B-ON83256975.004EDEE1@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br...H > Sometimes I think Samsung should develop their own Alphaservers in OEM with	 > Compaq.0! > They should become cheaper.....r  H Perhaps, but note that Samsung has a long and glorious AlGore-like trackJ record with Alpha. Overpromise and underdeliver, as the expression goes...   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Oct 2000 12:59:06 -0500* From: young_r@eisner.decus.org (Rob Young)5 Subject: Re: Good news from the Alpha processor fronth+ Message-ID: <4elSG+jKlqRh@eisner.decus.org>d  r In article <4R_E5.46789$tn.858847@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>, "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> writes: > 8 > <fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br> wrote in messageH > news:OF3D53F80A.E6DDDE3B-ON83256975.004EDEE1@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br...I >> Sometimes I think Samsung should develop their own Alphaservers in OEM, > with
 >> Compaq." >> They should become cheaper..... > J > Perhaps, but note that Samsung has a long and glorious AlGore-like trackL > record with Alpha. Overpromise and underdeliver, as the expression goes... >   C 	Yeah... but reading the editorials in today's Wall Street at leasto@ 	I can suggest that Samsung doesn't have a problem with history.@ 	i.e. they don't tell tall tales as if sitting around a campfire 	roasting marshmallows.p   				Robt   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 16:23:27 GMT"= From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-)g5 Subject: Re: Good news from the Alpha processor frontr0 Message-ID: <009F1706.8583F5D0@SendSpamHere.ORG>  r In article <4R_E5.46789$tn.858847@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>, "Terry C. Shannon" <terryshannon@mediaone.net> writes: > 7 ><fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br> wrote in messagetG >news:OF3D53F80A.E6DDDE3B-ON83256975.004EDEE1@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br...dI >> Sometimes I think Samsung should develop their own Alphaservers in OEMn >with 
 >> Compaq." >> They should become cheaper..... >eI >Perhaps, but note that Samsung has a long and glorious AlGore-like trackuK >record with Alpha. Overpromise and underdeliver, as the expression goes...I  7 Do you mean to say that Samsung invented the Alpha!  :)=   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM             /O city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after them.    ------------------------------   Date: 11 Oct 2000 17:09:49 GMT2 From: mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog)5 Subject: Re: Good news from the Alpha processor frontn, Message-ID: <8s26st$i3b@gap.cco.caltech.edu>  s In article <Pine.OSF.4.21.0010110703070.12195-100000@athena.csdco.com>, John Nebel <nebel@athena.csdco.com> writes:- >- >-2 >http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/1/13890.html >   < Also relevant for comments on stealth (technology) marketing# (although they don't call it that.)@   David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edue? Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech     ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 15:59:57 +0200r= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>E Subject: Re: heap manager?) Message-ID: <39E4725D.789C8CFA@gtech.com>s   Rob Eisink wrote:oJ > I mean an allocation/deallocation set to get malloc/calloc etc replaced.K > There thisd party vendors for other platforms like SmartHeap but I do nott, > know if the is such a package for OpenVMS.  * Have you looked at teh LIB$*VM* routines ?   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 17:50:18 +0100 - From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk>I9 Subject: Re: I'm looking for a job and offering a reward!u) Message-ID: <39E49A4A.B1F7F7EE@bbc.co.uk>n   Alan Greig wrote:   H >  Computer Futures in the UK seem to have a reasonable understanding of > the VMS market.  >-E > Go to www.compfutures.co.uk and type in VMS OR OPENVMS OR VAX under G > technical skills. Got 7 current hits. www.jobsearch.co.uk worth a trye  K At www.contractoruk.co.uk you can search several engines at once, and get adB very neat 4-pane window with a site in each. Contract only though.      --06 Tim Llewellyn, OpenVMS Infrastructure, Remarcs Project0 MedAS at the BBC, Whiteladies Road, Bristol, UK.A Email tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk. Home tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.uks  A I speak for myself only and my views in no way represent those of  MedAS or the BBC.o   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 16:05:29 +0100y0 From: Robert Taylor <taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com> Subject: IP Address Extraction* Message-ID: <39E481B9.58E0FB@jpmorgan.com>  F I want to take the output of SHOW TERM and cut out the IP address in a DCL script.i  # Can anyone tell me how to do this ?-  F Basically I want to build up a script that will allow me to get the IPB address , then SET DISPLAY /CREATE /NODE="IP address" /TRANS=TCPIP accordingly.  E Further , the final step would be to launch an Xterm. I don't know ifX= thats possible in VMS though and would appreciate any advice.   3 I only have 4 weeks VMS experience so bear with me.    Thanks in advance.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 11:35:39 -0400A& From: Ken Robinson <ksrobin@erenj.com>" Subject: Re: IP Address Extraction7 Message-ID: <5.0.0.25.2.20001011113224.00aadbe0@clmail>N  2 At 04:05 PM 10/11/2000 +0100, Robert Taylor wrote:G >I want to take the output of SHOW TERM and cut out the IP address in aU >DCL script. >y$ >Can anyone tell me how to do this ? > G >Basically I want to build up a script that will allow me to get the IPbC >address , then SET DISPLAY /CREATE /NODE="IP address" /TRANS=TCPIP4
 >accordingly.m  J Take a look at the DCL lexical functions, namely f$getdvi and the argument "TT_ACCPORNAM".s  F >Further , the final step would be to launch an Xterm. I don't know if> >thats possible in VMS though and would appreciate any advice. >r4 >I only have 4 weeks VMS experience so bear with me.  J Become used to using the VMS Help facility ... it is very helpful :-). In & your case, try "help create/terminal".   Welcome to the world of VMS...   Ken Robinson$ OpenVMS System Management Consultant ksrobin@erenj.comA kenrbnsn@rbnsn.com   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 15:51:08 +0000 (GMT)r, From: Bill McLaughlin <mcbill20@hotmail.com>" Subject: Re: IP Address Extraction5 Message-ID: <F175XtFT0D7GHzbwaV700000d4e@hotmail.com>t   >-----Original Message-----h8 >From: Robert Taylor [mailto:taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com]* >Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2000 9:05 AM >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com >Subject: IP Address Extraction- >- > G >I want to take the output of SHOW TERM and cut out the IP address in ai >DCL script. >j$ >Can anyone tell me how to do this ? >eG >Basically I want to build up a script that will allow me to get the IP C >address , then SET DISPLAY /CREATE /NODE="IP address" /TRANS=TCPIPo
 >accordingly.  > F >Further , the final step would be to launch an Xterm. I don't know if> >thats possible in VMS though and would appreciate any advice. >T4 >I only have 4 weeks VMS experience so bear with me. >Q >Thanks in advance.  >U  	 Try this:1  B $ AccessInfo = f$getdvi("TT","TT_ACCPORNAM") ! Get connection infoB $ AccessInfo = f$edit(AccessInfo,"COMPRESS") ! Compress whitespaceF $ TcpAddress = f$element(1," ",AccessInfo)   ! Extract address portion $ show symbol TcpAddress $!( $! Here's the same thing all on one line $ TcpAddress = f$element(1," >3 ",f$edit(f$getdvi("TT","TT_ACCPORNAM"),"COMPRESS"))y $ show symbol TcpAddress2 $ set display/create/node='TcpAddress'/trans=tcpip $ run sys$system:decw$terminal   Bill McLaughlintI _________________________________________________________________________oI Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.d  D Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at  http://profiles.msn.com.   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 10:53:10 -0500 (CDT)  From: rmegee@tqtx.coma" Subject: Re: IP Address Extraction2 Message-ID: <200010111553.KAA06376@exwin.tqtx.com>  9 here's what we use to obtain the ip address of a session:r  ( $ Xnode = F$getdvi("tt","tt_accpornam")   E for some sessions, there may be leading brackets or other qualifiers.FB I use something like this to strip a leading "[" and trailing "]" E take a look at what is produced by your instance.  You might not evenl need this step at all.  . $ if f$locate("[",Xnode) .nes. f$length(Xnode) $       thenN $               Xnode = f$extract(f$locate("[",Xnode)+1,f$length(Xnode),Xnode)> $               Xnode = f$extract(0,f$locate("]",Xnode),Xnode)
 $       endifr      Then you could use this as such:, $ set display/create/trans=tcpip/node='Xnode   > H > I want to take the output of SHOW TERM and cut out the IP address in a
 > DCL script.O > % > Can anyone tell me how to do this ?! > H > Basically I want to build up a script that will allow me to get the IPD > address , then SET DISPLAY /CREATE /NODE="IP address" /TRANS=TCPIP > accordingly. > G > Further , the final step would be to launch an Xterm. I don't know if ? > thats possible in VMS though and would appreciate any advice.I > 5 > I only have 4 weeks VMS experience so bear with me.t >  > Thanks in advance. >  >  >  >      -- eO =============================================================================== B               We are confronted with insurmountable opportunities.B                                              -- Walt Kelly, "Pogo"O ===============================================================================    ------------------------------   Date: 11 Oct 2000 10:01:36 GMT3 From: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann)/. Subject: Re: no MMOV sound on AlphaStation 5000 Message-ID: <8s1dq0$6kc$1@n.ruf.uni-freiburg.de>  i In article <39E3B5B3.CC3A0B5D@jenni.path.uiowa.edu>, Gib Copeland <copeland@jenni.path.uiowa.edu> writes: M >The release notes explain what needs to be done to configure the unsupported-H >ES1888 Sound Card - you need an entry in SYS$SYSTEM:SYS$USER_CONFIG.DAT >describing the device:e >   >device    = "ES1888 Sound Card" >  name    = AUe >  driver  = MMOV$ESSDRIVER. >  adapter = XBUS6 >  id      = ES18886 >end_device  >-I >I'm not sure why your MMOV$SERVER process was not running, the error loggI >usually indicates if there's a license problem.  I suspect that once youiL >tell VMS about AUA0: (above edit + reboot) and restart the server, all will	 >be well.a  I I don't think the Alphastaton 500 has this sound card. I know I had soundbK before and now I have not. And I didn't replace any hardware. So it must bet a software issue... .n   Regards,    Christoph Gartmannz  H -----------------------------------------------------------------------+H | Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452 |H | Immunbiologie                                                        |H | Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de     |H | D-79011  Freiburg, FRG                                               |H +--------- http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/english/menue.html ---------+   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 12:39:05 +0200-% From: "Kirk Acid" <Kirk.Acid@lion.cc>e Subject: No System Password . Message-ID: <8s1fhl$1qp$1@newstoo.ericsson.se>   Hello:  K Ive a DEC vax 2000 and no system password, i got info from a freind how to1 crack the vax:   1. conversational boot        >>> BOOT/1a   2. SYSBOOT> set uafalternate 1   3. SYSBOOT> continue  I 4. On the opa0 login with any username and password...  but that doensnte8 work, i still get the mdg "wrong username or password" l  ! Do you know how i could login ???J   Thanks, Kirk   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 14:57:52 +0200@( From: Bernd Eckstein <B.Eckstein@cli.de> Subject: Re: No System Passworde& Message-ID: <39E463D0.9A1E9643@cli.de>   Kirk Acid schrieb: >  > Hello2 > M > Ive a DEC vax 2000 and no system password, i got info from a freind how tot > crack the vax: >  > 1. conversational boot >  >      >>> BOOT/1t >   > 2. SYSBOOT> set uafalternate 1 >  > 3. SYSBOOT> continue > K > 4. On the opa0 login with any username and password...  but that doensntn: > work, i still get the mdg "wrong username or password" l >  have a look at< http://www.openvms.digital.com/wizard/openvms_faq.html#MGMT5     -- MH Microsoft broke Volkswagen`s world record: VW only made 22 million bugs!  ( Mit freundlichen Gruessen / Best regardsC B.Eckstein, CLI GmbH - mailto:B.Eckstein@cli.de - http://www.cli.dedC Matthiashofstr. 28, D-52064 Aachen - Fon: +49 241 47051-0, Fax: -89v   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 16:54:46 +0200 6 From: "Dijk, Jeroen van" <Jeroen.vandijk@getronics.nl> Subject: RE: No System Password M Message-ID: <2795B75EF003D311801A00A0C906B511A2AE80@cucexec.gbc.getronics.nl>o  F The answer is not simple to give, but this methode works only if you =' don't have a sys$system:sysuafalt file.l# It looks like Kirk has such a file.f  & If you want to know more read it on=20E http://www.openvms.compaq.com/doc/ssb71/6017/6017p007.htm#index_x_443d           -----Original Message-----* From: Kirk Acid [mailto:Kirk.Acid@lion.cc]$ Sent: woensdag 11 oktober 2000 12:39 To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Come Subject: No System Passworde     Helloa  H I=B4ve a DEC vax 2000 and no system password, i got info from a freind = how to crack the vax:   1. conversational boot        >>> BOOT/1    2. SYSBOOT> set uafalternate 1   3. SYSBOOT> continue  B 4. On the opa0 login with any username and password...  but that =
 doensn=B4t8 work, i still get the mdg "wrong username or password" l  ! Do you know how i could login ???    Thanks, Kirk   ------------------------------   Date: 11 Oct 2000 16:28:02 GMT1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)t Subject: Re: nonfree Freewarei+ Message-ID: <8s24ei$uch$1@info.cs.uofs.edu>s  , In article <8rt6h9$6v8@gap.cco.caltech.edu>,5  mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog) writes:nY |> Can somebody please explain to me why the freeware CDROM costs $25 from the estore??? y1 |>                                           ^^^^n[ |>   http://www.e-softwarefactory.com/acb/showprod.cfm?&DID=30&CATID=194&ObjectGroup_ID=790  |> aI |> The real cost for shipping and handling a CD is not more than $3 - $4.lK |> Production costs, even for a small batch of CD's, should be no more thant |> two dollars.  |> pJ |> Anything much beyond that makes the CD a commercial product and clearly@ |> violates the licenses on most of the software on the disk.    |> cD |> Anybody at Compaq care to explain where the extra $20 is going???  + It seems your estimate is a little low.....7  E From Walnut Creek (who probably sells a lot more "freeware" CD's thanv COMPAQ does.):%                  FreeBSD 4.1 ($39.95)y-                  Slackware Linux 7.1 ($39.95)    From RedHat:-                  Red Hat Linux 7      $29.95     And from GNU.ORG:   Q GNU Source Code CD-ROM set, 15th edition (August 2000): (or older editions below) A                   $280  for corporations and other organizations. (                   $ 70  for individuals.      ? GNU Compiler Tools Binaries CD-ROM set, 6th edition (May 2000): A                   $220  for corporations and other organizations. (                   $ 55  for individuals.  G Or are all these others (FSF included) violating some unnamed license??    bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 10:26:19 GMT % From: A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig)m% Subject: Re: OpenVMS in Oil companies 1 Message-ID: <39e44012.156575633@news.newsguy.com>   C On 10 Oct 2000 13:58:31 -0500, young_r@eisner.decus.org (Rob Young)8 wrote:  Y >In article <39e31c86.81938851@news.newsguy.com>, A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig) writes:h >o> >> Perception of VMS has improved sufficiently in last year toG >> allow us to upgrade an old Oracle application in place on VMS ratheriD >> than on HP-UX. Many senior decision makers expressed suprise at aF >> recent demo of work in progress as senior consultants had told them$ >> this was not possible with VMS... >> t >r8 >	senior consultants?  You mean senior unix consultants?   EDS to be precise.   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------   Date: 11 Oct 2000 15:03:20 GMT2 From: mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog)( Subject: Re: OpenVMS Integrated products, Message-ID: <8s1vfo$i3b@gap.cco.caltech.edu>   In article <y4lmvxxftq.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>, Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> writes:3 >Jim Jennis <jjennis@discovery.fuentez.com> writes:  >rL >> I agree 100% C/C++ is a defacto standard for development and (at the very& >> least) SHOULD be bundled with OVMS. >OL >So Sun, SGI, HP, IBM are all giving their C and C++ compilers away for free >with their systems? Show me.  >i  F No, they aren't, and Apple doesn't for Macs and Microsoft doesn't for  Windows either.e  < However VMS is not in the same boat as any of these because:  4 1.  There are many fewer binaries available for VMS.G 2.  More of the software used on these machines is either home grown ornW        must be compiled before use (compared to Windows, Mac, and possibly even Linux.)iI 3.  gcc is not generally available/useful on VMS.  So there's no "cheap" rI       compiler alternative - you either pay the full price for the Compaqe       kit, or you do without."K 4.  Buy MS's or Metrowerk's compilers and you get C/C++ for about $500.  On:I       VMS the equivalent amount of compiler capability will cost at leastS       4 times as much.J 5.  VMS is losing developer mindshare to a greater extent than are any of J       these others, and especially "marginal" developer mindshare (ie, theI       N+1th platform supported for a package.)  This last one feeds back eZ       and leads to (1) above.  I'm frequently faced with packages which are available onlyI       as binaries and the owner will not do a VMS port at least partiallyuD       because it costs so much to buy a development platform.  (And M       some of the time because they harbor long bitter memories from DEC pastu8       and have sworn never to use those products again.)  I The point being, that to get VMS really moving again requires increasing OL its mindshare, and the Q needs some tool to accomplish that.  The tool that L might just do it is shipping VMS with full compilers, so that people who do J cross platform development, especially those that do it only occasionally,I can learn to appreciate that code that builds cleanly on VMS is much more.K likely to work on other platforms than the other way around.  For instance,s2 just using the following construct in C programs:    #ifdef __VMS# #define myfree my_decc$free_wrapper3 #elsel #define myfree free  #endif  I has caught huge numbers of bugs for me because decc$free() returns status J and free() doesn't.  PCA is also a fantastic tool for picking up problems - in code at run time that debugger won't find.-   Regards,   David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu0? Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech m   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 13:20:32 -0300 ) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.brn( Subject: Re: OpenVMS Integrated productsL Message-ID: <OF414A4D22.76C9E56E-ON83256975.0059863A@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>   To improve this discussion...   H It=B4s time to have Visual C for OpenVMS,  VB for OpenVMS, Delphi for O= penVMS etc ....H And all those new programing languages.... Sometimes I think Compaq sho= uld ? GIVE some OpenVMS products to other companies "refurbish" thesed products....   Fabio C.                  C mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog) em 11/10/2000 13:03:20t  / Favor responder a mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu H                                                                        =     =20AH                                                                        =     =20 H                                                                        =     =20y    @                                                              =20@                                                              =20@                                                              =20@  Para:    Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com                              =20@                                                              =20@  cc:      (bcc: Fabio dos Santos Cardoso/E-P-BC/Contratada)  =20@                                                              =20@                                                              =20@                                                              =20@  Assunto: Re: OpenVMS Integrated products                    =20@                                                              =20           =d    H In article <y4lmvxxftq.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>= , H Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de> write= s:3 >Jim Jennis <jjennis@discovery.fuentez.com> writes:e > H >> I agree 100% C/C++ is a defacto standard for development and (at the=   very& >> least) SHOULD be bundled with OVMS. >1H >So Sun, SGI, HP, IBM are all giving their C and C++ compilers away for=   free >with their systems? Show me.D >5  E No, they aren't, and Apple doesn't for Macs and Microsoft doesn't for0 Windows either.r  < However VMS is not in the same boat as any of these because:  4 1.  There are many fewer binaries available for VMS.H 2.  More of the software used on these machines is either home grown or=  H        must be compiled before use (compared to Windows, Mac, and possi= bly= even Linux.)H 3.  gcc is not generally available/useful on VMS.  So there's no "cheap= " H       compiler alternative - you either pay the full price for the Comp= aq       kit, or you do without.pH 4.  Buy MS's or Metrowerk's compilers and you get C/C++ for about $500.=   OnH       VMS the equivalent amount of compiler capability will cost at lea= st       4 times as much.H 5.  VMS is losing developer mindshare to a greater extent than are any = ofH       these others, and especially "marginal" developer mindshare (ie, = the H       N+1th platform supported for a package.)  This last one feeds bac= k0H       and leads to (1) above.  I'm frequently faced with packages which=  are available onlyH       as binaries and the owner will not do a VMS port at least partial= lyC       because it costs so much to buy a development platform.  (AndaH       some of the time because they harbor long bitter memories from DE= Cm past8       and have sworn never to use those products again.)  H The point being, that to get VMS really moving again requires increasin= gyH its mindshare, and the Q needs some tool to accomplish that.  The tool = thatH might just do it is shipping VMS with full compilers, so that people wh= o doH cross platform development, especially those that do it only occasional= ly,nH can learn to appreciate that code that builds cleanly on VMS is much mo= reH likely to work on other platforms than the other way around.  For insta= nce,1 just using the following construct in C programs:o   #ifdef __VMS# #define myfree my_decc$free_wrappero #elsee #define myfree frees #endif  H has caught huge numbers of bugs for me because decc$free() returns stat= usH and free() doesn't.  PCA is also a fantastic tool for picking up proble= ms- in code at run time that debugger won't find.>   Regards,   David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.eduh> Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech       =    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 17:32:05 +0200_= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>i( Subject: Re: OpenVMS Integrated products) Message-ID: <39E487F5.A610EDF2@gtech.com>b   David Mathog wrote:uJ > 3.  gcc is not generally available/useful on VMS.  So there's no "cheap"K >       compiler alternative - you either pay the full price for the Compaqo >       kit, or you do without.c   What is wrong with GCC on VMS ?0  E I have used it at occasions over the last 10 years and it seems OK tos me.n   Arne   ------------------------------   Date: 11 Oct 2000 15:26:16 GMT1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) ( Subject: Re: OpenVMS Integrated products+ Message-ID: <8s20qo$rig$2@info.cs.uofs.edu>o  * In article <8s008g$tfg$1@lisa.gemair.com>,2  jordan@lisa.gemair.com (Jordan Henderson) writes: |> fA |> I remember reading where Stallman said that VMS had some good o? |> things that he wanted to see included in The Hurd, like file 3 |> versions.  Doesn't sound VMS unfriendly to me...r  B The fact that RMS wants to take someone elses work and incorporateB doesn't surprise me, but I hardly think that shows any interest in+ VMS at all other than as potential plunder.    |>  ? |> I've seen _lots_ of GNU software, like the kind you find at  @ |> www.gnu.org that has VMS mods in it.  I'm confident that more= |> GNU software would run on VMS mods if we'd only submit the.7 |> changes and keep them up-to-date with new releases. e |>  B |> Want more evidence that "core" GNU people don't have a problem @ |> with supporting VMS?  http://vms.gnu.org/  - gnu.org is GNU's? |> domain.  They went to the trouble of adding it to their name=& |> servers just to support GNU on VMS.  < Have you actually been there??  The page hasn't been touched> since 1997.  Having got my first hobbyist machine running over> the weekend and being primarily interested in porting freeware= to VMS I went looking.  I could not find a single GNU package = that had a VMS port of recent enough vintage to be usefull asT@ a starting point.  So, either no one has worked on a single line@ of VMS code for a GNU product in the past 3 years or none of the? changes have made it back into the dsitributions.  I don't knowu7 about you, but I can guess which one it most likely is.r   bill   -- lJ Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   M   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Oct 2000 12:51:47 -0400/ From: jordan@lisa.gemair.com (Jordan Henderson)w( Subject: Re: OpenVMS Integrated products* Message-ID: <8s25r3$rk7$1@lisa.gemair.com>  + In article <8s20qo$rig$2@info.cs.uofs.edu>,o) Bill Gunshannon <bill@cs.uofs.edu> wrote:l+ >In article <8s008g$tfg$1@lisa.gemair.com>,s3 > jordan@lisa.gemair.com (Jordan Henderson) writes:e >|> B >|> I remember reading where Stallman said that VMS had some good @ >|> things that he wanted to see included in The Hurd, like file4 >|> versions.  Doesn't sound VMS unfriendly to me... >-C >The fact that RMS wants to take someone elses work and incorporate4C >doesn't surprise me, but I hardly think that shows any interest in , >VMS at all other than as potential plunder. >  >|> @ >|> I've seen _lots_ of GNU software, like the kind you find at A >|> www.gnu.org that has VMS mods in it.  I'm confident that morew> >|> GNU software would run on VMS mods if we'd only submit the8 >|> changes and keep them up-to-date with new releases.  >|> C >|> Want more evidence that "core" GNU people don't have a problem  A >|> with supporting VMS?  http://vms.gnu.org/  - gnu.org is GNU'sa@ >|> domain.  They went to the trouble of adding it to their name' >|> servers just to support GNU on VMS.  >t= >Have you actually been there??  The page hasn't been touchedS? >since 1997.  Having got my first hobbyist machine running overw? >the weekend and being primarily interested in porting freewaren> >to VMS I went looking.  I could not find a single GNU package> >that had a VMS port of recent enough vintage to be usefull asA >a starting point.  So, either no one has worked on a single linejA >of VMS code for a GNU product in the past 3 years or none of the>@ >changes have made it back into the dsitributions.  I don't know8 >about you, but I can guess which one it most likely is. >c  B It seems like you are complaining about the VMS community, not the> GNU community.  The GNU community, by and large, does not HAVEC VMS machines, they depend on people in the VMS community to providedB updates, support web pages and do ports.  The VMS community hasn't
 participated.o  E However, in their own activities, distributing software, newsletters,-B supporting the gnu.org domain, they are more than happy to support< any work done by others to be included in their own aggenda.   >billm >- >-- K >Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolves-E >bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.a >University of Scranton   | B >Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>      -Jordan Hendersons jordan@greenapple.com9   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 18:44:23 +0200r= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>o( Subject: Re: OpenVMS Integrated products) Message-ID: <39E498E7.AC821178@gtech.com>u  * fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br wrote:M > Its time to have Visual C for OpenVMS,  VB for OpenVMS, Delphi for OpenVMSi
 > etc ....L > And all those new programing languages.... Sometimes I think Compaq shouldA > GIVE some OpenVMS products to other companies "refurbish" these  > products....   Why ?C  = I would say that DECset & compilers do fullfill any objective 
 requirements.a   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 10:48:18 -0700 ! From: Shane.F.Smith@Healthnet.com ( Subject: Re: OpenVMS Integrated productsC Message-ID: <OF79E78682.110B051E-ON88256975.0061573D@HEALTHNET.COM>   A I think the payoff would be to suddenly get millions of "trained" H Weeniedoze programmers able to work on VMS systems without cross-traini= ng.tH We'd have to hope that the VMS implementation of the tools would be don= e byF people of VMS engineering's quality, to VMS standards. Of course, thatH would leave the Weenies wondering where all those pretty blue screens w= ent,H and how come forgetting to save before their work crashed in testing di= dn't lose their changes....   SET MODE/DREAM=3DOFF   Shane           @ Arne Vajh=F8j <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> on 10/11/2000 09:44:23 AM   To:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com  cc:f  ) Subject:  Re: OpenVMS Integrated productsn    * fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br wrote:H > It=B4s time to have Visual C for OpenVMS,  VB for OpenVMS, Delphi for=   OpenVMSy
 > etc ....E > And all those new programing languages.... Sometimes I think Compaq  shouldA > GIVE some OpenVMS products to other companies "refurbish" thesep > products....   Why ?i  = I would say that DECset & compilers do fullfill any objectivem
 requirements.w   Arne         =    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 17:14:06 GMT4 From: kparris@my-deja.com % Subject: Re: OpenVMS Sessions at CETSm) Message-ID: <8s274m$ibi$1@nnrp1.deja.com>    I did 1-day seminars on:/   VMS Clusters: Basic and Intermediate Conceptsn!   VMS Clusters: Advanced Conceptsb% then 4-hour interactive workshops on:p)   VMS Cluster State Transitions in Action    VMS Lock Manager in Action and an ordinary session:)   Comparing VMS Clusters with TruClusters0  G I know not everyone could attend, so all my presentations are posted at ? http://www.geocities.com/keithparris/.  Hope they help someone. G -----------------------------------------------------------------------nG Keith Parris|Integrity Computing,Inc.|parris@decuserve.decus.org-nospamcF VMS Consulting: Clusters, Perf., Alpha porting, Storage&I/O, Internals    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.d   ------------------------------   Date: 11 Oct 2000 07:00:24 GMT1 From: "Kari Keronen" <kari.keronen@radiolinja.fi>nE Subject: Re: Print Queue jams if 2 print outs are queued to together? 2 Message-ID: <01c03351$30ce2e00$bb0ba8c0@rlhkikker>   Try defining the logical   UCX$TELNETSYM_RETRY_INTERVAL  I to for example 20 seconds. If I remember correctly the default value is 3t& minutes if the logical is not defined.G That is causing the 3 minutes delay of the second job if there is a jobe! already printing when it arrives.    Kari Keronen  4 Ray Phelan <Ray.Phelan@core-com.ie> wrote in articleA <81A01A7F3499D411A1C000508B655FCB0D1E@relay-mgr-2-b.indigo.ie>...nH > I have a problem.  We recently installed 3 new DS90M DECServers with aI > print queue on each.  These print queues are TCP/IP print queues, using-J > ucx$telnetsym process. We have done this is numerous other sites, but we > have a problem here. > H > The print queue is printing dockets from our system, and it works fineH > most of the time.  In one part of the system we print 2 dockets at theF > one time ( one after the other).  When this happens the first docketJ > prints fine, the queue tells me it's printing the second docket, it thenC > goes stalled, and after about 3 to 5 minutes it prints the secondd > docket.  This is baffling me.e > 7 > Can someone help me, has it happened to anybody else?  > 
 > Regards, >  > Ray Phelan! > CORE Computer Consultants Ltd.,  > 23 Upper Cork Street,  > Mitchelstown,e > Co. Cork, Ireland. >  > Phone :   353 - 25 - 84678 > Fax     :   353 - 25 - 84016# > E-mail  :  ray.phelan@core-com.ie  >  >  >    ------------------------------   Date: 11 Oct 2000 05:40 CSTo' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins) ! Subject: Re: Rename File Questions- Message-ID: <11OCT200005400263@gerg.tamu.edu>M  ) paddy.o'brien@zzz.tg.nsw.gov.au writes...t0 }>In article <39E1D54F.38ACE@trailing-edge.com>,0 }>  Tim Shoppa <shoppa@trailing-edge.com> wrote: }>> Richard L. Dyson wrote:C? }>> > I have a simple question that I hope has a simple answer!' }>> >lH }>> > How would I rename a file (OpenVMS 6.2 & v7.x) from "filename.ext"H }>> > to ".ext".  That is, with no filename part, just a leading dot (.)5 }>> > and some extension.  (Like a Unix hidden file).h }>> >aH }>> > VMS always wants to slip in a "default" of the old filename when I }>> > use COPY and RENAME. }>> >oD }>> > I can create such a file, but I want to rename a collection ofF }>> > files to "hidden" filenames without having to re-create them one }>> > at a time. }>>hE }>> Good question.  Even LIB$RENAME will preserve the part before thesF }>> dot.  (Not surprising, HELP LIB LIB$RENAME Arguments tells me thatC }>> the functionality is the same as the DCL RENAME command!  Doh!)a } Q }Forgive my total ignorance, but why would one want to do this?  Is it academic,  J }or something?  I cannot see any reason in the small world that I live in. }  }Regards, Paddy   H Sine he wants to make "hidden" files, I assumed that the disk was servedE via NFS to Unix systems. On most Unix systems files with the ".stuff"iF type names don't show up in normal directory listings (you have to add" a switch to tell it to show them).  G Other than that, if he expects them to disappear from directory listingi8 on his VMS system then he is in for some disappointment.  D It is also posisble that he has ported, or is porting, some softwareC that keeps it's configuration settings in a ".somethingrc" file. IntD that case, he'd be better off modifying the code to make it look for a "something.rc" file.   --- Carl   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 12:56:55 +0100i* From: Hitendra Patel <hiten@star.rl.ac.uk>7 Subject: Restore from *.bck (backup) onto UNIX platform-- Message-ID: <39E45585.68CDCAB6@star.rl.ac.uk>   & --------------AFB756552695D7FCB0CA0E3E* Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit6   Hi  E I have a user who has backed up his directories from a VMS system andnH wants to restore them onto the UNIX platform. Is this possible ? and how can I do this????    Any help will be appreciated.g Hiteng   --  $                                \\|//$                                (o -)F ---------------------------oOOo~(_)~oOOo------------------------------  F HITENDRA PATEL                              EMAIL: hiten@star.rl.ac.uk  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------@    The contents of this email are sent in confidence for the useG    of the intended recipients only.  If you are not one of the intended E    recipients do not take action on it or show it to anyone else, but=>    return this email to the sender and delete your copy of it.F ----------------------------------------------------------------------      & --------------AFB756552695D7FCB0CA0E3E) Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-asciin Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   > <!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en"> <html> HiH <p>I have a user who has backed up his directories from a VMS system andH wants to restore them onto the UNIX platform. Is this possible ? and how can I do this????   <p>Any help will be appreciated.	 <br>Hiten 
 <pre>--&nbsp;        &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; \\|//&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; (o -)&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;F ---------------------------oOOo~(_)~oOOo------------------------------   HITENDRA PATEL&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; EMAIL: hiten@star.rl.ac.uks  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------J &nbsp;&nbsp; The contents of this email are sent in confidence for the useV &nbsp;&nbsp; of the intended recipients only.&nbsp; If you are not one of the intendedO &nbsp;&nbsp; recipients do not take action on it or show it to anyone else, butVH &nbsp;&nbsp; return this email to the sender and delete your copy of it.L ----------------------------------------------------------------------</pre>
 &nbsp;</html>'  ( --------------AFB756552695D7FCB0CA0E3E--   ------------------------------  , Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 15:42:10 +0200 (CEST): From: "Gotfryd Smolik, VMS lists" <gotfryd@stanpol.com.pl>; Subject: Re: Restore from *.bck (backup) onto UNIX platformtI Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.21.0010111540070.7524-100000@irys.stanpol.com.pl>t  * On Wed, 11 Oct 2000, Hitendra Patel wrote:   +Hie [...as in subject...]  +Any help will be appreciated.  A  Probably the same as in "How to unpack .BCK files in non-VMS..."e9 subiect some days ago where includes the FAQ point... -;)y    Regards - Gotfryd   -- uE =====================================================================eF $ ON F$ERROR("LANGUAGE","ENGLISH","IN_MESSAGE").GT.F$ERROR("NORMAL") - 		THEN EXCUSE/OBJECT=MEd. $!                        GS@stanpol.zabrze.plE =====================================================================n   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 17:47:21 +0100h+ From: "antonio.carlini" <arcarlini@iee.org>e+ Subject: Re: Second ethernet for uVAX3180 ?i' Message-ID: <39E49999.B653C226@iee.org>y   trevor_deja@my-deja.com wrote:B > Anyone know if there is / was an add in card to provide a second) > ethernet interface in a MicroVAX 3180 ?o  ; I don't believe that there ever was one from DEC or COMPAQ.s& There may have been a third-party one.   Antoniop   ---------------n- Antonio Carlini             arcarlini@iee.orgr   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 09:21:19 GMTt% From: A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig)k/ Subject: Re: Shark x Penguin : The OpenVMS Logog1 Message-ID: <39e42f9a.152359561@news.newsguy.com>g  0 On Tue, 10 Oct 2000 18:08:05 +0200, Nigel Barker  <nigel.barker@compaq.com> wrote:  I >On Tue, 10 Oct 2000 10:39:03 -0400, Jim Agnew <agnew@hsc.vcu.edu> wrote:2 > C >>There was a griffin once???  Wasn't that the RSX dragon? or what?i  F Nope it was definitelly a griffin/griffon/gryphon. and it was for VMS.D I still have the shirt. Think I may have got it during the 7.1 fieldF test from the Spiralog development team. Yep, that's the same SpiralogB team who re-written history tells us were primarily NT developers.  2 Does anyone know what ever became of Claire Wells?  @ >That would be a gryphon. This was the codename for OpenVMS V7.1   From www.dictionary.com-  * griffin also griffon or gryphon (grfn)  n. 6  F A fabulous beast with the head and wings of an eagle and the body of a lion.t  P --------------------------------------------------------------------------------B [Middle English griffoun, from Old French griffon, from grif, from8 Latin grphus, variant of grps, grph- from Greek grups.] P --------------------------------------------------------------------------------     --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 16:34:08 GMTt From: kparris@my-deja.comi* Subject: Re: Sun Hardware problems persist) Message-ID: <8s24q0$g4m$1@nnrp1.deja.com>a  G I don't get to read this newsgroup very often, but just had to clear upf4 some incorrect postings and innuendos in this topic.  B > > Remember eTrade, what happened there, was it a Compaq engineerD > > doing the wrong thing and a bug in the OpenVMS cluster software,B > > who knows, neither Compaq or eTrade have been very forthcoming: > > about what really caused eTrade to have their outages.  < > I heard that a Compaq engineer had improperly put a lot of6 > non cluster traffic on a Fiber Cluster Interconnect.  H > The actual cause was rumoured to be a Compaq engineer making a mistakeD > upgrading the cluster and the cluster getting wedged. But this was > only rumour.  G There was no Compaq engineer involved in causing E*Trade outages in anyk way.  G The evidence doesn't support the contention that any bug in VMS was theh cause, either.  6 > So why is there no information, is Compaq protecting8 > itself at the expense of users being made aware of the7 > issue ? is there a conspiracy ? could eTrade be undero8 > NDA ? perhaps Compaq refused to fix their system until- > they agreed to keep quiet about the causes.-  9 > So where is the URL detailing the reason for the eTrade 5 > outage so that Compaq customers can be sure it doese7 > no happen to them ? shoudn't everone know ? why don't|9 > they ? could it be that eTrade are under NDA and Compaqe6 > don't want to admit that they messed up ? is there a5 > conspiracy going on here ?????? Perhaps Compaq onlyo5 > agreed to fix the eTrade system if they didn't tellc > anyone why it failed.k  D E*Trade had 4 outages which lasted 1-2 hours each over a period of 3@ days the first week of Feb. 1999.  Compaq flew in a full team ofC engineers even before the outages were over, worked with E*Trade totF analyze the potential causes, and reported their findings to E*Trade's> CIO and staff.  E*Trade did not choose to share those findingsA publicly, and respecting customer privacy, Compaq did not either.   E E*Trade did not have to sign any NDAs to get Compaq's analysis of thee	 problems.s  6 Compaq has not provided any free equipment to E*Trade.  ) > What were the causes of etrades failure   F There is still some amount of disagreement as to the exact causes.  It@ is always difficult in such a complex system to identify problemF sources with complete certainty, as hardware, software, networks, user@ application code, and rapidly-increasing workload levels are allG involved.  I posted a summary of my best understanding of the causes atoF the time in this newsgroup.  Press reports at the time (even those re-9 posted here recently) were all based on wild speculation.    We do know that:A o  There was a huge growth of workload for all the online brokers !    over that general time period.mD o  There were no power failures, contrary to the first news reports.?    (Each of the two sites have UPS and generators, and they areu    separated by 130 miles.)aE o  Contrary to the next wave of news reports, although E*Trade was ins=    the process of rolling out a software change (that happens =    constantly), the evidence seems to indicate this was not ah%    contributing factor to the outages @ o  Another vendor's DECnet network with the same DECnet area wasG    inadvertently bridged into E*Trade's network (apparently human errorMD    on the part of a network technician reconfiguring a Cisco router)G    and was the probable cause of the first day's 2 outages.  CorrectingtE    this network configuration error and rebooting the GIGAswitches to -    correct the forwarding tables solved this. G    Despite this problem being due to a network mis-configuration issue,dE    improvements have actually since been developed by VMS EngineeringbG    and included in VMS in 7.3 which would probably allow the cluster to /    survive such an error should it occur again.wE o  The actual causes of the outages on the two subsequent days is thei>    subject of disagreement to this day among people I respect.C o  The evidence indicates there were no Compaq hardware failures orn!    glitches involved, or VMS bugs-  C E*Trade obviously felt enough confidence in Compaq for their CIO toiA publicly endorse the Wildfire at its announcement, and to build aVC second production VMS cluster in the Atlanta area, with 2 Wildifire  boxes included.c  @ > Contrast this with the eTrade outage, just as serious as eBay,  D > >>> But eTrade did not have one outage associated with this issue,3 > they had a number each of which lasted hours. >>>d > @ > Yep, a long time ago (Feb 99 timeframe) they went through someA > configuration issues over the total space of about 4-5 days. NofD > question. No vendor can say they have NEVER had hardware problems.  > 4 outages of 1-2 hours each over 3 days.  No hardware problems involved.  No 22-hour outages.  F > So will Compaq admit that eTrade's outage was caused by Compaq ?????  1 Of course not.  The evidence indicates it wasn't.u  G -----------------------------------------------------------------------oG Keith Parris|Integrity Computing,Inc.|parris@decuserve.decus.org-nospamtF VMS Consulting: Clusters, Perf., Alpha porting, Storage&I/O, Internals    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 08:06:07 +0200n? From: "DECHAIZE Thierry (Dir INFRA)" <thierry.dechaize@sncf.fr>g. Subject: Support of JDK 1.2 on OpenVMS AXP 7.1@ Message-ID: <21EC2A9D83EED311A3EB0008C733892B1CEB3D@S70ERTBIA11>   	Hi all,  ( 	I'm very angry about this information :  ? 	Why only support JDK 1.2 on  OpenVMS AXP 7.2 minimum version ?i  B 	It's a software, many new classes in JDK, but what's problem with* OpenVMS AXP 7.1 ? I don't understand why !  
 	Sincerly.   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Oct 2000 11:46:21 -05009 From: Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen)o2 Subject: Re: Support of JDK 1.2 on OpenVMS AXP 7.1+ Message-ID: <rimQw3IVr0wE@eisner.decus.org>l   In article <21EC2A9D83EED311A3EB0008C733892B1CEB3D@S70ERTBIA11>, "DECHAIZE Thierry (Dir INFRA)" <thierry.dechaize@sncf.fr> writes:  * > 	I'm very angry about this information : > A > 	Why only support JDK 1.2 on  OpenVMS AXP 7.2 minimum version ?  > D > 	It's a software, many new classes in JDK, but what's problem with, > OpenVMS AXP 7.1 ? I don't understand why !  F The VMS tradition has been that the term "support" includes "testing".E Some of us would prefer they spend the time on _new_ versions of VMS.s   ------------------------------  , Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 14:55:41 +0200 (CEST): From: "Gotfryd Smolik, VMS lists" <gotfryd@stanpol.com.pl>" Subject: Re: SYSMAN can use DECnetI Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.21.0010111154500.6108-100000@irys.stanpol.com.pl>I  # On Fri, 6 Oct 2000, JF Mezei wrote:e   +Bob Koehler wrote: F +> Wrong.  I've used SYSMAN several times over DECnet in non-clustered +> configurations. p  
  I also...   +Got curious and made a test.- +-( +On node BIKE from a non-SYSTEM account: +4G +SYSMAN> SET ENV/NODE=VELO/USER=SYSTEM    (followed by password prompt)iI +SYSMAN> DO DIR $DISk2:[000000...]	(a command that takes a long time on a5
 +Microvax II)a  A  Althought the exact VMS version you haven't specify, supose thatE the info is unimportant.  ?  Be aware of the differrence: "takes a long time" and "displaysfC long time". But, right, probably the time may be enought regardlesst of point...   R +Then, I went on the console of VELO. NCP showed no network links for user SYSTEM.  C  At the moment can't fast check (unfortunatelly have on the tested 5D machines DECNET V, and you know that there is not a SHOW LINK - and H I will not fiddle at this moment to check where is the required info :[)   [...]sM +SMISERVER was very CPU hungry, so I assume it was the one doing the command. M +Interestingly enough, SHOW PROC SMISERVER/ALL revealed it had a NET4: devicep  ?  Supose, that here is one reason: the DIR command executes muchiB faster, than the "send output to screen". And looks like SMISERVER= is the intermediary between output of "execution process" and : the (DECNET or cluster-based) link (connection) to SYSMAN.  T +allocated to it and no subprocess. And SMISERVER does have a DECnet object created. +tN +So, how exactly does SMISERVER execute the command I asked it to do under the= +username/password configuration without creating a process ?l  4 $ REPLY/ENABLE/TEMP ! on "server" machine named BUK:  $ SET AUDIT/ALARM/ENAB=LOGIN=ALL  #  and on "client" machine named CIS:5 $ MC SYSMAN6  SYSMAN> SET ENV/NODE=BUK/USER=GS  and simple: SYSMAN> DO SHO PROC/ALL-    shows some interesting output:43 ------- selected info from SYSMAN output ----------j3 ------- Characters "*" used for marking  ----------0/ %SYSMAN-I-OUTPUT, command execution on node BUKnG 11-OCT-2000 12:00:20.36   User: GS               Process ID:   2020012B>I                           Node: BUK              Process name: "SMI$GS_1"C Terminal:           MBA73:                     *****l ...w  Images activated:           1)  Elapsed CPU time:          0 00:00:00.07l)  Connect time:              0 00:00:00.40  .... n  There is 1 process in this job:    SMI$GS_1 (*)9 -------- Output of audit alarms on servers node ---------l8 %%%%%%%%%%%  OPCOM  11-OCT-2000 12:00:20.29  %%%%%%%%%%%% Message from user AUDIT$SERVER on BUK 1 Security alarm (SECURITY) on BUK, system id: 7176e0 Auditable event:          Detached process login1 Event time:               11-OCT-2000 12:00:20.29t* PID:                      2020012B        * Process name:             SMI$GS_1        * Username:                 GS               [...]s  Terminal name:            MBA73:G Image name:               $8$DKA0:[SYSA.SYSCOMMON.][SYSEXE]LOGINOUT.EXE  -------------------------------   H +How can SMISERVER  execute a DCL command inside the context of an image0 +(SMISERVER.EXE) without creating a subprocess ?  &  You see: creating a detached process.  A  *Probably* SMISERVER uses a "hack" to run LOGINOUT in way, wheret8 LOGINOUT creates detached process as specified username.<  IMHO that is not connected with the availablity of personna? service (as you mean): VMS *has* (for sure -:)) build in module : to cvreate process "under" specified username, used in the- interactive, network and batch login process.o>  The fact, that RUN/DETACH/USER=  doesn't exists will not mean@ that system doesn't start detached processes under any username.  L +And is the NET: device allocated to SMISERVER used just in case it receives( +DECNET calls from non-clustered nodes ?  :  Supose: yes. But then the SYS$OUTPUT connection goes thru? mailbox (where is the output of the executing command) - really.> DO SHO LOG/PROC confirms that - next some code in SMISERVER to the "proper" remote connection.-    Regards - Gotfryd -- oE =====================================================================iF $ ON F$ERROR("LANGUAGE","ENGLISH","IN_MESSAGE").GT.F$ERROR("NORMAL") - 		THEN EXCUSE/OBJECT=MEo. $!                        GS@stanpol.zabrze.plE =====================================================================g   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 15:03:58 +0200 > From: "Jean-Franois Marchal" <jean-francois.marchal@x9000.fr> Subject: tcp/ip v4 lpd problem. Message-ID: <8s1obg$5bj$1@reader1.imaginet.fr>  B since an unidentified event (meaning "was working previously") ...  = the log file of a locally define lpd is repetitively saying :n  C     %SYSTEM-F-LINKDISCON, network partner disconnected logical link   +     lpd$ast_handler save_entry_number = 398i  = along with the following message in UCX$LPD_RCV_STARTUP.LOG :   .     Error opening primary input file SYS$INPUT     File not found"-  , We've checked there is no disk full problem.5 The target SYS$PRINT queue is still working properly.t3 We tried to setup a new LPD queue with same result.7  
 Any idea ? Cordialement   Jean-Franois Marchalr X9000 - LYON (FR)h   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 08:06:22 GMTy From: i.burgess@UQ.edu.aut8 Subject: Re: Thinking of switching from Multinet to UCX.) Message-ID: <8s171t$og1$1@nnrp1.deja.com>c  5 If you are still thinking of switching from Multinet,s7 I advise you to get MadGoat FTP to replace the UCX FTP.n  ; If you use the command line interface to Multinet FTP there;G will be some changes (esp. if there are mixed case usernames/ passwords;A involved), but at least you _will_ have a command line interface!n      & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.;   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 10:47:45 +0100s2 From: Chris Sharman <Chris.Sharman@CCAgroup.co.uk>8 Subject: Re: Trade-offs regarding Installed Known Images. Message-ID: <39E44551.6D90B450@CCAgroup.co.uk>   Lorin Ricker wrote:;H > It seems to me that it'd be beneficial to go ahead and INSTALL each of@ > the .EXE's as /OPEN /SHARE /HEADER_RES, so here's a multi-part@ > question (Hoff, I'd really like your insider's 2-cents worth): > E > 1.  What are the real tradeoffs here?  Reduced open-file count (perdG > multiple users) and  CHANNELCNT, obviously, vs. global pages/sectionsyE > (I can surely SYSGEN some more, since this is not a physical memoryi. > challenged system)?  What else, if anything? > D > Indeed, these are mostly "just" system message and transfer-vectorG > files, but having a copy open/attached for each and every applicationn > user seems extravagant, eh?F > H > Seems like we'd enjoy (somewhat) faster application startup as well asG > all the good things about a known/shared image (single shared copy insF > memory), but other than devoting more global pages/sections to this, > what downside? > E > 2.  Any advantage to including RIGHTSLIST.DAT as an INSTALLed file?1  G No, I don't think so. The best you can do there, afaik, is set some rms  global buffers.e   > G > 3.  If the advantages come down in favor of installing the files fromcH > this list, why doesn't VMS install 'em by default?  I know, this would> > vary from application to application, but should VMS be moreD > aggressive in this area, esp. with large memory systems being more > common now than in the past? > F > I'd appreciate some pertinent experiences and viewpoints on this oneH > before I go off and write an "install 'em all" com-file.  Many thanks!  B It would be nice to see a management tool to list all the multiplyG opened uninstalled files (which ought to be installed), and perhaps all3F the singly opened installed files (which maybe ought not), and prepare% something for inclusion at boot time. + Perhaps to be included as part of autogen ?eD I think the criteria for writing VMSIMAGES.DAT are static at presentA (from sys$manager:vms$images_master.dat), but autogen seems to benG written to handle a search list of master files in agen$images: perhaps@< that would be a hook for some more dynamic image management.  E Downsides: if you're not using the installed file, you'll pay a small:G price. If you use global buffers, you'll have to be sure there's enoughs> available on every node which will open the file, or write theB application to field rms$_crmp errors. If you replace an installedE image, there seems to be a small window for users to fall through thei6 cracks: we experience this with decforms applications,> which tend to crash immediately if started as we replace them.   Chrisl   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 14:48:51 +0000h- From: ezzaoudi med <m.ezzaoudi@digitem.co.ma>m) Subject: VAX 4000-100 low responding timel- Message-ID: <39E47DD2.F5819742@digitem.co.ma>n   Helloa' I have two VAX 4000-100 in VMS cluster.o It works fine since 7 years.D About few days , one of them presents a low responding time with LAN
 connection ( Terminal emulation).> I suspected the Ethernet port then I changed the Mother Board. But the problem persists.-D I also changed the memory modules , I removed the Synchronous card , changedd) the DSSI module BUT the problem persists.o  0 The two VAX boots with the same System Disk !!!!  
 Any idea ?   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 16:03:11 +0200-= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>-* Subject: Re: VAX Decompiler / Disassembler) Message-ID: <39E4731F.3CA9CED8@gtech.com>:   Jefferson Humber wrote:iF > Can anybody recommend a good De-compiler / Dis-assembler for reverse$ > engineering a .OLB library file ?? > L > The library object is created in MACRO language I believe, but may contain > 'C' as well.   Got for DISM32 !  6 (sorry I can not remember where to download it, but it should be easy to locate)r   Arne   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 06 Oct 2000 20:28:18 GMT - From: morrisj@epsilon3.comdex (Jay E. Morris).) Subject: VAX<>Alpha Software distributionp1 Message-ID: <39de35d6.9603523@news.brooks.af.mil>b  B Ok, got my Decus licenses but before I buy the media I thought I'dD check to see if there's anyone that be willing to trade a recent (atE least 7.1) VAX set for a Alpha 7.21 (June 2000) distribution set?  IfnF not, they're going out the door, although I have been thinking that an, OpenVMS mobile would look nice over my desk.     mailto:morrisj@epsilon3.com : Jay E. Morris, Epsilon 3 Productions - Web sites & Hosting1 Extreme masochism - Beat me, whip me, Windows Me.e   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 11:26:40 +0200 9 From: "Michel Herrscher Consultant" <michel@herrscher.fr>k( Subject: Re: VMS databases for hobbyist?% Message-ID: <8s1bv5$5lk$1@wanadoo.fr>e  D It seems to me that there is an hobbyist licence for Oracle Rdb  for OpenVms /Alpha or VAX.  & Without any warrty, ask Oracle people.     -- Michel HERRSCHER ConsultantC mhc@herrscher.fr Tl : +33 (0)450 870 912 Fax : +33 (0)450 871 741 Gsm : +33 (0)609 044 711  @ Bill McLaughlin <mcbill20@hotmail.com> a crit dans le message :* F102njQ8vjqueolj8Je00010b6a@hotmail.com...J > I ran into this same issue. Oracle for my NT machine is a couple hundredA > dollars. Oracle doesn't offer a "personal use" version for VMS.v >bK > I talked to an Oracle person about this. (I can't give a name for obviousaM > reasons.) I was told that they can't send me a VMS CD without me paying the J > full VMS price. But, if I can find a VMS CD to borrow, they don't reallyK > care if I install it, as long as it's not for any type of commercial use.' >nA > (LOL, this sounds suspiciously like "Don't ask, don't tell"...)p >tN > So, if you aren't using your hobbyist box to set up a commercial web site, II > would think you can run Oracle. I certainly wouldn't expect them to putnI > something like this in writing, but since it obviously benefits them by,? > having more people learning Oracle, they probably don't mind.i >-K > Is anyone else here running Oracle on a hobbyist machine? Maybe others inu, > the group can offer some additional input? >nJ > One last thing about Oracle though...if you run 8i on VMS, make sure youL > have lots of memory. I have 128mb but I get a lot of paging *and* swapping! > with just one instance running.n >r > Bill McLaughlint >n >l- > >yyyc186.illegaltospam_@flashcom.net wrote:,@ > > > In <9EPD5.597$iY1.12813@sodalite.nbnet.nb.ca>, on 10/08/00< > > >    at 12:24 AM, "Marco Shaw" <marco@nbnet.nb.ca> said: > > M > > >>Are any commercial databases available for VMS hobbyist (at no charge)?p > >s > > >>Marcou > >oM > > > No, but if you scrounge around in the FTP sites you can find source foriH > > > freeware databases.  Ingres used to release really old versions of	 > >itselfoM > > > for free on other platforms.  Perhaps an old version of VMS Ingres (arer+ > > > there any others?) will be out there.  > >wL > >To the best of my knowledge you're not going to find any free versions ofM > >Ingres for VMS.  I'm always on the lookout for a database that can be usedn3 > >by Hobbyists, and so far haven't found anything.a > > < > >One possibility that I just remembered is Interbase, see:L > >http://www.interbase.com/  It's now opensource using the Mozilla license,L > >and old versions ran on OpenVMS.  I just snagged the source and am in theL > >process of unpacking it.  I'm wondering if there is anything dealing with > >OpenVMS in there....u > > N > >Well, there is mention of VMS in there, but I'm guessing it's going to takeD > >someone better with programming than me to make anything of this. > >  > > Zane > >  > >c > K > _________________________________________________________________________fK > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.u > E > Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at  > http://profiles.msn.com. >t >i   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 11:23:40 GMTd% From: A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig)i( Subject: Re: VMS databases for hobbyist?1 Message-ID: <39e4357d.153866558@news.newsguy.com>e  B On Tue, 10 Oct 2000 19:18:55 GMT, LBohan@dbc.spam_less..com wrote:  : >On Tue, 10 Oct 2000 15:13:13 +0000 (GMT), Bill McLaughlin ><mcbill20@hotmail.com> wrote: >pL >>Is anyone else here running Oracle on a hobbyist machine? Maybe others in , >>the group can offer some additional input? >a9 >I'm wondering how would one get around licensing issues?c% >or does Oracle not use license keys?a  ? Oracle on VMS does no license checking. Oracle have removed the-+ license checking from RDB and DBMS as well.i     --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2000 16:02:12 +0200r= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> L Subject: Re: What would be your ultimate dream VMS machine (desktop/tower) ?) Message-ID: <39E472E3.DF1BA4A2@gtech.com>r  
 dan wrote:L > But if I could get the same box, without ANY drives, and with NO ram, it'd
 > be cheaper.8N > hell, I can get a 40 gig drive for $250 or so (that's about $175 to those in
 > the US),N > and ram, well, 128MB of ram doesn't cost more than $100 (again, $65 to those
 > in the US).  > L > So those other systems on that site with just ram and HD upgrades, are not > really worth it.N > cheaper to get a stripped down system and build it up myself. Even SCSI hard > drives aren'trJ > that expensive, really, maybe 2x the cost of IDE where I am, maybe a bit > more.7 > L > and since it's PCI, I might be able to get away with an Adaptec controller > (maybe not likely),0: > which are fairly cheap as well. It's not a PC after all.  E Do not expect all "cheap standard PC hardware" to work in a VMS Alphay box !u   Arne   ------------------------------   Date: 11 Oct 2000 15:57:35 GMT2 From: mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog)L Subject: Re: What would be your ultimate dream VMS machine (desktop/tower) ?, Message-ID: <8s22lf$i3b@gap.cco.caltech.edu>  A In article <39E235BF.EC415FD0@vrx.net>, dan <dan@vrx.net> writes: G >Is there a high end Alpha system (multi-cpu ?) in a desktop/tower unitC >that runs VMS?rH >How about an Alpha system with 512Mb of ram (and expandable after than)& >with ability to put at least 4 drives6 >in the case (scsi, say 9gig or 18gig or even bigger)? >c( >How much would a system like this cost?  J From Compaq?  If it's >1 CPU that would be at least a DS20 and it would beJ well over $10K. One of the API based machines would be somewhat less - butK I'm not very impressed with the quality of their work so far, and even less=A so with their prices, which are not very much lower than the Q's.0  E It would be nice if the Q got completely out of the business of finaloG assembly of low end Alphas - and did so by providing an ATX form factor D Alpha motherboard and the processors for it for sale to OEMs.  (And F that motherboard would support faster CPUs and field upgrades.  What aG novel concept!)  That way the smaller resellers/vendors, or even an enddJ user, could slap these into standard ATX cases and add third party memory,G an intraserver scsi controller, and disks - and the final product wouldeI cost less than the Q boxes do because it wouldn't have their 3X markup on K all of these items. Anyway, then you could finally get a DS10 class machinemH in as big a case as you wanted, instead of the BS that the Q pulls whereG they force you to either buy a storageworks shelf or a DS20 if you wante more than 3 drives.    <SNIP> >iH >I know, too many questions, but if I can get a good high-end system for% >a few $k (1-2 hopefully), I'm there!u >n  K Sorry, no such beast.  The Q still hasn't figured a way (and isn't clearly aI trying very hard to) break VMS out of its niche.  And niche products are r inherently expensive.a   Regards,   David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edud? Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech s   ------------------------------   Date: 11 Oct 2000 16:11:16 GMT2 From: mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog)L Subject: Re: What would be your ultimate dream VMS machine (desktop/tower) ?, Message-ID: <8s23f4$i3b@gap.cco.caltech.edu>  A In article <39E26399.E7AF6B1F@vrx.net>, dan <dan@vrx.net> writes: K >But if I could get the same box, without ANY drives, and with NO ram, it'dn >be cheaper.  @ Correct, the Q marks up controllers, disks, and memory big time.  M >hell, I can get a 40 gig drive for $250 or so (that's about $175 to those in"	 >the US), M >and ram, well, 128MB of ram doesn't cost more than $100 (again, $65 to those: >in the US).  J Not quite.  The DS10 doesn't take regular memory.  However, the memory it B does take is much cheaper from 3rd parties than it is from Compaq.   >-K >So those other systems on that site with just ram and HD upgrades, are notO >really worth it. M >cheaper to get a stripped down system and build it up myself. Even SCSI hard  >drives aren'tI >that expensive, really, maybe 2x the cost of IDE where I am, maybe a bit  >more.  L More like 3X more as IDE is dirt cheap.  And you do NOT want to use the IDE J drive on the DS10.  The IO is slow enough on VMS due to RMS overhead, and K the last thing you need is a dirt slow 33Mhz IDE drive slowing things down A further. >MK >and since it's PCI, I might be able to get away with an Adaptec controllerE >(maybe not likely),9 >which are fairly cheap as well. It's not a PC after all.o  I No, you need an intraserver controller.  However, again, much cheaper to bH get that directly from them than from Compaq.  In fact the VMS tax isn'tG even all that high on the intraserver VMS specific models (compared to   models for other OS's.)    Regards,   David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edul? Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech     ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2000.569 ************************