1 INFO-VAX	Thu, 19 Oct 2000	Volume 2000 : Issue 585       Contents: RE: 2nd Hand sales in Europe.  Re: Adaptec 2940 on AS 400 Re: After RTFFAQ :-) Re: After RTFFAQ :-) Re: After RTFFAQ :-)# Re: ALPHA vs. VAX: system disk size B Re: Anybody else having bugchecks after installing recent patches?B Re: Anybody else having bugchecks after installing recent patches? Automate Decserver Login Re: Automate Decserver Login Re: Automate Decserver Login Re: Automate Decserver Login Re: Automate Decserver Login Re: Cleaning up disk space?  Re: comp.org.encompass.us  Re: Compaq information Re: Compaq VMS promo Re: Compaq VMS promo0 Decoding dates with Lib$Table_Parse (Lib$TParse)( Re: Detecting hardware failures from VMSN Re: Disaster-Tolerant Clusters and Sun (was Re: Sun Hardware problems persist)M Re: Disaster-Tolerant Clusters and Sun (was Re: Sun Hardware problemspersist) M Re: Disaster-Tolerant Clusters and Sun (was Re: Sun Hardware problemspersist) M Re: Disaster-Tolerant Clusters and Sun (was Re: Sun Hardware problemspersist) 3 Re: Encompass Bylaw Ballot: THE ENVELOPE, PLEASE... & Re: Extending LATNET over dial-up line& Re: Extending LATNET over dial-up line Re: File Comparison - Urgent Re: File Comparison - Urgent Re: File Comparison - Urgent Files not deleting?  Free 7 TK50 cartridges in UK  Re: Free 7 TK50 cartridges in UK  Re: Free 7 TK50 cartridges in UK' Re: Getting Compaq to advertise OpenVMS / HELP! - UCX (TCPIP V5.0A) SMTP problem/question 3 Re: HELP! - UCX (TCPIP V5.0A) SMTP problem/question  Re: How to send an SMS message Re: How to send an SMS message Re: How to send an SMS message Re: html on vms  Re: Java on Openvms  Re: Java on Openvms  Re: Java on Openvms 3 re: Linker performance on DS20 slower than VAX 6520 J Re: looking for company to provide home IP connection (for VMS)  (Germany)I RE: looking for company to provide home IP connection (for VMS) (Germany) I Re: looking for company to provide home IP connection (for VMS) (Germany) I Re: looking for company to provide home IP connection (for VMS) (Germany) I Re: looking for company to provide home IP connection (for VMS) (Germany) I RE: looking for company to provide home IP connection (for VMS) (Germany) H Re: looking for company to provide home IP connection (for VMS)(Germany)' loss of linefeeds when typing a file-11 , Re: loss of linefeeds when typing a files-11 Re: Mail forwarding & Memo:   Re: How to send an SMS message Memory
 Re: Memory
 Re: Memory  Re: Migrating the last VAX users MOUNT/FOR  fails for shadowset. # Re: MOUNT/FOR  fails for shadowset. # Re: MOUNT/FOR  fails for shadowset. " Re: MOUNT/FOR fails for shadowset.  Re: OpenVMS, java, perl, etc ...  Re: OpenVMS, java, perl, etc ...  Re: OpenVMS, java, perl, etc ...  Re: OpenVMS, java, perl, etc ... Re: PDF under OpenVMS * Re: SMG, BASIC, ckermit, and Printer ports- Re: Solved: no MMOV sound on AlphaStation 500 - Re: SUMMARY:  installing VMS 7.2-1 on 433au ?  Re: Sun "uptime" belly laugher# TCPware + "Web Connector" question? ' Re: TCPware + "Web Connector" question? ' TECO (was Re: File Comparison - Urgent) + Re: TECO (was Re: File Comparison - Urgent) " Re: This list participants profile/ Re: Trade-offs regarding Installed Known Images  Re: VAX emulator Re: VAX to Alpha (DS10)  Re: VAX to Alpha (DS10)  RE: VAX to Alpha (DS10)  VMS C Compiler Re: VMS C Compiler Re: VMS C Compiler Re: VMS C Compiler Re: VMS C Compiler Re: VMS C Compiler Re: VMS C Compiler Re: VMS Pascal 5.7 vs. gpc VMSINSTALL Question  Re: VMSINSTALL Question 9 What connector to use to interconnect X.25 and DECNet V ? C Re: What would be your ultimate dream VMS machine (desktop/tower) ? 
 Re: X Desktop 
 Re: X Desktop 
 Re: X Desktop 
 Re: X Desktop 
 Re: X Desktop   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  " Date: Fri, 13 Oct 00 10:31:52 +200' From: huber@mppmu.mpg.de (Joseph Huber) & Subject: RE: 2nd Hand sales in Europe., Message-ID: <8s6h9r$1a50$1@kiosk.rzg.mpg.de>  * In Article <8FCBA37A7BMcN@212.100.160.123>, noSpamPlease@takeit.elsewhere (BMcN) writes:M >Can anyone point me in the direction of websites or companies that might be  E >able to help me out there? Ideally in Belgium, or within reasonable   >travelling/shipping distance.  < In Germany there is http://www.kuno.de, mailto:sales@kuno.de   --  / Joseph "Sepp" Huber,MPI Physik,Muenchen,Germany 9 huber@mppmu.mpg.de  URL http://wwwvms.mppmu.mpg.de/~huber    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 10:31:39 GMT 2 From: "Mark Ashley" <markhashley@optushome.com.au># Subject: Re: Adaptec 2940 on AS 400 A Message-ID: <f4AH5.1147$pG5.6015@news1.rdc1.nsw.optushome.com.au>    Hmm thanks guys for the answer.   J Pity about Adaptec being unsupported. I'm going to have to see if it'll beL worth the money to get another SCSI controller. The machine is only so I canA scratch up on VMS after a few years of being away in Windoze land  (purgatory).   Mark  ; Mark Ashley <markhashley@optushome.com.au> wrote in message ; news:ychH5.1138$pG5.5823@news1.rdc1.nsw.optushome.com.au...  > Hi > + > I was wondering if someone could help me. F > I have an Alphastation 400 and I have an Adaptec 2940 fast wide SCSI% > controller plugged into a PCI slot. D > Now I realise that the firmware for the AS400 does not support theD > controller for booting, you can't see the devices attached to this > controller from SRM.I > But I know Linux and even Windoze NT V4 can see the devices attached to  the ) > controller, after the OS's have booted.  > J > What I was wondering was: Can I load a device driver under VMS that willH > allow me to see this controller and the attached devices? I have a few disks J > and a TZ89 attached. If I can do this can someone show me what is needed to > do to load this driver.  >  > Thanks > Mark >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 12:51:29 -0400 5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>  Subject: Re: After RTFFAQ :-) , Message-ID: <8si080$ectt$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>  F HALT/CONTINUE was always a dicey thing.  Worked pretty well for simpleJ serial consoles.  Works less well on Graphics consoles.  In fact it shouldL never have been done on graphics consoles, because the design never provided/ (nor can it really) for proper synchronization.   J What is happening in the future is being pushed along by the Windows/IntelE design centers - where eventually we will have "legacy free" hardware J platforms - in this case the "legacy" is the PC hardware giblets includingF the ISA bus, and the mouse and keyboard controller.  In this brave new9 world - all the new giblets will be hooked to a USB port.   K USB is a very complex subsystem.  It isn't feasible to somehow allow a HALT J to reset the USB to use it (and not lose transactions in flight), and thenK have the OS capable of a complete reinit/restart of the USB.  Remember that I the USB could have the mouse, kb, printer, boot disk, network, and/or any ( number of other things on it and active.  E What we have asked for from the HW/FW folks is that every platform be J capable of having a supported dumb serial line option available (perhaps aK PCI option, or whatever) that can be used as a serial port - to allow debug , including the availability of HALT/CONTINUE.  L What you are not likely to see is the ability to halt a system with graphics? running on it, and be able to CONTINUE from the console prompt.       ? antonio.carlini wrote in message <39E78B14.622B1554@iee.org>...  >Brian Tillman wrote: K >> >  CONTINUE may or may not resume after a halt -- on upcoming platforms, F >> >  OpenVMS Engineering is expecting that there will be too much I/O context 2 >> >  and that reboot or similar will be required. >>& >> Bill Gates' influence, do doubt ;-) > 7 >I'm guessing here, but I think you need to look at the & >other half of the wintel alliance ... > % >OTOH I may be well wide of the mark.  >  >Antonio >  >---------------. >Antonio Carlini             arcarlini@iee.org   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 11:34:11 GMT = From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-)  Subject: Re: After RTFFAQ :-) 0 Message-ID: <009F1D27.6FEBDBC8@SendSpamHere.ORG>  d In article <8si080$ectt$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>, "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> writes: {...snip...}F >What we have asked for from the HW/FW folks is that every platform beK >capable of having a supported dumb serial line option available (perhaps a L >PCI option, or whatever) that can be used as a serial port - to allow debug- >including the availability of HALT/CONTINUE.   J You'd best twist their arms and necks or hire some fellow named Bruno withK white jacket and tie fashion sense to bust their knee caps if XDELTA can no  longer be supported!  F BTW, these new USB keyboards had best have DEC-style keyboard layouts. --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              O city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after them.    ------------------------------    Date: 19 Oct 2000 18:09:56 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  Subject: Re: After RTFFAQ :-) H Message-ID: <y47l74izhn.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>  7 "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> writes:   M > USB is a very complex subsystem.  It isn't feasible to somehow allow a HALT L > to reset the USB to use it (and not lose transactions in flight), and then? > have the OS capable of a complete reinit/restart of the USB.    L So there will no longer be the ability to do a restart after a power failure0 (with battery-backed up main memory and caches)?   It _was_ such a neat sight...    	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 18:44:52 +0200 = From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> , Subject: Re: ALPHA vs. VAX: system disk size) Message-ID: <39EF2504.82E06FBC@gtech.com>    Phillip Helbig wrote: J > Second, will the minimum size for VAX or ALPHA (1 GB now, I guess) for a; > standard installation increase in the foreseeable future?   H The forseeable are 7.3 and someone else may give you an exact number for that.   C > Third, what is the optimum ratio of free to used space on a disk? . > Assume that it is defragmented often enough.   Depends on the usage: .   high read/wrire ratio allows for higher fillC   bigger files give more problems than smaller files with high fill 
   etc.etc.  G I think the old rule of thumb says 70%, but that is just a more or less  random number.   Arne   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 13:15:20 GMT % From: A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig) K Subject: Re: Anybody else having bugchecks after installing recent patches? 1 Message-ID: <39eef318.857755026@news.newsguy.com>   1 On Wed, 18 Oct 2000 13:27:52 +0100, Tim Llewellyn   <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk> wrote:   >  >  >Curtis Rempel wrote:  > M >> Although we did not see any crashes, we rolled the kit back today as well, K >> under duress I might add, knocking 1500 users off our production cluster N >> during prime time.  The kit was installed early Saturday morning and thingsM >> started to go really wonky last night (Monday) with backups and OPCOM.  In K >> particular, all backups hanging in RWCSV (CLUSTER_SERVER wedged in LEF), O >> SHOW USERS busting across the cluster, and various OWT (other weird things). M >> Things got progressively worse and we declared that we were landing on the L >> nearest runway without further notice.  Fortunately, it only cost us a 37L >> minute outage, however, that was 37 minutes more than it should have beenL >> and it was pretty painful during that period from a sysadmin perspective.M >> We would have been spared this outage if the Compaq OpenVMS patch list had K >> been functioning properly - not everybody on the list gets the alerts it O >> seems and it's a known problem that Compaq has been working on for some time  >> to rectify.  Sigh.  >> > I >Much sympathy, except, you did q/a those patches on a development system 7 >before deploying them on your live systems didn't you?   E This is certainly a valid question but it's very, very rare to find a F VMS patch as completely broken as this one seems to be thus lulling us@ all into a false sense of security. It almost looks as if Compaq& didn't test this patch to any degree.    > --7 >Tim Llewellyn, OpenVMS Infrastructure, Remarcs Project 1 >MedAS at the BBC, Whiteladies Road, Bristol, UK. B >Email tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk. Home tim.llewellyn@cableinet.co.uk > B >I speak for myself only and my views in no way represent those of >MedAS or the BBC. >  >    --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 13:26:25 GMT % From: A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig) K Subject: Re: Anybody else having bugchecks after installing recent patches? 1 Message-ID: <39eef424.858023602@news.newsguy.com>   1 On Wed, 18 Oct 2000 13:52:42 GMT, "Curtis Rempel" % <vmsguy.no.spam.here@home.com> wrote:      >>K >> Much sympathy, except, you did q/a those patches on a development system 9 >> before deploying them on your live systems didn't you?  >> > K >Development AND test.  Of course, none of this ever shows up until it gets  >to production right?   C Especially true of Pathworks in my experience. Compaq's attempts to C fix the problem of extremely poor Pathworks performance for example A seem to fix the problem IF AND ONLY IF the client is running NT 4 F Service Pack 5, 6 or 6A. Not with anything else including Windows 2000B with or without Service Pack 1. It looks to me as if Compaq TCP/IPF Engineering is attempting to "do the right thing" rather than "Do whatC Microsoft does". In most cases this is probably correct but creates B problems if the product is designed to emulate/replace a Microsoft product as Adanced Server does.   C Over the last few years I have seen numerous probems with Pathworks C which worked fine in limited testing but broke apart as the clients F became more diverse and numerous. Worse still some things broke as youB added processors and/or memory to the VMS server which is far less excusable.     Alan --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 08:44:25 +0000 (GMT) ( From: Premjith N <premjithn@hotmail.com>! Subject: Automate Decserver Login 5 Message-ID: <LAW2-F153qBHksQ6KLV0000174d@hotmail.com>   ; To Logout Decserver Port, we login to Decserver as follows,   9 set host/mop decsvr (Press Enter twice to get "#" prompt)  #passwd  Enter Username> c  Local> show port all Local> log port <portno> CTRL\ (To Exit)   + How do I automate this via a DCL Procedure.    Please Advice.  	 Premjith.  Premjithn@hotmail.com     I _________________________________________________________________________ I Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.   D Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at  http://profiles.msn.com.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 11:27:32 +0000 $ From: Steve.Spires@yellowpages.co.uk% Subject: Re: Automate Decserver Login / Message-ID: <0025697D.003EB112.00@quegw01.btyp>   L Contact:   Tel: 3063  -  IS - Infrastructure, 1st Floor, Bridge Street Plaza    . My suggestion would be to use KERMIT for this.   Steve Spires VMS System Manager BT/Yellow Pages         < Premjith N <premjithn@HOTMAIL.COM> on 19/10/2000 08:44:25 AM    To:        Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com+ cc:         (bcc: Steve Spires/YellowPages) I From:      Premjith N <premjithn@HOTMAIL.COM>, 19 October 2000, 8:44 a.m.    Automate Decserver Login          ; To Logout Decserver Port, we login to Decserver as follows,   9 set host/mop decsvr (Press Enter twice to get "#" prompt)  #passwd  Enter Username> c  Local> show port all Local> log port <portno> CTRL\ (To Exit)   + How do I automate this via a DCL Procedure.    Please Advice.  	 Premjith.  Premjithn@hotmail.com     I _________________________________________________________________________ I Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.   C Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at  http://profiles.msn.com.   ------------------------------   Date: 19 Oct 2000 11:02:18 GMT3 From: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann) % Subject: Re: Automate Decserver Login00 Message-ID: <8smkbq$t79$4@n.ruf.uni-freiburg.de>  ` In article <LAW2-F153qBHksQ6KLV0000174d@hotmail.com>, Premjith N <premjithn@hotmail.com> writes: >e< >To Logout Decserver Port, we login to Decserver as follows, >f: >set host/mop decsvr (Press Enter twice to get "#" prompt) >#passwd >Enter Username> c >Local> show port allg >Local> log port <portno>L >CTRL\ (To Exit) >c, >How do I automate this via a DCL Procedure.  C Again, something typical for C-Kermit from Columbia University. See "    http://www.columbia.edu/kermit/   Regards,    Christoph Gartmann   H -----------------------------------------------------------------------+H | Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452 |H | Immunbiologie                                                        |H | Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de     |H | D-79011  Freiburg, FRG                                               |H +--------- http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/english/menue.html ---------+   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 15:25:19 +0200e5 From: Oswald Knoppers <Oswald.Knoppers@whitehouse.nl> % Subject: Re: Automate Decserver Login5- Message-ID: <39EEF63F.E13B0F59@whitehouse.nl>i   Christoph Gartmann wrote:g > b > In article <LAW2-F153qBHksQ6KLV0000174d@hotmail.com>, Premjith N <premjithn@hotmail.com> writes: > >P> > >To Logout Decserver Port, we login to Decserver as follows, > >m< > >set host/mop decsvr (Press Enter twice to get "#" prompt)
 > >#passwd > >Enter Username> c > >Local> show port allo > >Local> log port <portno>m > >CTRL\ (To Exit) > >e. > >How do I automate this via a DCL Procedure. > E > Again, something typical for C-Kermit from Columbia University. See $ >    http://www.columbia.edu/kermit/  , Is Kermit capable of using mop as transport?  H There used to be a product called TSM especially for this. I am not sure# if this product is still available.    Oswald   ------------------------------   Date: 19 Oct 2000 14:49:14 GMT3 From: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann)c% Subject: Re: Automate Decserver Logink0 Message-ID: <8sn1la$584$1@n.ruf.uni-freiburg.de>  e In article <39EEF63F.E13B0F59@whitehouse.nl>, Oswald Knoppers <Oswald.Knoppers@whitehouse.nl> writes:e >Christoph Gartmann wrote: >> oc >> In article <LAW2-F153qBHksQ6KLV0000174d@hotmail.com>, Premjith N <premjithn@hotmail.com> writes:  >> >? >> >To Logout Decserver Port, we login to Decserver as follows,/ >> >= >> >set host/mop decsvr (Press Enter twice to get "#" prompt)p >> >#passwdp >> >Enter Username> cM >> >Local> show port all >> >Local> log port <portno> >> >CTRL\ (To Exit)p >> >/ >> >How do I automate this via a DCL Procedure.k >> ,F >> Again, something typical for C-Kermit from Columbia University. See% >>    http://www.columbia.edu/kermit/  > - >Is Kermit capable of using mop as transport?C  F For this specific purpose this is simply not relevant. Kermit uses theG underlying protocol for communication, be it LAT or TCP/IP or whatever.t3 But Kermit is no tool to bootload terminal servers.s  I >There used to be a product called TSM especially for this. I am not sure $ >if this product is still available.   It's at the end of its life.   Regards,    Christoph Gartmannl  H -----------------------------------------------------------------------+H | Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452 |H | Immunbiologie                                                        |H | Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de     |H | D-79011  Freiburg, FRG                                               |H +--------- http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/english/menue.html ---------+   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 18:40:29 +0200 = From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>a$ Subject: Re: Cleaning up disk space?) Message-ID: <39EF23FD.529C9FFC@gtech.com>e  
 dan wrote:J > Can anyone post some general guidelines on what is safe to delete from a	 > system? F > For example, on my vax, I'll never use LAT or DEC Windows, and don't+ > think I'll use TNT (not sure what it is). F > Anyhow, maybe I got a bit overzealous, and wiped out all that stuff. >  > Any suggestions?   When comparing:n$   - the disk-space that can be freed   - the risk of problems   - the price of hard-drives  ' I would recommend you to drop the idea.    Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 03:55:44 -0400 & From: "Jeff Killeen" <Jeff@IDM-IO.com>" Subject: Re: comp.org.encompass.us2 Message-ID: <8sm9fl$aeg$1@slb2.atl.mindspring.net>  G If it is a "replace" (which wasn't my suggestion) then I would drop the  ".us"a   --      0 Jeff Killeen - www.Killeen.cc (All contact info)E =====================================================================.  0 "Brian Tillman" <tillman_brian> wrote in message news:39edcf5b$1@news.si.com...9 >Will having a new group not detract from comp.org.decus?   > The proposal I'll write will be to replace comp.org.decus withL comp.org.encompass (or ...encompass.us, as Jeff wants).  Personally, I thinkL that the former is better than the latter.  If other chapters form, let them/ propose a restructuring of the group hierarchy.h  E By the way, thanks to those who have sent me pointers to the "How to"dL documents.  I'm working on it, but it may take a few weeks, because I have a real job, too. --A Brian Tillman                   Internet: tillman_brian at si.comdA Smiths Industries, Inc.                   tillman at swdev.si.comd= 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS      Addresses modified to prevent < Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991     SPAM.  Replace "at" with "@"8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 13:52:31 GMT % From: A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig)m Subject: Re: Compaq information 1 Message-ID: <39eef9d9.859483752@news.newsguy.com>A  @ On Thu, 19 Oct 2000 00:50:05 GMT, StevenU@POBoxes.com (Steven P. Underwood) wrote:   > >On 18 Oct 2000 15:00:18 PDT, Fairfield@SLAC.Stanford.EDU (Ken5 >Fairfield; SLAC: 650-926-2924; FAX: 926-3515) wrote:e > J >>    for me (I  don't  even  remember  the  phone number...something likeA >>    1-800-BUYCOMPAQ...which is two characters too long, yuch!).n >nB >Which is actually good seeing that on most (all?) US based phones >there is no "Q".t  F I thought these codes had been standardized internationally now. ThereE uses to be a few differences between the UK and the US Alphabetics sol? the UK discouraged use for many years until the old phones weresA history to avoid confusion. Every phone I have ever seen recentlytE lists "PQRS" on "7". A quick look at a Motorola US cellphone revealedaB that it to had Q on 7. Actually it would make it damn difficult to@ send an SMS or enter a name with a Q in it if it didn't I guess!     >u >Steve >Steven P. Underwood,DNRCv >Whitinsville,MA >StevenU@POBoxes.com   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 06:40:21 -0400v) From: yyyc186.illegaltospam_@flashcom.net) Subject: Re: Compaq VMS promoo9 Message-ID: <39eecfc2$1$lllp186$mr2ice@news.flashcom.com>N  6 In <ko1ms8.12f.ln@news.atl.mediaone.net>, on 10/19/00 2    at 05:37 AM, "RickB" <nobody@nowhere.com> said:  J Powerhouse works with RDB.  I beleive the later version worked with OracleG as well.  Been over a year since I took a PowerHouse contract.  Kind ofN miss the product.e   Roland  H >Seems like it also worked with RDB before somebody bought the rights to% >it. Am I remembering this correctly?    >Rickn  7 ><yyyc186.illegaltospam_@flashcom.net> wrote in messagee4 >news:39dff577$2$lllp186$mr2ice@news.flashcom.com...2 >> In <39de107f$1@obsidian.gov.bc.ca>, on 10/08/00J >>    at 12:17 AM, "Graham Bennett" <Graham.Bennett@gems5.gov.bc.ca> said: >>K >> Powerhouse is a 4GL, not a database itself.  Although it is a wonderfull-M >> package and can give you database like access to RMS files.  I try to findmJ >> a PowerHouse contract every 3 years or so in order to keep current with >> it. >>	 >> Roland9 >>M >> >Alan Greig wrote in message <39c77a18.1124658914@news.newsguy.com>... >OnrI >> >Tue, 19 Sep 2000 14:27:31 +0200, "Hans Vlems" <hvlems@iae.nl> >wrote:e >> >>sJ >> >>>Database vendors are another important segment. How many run on VMS?J >> >>>Adabas/Natural and Oracle/Rdb and it seems to mee that the latter is >tryingh >> >>>to >> >>>get rid of VMS.  >> >>wK >> >>Oracle is most certainly not droping RDB on VMS. They've dropped it one! >> >>NT and Tru-64 but *NOT* VMS.o >> >> ' >> >>CA Ingres isn't going away either.s >> >>  >> >>/ >> >Cognos Powerhouse is another viable option.e >> >> >> >> --w> >> -----------------------------------------------------------G >> yyyc186@flashcom.net              To Respond delete ".illegaltospam")9 >>                             MR/2 Internet Cruiser 1.52t; >>                             For a Microsoft free univers-> >> ----------------------------------------------------------- >>     -- m; -----------------------------------------------------------tD yyyc186@flashcom.net              To Respond delete ".illegaltospam"6                             MR/2 Internet Cruiser 2.2a8                             For a Microsoft free univers; -----------------------------------------------------------e   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 11:17:00 GMTe% From: A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig)t Subject: Re: Compaq VMS promo 1 Message-ID: <39eed74e.850641467@news.newsguy.com>w  E On Thu, 19 Oct 2000 05:37:24 GMT, "RickB" <nobody@nowhere.com> wrote:s  L >Seems like it also worked with RDB before somebody bought the rights to it.! >Am I remembering this correctly?e  @ If you mean acess to RMS files then yes it still can do this viaC "transparent gateway to RMS" IIRC when Oracle first bought RDB theyc> didn't buy the tansparent gateways from DEC but did so later.    Alan   >Rick( >B7 ><yyyc186.illegaltospam_@flashcom.net> wrote in message 4 >news:39dff577$2$lllp186$mr2ice@news.flashcom.com...2 >> In <39de107f$1@obsidian.gov.bc.ca>, on 10/08/00J >>    at 12:17 AM, "Graham Bennett" <Graham.Bennett@gems5.gov.bc.ca> said: >>K >> Powerhouse is a 4GL, not a database itself.  Although it is a wonderfullrM >> package and can give you database like access to RMS files.  I try to findsJ >> a PowerHouse contract every 3 years or so in order to keep current with >> it.   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 07:35:11 -0400 2 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" <DRAGON@compuserve.com>9 Subject: Decoding dates with Lib$Table_Parse (Lib$TParse)b7 Message-ID: <200010190735_MC2-B79E-F2EB@compuserve.com>3  H         I wonder if you aren't trying to use the wrong tool for the job!  J         If you make that /DATE_RANGE=3D(date1,date2, . . . ) then I think=  youJ might be able to use the command definition utility and the CLI$ routines= . =   * The syntax checking would be done for you!    $ Message text written by Alan Frisbie@ >I need a bit of help with Lib$Table_Parse in my latest program.  < The user needs to be able to specify zero or more (up to 10)? date ranges.   I wanted to use a specifier that looks something ! like:   /DATE_RANGE=3Ddate1,date2>  7 To make it more complex, I would like to allow dates toh7 be specified in any valid VMS date format.   This means 8 that the symbol alphabet consists of letters, numbers, =  9 "-", and "/".   Unless I am mis-reading the manual, there 7 doesn't seem to be any way to specify this, since therei5 isn't a TPA$DATE alphabet (Darn!).   Does anyone have ( any good ideas on how to easily do this?  < If any VMS developers are reading this, what are the chances@ of TPA$DATE being added to a future version of Lib$Table_Parse?<   ------------------------------   Date: 19 Oct 2000 13:33:41 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)1 Subject: Re: Detecting hardware failures from VMSi6 Message-ID: <8smt7l$qi2$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  g In article <pk2sus0nf6ubj4jt6au6qa8jva2l4gh9gp@4ax.com>, Dave Harrold <DRHarrold@earthlink.net> writes:rE :We just had a situation here that got me thinking.  One of our GS60EuE :systems just lost a power supply with a bang. Fortunately (?) one of F :our people was standing next to it when it went, so he came on got meG :right away.  There isn't anything I can see in DECevent recording thisR :event.t  G   DECevent (and its replacement, Compaq Analyze) provides analysis and kD   notification capabilities for customers with hardware service fromF   Compaq -- the bit-to-text translation is probably the best known andE   most commonly-used function, but it is not the only available part.n  A   I would expect that DECevent or Compaq Analyze would detect andiD   report a power supply failure -- assuming that the failure was notG   effectively "catastrophic" and would thus prevent logging, of course.o  E   Various systems do have bits or ways to track failures in redundent/E   power supplies.  Off-hand, I don't know about the AlphaServer GS60EoH   host-visibility of these aspects, but I know that various Alpha boxes H   can have the power supply status read directly from the host software.  N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 14:53:32 GMTt From: kparris@my-deja.comiW Subject: Re: Disaster-Tolerant Clusters and Sun (was Re: Sun Hardware problems persist)n) Message-ID: <8sn1t8$2np$1@nnrp1.deja.com>h  1 andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote: : > Were there two sets of outages with two separate causes.  F Yes.  While the first pair of outages were clearly caused by the humanE error of a network misconfiguration, and the problems went away after A bridge reboots to reset the forwarding tables, there were severaltE potential contributing factors involved in the second set of outages.y/ None of those factors puts the blame on Compaq.v  @ > Out of the box Sun supports 10K separation, you can get longerH > separation and we have customers with significantly longer connections- > these are qualified on an indevidual basis.c  C But in going beyond officially-supported and tested limits they arehA breaking new ground and taking on significant risk -- essentiallyfF acting as Sun's R&D Department.  Customers who need disaster toleranceG don't need more risk.  And if Sun really knew it worked in general, notnC just special cases, they'd raise the official supported limits in a  flash.  @ > You can also use EMC SRDF or Suns Network Data Replicator over> > much longer distances than 10K and this allows you to keep a* > remote cluster or single system in sync.  C Any vendor can use EMC or replication -- this is not unique to Sun.yD These don't allow simultaneous, coordinated read/write access to the@ data at both sites, and so are of no use for disaster tolerance,@ although they can be used for the less-stringent requirements ofG disaster recovery (but implying some not-insignificant length of outage 3 time and requiring manual action for the failover).tG -----------------------------------------------------------------------sG Keith Parris|Integrity Computing,Inc.|parris@decuserve.decus.org-nospamMF VMS Consulting: Clusters, Perf., Alpha porting, Storage&I/O, Internals    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.j   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 14:08:20 +0100e0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>V Subject: Re: Disaster-Tolerant Clusters and Sun (was Re: Sun Hardware problemspersist)* Message-ID: <39EEF244.2440E830@uk.sun.com>   kparris@my-deja.com wrote: > 3 > andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote:aH > > > (Disaster-Tolerant VMS Clusters) is designed for just that sort ofJ > > > thing, and it works.  Sun can't provide technology with capabilities > > > anywhere close to that.m > >r@ > > Clearly you obviously know a lot more about OpenVMS than youF > > do about Solaris otherwise you would not have made this statement. >    Answer the first question.  8 Were there two sets of outages with two separate causes.  ; If there were and if as you seem to imply the cause of the  9 second set of outages is still unknown correct Kerry who   seems to be poorly informed.  7 The rest is smply a straw man on your part. We are not w5 talking about Sun's clustering capability, it wasn't e  responsible for eTrades outages.    H > Disaster-Tolerant Clusters allow continued and uninterrupted operation> > despite the loss of up to an entire datacenter.  Two or moreH > datacenters are placed a safe distance apart, and the cluster solutionH > ensures that data is kept identical on the storage in each datacenter.I > Where Sun fails is in not being able to provide a safe distance between-G > datacenters.  IBM's hardware-assist-centered Parallel Sysplex Cluster ( > design suffers from the same weakness. > B > Sun Campus Clusters allow up to 10 km (about 6 miles) separationH > between nodes with version 2.2.  VMS supports 150-mile site separationH > out-of-the-box, or 500 miles with DTCS.  Sun's headquarters in SiliconI > Valley is near the San Andreas fault line (not far from E*Trade's first-E > datacenter, in fact).  You can go 10 km in any direction you choose:F > there and not find a site that will survive The Big One when it hitsC > Sun's headquarters.  Sun can't protect it's own data with its ownwD > solution, so don't try to convince me it is anywhere near what VMS! > provides in disaster tolerance.  >   : Despite the staw man I will answer your point since it is  incorrect. w  ? Out of the box Sun supports 10K separation, you can get longer sF separation and we have customers with significantly longer connections+ these are qualified on an indevidual basis.t  ? You can also use EMC SRDF or Suns Network Data Replicator over  = much longer distances than 10K and this allows you to keep a l( remote cluster or single system in sync.    G > > We may have to do more work at the apps level than an OpenVMS baseds. > > system but we can achieve the same effect. > I > Yes, customers must modify their programs and code to Sun's proprietary-F > Cluster API so applications can fail over.  This ties them even moreH > tightly to Sun.  This from a company that professes to believe in OpenG > Systems.  Sun has added so many proprietary features to Slolaris thatFH > one college O/S textbook I saw recently at Barnes & Noble actually hadC > a separate section on Solaris in addition to the section on Unix!B  D No sorry again this is incorrect. Customers can use Oracle Parallel > Server which is not proprietary to Sun , or Sybase Replication Server/OpenSwitch>' which again is not proprietary to Sun. t  G They both require Sun's cluster software but do not require any specialo  programming on a customers part.  F Of course if your argument is that the DBMS's need to be aware of the D cluster foundation and that makes it a proprietary solution then youC are in a glass house chucking stones because this is also the case t with OpenVMS clusters as well.   Regards  Andrew Harrisonp Enterprise IT Architectl   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 17:19:31 +0200 = From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>lV Subject: Re: Disaster-Tolerant Clusters and Sun (was Re: Sun Hardware problemspersist)) Message-ID: <39EF1103.3A3D84DF@gtech.com>t   andrew harrison wrote:8 > The rest is smply a straw man on your part. We are not6 > talking about Sun's clustering capability, it wasn't" > responsible for eTrades outages.   Or so you claim !4   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 17:56:54 +0100 0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>V Subject: Re: Disaster-Tolerant Clusters and Sun (was Re: Sun Hardware problemspersist)* Message-ID: <39EF27D6.30643F84@uk.sun.com>   Arne Vajh=F8j wrote: > =h   > andrew harrison wrote:: > > The rest is smply a straw man on your part. We are not8 > > talking about Sun's clustering capability, it wasn't$ > > responsible for eTrades outages. > =c   > Or so you claim !F > =C   > Arne  1 Wow, so you honestly think that its possible thatg1 Sun Cluster was involved in the eTrade outages. =m    2 I know its fashionable amongst the more paranoid =  5 denizins of this group to blame Sun for most of the =t  3 bad things that have happened to OpenVMS but this =p  / would be if it really represents your views a =h  + further descent into total paranoia. :):):)f  " Of course you arn't serious :):):)    	 regards =-   Andrew Harrisone Enterprise IT Architectd   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 09:28:59 -0400:. From: rochelle lauer <rochelle.lauer@yale.edu>< Subject: Re: Encompass Bylaw Ballot: THE ENVELOPE, PLEASE...( Message-ID: <39EEF71B.F9C0CE6F@yale.edu>   Bob Kaplow wrote:aI >>I don't know about San Diego, but in LA 2 weeks ago there was a sessionnK >>comparing VMS cluster to Tru64 Cluster by Keith Parris. Unfortunately, it=  - Actually I gave a session in San Diego called #    TruCluster for VMScluster PeoplesJ I believe that each of the sessions mentioned (the BOF with the engineers,( the one I did in San Diego, Keiths in LA: and my interactive workshop in LA) did some comparisons ofF VMScluster and TruCluster each with a different slant.  The infomationM had some overlap but the sessions approached the subject with different goalsr  Y This session I did in San Diego  had a different slant from the one Keith presented in LA"D (he sent me a copy of his slides).  Keith's session was a comparisonD of features/implementation (as was the BOF with the engineers,though) the BOF had a lot more internal details).IA My session in San Diego was more of what VMS people should EXPECTtN with TruCluster knowing what they will looking for.  Also what they will miss.[ It ws intended to be FUN(although it gave quite a bit of technical detail) and it I believey it was  Q The interactive workshop I gave in LA was intended to provide VMS system managersgO ( a specific bunch of folks) with  equivalent commands to do their daily tasks,4O with information on equivalent METHODS in TruCluster (boot, startup procedures,  naming etc)nH and also to provide them with background that would help them understandE how TruCluster management is different from VMScluster management and>  , In my opinion all these sessions are useful.  & What would you like to see next time ?  
 --rochelle   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 02:27:29 -0400a  From: John Santos <JOHN@egh.com>/ Subject: Re: Extending LATNET over dial-up linee5 Message-ID: <1001019022108.2093A-100000@Ives.egh.com>a  - On Wed, 18 Oct 2000, David J. Dachtera wrote:e   > Michael Moroney wrote: > [snip]; > > Again, I was talking about LAT boxes that boop via MOP.i >  > Boop? ...as in Betty?e > F > Remember also that a(n) "LAT box" (example: DECserver-300) becomes aH > "multi-protocol" box simply by upgrading the file that it downloads atI > boot time (or loads from flash) to one that includes support for TCP/IPuH > as well as LAT. With a firmware update, some boxes will even request a$ > load by either MOP, TFTP or BOOTP. >  - > [snip]P > > I know how LANs work.  I did, after all, write a VMS LAN device driver once. > E > Amazing. IMO, you have a very confused/confusing paradigm about howeC > these things work and/or inter-relate. I suppose it may just be a1I > "failure to communicate", though. I've misread meanings before (not thew* > first time, probably won't be the last).  G David, please go back and read your original posting in this sub-threadnH way back when, and Mike's response.  I think you will find that what you> are saying now is exactly what Mike has been saying all along!  J The only dispute is the "VMS" - "DECnet/VMS" - "No, VMS" - "No DECnet/VMS"H business.  Mike's point is that LANCP is part of VMS, not DECnet, and itI comes on VMS out-of-the-box.  You don't need to install DECnet to get it.mD Once you've configured it, you can boot your LAT DECServers, and use> LAT on your VMS system without having installed DECNet at all.   >  e > [snip]J > > Don't have to.  I know what to look for in SDA as well as knowing what/ > > DECnet does if it can't change the address.r > B > Then you've probably seen what happens when you start LAT before( > DECnet-IV (even as late OpenVMS V7.2). >  > -- , > David J. Dachtera  > dba DJE Systems  > http://www.djesys.com/   --   John Santose Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------   Date: 19 Oct 2000 16:24:22 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)/ Subject: Re: Extending LATNET over dial-up lineo6 Message-ID: <8sn77m$sad$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  g In article <39EE3EA9.99770822@earthlink.net>, "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@earthlink.net> writes:r  G   LAT and DECnet are totally unrelated.  LAT runs quite nicely with or -C   without DECnet, and DECnet runs quite nicely with or without LAT.   K   Some LAT-based devices use do a DECnet-related protocol known as MOP for /K   downloads of the software that runs inside the particular widget -- this  I   same mechanism is used for OpenVMS Cluster Satellite downloads and for >L   network router downloads, for instance -- and you need to configure which J   implementation of MOP should be used (eg: DECnet Phase IV, DECnet-Plus, N   or LANCP) for the MOP download operations that will be performed by OpenVMS.  I   There are LAT-based devices that do not need and do not use MOP at all.-  K   As for another part of this discussion: DECnet Phase IV likes to shuffle eG   the controller address around, and most (but not all) clients of the  I   network drivers can transparently tolerate the address shuffle, or they5K   can be told to tolerate the address shuffle if it occurs, or they can be dM   told to default to the use of the Phase IV address and preempt the shuffle.eL   One of the more common techniques for dealing with this involves starting    up DECnet first, of course.   N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 17:58:11 +1000>/ From: "Phil Howell" <phowell@snowyhydro.com.au> % Subject: Re: File Comparison - Urgenta1 Message-ID: <ZVwH5.1015$SF5.21335@ozemail.com.au>s  < A combination of vms sort and diff could be used to do this.> When using specification files sort is both flexible and fast. Phil; Robert Taylor <taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com> wrote in messager& news:39EDB194.58833CD9@jpmorgan.com...H > I wonder if anyone could give a DCL solution ( or any solution ) for a! > file comparison utility on VMS.b- > We have two text files ( comma delimited ). H > Say each file has 4 columns ( varying number of columns handling would > be good ).I > And you want to compare the first 3 columns and ignore the 4th. ( beingo> > able to specify columns to ignore would be good also.......) >. > i.et >  > File1  > ---------e	 > A,B,C,De	 > 1,2,3,1d	 > X,Y,Z,O  >l >  > File2L
 > --------	 > A,B,C,Zh	 > 1,2,3,9e	 > X,Y,D,O  >d > G > If these 2 files were compared using the method I've tried to outline 5 > the utility would report that line 3 was a failure.n >sG > Its the equivalent of doing a cut in Unix and piping the results intooI > diff. I know how to do that but I'd appreciate any help on how to do it H > in VMS. We need the utility for some testing so the faster the better. > Thanks in advance. >a   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 09:26:59 +0100 0 From: Robert Taylor <taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com>% Subject: Re: File Comparison - Urgentt, Message-ID: <39EEB053.C2A2E903@jpmorgan.com>  J Would you care to expand on that ? I've had a look at the on-line help and( nothing strikes me as being a solution :  L Diff - I can't see how it can handle excluding a column in a variable length delimited record.- Sort - How can I use this ?a  @ Sorry if the answer is obvious to everyone, maybe I'm being dim.    > > A combination of vms sort and diff could be used to do this.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 12:51:22 +0000n$ From: Steve.Spires@yellowpages.co.uk% Subject: Re: File Comparison - Urgentr/ Message-ID: <0025697D.00465C8A.00@quegw01.btyp>   L Contact:   Tel: 3063  -  IS - Infrastructure, 1st Floor, Bridge Street Plaza    K Well, you COULD use DIFF if you could somehow exchange the last comma for aeP different character, then use the /COMMENT_DELIMITER and /IGNORE qualifiers. But4 of course that isn't what the original poster wants.   ;^Dz   Steve Spires VMS System Manager BT/Yellow Pagese        7 Jim Agnew <agnew@hsc.vcu.edu> on 18/10/2000 09:10:47 PMo    To:        Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com+ cc:         (bcc: Steve Spires/YellowPages)bD From:      Jim Agnew <agnew@hsc.vcu.edu>, 18 October 2000, 9:10 p.m.   Re: File Comparison - Urgent        J now THAT i'd like to know also... perl or something *would* be required...   Jim    "Richard D. Piccard" wrote:r >nK > He wants to be able to ignore differences in certain "columns" defined bylN > the comma-delimiters.  I, for one, don't know how to do that with DIFFERENCE	 > in DCL.  >o% >                                 RDPn >t > Jim Agnew wrote: >  > > what's wrong with diff?? > >s > > Jime > >f > > Robert Taylor wrote: > > >-L > > > I wonder if anyone could give a DCL solution ( or any solution ) for a% > > > file comparison utility on VMS.n1 > > > We have two text files ( comma delimited ).-L > > > Say each file has 4 columns ( varying number of columns handling would > > > be good ).M > > > And you want to compare the first 3 columns and ignore the 4th. ( beingsB > > > able to specify columns to ignore would be good also.......) > > >.	 > > > i.eo > > >  > > > File1o > > > ---------w
 > > > A,B,C,De
 > > > 1,2,3,1.
 > > > X,Y,Z,Os > > >o > > > File2e > > > --------
 > > > A,B,C,Zr
 > > > 1,2,3,9k
 > > > X,Y,D,Oo > > >tK > > > If these 2 files were compared using the method I've tried to outlinet9 > > > the utility would report that line 3 was a failure.  > > >sK > > > Its the equivalent of doing a cut in Unix and piping the results into M > > > diff. I know how to do that but I'd appreciate any help on how to do itdL > > > in VMS. We need the utility for some testing so the faster the better. > > > Thanks in advance. >  > --D > ==================================================================D > Dick Piccard                           Academic Technology ManagerD > piccard@ohio.edu                                 Computer ServicesD > http://oak.cats.ohiou.edu/~piccard/                Ohio University   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 13:08:17 GMT. From: russ@gordon.eduE Subject: Files not deleting?) Message-ID: <8smrnr$t0q$1@nnrp1.deja.com>n  ? OpenVMS 6.2 running on an VAX 4000 with Pathworks for Mac 1.3a.e  : Running into a problem with OS/9 and Pathworks Macvolumes.  F Prior to OS/9 a user could drag and drop files from a MacVolume to theC desktop trashcan ansd the file would be deleted from the VAX.  WitheG OS/9 this doen't seem to be the working.  Has anyone else run into thist problem?   thanks        & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.a   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 14:13:04 +0100-& From: Roy Omond <Roy.Omond@Compaq.com>% Subject: Free 7 TK50 cartridges in UKI* Message-ID: <39EEF360.3CB328CD@Compaq.com>  > I've just been given 7 TK50 cartridges by one of our customers> at whose site I am located (south west London).  I'd prefer to  give them to a hobbyist user ...  ? Anyone interested ?  I could also arrange for them to be pickedd> up from my home (between Cambridge and Saffron Walden, Essex).  	 Roy OmondR Blue Bubble Ltd.- (certainly not squeaking on behalf of Compaq)u   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 14:52:50 +0100p5 From: "Mike Ryan" <mike.ryan@.nospam.nospam.ohno.com>u) Subject: Re: Free 7 TK50 cartridges in UK - Message-ID: <AZCH5.6697$_B5.43919@NewsReader>h  I Someone told me these were selling for up to 20 each (second-hand) ?!?!?o3 "Roy Omond" <Roy.Omond@Compaq.com> wrote in message $ news:39EEF360.3CB328CD@Compaq.com...@ > I've just been given 7 TK50 cartridges by one of our customers@ > at whose site I am located (south west London).  I'd prefer to" > give them to a hobbyist user ... >hA > Anyone interested ?  I could also arrange for them to be pickedr@ > up from my home (between Cambridge and Saffron Walden, Essex). >a > Roy Omondt > Blue Bubble Ltd./ > (certainly not squeaking on behalf of Compaq)e >e   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 15:19:16 +0100i& From: Roy Omond <Roy.Omond@Compaq.com>) Subject: Re: Free 7 TK50 cartridges in UK * Message-ID: <39EF02E4.BA5F3985@Compaq.com>   Mike Ryan wrote:  K > Someone told me these were selling for up to 20 each (second-hand) ?!?!? 5 > "Roy Omond" <Roy.Omond@Compaq.com> wrote in messagee& > news:39EEF360.3CB328CD@Compaq.com...B > > I've just been given 7 TK50 cartridges by one of our customersB > > at whose site I am located (south west London).  I'd prefer to$ > > give them to a hobbyist user ... > >aC > > Anyone interested ?  I could also arrange for them to be pickedeB > > up from my home (between Cambridge and Saffron Walden, Essex).  D Yeah, I know;  I'm a nice guy trying to help a hobbyist if I can :-)             .s   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2000 10:34:16 -0400 5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>n0 Subject: Re: Getting Compaq to advertise OpenVMS, Message-ID: <8s76mu$a407$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>  5 Not speaking for COMPAQ or OpenVMS...  just myself...S  J For the most part, the vast majority of enhancements that appear on Alpha,L and not on VAX, are because those enhancements are being driven by hardware.J GALAXY for instance was driven by where we saw large scale hardware going.K Taking advantage of the performance of new hardware is a large part of what  drives things.  L Many times, it may not be obvious why the underlying problem being solved byH an Alpha-only enhancement is hardware driven.  For instance, the way theI primitive locking is done on Alpha is very, very much different.  And the L solutions for performance enhancement employed must be different between the VAX and Alpha.  J Every project that is proposed and accepted for OpenVMS has to address theL question of VAX & Alpha, or Alpha-Only.  Sometimes the decision is driven byI pure technical reasons - like the VAX not having a capability.  SometimesrH its driven by the fact we do NOT want to introduce anything into the VAXJ base that could destablize it - so things need to remain as compatable and stable as possible.s  I Sometimes, the plain truth is that in combination with the other reasons,hL there are not enough resources to make the change and support it - I'll give you an example:r  K DECwindows on the VAX was developed in the initial stages of X11.  In fact, L X11R1-beta was the base.  Because X11R1-beta really was bad, and at the timeJ the DECwindows VMS group was something over 30 people - we created our ownJ server code base as we improved the code quality for FRS.  We never mergedG with the MIT code base over the next decade, even though the MIT server 1 quality improved, and got enhancements we didn't.-  J Now when we went to Alpha, we broke with the VAX and used the then currentF X11R5 server base.  We *didn't* back port this to VAX.  Why?  Well, weF couldn't break the stuff on VAX, and even if we spent the resources onI backporting, it was sure to introduce new bugs and incompatabilities.  We H didn't use the VAX stuff on Alpha (and there were quite a few people whoF believed that we should) because we knew that the only way we could beI competetive was to be able to chare common source with Digital UNIX.  And1K since new hardware development (in particular graphics hardware) was over - I it was not a reasonable investment to do a supported VAX port (in fact weeJ did port a simple dumb CFB X11R4 server to the VAX as an part of the Alpha( port) or to use the VAX server on Alpha.  G We *did* enhance the client libraries however, where we were reasonableuK certain that we could do it.  And in fact, we ended up having to create and K maintain 2 sets of librarys for people who absolutely needed compatability. = Adding a lot of complexity and cost to supporting DECwindows.g  I But now as time has gone forward, we have significant conditional code in L the libraries.  We can't really enhance the VAX code much without revisitingD those decisions.  Do you really want the VAX graphics stuff to startI breaking all over again?  How many people will switch to a completely neweJ VAX graphics library base?  It certainly won't sell any more new VAXes ;-)J and it is likely to cause more problems than making existing VAX customers happy.  L When we upgrade the X11 client libraries to X11R6 - or even XFree86 - do youI really want to buy into the risk for your VAX applications that have beenwJ running for 15 years?  Do we (COMPAQ OpenVMS) want to dig up every antiqueJ VAXstation ever built to develop, and do verification testing on?  Heck, IG haven't had a VAXstation in over 5 years.  More likely, we would end upeJ retiring every VAX graphics option except the SPX-g on the VS4000.  But weL *can't* stand still on the Alpha side where new applications targeted to theH performance of Alpha, and new hardware, are driving the need to upgrade.I Like the decision to go to X11R5 for Alpha - we may one day need to go tos XFree86, GTK+, and Gnome.t  I There is NO technical reason why we cannot make the VAX and Alpha sourcesaG common for all of X11/DECwindows/Motif.  There are significant business.G reasons we may not want to - both for ourselves, and for our customers.e  G When the time comes to make the project decision, we will still ask the I question of VAX & Alpha or Alpha-Only.  And try to make the best decisionuF for our entire customer base, and try to balance it with the available) resources we can invest, for the payback.u  L NOT doing it for VAX is the part that needs justifcation.  You don't have to' justify doing it on both VAX and Alpha.       J John Santos wrote in message <1001011003109.24370A-100000@Ives.egh.com>..." >On 9 Oct 2000, Marty Kuhrt wrote: >o	 >> [snip]t >>+ >> > o Extended File Cache - no VAX support K >> >     This is bogus.  There's no techincal reason this needs to be true.  >> >= >> > o Lock Manager Performance Enhancements - no VAX supportnJ >> >     Triply bogus.  There's no TECHINCAL reason this needs to be true. >>	 >> [snip]n >>C >> If you don't have 64bit addressing, you don't have S2 space, so,1A >> no XFC or DLM enhancements.  Part of the DLM enhancement mightc> >> also be for the requirements of Galatic Shared Memory (i.e.A >> putting the DLM in shared memory between VMS instances in a GS  >> class machine). >>D >> While I can understand why you'd want VAX support for all the newC >> VMS features, you gotta realize that the survival of VMS dependsaC >> on fast Alpha implementations.  To do this I'm sure they have topA >> exploit all the pluses that the architecture has to offer.  TooB >> limit their work to only what the VAX chip and addressing could >> support would be suicide. >>@ >> Alphas have been out for over eight years now, I should think@ >> you'd be reasonably happy that Compaq still supports VAXen atB >> all.  I can think of better scenarios for the continued support/ >> of VAXen, but I can also imagine MUCH worse.  >> > . >Out of curiosity, does W2K run on 486's?  ;-) >  >[...] >  >--  >John Santos >Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc.d >781-861-0670 ext 539h >    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 09:02:17 -0700d& From: "Rick Cadruvi" <rick@rdperf.com>8 Subject: HELP! - UCX (TCPIP V5.0A) SMTP problem/question1 Message-ID: <qXEH5.25$gQ3.12248@news.pacbell.net>M  L I had my ISP redirect email going to USER@rick.rdperf.com to USER@rdperf.com  F Now my email server rejects on RDPERF.COM those emails as the user not local.K At the end of this message is a copy of a rejected message with the errors.   K I need to be able to have UCX V5.0A SMTP server accept these messages as if,B they were directed to USER@rdperf.com.  How do I make UCX do this?  A I have setup user account on the local VMS system for the "USER".n     Please email me responses.   thanks,  Rick Cadruvi  rick@rdperf.coms    K This report relates to a message you sent with the following header fields:n  -   Message-id: <39EF0E1F.97431C49@pacbell.net> '   Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 08:07:11 -0700     From: rc <cadruvi@pacbell.net>   To: rick@rick.rdperf.com   Subject: test-  = Your message cannot be delivered to the following recipients:t  )   Recipient address: rick@rick.rdperf.comd1   Reason: Remote SMTP server has rejected addressTI   Diagnostic code: smtp; 551 <<rick@rick.rdperf.com>> ... User not local,o Relay disabled.<K   Remote system: dns; rdperf.com (TCP|206.13.28.142|59494|216.100.15.81|25)k* (rdmain.rdperf.com V5.0A-1, OpenVMS V7.2-1I Alpha ready at Thu, 19 Oct 2000 08:02:35 -0700 [PDT] ) (rdmain.rdperf.comt/ Hello mta4.snfc21.pbi.net, pleased to meet you)e          8 Original-envelope-id: 0G2O00KPUNE229@mta4.snfc21.pbi.net' Reporting-MTA: dns; mta4.snfc21.pbi.net    Action: failed7 Status: 5.0.0 (Remote SMTP server has rejected address)S/ Original-recipient: rfc822;rick@rick.rdperf.com , Final-recipient: rfc822;rick@rick.rdperf.comF Remote-MTA: dns; rdperf.com (TCP|206.13.28.142|59494|216.100.15.81|25)K  (rdmain.rdperf.com V5.0A-1, OpenVMS V7.2-1 Alpha ready at Thu, 19 Oct 2000l  08:02:35 -0700 [PDT] ).C  (rdmain.rdperf.com Hello mta4.snfc21.pbi.net, pleased to meet you) G Diagnostic-code: smtp; 551 <<rick@rick.rdperf.com>> ... User not local,e  Relay disabled.   ------------------------------   Date: 19 Oct 2000 17:33:17 GMT2 From: hoffman@xdelta.zko.dec.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)< Subject: Re: HELP! - UCX (TCPIP V5.0A) SMTP problem/question6 Message-ID: <8snb8t$t0i$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>  Z In article <qXEH5.25$gQ3.12248@news.pacbell.net>, "Rick Cadruvi" <rick@rdperf.com> writes:L :I need to be able to have UCX V5.0A SMTP server accept these messages as ifC :they were directed to USER@rdperf.com.  How do I make UCX do this?-  I   You do not want to do this prior to the TCP/IP Services V5.1 kit -- thed,   V5.1 release is currently in field test.    J   If you do decide to enable SMTP relay, your SMTP server will very likelyG   be located by spammers and will get used to send spam -- these folks ZF   regularly probe the net for open SMTP servers.  Having an open relayG   can have dire consequences -- you will get locked out of many sites,  G   you will get deluged with feedback from spam recipients, and your IP eA   address could well end up on one or more of the "pariah" lists.   F   In V5.0A, the relay setting is all-or-nothing.  In V5.1, SMTP relay    is rather more programmable.  :   The TCPIP> command that controls SMTP relay in V5.0A is:  $     SET CONFIG SMTP/OPTION=[no]RELAY   :Please email me responses.o     Ask here, get an answer here.n  L :... Diagnostic-code: smtp; 551 <<rick@rick.rdperf.com>> ... User not local, : Relay disabled.   N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------L    Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 09:25:31 +0000o From: nclews@csc.com' Subject: Re: How to send an SMS messaget@ Message-ID: <OF576BFBE3.C62B1126-ON0025697D.00329A74@eu.csc.com>  1 We do this. Pagers, phones, and regular dial out.t  2 We do this to Orange phones in the UK, does anyone5 know the direct dial SMS for other UK phone networks?  (Orange is 07973 - 100602).-  : We're using a UUCP dialler. However I'm having some hassle0 getting it to compile on Alpha and DEC-C on VAX.  < But compiled at 6.2 and VAXC it works very well, and a small? efficient program. If we (hint hint) can get it ported to later ? version of C and multi architecture I think it will be a usefulf* little inclusion for the next freeware CD.  = http://www.acs.bolton.ac.uk/~npc1/pickup.html down the bottomI of the page.   Regards, Nic Clews nclews at csc dot com    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 14:40:15 GMTs% From: A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig)-' Subject: Re: How to send an SMS message21 Message-ID: <39ef0678.862715228@news.newsguy.com>j  , On Wed, 18 Oct 2000 08:03:00 -0400, JF Mezei% <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> wrote:    >Wim wrote:  >> atz >> OKn >> atdt 0654545000 >> CONNECT 2400t >> a= >> Some text asking me for the phone number of the cell phonee  >> >1234567890 ( example input )6 >> Some text asking for the message max 160 characters >> >Test7 >> Some telling me that the message is succesfuly send. 
 >> NO CARRIERp >s >M4 >Try Kermit. It has powerful scripting capabilities. >nO >You may also want to look into some TAP software, it is a more robust protocolc >for sending SMS messages.  C Combining the two there's a TAP (Telelocator Alphanumeric Protocol)0F script (APAGE.KSC) that comes with the Kermit distribution which worksC quite well. However not all phone companies accept TAP protocol forR7 mobile phones and some won't gateway to other networks.i     --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 14:56:43 GMTt% From: A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig) ' Subject: Re: How to send an SMS message 1 Message-ID: <39ef0840.863171464@news.newsguy.com>w  9 On Thu, 19 Oct 2000 09:25:31 +0000, nclews@csc.com wrote:t  2 >We do this. Pagers, phones, and regular dial out. >u3 >We do this to Orange phones in the UK, does anyone 6 >know the direct dial SMS for other UK phone networks? >(Orange is 07973 - 100602).  E Cellnet is 0860 980480. TAP protocol. Did know Voodophone at one timeo but can't find it off hand.o   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 17:28:35 +0200r= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>  Subject: Re: html on vms( Message-ID: <39EF1323.67CA8EA@gtech.com>   John Nixon wrote:iK > I have downloaded the software, ecos and documentation to load Java on my  > AlphaVMS 7.2-1 system. > F > However, the release notes and documentation are all in HTML format. > ' > I reckon I need to install a browser.    You have many choices:   NetScape Navigator Gold 3.03" Mozilla Mx (18 is current I think) Mosaic Lynx   Arne   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 11:48:01 GMT % From: A.Greig@virgin.net (Alan Greig)e Subject: Re: Java on Openvms1 Message-ID: <39eedbf8.851835114@news.newsguy.com>=  3 On Wed, 18 Oct 2000 17:19:39 +0100, andrew harrison ! <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote:n    8 >The fact that OpenVMS has not kept up has nothing to do6 >with the Java standardisation process and everything : >to do with the ammount of resources Compaq have committed >to Java on OpenVMS.  E It is interesting that the Mozilla VMS port appears for VMS virtually C synchronously with the NT, Linux, Solaris ports but the one glaringaD omission from it is JAVA support as the JVM is no longer part of theC browser but relies on an external Java engine not yet available fornE VMS. I have to agree with Andrew here in saying that it would be niceu3 to see more timely support for Java updates in VMS.s  9 I also don't  have much time for posts like: "but Java iseF slow/crap/Sun/insecure/I-ALWAYS-TURN-IT-OFF so who cares". Well that'sB their sitiation. That's of no help at all at a site which actually	 needs it.0  ? Given that VMS engineering have demonstrated that they can stayr@ synched with a multi-platform code project I wonder why the sameB things doesn't hapen with Java. Is it a question of resources or aD question of having no option but to report each new release from Sun
 from scratch?.  < >IBM for example have the 1.3 production JVM and have had it; >available for a similar time as Sun. Your suggestion that ,= >Sun controls the Java standard for its own benefit does not i4 >seem to have prevented them from being up to date.  >-= >If you really think this then you have a great career ahead m: >of you in marketing at Microsoft you could even get a job >as a Microsoft spokesman. >  >Regards >Andrew Harrison >Enterprise IT Architect   --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 14:40:50 +0100>0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> Subject: Re: Java on Openvms* Message-ID: <39EEF9E2.4AF94095@uk.sun.com>   Alan Greig wrote:l > 5 > On Wed, 18 Oct 2000 17:19:39 +0100, andrew harrisona# > <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote:r > : > >The fact that OpenVMS has not kept up has nothing to do7 > >with the Java standardisation process and everythinga< > >to do with the ammount of resources Compaq have committed > >to Java on OpenVMS. > G > It is interesting that the Mozilla VMS port appears for VMS virtuallyiE > synchronously with the NT, Linux, Solaris ports but the one glaringrF > omission from it is JAVA support as the JVM is no longer part of theE > browser but relies on an external Java engine not yet available for-G > VMS. I have to agree with Andrew here in saying that it would be nicee5 > to see more timely support for Java updates in VMS.g > 9 The 1.2.x JVM plugin is available for Tru64 and no doubt t6 will be available for OpenVMS. The removal of the JVM > from the browser was done mainly I think because historically ; Netscape were struggling to keep the Netscape/Java/Platformh releases in sync.   ; The plugin removes the necessity for this but does require  ; the platform vendors to port and test the plugin for their -
 platforms.  = I havn't tried it recently but the plugin also allowed peopleF9 to get a non MS JVM in IE. Of course it was missing some : special features :):):)i   Regards  Andrew Harrisonm Enterprise IT Architect>   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 16:43:00 GMTt+ From: Jordan Henderson <jordan@my-deja.com>  Subject: Re: Java on Openvms) Message-ID: <8sn8aj$7c1$1@nnrp1.deja.com>g  * In article <39EDCD9B.EDDED490@uk.sun.com>,3   andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote:a > Jordan Henderson wrote:r > > . > > In article <39EB3430.2E58AE86@uk.sun.com>,6 > > andrew harrison  <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote: > > >Hoff Hoffman wrote: > > >>1 > > >> In article <Fb4F5.1527$9T4.80301@bgtnsc04-iE news.ops.worldnet.att.net>, "John Nixon" <jorlnixon@worldnet.att.net>m writes:r  > > >> :Is JAVA free on OpenVMS? > > >>
 > > >>   Yes.l > > >> > > >> :How do I get it? > > >>F > > >>   As part of OpenVMS Alpha V7.2 and later, and via download for OpenVMSs > > >>   Alpha V7.1 and later. > > >> > > >> :Is it any good?s > > >> > > >>   It's Java.c > > >> > > >k; > > >Umm well yes and no. The devil is in the detail and it 7 > > >all depends on the Java implimentation on OpenVMS.X > > >t > >o> > > This is an example of how Andrew likes to spread FUD here. > >e4 > Oh dear oh dear. I know that you really don't like7 > facts if they are uncomfortable for you as an OpenVMSu6 > advocate but I didn't realise that you automatically8 > assume that uncomfortable facts are automatically FUD. >n6 > What was unfactual about my posting. Lets review the > situation. > 7 > 1.   There are a number of different versions of Javas >      1.2.x 1.3 etc. FACT.  >p6 > 2.   Some applications "but not all" only run or are> >      only qualified on specific JVM releases 1.2.x, 1.3 etc. >      FACT. >e9 > 3.   There are applications that only work or have onlyn: >      been qualified on 1.3, I am building a platform for; >      one application that falls into this category for anr+ >      investment bank at the moment. FACT.h > < > 4.   The FastVM is not currently available as a production; >      release for OpenVMS. FACT. Though no doubt you think  >      this is FUD.i >s; > 5.   If you want the fastest production JVM on Alpha fromt= >      Compaq then you need to use Tru64. FACT. More FUD ????a >h< > 6.   The unavailability of 1.2.X on OpenVMS until recently; >      has caused people posting to this group problems andl9 >      has let to people dropping support for OpenVMS, ansA >      example was also posted on this group of a German ExchangeeC >      who have dropped OpenVMS because of poor Java Support. FACT.e# >      More FUD ???????????????????r > = > 7.   The JVM support for OpenVMS has lagged Tru64 and otherw< >      OS platforms, not by a little but by a lot. The 1.2.XA >      production release for OpenVMS is roughly 12 months behind ? >      the rest of the market. FACT. More FUD ?????????????????p2 >      ???????????????????????????????????????????  E 12 months?  I thought 1.3 only came out from Sun in May of this year. B That's less than 6 months from where I sit.  Maybe when everythingB shakes out, it'll be 12 months, but Sun and their 'open' standards. process will probably have moved on by then...   >l@ > 8.   OpenVMS users/developers and admins have complained about@ >      this on this newsgroup. FACT. More FUD ??????????????????@ >      ?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????@ >      ????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? >u  ; What is FUD about your posting is your implication that thea; statement "It's Java" is in some way not true.  Good FUD isa< not something based on facts that can be checked, that would: be too easy to knock down.  Good FUD is all about spin and< half truths.  Spinning is your particular area of expertise,	 it seems.X  < When Microsoft spreads rumors that to get the best supported? RDBMS on Windows you have to use MS-SQL Server, that's probablyo; true, it's also FUDding Oracle.  FUD is just the attempt to > spread Fear, Uncertainty and Doubt about a product.  Something= that you've been not reluctant to do in comp.os.vms again andr again and again.  @ > > In no way can you say that the 1.2 Java that's available for
 OpenVMS isH > > NOT Java, but that's exactly what he's saying above.  In response toA > > the statement "It's Java" he says "yes and no", which impliese	 that "no"h > > is in some way true. >tE > Of course 1.2.x is Java but it isn't the latest release of Java 1.3h is.tD > 1.3 has been available for some time and because of this there areD > some applications will not run on 1.2.x or have not been qualifiedF > for it. This was the same situation when the most current release of > JavaA > on OpenVMS was 1.1.X with 1.2.x being widely available on other0 > platforms. >A/ > FACT. More FUD ??????????????????????????????u > C > Oracle 7 is Oracle but I am sure you would be the first person torE > criticise me if for example someone had asked if Oracle ran on suchbE > and such OS and I had answered yes Oracle does run on such and suchu OS? > without pointing out that only Oracle 7 was available and nots	 8.0.x/8i.. >>  D An invalid comparison.  When it makes a difference, people generallyB refer to it as Oracle 7 and Oracle 8, but Java is, supposed to be,D Java, a standard that you can write against.  The fact that it's notE is an embarrassment to Sun.  Java for it's success depends on a largeaA market of people writing to the same spec, which is why Sun fundsa* development of Windows and Linux versions.  D > > So, Andrew has succeeded in spreading Fear Uncertainty and Doubt aboute > > using Java on OpenVMS. > >t@ > > Of course, Compaq has stated their commitment to Java, cross
 platforms,E > > but is a little behind Sun (surprise surprise) and IBM.  I wonder  howpF > > many _deployed_ applications require Java 1.3 today?  Probably not many. F > > In the meantime, you can certainly develop on the Compaq platforms while  > > they Compaq plays catch up.e > >s >rD > Your choice of phrase "a little behind" would not be one that manyE > people would endorse though it does go a long way towards expaining C > why appear to have such difficulty with FACTS. I don't think that B > a year late and without a production accelerated VM is what manyB > people would describe as "a little behind" nor is it a view that@ > has been shared by the posters to this newsgroup who have beenC > complaining about the delays in getting 1.2.X on OpenVMS for thato	 > period.@ >k  E Of course, only Sun and IBM have produced 1.3 Java so far.  EverybodyO else is behind.   C > I don't know how many 1.3 only apps there are, I do know that thed1 > one I am working on at the moment is a 1.3 app.h > B > > >OpenVMS does support Java 1.2.x but this is only a relatively > > >recent change.. > > >oE > > >However 1.3 FCS is out on other platforms Solaris, Win32 and AIXeE > > >to my knowledge and some applications require 1.3 incedentally ar- > > >pre-beta version is available for Tru64.  > > >sB > > >There is also the question as to how fast the 1.2.x JVM is on OpenVMS7B > > >Compaq appear to have concentrated their efforts on Tru64 and> > > >at the moment there is a not a supported JVM with the the@ > > >FastVM for OpenVMS though there is a beta version available > > >for download. > > >d> > > >So if for example you are wedded to AlphaServers but want: > > >the Compaq OS with the best support for Java then you. > > >would have no choice but to choose Tru64. > > >e; > > >If you didn't care which OS or HW platform you ran but.: > > >just wanted the best supported JVM then you would not$ > > >choose either Tru64 or OpenVMS. > > >D > >(= > > So, what is the "best" supported JVM?  I bet it'll alwaysy) > > be a product of Sun Microsystems Inc.0 > >2> > No you would be wrong, Sun claims to have the best supported; > JVM, IBM also makes this claim, I would not like the makee > a call on it.r  @ Except that you _ARE_ Sun.  You never make any disclaimers aboutC not representing Sun and we know that Sun Product Managers (such as1A the Product Manager for the SIMS product) monitor what you say to. correct inaccuracies.   ? I wonder if we are going to get an _official_ word here for whot> produces the best supported Java system?  Wouldn't it be funny= if Sun announced that they _don't_ produce the best supportedb Java system?  D Let me ask you this, ask 1000 IT professionals who produces the bestB supported Java systems and see what the perception is.  That's allA that's important, really, Sun knows that they can win in the Java0F market they've created as long as people perceive that the best system( for running Java is a Sun supported one.   >n= > > I guess this is why so there is so much concern about SungE > > controlling the Java 'standards'.  Like Microsoft they can change  the-= > > standards at any time and then point to all of their poor5 competitorsd > > who can't keep up. > > : > Ohh dear ohh dear, that is not how it has worked. Sun is: > the final arbiter of what is in the Java SPEC but no one? > to my knowledge except Microsoft and a few Microsoft boostersb= > have suggested that Sun controls the standard to get a jumpa9 > on our competition. People are afraid that we might bute0 > there is no evidence that it has happened yet. >r   Yet...  9 > In fact most of the other vendors are only too happy to 8 > submit their technology proposals for inclusion in the2 > Java standard, IBM for example have been a major > contributor. >   D HP tried to get their real-time Java spec submitted and was snubbed.  9 > The fact that OpenVMS has not kept up has nothing to do 6 > with the Java standardisation process and everything; > to do with the ammount of resources Compaq have committede > to Java on OpenVMS.- >-= > IBM for example have the 1.3 production JVM and have had it-; > available for a similar time as Sun. Your suggestion thata= > Sun controls the Java standard for its own benefit does not 4 > seem to have prevented them from being up to date.  B As I pointed out, it appears that only Sun (and Sun produced ports@ like Windows and Linux) and IBM have kept to this high standard.  ; HP and Compaq are behind some, but both have commitments toe> catch up.  I wonder if Sun and IBM will have moved on again by
 this time?  @ HP and others have expressed a lot of concern about how they are@ shut out of the standards process.  Sun first submitted it as an? ISO standard, then yanked it back, then they submitted it as ana= ECMA standard, only to withdraw it and announce that Sun willaB maintain complete control over the TradeMarked Java.  I think this@ history does tend to cause concerns among other vendors.  HP has( been very vocal about this, for example.  G IBM even expressed a lot of concern about the Java 2 Enterprise Edition-C initially and said they were going to go their own way with Java 1. & But, IBM and Sun have patched that up.  D Everyone, except Sun, has had concerns about Java standardization at@ one time or another.  Don't try and make it sound like it's just Microsoft and their lackeys.   > = > If you really think this then you have a great career aheadT; > of you in marketing at Microsoft you could even get a jobt > as a Microsoft spokesman.0 >e  > You think so?  Perhaps you could get a job as a Sun spokesman.( Oh, but wait, you already have that job.  	 > Regardss > Andrew Harrison> > Enterprise IT ArchitectK >i   -- -Jordan Hendersoni jordan@greenapple.comY   -- -Jordan Hendersoni jordan@greenapple.comi    & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.o   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 18:53:04 +0100(/ From: Nigel Arnot <sysmgr@maxwell.ph.kcl.ac.uk>n< Subject: re: Linker performance on DS20 slower than VAX 65207 Message-ID: <009F1D86.46E78946.10@maxwell.ph.kcl.ac.uk>y   > L > In article <8sinqq$iri$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, chucknichols@my-deja.com writes:H > > We are in the process of converting a real-time application from VAXJ > > VMS 5.5-2 to Alpha openVMS 7.2. We have purchased dual CPU DS20 AlphasJ > > with 1GB memory and two 9 GB disks mirrored for the system disk, three8 > > 9 GB disks RAIDed to give 18GB for application disk. > > D > > Linking programs takes much longer on the Alpha, for example oneI > > program takes about 3 minutes to link on our VAX 6520 (128 Kb) but it ( > > takes 12 - 13 minutes on the DS20!!! > E > Alpha does not have the position-independent instructions that were-5 > on VAX, so linking is going to be more complicated.:  K I doubt it's a CPU issue. LINK, even on a VAX, is a disk-limited operation.uK How good was the disk subsystem on the VAX compared to the Alpha subsystem?n  L Also bear in mind that Alpha code is 2-3 times larger than the correspondingH VAX code, so if that humungous LINK is mostly code rather than data, the5 Alpha LINK is shovelling 2-3 times more stuff around.e  J You might want to consider pre-linking any large .OLBs into (a) shareable J library .EXE(s). LINKs against such a library are much faster if a lot of D internal cross-references are pre-resolved. Of course it's more workB for someone; trade time taken to do it (once) against smaller timeG saved every time someone links against it. And +/- feature in that when:I the shareable is updated, all images linked against it get the benefit ofcK all the bugfixes and the curse of all the new bugs, both without relinking.i  p 	Yours,d
 		Nigel Arnott- 		NRA@MAXWELL.PH.KCL.AC.UK                   c  7 		"In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded."e   ------------------------------   Date: 19 Oct 2000 08:36:35 GMT- From: brian-DOT-mcneil@easynet-DOT.-be (BMcN) S Subject: Re: looking for company to provide home IP connection (for VMS)  (Germany)i+ Message-ID: <8FD268B9ABMcN@212.100.160.123>l  G Hey! jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca (JF Mezei) you went and wrote messagecG <39EE4E82.AE2043AC@videotron.ca> and forced me to type some nonsense in  response...    >Phillip Helbig wrote:F >> Suppose YOU want to telnet into my machine, access its webserver or >> whatever.  Could you do it? > F >yes you can. But the caller will need to know the numerica IP addressI >that your router has negotiated with your ISP at the time of connection.  >eH >So, at regular intervals, your VAX would have to talks to the router toG >find out what IP address the router has negotiated from your ISP. Then I >the VAX would  notify "whatever" of the current IP address to reach you.c >nH >Because that IP address can potentially change at the whim of your ISP,- >you can't associate a name to an IP address.t >wF >However, you could get one of those free web hosting services to host@ >one page of yours which would be updated by your VAX at regularG >intervals and would contain a redirect to your numeric IP address thati" >is currently used by the router.  >e  J I've been following this because I'm going to have to go through the same I nonsense fairly soon. Somewhere on the web I came across one of the free  K shell accounts offering the possibility to host your DNS records such that EK it was easy to update them. This was intended for DHCP leased addresses so :F that you could update whenever it changed. I'll see if I can find the I reference again. Obviously you'd need to have the leased address checked sL regularly and hope that updating it on the remote DNS would be reliable. As F to referencing specific machines within your network... I don't know. 3 Presumably running own DNS server might help there.   G My other option here in Belgium is to cough up the 6000 BEF ($135) per mG month to get a fixed IP address. Also included is an SMTP feed on that.w -- u+ Reply to brian<dot>mcneil<at>easynet<dot>bev  - The crux of the biscuit is the Apostrophe (')h - F.Z.   ------------------------------   Date: 19 Oct 2000 10:41:40 GMT3 From: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann)lR Subject: RE: looking for company to provide home IP connection (for VMS) (Germany)0 Message-ID: <8smj54$t79$2@n.ruf.uni-freiburg.de>  [ In article <8sl9bn$9pe$1@info.service.rug.nl>, helbig@astro.rug.nl (Phillip Helbig) writes: D >Suppose YOU want to telnet into my machine, access its webserver orF >whatever.  Could you do it?  Based on the (local) IP---no, apparentlyE >(since other people could have the same ones).  Based on some other n8 >static IP---no, apparently doesn't exist in this setup.  F If this static IP address is known in the world-wide routing tables itG is possible to connet to your machine as my request gets to your router F and your router has a table that allows it to decide where to route myG request. If telnet then the router has to know that requests to port 23D9 should be directed to the local address of your VMS host..  J >Based on some name which somehow gets resolved to my machine---if so, how >does this work?  K The name will resolve to your router which in turn redirects the packets to:
 your machine.>   Regards,    Christoph Gartmanng  H -----------------------------------------------------------------------+H | Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452 |H | Immunbiologie                                                        |H | Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de     |H | D-79011  Freiburg, FRG                                               |H +--------- http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/english/menue.html ---------+   ------------------------------   Date: 19 Oct 2000 10:33:50 GMT3 From: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann)pR Subject: Re: looking for company to provide home IP connection (for VMS) (Germany)0 Message-ID: <8smime$t79$1@n.ruf.uni-freiburg.de>  [ In article <8sl9de$9pe$2@info.service.rug.nl>, helbig@astro.rug.nl (Phillip Helbig) writes:uM >> Why not?  NAT -- Network Address Translation -- changes the packet address M >> from the WAN side to the address on the inside.  Many of the devices which N >> provide this make it very easy to maintain a static set of addresses on theJ >> machine on the inside while the WAN address may change (DHCP assigned). >.I >OK.  But if YOU want to connect to my machine, what do you have to know?e  F You tell your router something like "map port 80 to 192.168.1.1" whereH 192.168.1.1 is your VMS machine running a WWW-server. In this case it isK sufficient for me to know the IP-address of your router or the name of your J router. In case that your router uses DHCP things get a bit tricky as yourH provider has to ensure that your internet name resolves to your router's current DHCP IP-address.   Regards,    Christoph Gartmann   H -----------------------------------------------------------------------+H | Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452 |H | Immunbiologie                                                        |H | Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de     |H | D-79011  Freiburg, FRG                                               |H +--------- http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/english/menue.html ---------+   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 11:19:50 GMT = From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-)eR Subject: Re: looking for company to provide home IP connection (for VMS) (Germany)0 Message-ID: <009F1D25.6E79A71D@SendSpamHere.ORG>  [ In article <8sl9de$9pe$2@info.service.rug.nl>, helbig@astro.rug.nl (Phillip Helbig) writes:rI >In article <009F1CA9.FF21CCC9@SendSpamHere.ORG>, system@SendSpamHere.ORG ) >(Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-) writes: . > ^ >> In article <8sknpi$4f5$2@info.service.rug.nl>, helbig@astro.rug.nl (Phillip Helbig) writes:8 >> >In article <39ED7EB4.8BAE885B@Compaq.com>, Roy Omond# >> ><Roy.Omond@Compaq.com> writes: ? >> >Q >> >> However, if you go the ISDN (or ADSL) router way (as many in this newsgroupiN >> >> have recommended, including myself), you do *not* need static addresses.Q >> >> I personally would recommend the Netgear family of routers.  They're cheap,kP >> >> a dawdle to setup, flexible, support NAT (a definite prerequisite for yourA >> >> situation), and well supported.  That's what I use at home.  >> >L >> >Will this allow IP access on demand from outside and inside and allow a L >> >domain name to be associated with my stuff?  Is NAT compatible with VMS?L >>                                               ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >> SM >> Why not?  NAT -- Network Address Translation -- changes the packet address M >> from the WAN side to the address on the inside.  Many of the devices which N >> provide this make it very easy to maintain a static set of addresses on theJ >> machine on the inside while the WAN address may change (DHCP assigned). >"I >OK.  But if YOU want to connect to my machine, what do you have to know?t  K The address on the WAN side.  You'd also have to forward the port requestedd@ to a machine on the inside or place the machine inside in a DMZ. --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMu             O city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after them.    ------------------------------   Date: 19 Oct 2000 10:46:51 GMT3 From: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann) R Subject: Re: looking for company to provide home IP connection (for VMS) (Germany)0 Message-ID: <8smjer$t79$3@n.ruf.uni-freiburg.de>  [ In article <8sl9la$9pe$3@info.service.rug.nl>, helbig@astro.rug.nl (Phillip Helbig) writes:sD >Let me make two things clear which are perhaps not clear.  ANYBODY I >should be able to access the machines, based on NAMES (or addresses, if oG >they don't change, but in that case I could associate them with names tG >through DNS etc).  Also, it's not just the fixed IP addresses for the aI >machine, but fixed AND UNIQUE in the entire world.  Otherwise, how does e >one get to my machine?L >x; >If one can get to it by name without it having a---for theUG >world---fixedd number, OK, but then I couldn't run my own DNS server, u? >access individual machines on my lan from outside etc---right?,  O If your provides assigns you different addresses it is the job of your provider L to ensure that your name is properly resolved to the current address of yourI router. This is something almost impossible as the provider has to update K his primary and secondary nameserver at the moment when you get your new IPlF address. And even if this is manageable, there are nameservers cachingI addresses, so some sites in the world will not be able to connect to yourw0 machine for some time (until the cache expires).  N So, the best thing is to have one static address and one or even several namesD that resolve to this address and this is the address of your router.   Regards,    Christoph Gartmanno  H -----------------------------------------------------------------------+H | Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452 |H | Immunbiologie                                                        |H | Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de     |H | D-79011  Freiburg, FRG                                               |H +--------- http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/english/menue.html ---------+   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 12:50:51 -0400e# From: John Vottero <John@MVPSI.com>eR Subject: RE: looking for company to provide home IP connection (for VMS) (Germany)D Message-ID: <C15945A9D9EFCF11BA8B08002BBF1CCC0CD867@berry.mvpsi.com>   > -----Original Message-----8 > From: helbig@astro.rug.nl [mailto:helbig@astro.rug.nl]+ > Sent: Wednesday, October 18, 2000 6:48 PM F > In article <C15945A9D9EFCF11BA8B08002BBF1CCC0CD860@berry.mvpsi.com>,( > John Vottero <John@MVPSI.com> writes:  > @ > > You need a xDSL router.  The DSL equipment will probably be  > dictated by the  > > ISP. > >  [snip]> > For incoming connections, you have to tell the router which  > local machine it? > > should direct connection requests to.  You do this by port u > so you could say? > > connections to port 25 (SMTP) should go to 192.168.1.5 and a > connections to, > > port 80 (HTTP) should go to 192.168.1.6. > E > Suppose YOU want to telnet into my machine, access its webserver oraG > whatever.  Could you do it?  Based on the (local) IP---no, apparentlyaF > (since other people could have the same ones).  Based on some other ; > static IP---no, apparently doesn't exist in this setup.  d > Based on some H > name which somehow gets resolved to my machine---if so, how does this  > work?a >g  G It's just like SMTP and HTTP.  You would define a map that says port 23aF should go to IP address 192.168.1.???  From the outside you could onlyH telnet to that one machine but, if that was a VMS machine you could thenG telnet to any other local node.  Also, you might be able to make telnet L listen on a port other than 23.  Then you could define additional NAT server maps.   t   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 13:18:23 -0400y- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca> Q Subject: Re: looking for company to provide home IP connection (for VMS)(Germany)n, Message-ID: <39EF2CDE.28C2EC95@videotron.ca>   BMcN wrote:-J > nonsense fairly soon. Somewhere on the web I came across one of the freeL > shell accounts offering the possibility to host your DNS records such thatL > it was easy to update them. This was intended for DHCP leased addresses so, > that you could update whenever it changed.  K You have to be careful with this.  This may be just a web re-direct serviceaJ (you type www.chocolate.com and that connects you to their web server, andK their web server then sends a redirect to your current numeric IP address).e  J If it is a true DNS update service, consider that DNS updates do take someG time to propagate on the internet (I beleive it is a question of days).i  M > regularly and hope that updating it on the remote DNS would be reliable. As.G > to referencing specific machines within your network... I don't know.e5 > Presumably running own DNS server might help there.i  K Running your own DSN on your LAN allows one machine on the LAN to reference M another machine on your LAN by name. Easy. I do that. But your local DNS does G abosolutely nothing to inbound calls since by the time they get to yournK router, the name of the host has long been replaced with a numeric address.u  H > My other option here in Belgium is to cough up the 6000 BEF ($135) perI > month to get a fixed IP address. Also included is an SMTP feed on that.P  P In Montreal, the "big" ISPs was closer to $400 per month when you include taxes.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 12:14:51 GMTe From: salvatorelli@my-deja.com0 Subject: loss of linefeeds when typing a file-11) Message-ID: <8smojo$qg5$1@nnrp1.deja.com>   	 Hi there,t" this is the service configuration. Thanks for your help.o Marilena     NETCU> sh versionnA TCPware(R) for OpenVMS V5.3-2 Copyright (c) 1997 Process Softwaren Corporationr  ! NETCU> sh service hnm bg_tcp/fullt& TCPware(R) for OpenVMS NETCP Services:  3 Protocol    Port Active Limit Connects Errors Imageo3 --------    ---- ------ ----- -------- ------ ----- - BG_TCP       hnm      1  none       13     12t9                            /ROUTINE=create_server_processo                            /LOGa;                            /INPUT=DSA1:[SMSC.LOG]HNMLOG.COM )                            /USERNAME=SMSC   & SYSTEM> type dsa1:[smsc.log]hnmlog.com $! $def/user sys$output sys$net# $ type/cont dsa1:[smsc.log]smsc.logt $!          & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 12:36:03 GMT  From: salvatorelli@my-deja.com5 Subject: Re: loss of linefeeds when typing a files-11h) Message-ID: <8smpri$rfc$1@nnrp1.deja.com>n  " This is the service configuration:   NETCU> sh versionlA TCPware(R) for OpenVMS V5.3-2 Copyright (c) 1997 Process Softwareo Corporation-  ! NETCU> sh service hnm bg_tcp/full & TCPware(R) for OpenVMS NETCP Services:  3 Protocol    Port Active Limit Connects Errors Image 3 --------    ---- ------ ----- -------- ------ ----- - BG_TCP       hnm      1  none       13     12 9                            /ROUTINE=create_server_processs                            /LOGi;                            /INPUT=DSA1:[SMSC.LOG]HNMLOG.COM )                            /USERNAME=SMSC  NETCU>    and this is the hnmlog.com file:  & SYSTEM> type dsa1:[smsc.log]hnmlog.com $! $ def/user sys$output sys$nets# $ type/cont dsa1:[smsc.log]smsc.logd $!   Thanks for your help.a
      Marilenao  . In article <Pine.LNX.4.21.0010171143130.21101- 100000@irys.stanpol.com.pl>,=   "Gotfryd Smolik, VMS lists" <gotfryd@stanpol.com.pl> wrote:e5 > On Mon, 16 Oct 2000 tony_barratt@my-deja.com wrote:n >t > +Hi List, ; > +Can anyone cast some light on how linefeeds can go AWOL?t > [...] D > +We are telneting to a port on the VMS node that invokes a service whicho3 > +performs a "type/continuous" on a files-11 file.t >A> >  Can you be little more specific how the service is set-up ?  > (UCX> SHOW SERV name/FULL etc) > > > +                                              This file hasF > +additional lines regulary appended to it by an application. Each of thetB > +appended lines appears in the file complete with line feeds, as > +expected.G > +But the data appears minus the line feeds when we telnet to the portf inF > +the manner desribed above. We can telnet from a unix machine, or we can A > +telnet from the VMS machine to itself and get the same result.s > +n1 > +Can anyone suggest what might be causing this?  >uG >  One reason: "something" in your TCP services is not aware of "records
 > barier".A >  The RMS data (mostly used), including file structure (but alsoiD > one read b.ex. from mailbox !) are record-oriented. That mean: the: > stream of data is somewhere "cut" as a separate records.A >  The "record" in known to record-aware program and the programsa2 > can "do something" with *whole records* of data.> >  A example is a "typical text file": in *most* files (except: > "fit stream type") you do *not* have a "line separator".@ >  The file is saved in RMS level as a "series of records" - and< > *while displaying* the "end of record" marks are converted1 > to "new line" character or character seqeuence.t9 >  Be aware: the file itself has *not* the CR, LF or CRLFtB > sequences saved in data, the sequence is added *by application*.; >  The file, of course, *can* have some CRLF saved into: in ? > attached .BCK you can find a example; BTW: check it with yourn: > service and see, if the third record is cut to two lines > when typed via the service !< >  When you b.ex. TYPE a file - the "carrier control" means:) > "add (or not) a virtual CR LF to data".c8 >  *If* you read the file record-by-record *and* send to: > output only data (ignoring the "record breaks") you will6 > *not* see the virtual CRLF - because it not exists !3 >  Probably your programm does something like this.t >o> >  The "unix concept" uses only data as "stream of byte" - and > expect a "real CRLF" in data.n8 >  Someone can say: "how then a C program, where ignores6 > a record structure can work ?" - the answer is: "the= > library manages the conversion of >>virtual CR<< (as recordl, > end) to >>real CRLF<< (or CR or LF only)".: >  The "bug" of "missing CRLF" manifests only, if the data9 > is read as records but written as stream of bytes *and*m4 > the code ignores the "add virtual line end" needs. >y0 >  Then have ask about info of your UCX service. >n > +TIA > +e > +Tonyg >. >  Regards - Gotfryd >h > --G > =====================================================================mH > $ ON F$ERROR("LANGUAGE","ENGLISH","IN_MESSAGE").GT.F$ERROR("NORMAL") - > 		THEN EXCUSE/OBJECT=ME 0 > $!                        GS@stanpol.zabrze.plG > =====================================================================) >r >     & Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy.d   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 17:26:37 +0200o= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>- Subject: Re: Mail forwarding) Message-ID: <39EF12AC.4C29FF5A@gtech.com>.   Phillip Helbig wrote:n; > In article <39EA8FE8.4D1DDDD7@Easynet.fr>, Didier Morandic% > <Didier.Morandi@Easynet.fr> writes:8 >  > > Maulis Adam wrote: > > > ( > > > MAIL> set forward _NEO,xxx@xxx.comR > > > %CLI-W-NOLIST, list of parameter values not allowed - check use of comma (,) > > > /_NEO,xxx@xxx.com/ > >rJ > > Sorry. Bad memory. I didn't have access to VMS when I posted this, and/ > > of course I forgot about the Set COPY_SELF.) > F > I haven't checked; this applies to the FORWARD command; does it also: > apply to SET FORWARD, which is really a different beast?   No.i   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 09:51:57 +0100e, From: Paul BEAUDOIN <paul.beaudoin@hsbc.com>/ Subject: Memo:   Re: How to send an SMS messaget? Message-ID: <8025697D.0030A3BA.00@emea-smtp-03.systems.uk.hsbc>i  C I have a dialler program (VAX or Alpha) that would work. OriginallyhD designed to dial and log into an ISP but it includes ability to sendE strings in response to prompts (with wildcards) or timeouts and such.c If you want it,mail me. $ It's in Macro32 and not too lengthy.   Paul      D ********************************************************************B  This message and any attachments are confidential to the ordinaryB  user of the e-mail address to which it was addressed and may also>  be privileged. If you are not the addressee you may not copy,8  forward, disclose or use any part of the message or itsC  attachments and if you have received this message in error, pleaseeB  notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete it from
  your system.0  =  Internet communications cannot be guaranteed to be secure ornA  error-free as information could be intercepted, corrupted, lost,(>  arrive late or contain viruses. The sender therefore does not?  accept liability for any errors or omissions in the context ofr?  this message which arise as a result of Internet transmission.d  sD  Any opinions contained in this message are those of the author and ?  are not given or endorsed by the HSBC Group company or office e=  through which this message is sent unless otherwise clearly nA  indicated in this message and the authority of the author to so C3  bind the HSBC entity referred to is duly verified.   D ********************************************************************   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 13:43:01 +0530u, From: "krish" <a.krishnamoorthy@digital.com> Subject: Memoryo* Message-ID: <8smafr$u34@usenet.pa.dec.com>   Hello,  K  I was wondering how much of memory does VMS operating system occupy in RAMvF . What i mean is, suppose in a machine with 64MB RAM , when i boot theH machine,how much of RAM will get occupied by VMS. When i mean VMS i meanG only the core operating system, and nothing else like layered products.k   Thanks in advanceh Regards4 -Krish --@ "Courage is the price that life extracts for granting peace with yourself."Amelia Earhart   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 07:29:05 -0400 2 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" <DRAGON@compuserve.com> Subject: Re: Memory-7 Message-ID: <200010190729_MC2-B779-CB47@compuserve.com>m  J         It varies!  The numbers are very different for VAX and Alpha.  Th= e A version of VMS makes a difference.  Your SYSGEN parameters make aeJ difference.  The Software Product Description (SPD) for the release you a= re2 running will give you the minimum memory required.  J         As a rule of thumb, allow 8mb for a VAX without DECwindows and 16= mbG with.  For the Alpha it's 32mb and 64mb.  More should usually result inmG better performance, especially with the Alpha.   These are not what the E kernel occupies but the minimum memory required to run the O/S and anp application or two.>  H         The actual physical memory occupied by the kernel is, I believe,J set the the SYSGEN parameter SYSMWS (sp?).  The virtual address space can=  A be much larger, especially if performance is not a consideration.f   Message text written by "krish"e >Hello,   J  I was wondering how much of memory does VMS operating system occupy in R= AMF . What i mean is, suppose in a machine with 64MB RAM , when i boot theH machine,how much of RAM will get occupied by VMS. When i mean VMS i meanG only the core operating system, and nothing else like layered products.    Thanks in advancen Regards  -Krish<d   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 11:36:05 GMT = From: system@SendSpamHere.ORG (Brian Schenkenberger, VAXman-)n Subject: Re: Memoryd0 Message-ID: <009F1D27.B408F398@SendSpamHere.ORG>  Y In article <8smafr$u34@usenet.pa.dec.com>, "krish" <a.krishnamoorthy@digital.com> writes:i >Hello,  >yL > I was wondering how much of memory does VMS operating system occupy in RAMH >.. What i mean is, suppose in a machine with 64MB RAM , when i boot theI >machine,how much of RAM will get occupied by VMS. When i mean VMS i meaneH >only the core operating system, and nothing else like layered products.  I Well, for a simple figure, try $ SHOW MEMORY  and look for the line whiche reads:  N Of the physical pages in use, #### pages are permanently allocated to OpenVMS.   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM-             O city, n., 1. a place where trees are cut down and streets are named after them.n   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 13:13:22 -0400)5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>g) Subject: Re: Migrating the last VAX usersc, Message-ID: <8si1h0$e8er$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>   Nope.s  $ Dave Weatherall wrote in message ...C >On Thu, 12 Oct 2000 19:10:04, mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (Davids >Mathog) wrote:( >a. >> In article <hQdHaBz6umHY@eisner.decus.org>,; Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen) writes:  >o? >>> But if you think Compaq is going to keep VMS/VAX up to datei >forever, well, I >> it just doesn't seem likely.  Draw a graph showing the fraction of new E >> features in VMS releases that are making it into VMS/VAX (which isd falling I >> with each release) and you'll be able to estimate as well as any of use when& >> the de facto de-support will occur. > D >It suddenly struck me,. If Larry prefers debugging on VAX, a view IF >share even if its only because I can read the M32 code and thus don'tF >usually need the /NOOPT qualifier, maybe VMS engineers find it easier >to do some things on VAX too? >d >Cheers - Dave.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 14:56:18 +0530l, From: "krish" <a.krishnamoorthy@digital.com>( Subject: MOUNT/FOR  fails for shadowset.* Message-ID: <8smep8$9jj@usenet.pa.dec.com>   Hello,  C  I am trying to backup some data, and facing the following problem.d4  I am trying to mount a shadow set dsa201 having twoI disk($1$dkb0:,$1$dkb300:) using the foreign qualifier. I want to mount itn2 foreign and do a backup/restore on that shadowset.  D  But when i give the following command, after creating the shadowset  :  PROMPT :-))mount/for dsa201:/shadow=($1$dkb0:,$1$dkb300:)  *  I am getting the following error message.  @ %DCL-W-CONFLICT, illegal combination of command elements - check
 documentatione  \FOR\  3  Could somebody tell me what i am doing wrong here.-  -  Your suggestion will be greatly appreciated.n    -Krish-   --@ "Courage is the price that life extracts for granting peace with yourself."Amelia Earhart   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 09:05:39 -0400 0 From: David Beatty <David.Beatty.NOSPAM@sas.com>, Subject: Re: MOUNT/FOR  fails for shadowset.2 Message-ID: <+enuOQF2yZZl5W0u6a46e0I2cfy9@4ax.com>  3 If memory serves, you can't mount a shadow set withn1 the /FOREIGN qualifier; in fact, /SYSTEM may very9 well be implied.  ! What you should be able to do is:   > $ Initialize  $1$Dkb0:  WHATEVER  ! Label will get overwritten $ Mount/Foreign $1$Dkb0:' $ Backup/Image <your save set> $1$Dkb0:  $ Dismount $1$Dkb0: / $ Mount Dsa201: /Shadow=($1$Dkb0:) <your label>u$ $ Mount Dsa201: /Shadow=($1$Dkb300:)   David R. Beattyi  + On Thu, 19 Oct 2000 14:56:18 +0530, "krish"u% <a.krishnamoorthy@digital.com> wrote:(   >Hello,d > D > I am trying to backup some data, and facing the following problem.5 > I am trying to mount a shadow set dsa201 having twoyJ >disk($1$dkb0:,$1$dkb300:) using the foreign qualifier. I want to mount it3 >foreign and do a backup/restore on that shadowset.l >oE > But when i give the following command, after creating the shadowsete >y; > PROMPT :-))mount/for dsa201:/shadow=($1$dkb0:,$1$dkb300:)i >s+ > I am getting the following error message.o >oA >%DCL-W-CONFLICT, illegal combination of command elements - checkd >documentation > \FOR\t >a4 > Could somebody tell me what i am doing wrong here. > . > Your suggestion will be greatly appreciated. >t > -Krish   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 14:54:40 GMTg1 From: "Mark D. Jilson" <jilly@clarityconnect.com>t, Subject: Re: MOUNT/FOR  fails for shadowset.2 Message-ID: <39EF0CD0.DEB3C0C3@clarityconnect.com>  E Try MOUNT/FOREIGN/OVERRIDE=(IDENTIFICATION,SHADOW) $1$DKB0: and afteroD the restore is done then MOUNT/SYSTEM/SHADOW=$1$DKB0: DSA201 {label}H {logical} followed by a MOUNT/SYSTEM/SHADOW=($1$DKB0:,$1$DKB300:) DSA201 {label} {logical}    krish wrote: >  > Hello, > E >  I am trying to backup some data, and facing the following problem. 6 >  I am trying to mount a shadow set dsa201 having twoK > disk($1$dkb0:,$1$dkb300:) using the foreign qualifier. I want to mount ity4 > foreign and do a backup/restore on that shadowset. > F >  But when i give the following command, after creating the shadowset > < >  PROMPT :-))mount/for dsa201:/shadow=($1$dkb0:,$1$dkb300:) > , >  I am getting the following error message. > B > %DCL-W-CONFLICT, illegal combination of command elements - check > documentation  >  \FOR\ > 5 >  Could somebody tell me what i am doing wrong here.e > / >  Your suggestion will be greatly appreciated.g > 	 >  -Krisht >  > --B > "Courage is the price that life extracts for granting peace with > yourself."Amelia Earhart   -- bD Jilly	- Working from Home in the Chemung River Valley - Lockwood, NY0 	- jilly@clarityconnect.com			- Brett Bodine fan. 	- Mark.Jilson@Compaq.com			- since 1975 or so, 	- http://www.jilly.baka.com               -   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 11:25:07 +0000h$ From: Steve.Spires@yellowpages.co.uk+ Subject: Re: MOUNT/FOR fails for shadowset.t/ Message-ID: <0025697D.003E7868.00@quegw01.btyp>$  L Contact:   Tel: 3063  -  IS - Infrastructure, 1st Floor, Bridge Street Plaza    5 I think that /FOR and /SHADOW are mutually exclusive.m  O What you should be doing is your restote to ONE of the shadow set members, then 8 recreate the shadow set with that device as the primary.   Steve Spires VMS System Manager BT/Yellow PagesD        @ "krish" <a.krishnamoorthy@digital.com> on 19/10/2000 09:26:18 AM    To:        Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com+ cc:         (bcc: Steve Spires/YellowPages)rM From:      "krish" <a.krishnamoorthy@digital.com>, 19 October 2000, 9:26 a.m.    MOUNT/FOR  fails for shadowset.)         Hello,  C  I am trying to backup some data, and facing the following problem.-4  I am trying to mount a shadow set dsa201 having twoI disk($1$dkb0:,$1$dkb300:) using the foreign qualifier. I want to mount itO2 foreign and do a backup/restore on that shadowset.  D  But when i give the following command, after creating the shadowset  :  PROMPT :-))mount/for dsa201:/shadow=($1$dkb0:,$1$dkb300:)  *  I am getting the following error message.  @ %DCL-W-CONFLICT, illegal combination of command elements - check
 documentation   \FOR\  3  Could somebody tell me what i am doing wrong here.-  -  Your suggestion will be greatly appreciated.     -Krisht   --@ "Courage is the price that life extracts for granting peace with yourself."Amelia Earhart   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 14:44:56 +0100s0 From: andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com>) Subject: Re: OpenVMS, java, perl, etc ...C* Message-ID: <39EEFAD8.5C9C2486@uk.sun.com>   David Mathog wrote:e > z > In article <OF6890C3BE.DDF50E5B-ON8325697C.00633BC0@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>, fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br writes:A > >in my personal opinion, Java will be a great tool to redevelopN > >old productsr > >and to create others  > H > Fine if you like really, really, really slow and bloated applications.H > Don't know what I mean?  Give the java version of the Acrobat viewer a > whirl sometime.T > > While the performance of the Java PDF viewer would not make me= stop using the native Solaris one it isn't so slow that it is ; unusable at least on the box I am using which is an Ultra1.3  < Does the OpenVMS JVM have the JIT turned on by default or do! you need to explicitly enable it.o     regardsn Andrew Harrisony Enterprise IT Architecte   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 10:29:03 -0400 0 From: David Beatty <David.Beatty.NOSPAM@sas.com>) Subject: Re: OpenVMS, java, perl, etc ...o2 Message-ID: <3wTvOZJ7kg5cHh41ElO=HizevSqE@4ax.com>  3 On Thu, 19 Oct 2000 14:44:56 +0100, andrew harrisoni! <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> wrote:a   >David Mathog wrote: >>  { >> In article <OF6890C3BE.DDF50E5B-ON8325697C.00633BC0@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>, fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br writes:hB >> >in my personal opinion, Java will be a great tool to redevelop >> >old products >> >and to create others >> hI >> Fine if you like really, really, really slow and bloated applications. I >> Don't know what I mean?  Give the java version of the Acrobat viewer ai >> whirl sometime. >> s? >While the performance of the Java PDF viewer would not make meh> >stop using the native Solaris one it isn't so slow that it is< >unusable at least on the box I am using which is an Ultra1. >c= >Does the OpenVMS JVM have the JIT turned on by default or do " >you need to explicitly enable it. > > It would appear to be enabled by default.  For you VMSers, see7 process logical name JAVA_COMPILER in command procedurer SYS$STARTUP:JAVA$SETUP.COM   David R. Beatty  >d >regards >Andrew Harrison >Enterprise IT Architect   ------------------------------   Date: 19 Oct 2000 15:46:57 GMT2 From: mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog)) Subject: Re: OpenVMS, java, perl, etc ...t, Message-ID: <8sn51h$b6t@gap.cco.caltech.edu>  ] In article <39EEFAD8.5C9C2486@uk.sun.com>, andrew harrison <andrew.nospam@uk.sun.com> writes:r >David Mathog wrote: >> n{ >> In article <OF6890C3BE.DDF50E5B-ON8325697C.00633BC0@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>, fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br writes: B >> >in my personal opinion, Java will be a great tool to redevelop >> >old products >> >and to create others >> tI >> Fine if you like really, really, really slow and bloated applications.lI >> Don't know what I mean?  Give the java version of the Acrobat viewer af >> whirl sometime. >> *? >While the performance of the Java PDF viewer would not make mei> >stop using the native Solaris one it isn't so slow that it is< >unusable at least on the box I am using which is an Ultra1. >x= >Does the OpenVMS JVM have the JIT turned on by default or do"" >you need to explicitly enable it. >y  < The JIT is run by default.  To turn it off use: $ java/nojit  A The problem here is less with the speed than the (obscene) bloat.>    PDF viewer      Memory usage  OS* acrobat          9.5 Mb       WNT (native)! Acrobat Java   >50.0 Mb       VMSl! XPDF 0.9         3.0 Mb       VMSs! GV               2.1 Mb       VMSd  J I've never tried the Java version on another OS but doubt that it would be much smaller elsewhere.    Regards,   David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edud? Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech =   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 17:41:02 +0200E= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com> ) Subject: Re: OpenVMS, java, perl, etc ...=) Message-ID: <39EF160E.8DF56194@gtech.com>=  * fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br wrote:I > I think OpenVMS is becoming a Frankenstein .... these  "ports" from the  > Unix world are notL >  working fine in my vision because theres no real acceptance from the old > VMS managers >  in these new technologies.    ????  A In my experience Java and Perl are relative poular on VMS. Not asF
 popular as- on Unix, but at least as popular as on Win32.@  yC > But OVMS needs to become "modern"  for  all markets.... and these  > improvments arexM > needed ....  in my personal opinion, Java will be a great tool to redevelopc > old productsG > and to create others ..... but just port from Unix wil not work ! TheV > products must be+ > redeveloped using the  OpenVMS structure.C   ????  , Java are per definition system independent !  K > I talked a few time ago: C++, Basic,  and other developemnt  products forr > OVMS must become& >  visual ! ! !  Management tools too.   Already exist.  G DECset and VMS Management Station (I hope I remember the name correct).j   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2000 12:36:02 -0400a5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>( Subject: Re: PDF under OpenVMS, Message-ID: <8s7drg$a6ug$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>  # Clarification of a clarification...i  I We are removing the Display Postscript Extension for X11.  This extensionnG allows X11 applications to send postscript commands directly to the X11*J server, where they are interpreted and drawn by the extension (to answer aH later question from Dave Mathog - this is not the same as software which@ converts data in some arbitrary format, into postscript output.)  L DPS consists of two parts:  Application client libraries, and the DPS Server
 Extension.  G Motif1.2-6, which will ship with V7.3 (and which should install back topL V6.2) removes the client libraries, or rather, it will replace the librariesE with a stubbed out library that shoud return extension not available.u  G V7.3 will remove the DPS extension from X11, and all and any hooks that  might exist for it.i  J So.  Installing Motif 1.2-5 on a V7.3 system *will not* allow DPS, because there is no DPS extension.  H To use DPS will require that you use both pre-V7.3 and pre-V1.2-6.  EvenJ then, if it doesn't work - you are pretty much SOL.  We no longer have theH ability to get support from Adobe, or to obtain objects built debug fromL them.  I've already had to close several bug reports with a "sorry, we can't support or fix it".u  I Ghostscript/view is a good alternative to replacing viewers... it isn't a*L replacement for real applications that use DPS... they are pretty much stuck using pre-V7.3 and pre-V1.2-61        K Hoff Hoffman wrote in message <8s2e3g$ntm$1@mailint03.im.hou.compaq.com>...m >o >In article J <60333E9D00AE31E8.237882F2CA4681FE.216FA30F2142BBFB@lp.airnews.net>, Chris+ Scheers <chris@applied-synergy.com> writes: H >:As I understand it, Display Postscript on VMS has been unsupported forG >:some time, but if it was already installed, it would be left in placen >:during previous VMS upgrades.  >:B >:This changes with VMS 7.3, which will remove Display Postscript. >hI >  Clarification:  This capability -- and its expected removal -- is partrH >  of DECwindows and of upgrading to the version of DECwindows availableI >  with OpenVMS V7.3, and not specifically part of upgrading OpenVMS V7.3 * >  itself.  A subtle difference, I know... >_+ > --------------------------- pure personalv# opinion ---------------------------t0 >   Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering hoffman#xdelta.zko.dec.com >a   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 09:59:10 -0600  From: Kevin Handy <kth@srv.net>g3 Subject: Re: SMG, BASIC, ckermit, and Printer portsr' Message-ID: <39EF1A4E.DDAD3910@srv.net>   < Finally got a change to try this, but it made no difference.; I really think that is is some sort of buffering problem onl< the VMS side (buffering on two channels, the SMG one and the% BASIC one) are not being syncronyzed.t  ; I'll have to try changing it to close/reopen the channel toi; see if that works I guess (ugly code, but will proove it to  me what is happening)    Frank da Cruz wrote: > K > In article <39E60882.38DA6BDC@srv.net>, Kevin Handy  <kth@srv.net> wrote:n@ > : I have a Vax/Basic program that output's to the printer port< > : and displays information on the screen using SMG$ calls.: > : The printer port is currently handled by printing to a6 > : channel on which I have opened "tt:". (sending the7 > : printer on escape sequence, then the data to print, * > : then the printer off escape sequence). > : = > : On a VT420, VT320, etc connected through terminal servers-= > : it works fine, but when using ckermit through the networkm: > : (ucx on vax), the printing and SMG output get mixed up7 > : sometimes. I am guessing that telnet flushes output.: > : differently than the terminal servers (from looking at# > : a log file created in ckermit).i > :l= > : I do a SMG$FLUSH_BUFFER before doing a PRINT, but I don'tn+ > : know of a way to flush a basic channel.u > : > > : Now my real question: Is there a good way to flush a basic> > : channel (to see if that is really my problem), or is there= > : a way to get SMG to handle output to the printer port, ort; > : some way to sync the SMG output with the basic channel?f > :e@ > C-Kermit itself does some filtering of escape sequences, whichA > should not interfere with printing.  But as a quick experiment,t? > try the following commands and see if they make a difference:  > 	 >   eight  >   set terminal apc off* >   set terminal character-set transparent > < > If nothing changes, then it's almost certainly not Kermit. > 	 > - Frankm   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2000 12:43:18 -0400t5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>.6 Subject: Re: Solved: no MMOV sound on AlphaStation 500, Message-ID: <8s7e96$a7ie$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>  J Yeah, EISA has this bizzare encoding for device ids.  The ISA_ON_EISA flagL says to use the ISA rules for interpreting the string (1-8 byte string, zero$ terminated, case insensitive ASCII).    K Christoph Gartmann wrote in message <8s40ip$2m5$1@n.ruf.uni-freiburg.de>...e >Hi, > I >in the file SYS$SYSTEM:SYS$USER_CONFIG.DAT I needed to add an extra linem  >in the relevant driver section: >l) >   device       = "Microsoft Sound Card"b >     name       = AUa! >     driver     = MMOV$MSBDRIVER  >     adapter    = EISA  >     flags      = ISA_ON_EISA >     id         = "ISA2000" >   end_device >eI >The "flags" statement was missing and is required on all systems with an  ISAN >to EISA bridge. >  >Afterwards I did:
 >   MC SYSMANo >   IO REBUILD >   IO AUTO/SEL=(AU*,VI*)e >   EXIT >   @sys$startup:mmov$startupa > 	 >Regards,  >   Christoph Gartmann > I >-----------------------------------------------------------------------+wI >| Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452 |tI >| Immunbiologie                                                        |nI >| Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de     |gI >| D-79011  Freiburg, FRG                                               |hI >+--------- http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/english/menue.html ---------+o   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 13:30:05 -0400 5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>,6 Subject: Re: SUMMARY:  installing VMS 7.2-1 on 433au ?, Message-ID: <8si2gc$edn0$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>  L This is pure bs.  We do *not* look at the boot device and deliberately causeJ it to fail unless it's known.  The primitive drivers that run during boot,I use minimal functionality.  These drivers in fact live in the console forhI Alpha for the last few years.  When the runtime drivers come online, they.H then actually *use* the device in a more intellegent way, and expect the6 device to behave within the specifications we require.  B Now.  I too agree that it would "be nice" to have some way to haveH dumb-drivers or dumb driver modes, which would restrict the operation toI only those things that the worst PC in the world would tolerate (and damn J the performance).  It just isn't high on peoples list of things we need toF do - most people are asking for faster, cheaper, more reliable.  Well,> cheaper isn't always compatable with faster and more reliable.  D The original message that your rant responded to in fact wasn't evenL complaining about the *disk*.  What happened is that someone booted a systemL which had SRM console support for the disk CONTROLLER, on a VMS version thatI did not have runtime support for it.  We looked around, couldn't find thesG driver, and tried to simply ignore the device in the boot command.  ThetJ solution for that is to either get a version of VMS with the driver on it,G or what we call a "SHIP" kit that is a floppy that has the supplimental%K support to allow an older version to be booted.  IntraServer uses (or used)iG this method, for instance, when you purchase a controller directly from  them.r      8 SysAdmin wrote in message <39EB489A.5DD14872@fsi.net>... >- ><RANT>-I >Later in the boot process, the "primitive" drivers in the bootstraps get<H >replaced with the o.s. drivers which promptly look at their boot deviceH >and say, "Oh! This is disk is "commodity" trash! I'm not soiling myselfD >with THIS garbage!" ...where upon it pukes, takes its ball and goes >home. ></RANT> >H= >Yes, I realize that's an unfair exaggeration. I just find itT  >frustrating, as many others do. >1H >I do appreciate the time and effort that the VMS people take to certifyG >devices and drivers. I just can't help feeling that a less restrictingo. >compromise would be beneficial in many cases. >, >David J. Dachtera   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 16:52:06 -0000 . From: shawbrow@delilah.cisco.com (Shawn Brown)' Subject: Re: Sun "uptime" belly laughero- Message-ID: <971974416.604379@sj-nntpcache-3>w  + In article <MYnw451i3kbz@eisner.decus.org>, + Rob Young <young_r@eisner.decus.org> wrote:C >iL >The only thing that really matters is uptime.  Only bring it down a handfulL >of times in a year?  How about staying up a couple years?  Foreign concept?F >Better yet.... how about designing and selling machines that can stay >up more than a month!!!   Nice troll.n  D I've had production sun boxes with two year uptimes.  I think that'sH actually negligent on my part, since I wasn't patching for the duration.  K It's routine for our production sun boxes to have one or two month uptimes.:3 Not much more than that because we patch quarterly.-   Shawn-   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 10:18:01 GMTo) From: "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca>f, Subject: TCPware + "Web Connector" question?< Message-ID: <tTzH5.350912$Gh.10553961@news20.bellglobal.com>   Folks,K I just sent the following message to "Process Software". Does anyone on thec7 newsgroup have an answer to the question at the bottom?N  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  K On the web page at: http://www.process.com/tcpip/tcpcompare.html you should K add the fact that TCPware has callable FTP + Telnet libraries while "TCP/IP  Services 5.0" does not.   J I work at xxxxxxxx and we're preparing to port some large apps from VAX toI Alpha. My boss wanted to simplify "his job" by dropping TCPware and usingoJ Compaq's "TCP/IP Services 5.0" but we discovered that many of our apps areG "TCPware friendly" and make direct calls to the FTP or Telnet libraries # which only exist with your product.o  H With "TCP/IP Services 5.0" we would need to produce our own FTP + TelnetK libraries (which would then call the "C-Socket" interface) but I'm sure youaJ know this is easier said than done. (especially all that WILL-WONT DO-DONT7 voodoo required at the start of any Telnet connection.),   --------------------  G Having said all this, we still may need to go the "TCP/IP Services 5.0" I route depending on how you answer the question below. It is the intent ofd  our company to do the following:  J Convert FMS (Forms Management Systems) enabled applications to DECforms soK we can use Compaq's "Web Connector" product to allow existing forms to work K from web pages. (We still need to support a large infrastructure of VT420's # and "PC's running VT420 Emulation").  J The problem here is that Compaq claims that "Web Connector" will only workD with "TCP/IP Services 5.0" but makes no mention of 3rd party stacks.   --------------------  J So, can you tell me if you are aware of anybody using "Web Connector" with
 "TCPware"?  
 Neil Rieck	 xxxxxxxxx  Kitchener, Ontario, Canada.r tel: 519-571-6303 (biz)o eml: n.rieck@sympatico.ca (rez)w   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 16:32:17 GMTi- From: goathunter@goatley.com (Hunter Goatley) 0 Subject: Re: TCPware + "Web Connector" question?/ Message-ID: <39ef213f.3046140@swen.process.com>a  E On Thu, 19 Oct 2000 10:18:01 GMT, "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca>M wrote:   >Folks,dL >I just sent the following message to "Process Software". Does anyone on the8 >newsgroup have an answer to the question at the bottom? >-K >So, can you tell me if you are aware of anybody using "Web Connector" with. >"TCPware"?@ >.A I don't know of anyone using "Web Connector" with TCPware, but weOE at Process always strive to make sure that all such applications work > under TCPware.  My guess is that it would work just fine under= TCPware, though there may be some startup issue, depending on7@ whether or not and how they check for the TCP/IP stack.  But any2 such problems should be easily made TCPware-aware.  B We're trying to work closely with Compaq to ensure that everything? they have works with both MultiNet and TCPware.  But we haven'tl? gotten to all of the products yet.  If a Compaq product says ite@ requires TCP/IP Services, it just means that they didn't test it= to see if it would work on MultiNet and TCPware.  We can work = with you to make sure you get it all running OK with TCPware.a   Hunter ------9 Hunter Goatley, Process Software, http://www.process.com/ : goathunter@goatley.com      http://www.goatley.com/hunter/   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 12:38:11 +0000u$ From: Steve.Spires@yellowpages.co.uk0 Subject: TECO (was Re: File Comparison - Urgent)/ Message-ID: <0025697D.00452847.00@quegw01.btyp>d  L Contact:   Tel: 3063  -  IS - Infrastructure, 1st Floor, Bridge Street Plaza    N I recall someone sometime ago mentioning TECO documentation on the internet. IN can't seem to find the message on Deja (perhaps it's more than two days old...; ;^D ) so if someone could post a URL I would appreciate it.r   TIAn   Steve Spires VMS System Manager BT/Yellow Pages:        M Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen) on 18/10/2000 11:19:19 PM     To:        Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com+ cc:         (bcc: Steve Spires/YellowPages)lP From:      Kilgallen@eisner.decus.org.nospam (Larry Kilgallen), 18 October 2000,            11:19 p.m.l   Re: File Comparison - Urgent        H In article <5.0.0.25.0.20001018153319.01c57b30@24.8.96.48>, Dan Sugalski <dan@sidhe.org> writes:m. > At 03:15 PM 10/18/00 -0400, Jim Agnew wrote: >>what's wrong with diff?? > . > That whole "ignore the fourth column" thing. > < > Perl's probably the fastest general-purpose tool for this,  > 97 characters in TECO, with the DCL command spelled out fully, for clarity :-)u   eb1.dat<3fn,$!$;>ecb eb2.dat<3fn,$!$;>ec 7 egdifferences 1.dat 2.dat/ignore=comments/comment="!"$$h   ------------------------------    Date: 19 Oct 2000 10:12:53 -05003 From: rivie@server.newlogan.teraglobal (Roger Ivie)M4 Subject: Re: TECO (was Re: File Comparison - Urgent)= Message-ID: <slrn8uu40d.3tt.rivie@server.newlogan.teraglobal>   O In article <0025697D.00452847.00@quegw01.btyp>, Steve.Spires@yellowpages.co.uk l wrote: >sO >I recall someone sometime ago mentioning TECO documentation on the internet. IaO >can't seem to find the message on Deja (perhaps it's more than two days old...-< >;^D ) so if someone could post a URL I would appreciate it.   Try looking around athI http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/academic/computer-science/history/pdp-11/teco/= -- s
 Roger Ivie% TeraGlobal Communications Corporationp& 1770 North Research Park Way Suite 100 Logan, UT 84341c mailto:rivie@teraglobal.coms phoneto:(435)787-0555  faxto:(435)787-0516     > -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----A http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!n> -----==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 18 Oct 2000 21:29:53 GMTV! From: Ian Parker <parker@gol.com>l+ Subject: Re: This list participants profile & Message-ID: <5Mn3KCArhM75Ewi0@gol.com>  F In article <VA.0000010b.120ed538@sture.ch>, Paul Sture <paul@sture.ch> writes? >In article <39EB1C6D.14968CD3@bbc.co.uk>, Tim Llewellyn wrote:e0 >> From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@bbc.co.uk> >> Newsgroups: comp.os.vms. >> Subject: Re: This list participants profile( >> Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2000 16:19:09 +0100 >> u >> o >>   >> Roy Omond wrote:v >>   >> > Paul Sture wrote: >> > >> > > [... snip snip ...] >> > >L >> > > I have found it interesting to read in this thread of folks my age orN >> > > older who actually studied Computer Science. IIRC there was only one CSH >> > > course available in the UK in my time (at Loughborough - this wasB >> > > 1973), although computing facilities were available at mostE >> > > universities for those studying science / engineering / maths.X >> > >> > Not true at all, Paul ! >> >N >> > I started off in Chemistry (1971) at Newcastle, but quickly got hooked onN >> > the CS path, which was certainly offered at quite a few places (NewcastleN >> > included).  I then transferred to Edinburgh eventually finishing in 1978.G >> > CS was available at least at St.Andrews, Glasgow, Aberdeen, Leeds,lL >> > Manchester, UMIST, and I'm sure quite a few of the London universities. >> > >> aG >> I concur, there was a CS dept at Bristol Uni whan I started in 1980,rG >> admittedly it was tacked on to the matcs dept but they had a Multicsu >> and taught CS degrees.l >> uI >1980 is a different time frame from 1973 :-) The fact that CS was still  L >"tacked on to the maths dept" 7 years later has me wondering if CS degrees  >were available there in 1973. > O >Please note that I'm not trying to be pernickety, rather trying to understand -N >what the true situation was. I _can_ remember an attitude in various sectors K >of industry, persisting into the 1980s, that computers (and CS degrees by m% >implication) were "a waste of time".r >b >___ >Paul Stures >Switzerland >u  C I recall CS degrees being available at a number of Universities andn Polytechnics in 1975.* -- l
 Ian Parker   ------------------------------    Date: 19 Oct 2000 17:42:52 +0200G From: Jan Vorbrueggen <jan@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>$8 Subject: Re: Trade-offs regarding Installed Known ImagesH Message-ID: <y4aec0j0qr.fsf@mailhost.neuroinformatik.ruhr-uni-bochum.de>   The advantages are:n  H - /OPEN: no (realively-costly) file open required by the image activatorM - /HEADER: no disk read required for this image header by the image activatort8 - /SHARE: less hard page reads required on image startup  I The downside of all is additional memory consumption. The amount consumediI by the first two is negligible by modern standards. You can install /OPENoI /HEADER first and then check the INSTALL usage counts to determine, after 0 some period of time, whether /SHARE makes sense.  J As noted, you can set global buffers on RIGHTSLIST, but cannot install it. Maybe XFC will help, as well.o  N As to why they aren't installed by default, the ones in your case are somewhatG obscure (SCAN RTL, PASCAL translated RTL etc) and wouldn't be used on a H "typical" system (whatever that may be). Also, you wouldn't want to put L VMS system managers out of a job, would you? Finally, VMS has to run on someK pretty old, memory poor systems, by modern standards, so the default better 7 make it possible for them to boot into a useable state.l  N A question to VMS engineering: do INSTALLs data structures scale properly whenN hundreds or thousands of images/sections are installed (e.g., use a hash table instead of a linear search)?   	Jan   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 10:33:27 -0200:) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.bre Subject: Re: VAX emulatoreL Message-ID: <OF8DFDE3DA.BE36A875-ON8325697D.0044E58A@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>   Didier  H Dont stimulate them, or in a few year we will run OpenVMS under Solaris,! HP-UX, Tru64, OS/390 ! ! ! !  :-)    Fabio C.                  A Didier Morandi <Didier.Morandi@Easynet.fr> em 18/10/2000 16:34:27dL                                                                             L                                                                             L                                                                                 >                                                               >                                                               >                                                               >  Para:    Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com                               >                                                               >  cc:      (bcc: Fabio dos Santos Cardoso/E-P-BC/Contratada)   >                                                               >                                                               >                                                               >  Assunto: Re: VAX emulator                                    >                                                                              Sue Skonetski wrote: >f > Just in case you missed this.  >mC > VAX Emulator Family Announced by Software Resources Internationalt  ! CHARON PC ? When a CHARON MacOS ?n   D.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2000 13:46:09 -0400 5 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com>n  Subject: Re: VAX to Alpha (DS10), Message-ID: <8si3eg$eduh$1@lead.zk3.dec.com>  < The VX1 is in the last stages of platform qualification, andK documentation/release note writeups.  It should hit the streets in early to J mid-November.  The card will actually be 32mb.  You may also be interestedL to know that the 16bpp mode is as fast in xmarks as 8bpp mode, giving a good@ compromise between number of colors, size of pixmaps/images, andH performance.  It is visibly faster than the ELSA card at all depths.  WeK plan to follow up the release in November with a release that uses full DMAa; functionality, which should also help with CPU utilization.   K I believe you will be much happier with it than with the ELSA.  On the ELSA L front, the next "GRAPHICS" patch kit will contain the rewritten ELSA server, which may help a bit..    " Terry Kennedy wrote in message ...0 >Patrick MOREAU, CENA Athis, Tel: 01.69.57.64.40& <pmoreau@cenaath.cena.dgac.fr> writes:I >> You're an happy man, Terry !! I'm waiting for the delivery of my first- homeJ >> DS10 and I can't wait .... My son will inherit my 255, nice for playing with >> Dec's flight  ... > F >  They're really cute boxes. Too bad they're priced where they are... > B >> Have you some info regarding the replacement of the Elsa card ? > : >  Just what Fred's posted here in the past - for example:7 >http://www.deja.com/getdoc.xp?AN=650597829 which says:p >eC >  "The 3DLabs Oxygen VX1 (16mb) will replace that card in October.- >It is Permedia-3 based."1 >05 >        Terry Kennedy             http://www.tmk.como6 >        terry@tmk.com             Jersey City, NJ USA   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 10:11:50 -0700.  From: Shane.F.Smith@Notes.FH.Com  Subject: Re: VAX to Alpha (DS10)D Message-ID: <OF51A9A9E3.ADF59F15-ON8825697D.005E6775@foundation.com>  D Would you care to share with us which graphics chipset the VX1 uses?   Shane           G Fred Kleinsorge <kleinsorge@star.zko.dec.com> on 10/17/2000 10:46:09 AM    To:   Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Coml cc:t  ! Subject:  Re: VAX to Alpha (DS10)e    < The VX1 is in the last stages of platform qualification, andK documentation/release note writeups.  It should hit the streets in early to,J mid-November.  The card will actually be 32mb.  You may also be interestedG to know that the 16bpp mode is as fast in xmarks as 8bpp mode, giving ah good@ compromise between number of colors, size of pixmaps/images, andH performance.  It is visibly faster than the ELSA card at all depths.  WeK plan to follow up the release in November with a release that uses full DMAe; functionality, which should also help with CPU utilization.   K I believe you will be much happier with it than with the ELSA.  On the ELSA D front, the next "GRAPHICS" patch kit will contain the rewritten ELSA server,e which may help a bit.t    " Terry Kennedy wrote in message ...0 >Patrick MOREAU, CENA Athis, Tel: 01.69.57.64.40& <pmoreau@cenaath.cena.dgac.fr> writes:I >> You're an happy man, Terry !! I'm waiting for the delivery of my firstp homeJ >> DS10 and I can't wait .... My son will inherit my 255, nice for playing with >> Dec's flight  ... >mF >  They're really cute boxes. Too bad they're priced where they are... > B >> Have you some info regarding the replacement of the Elsa card ? >A: >  Just what Fred's posted here in the past - for example:7 >http://www.deja.com/getdoc.xp?AN=650597829 which says:c >rC >  "The 3DLabs Oxygen VX1 (16mb) will replace that card in October.m >It is Permedia-3 based."n >y5 >        Terry Kennedy             http://www.tmk.coms6 >        terry@tmk.com             Jersey City, NJ USA   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 13:56:09 -0400e) From: "Ebinger . Eric" <EEbinger@drc.com>f  Subject: RE: VAX to Alpha (DS10)B Message-ID: <7162F87E9EF4D311BA9900805FC1D3AE7A621D@and02.drc.com>  E According to 3DLabs web site (http://www.3dlabs.com) the Oxygen VX1 =J uses=20aF the "3Dlabs=AE GLINT=AE R3" graphics processor.  Aren't you glad you =	 asked?=20    Eric Ebinger   > -----Original Message-----F > From: Shane.F.Smith@Notes.FH.Com [mailto:Shane.F.Smith@Notes.FH.Com]* > Sent: Thursday, October 19, 2000 1:12 PM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comu" > Subject: Re: VAX to Alpha (DS10) >=20 >=20 >=20F > Would you care to share with us which graphics chipset the VX1 uses? >=20 > Shaneb >=20   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 12:43:22 +0100n0 From: Robert Taylor <taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com> Subject: VMS C Compilero, Message-ID: <39EEDE5A.2565285A@jpmorgan.com>  E I have decided just to do my own file comparison utility in C on VMS.s  + I'm having problems with the atoi routine :f  $ DAXPS2::RTaylor 1-> cc csv_compare.c  #         ignore_col = atoi(argv[3]);h .....................^? %CC-I-IMPLICITFUNC, In this statement, the identifier "atoi" is " implicitly declared as a function. at line number 25 in filep4 MOSSUSERS_DEV01:[USERS.TAYLOR.BIN.C]CSV_COMPARE.C;18   Heres the code :   #include <stdio.h> #include <string.h>> #include <ctype.h>  2 /* Compare 2 CSV files, ignoring specified columns */  " main(   int argc,   char *argv[] ) {h     char file1_rec  [1024];      char file2_rec  [1024];-     FILE *Fp1 = 0;     FILE *Fp2 = 0;       int current_col = 0;     int idx = 0;     long ignore_col;       if ( argc != 3 )     { 7         printf("Usage : CSV_COMPARE FILENAME1 FILENAME2  COLUMN_TO_IGNORE");n     }      else     {x#         ignore_col = atoi(argv[3]);g  C         printf(" File1 : %s File2 %s Ignore Column %s \n", argv[1],p argv[2], argv[3] );o  #         /* Open file1 and file 2 */ !         Fp1 = fopen(argv[1],"r");e!         Fp2 = fopen(argv[2],"r");t           do{T                 /*E                 Test if EOF FILE1 has been reached, further if it hasw test that FILE2 hasc)                 been completely read alsou                 */<                 if (!fgets(file1_rec,sizeof(file1_rec),Fp1))                 {aC                         printf("End of file1 detected - quitting");eD                         if (!fgets(file2_rec,sizeof(file2_rec),Fp2))                 {gC                         printf("End of file1 detected - quitting");uG                         printf("This means FILE1 wasn't completely reado
 - ERROR");                         break;                 }C  B                 /* So we have a record from each file, now compare
 content */               } while (1);    %         /* Close file 1 and file 1 */o         fclose(Fp1);         fclose(Fp2);     }   
     return 0;i      = I'm just checking it out , compiling it as I go along with ccPE CSV_COMPARE.C. I'm no C expert ( as you can tell by the fact I've put-A all the code in main to keep it simple ) , but I'd like to get itWH working. The result of the cc is a .OBJ file - How do I change that to a .EXE ?   Thanks in advance.   ------------------------------    Date: 19 Oct 2000 09:17:26 -0500, From: koehler@eisner.decus.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: VMS C Compilerm+ Message-ID: <zo+4ifrTdh1w@eisner.decus.org>e  _ In article <39EEDE5A.2565285A@jpmorgan.com>, Robert Taylor <taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com> writes:1G > I have decided just to do my own file comparison utility in C on VMS.s > - > I'm having problems with the atoi routine :  > & > DAXPS2::RTaylor 1-> cc csv_compare.c > % >         ignore_col = atoi(argv[3]);c > .....................^A > %CC-I-IMPLICITFUNC, In this statement, the identifier "atoi" iso   [...]o   > #include <stdio.h> > #include <string.h>t > #include <ctype.h>  C    As the docs say, the atoi() protoype is in stdlib.h.  You didn't E    include stdlib.h, so the signature is picked up implicitly.  Also aD    note the -I- in the message; this is not an error, it's just for     your information.  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------? Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporationy= Hubble Space Telescope Payload  | Federal Sector, Civil GroupoE  Flight Software Team           | please remove ".aspm" when replyings   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 13:51:38 +0100d0 From: Robert Taylor <taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com> Subject: Re: VMS C Compilera, Message-ID: <39EEEE5A.AB9C33A6@jpmorgan.com>   Works now. Many thanks.o   Bob Koehler wrote:  a > In article <39EEDE5A.2565285A@jpmorgan.com>, Robert Taylor <taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com> writes:-I > > I have decided just to do my own file comparison utility in C on VMS.s > >k/ > > I'm having problems with the atoi routine :) > >s( > > DAXPS2::RTaylor 1-> cc csv_compare.c > > ' > >         ignore_col = atoi(argv[3]);u > > .....................^C > > %CC-I-IMPLICITFUNC, In this statement, the identifier "atoi" iso >n > [...]r >. > > #include <stdio.h> > > #include <string.h>p > > #include <ctype.h> >lE >    As the docs say, the atoi() protoype is in stdlib.h.  You didn'tIF >    include stdlib.h, so the signature is picked up implicitly.  AlsoE >    note the -I- in the message; this is not an error, it's just for  >    your information. >.H > ----------------------------------------------------------------------A > Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporation ? > Hubble Space Telescope Payload  | Federal Sector, Civil GrouptG >  Flight Software Team           | please remove ".aspm" when replyings   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 13:51:11 +0100s0 From: Robert Taylor <taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com> Subject: Re: VMS C Compilere, Message-ID: <39EEEE3F.FD17B881@jpmorgan.com>   Works , many thanks.   Bob Koehler wrote:  a > In article <39EEDE5A.2565285A@jpmorgan.com>, Robert Taylor <taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com> writes:fI > > I have decided just to do my own file comparison utility in C on VMS.- > >-/ > > I'm having problems with the atoi routine :i > >v( > > DAXPS2::RTaylor 1-> cc csv_compare.c > >R' > >         ignore_col = atoi(argv[3]);) > > .....................^C > > %CC-I-IMPLICITFUNC, In this statement, the identifier "atoi" is. >q > [...]y >  > > #include <stdio.h> > > #include <string.h>r > > #include <ctype.h> >mE >    As the docs say, the atoi() protoype is in stdlib.h.  You didn'thF >    include stdlib.h, so the signature is picked up implicitly.  AlsoE >    note the -I- in the message; this is not an error, it's just fora >    your information. >pH > ----------------------------------------------------------------------A > Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporationi? > Hubble Space Telescope Payload  | Federal Sector, Civil Group4G >  Flight Software Team           | please remove ".aspm" when replyingU   ------------------------------   Date: 19 Oct 2000 15:23:08 GMT2 From: mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edu (David Mathog) Subject: Re: VMS C Compilere, Message-ID: <8sn3ks$b6t@gap.cco.caltech.edu>  _ In article <39EEDE5A.2565285A@jpmorgan.com>, Robert Taylor <taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com> writes:pF >I have decided just to do my own file comparison utility in C on VMS. ><, >I'm having problems with the atoi routine : >s% >DAXPS2::RTaylor 1-> cc csv_compare.c. >6$ >        ignore_col = atoi(argv[3]); >......................^@ >%CC-I-IMPLICITFUNC, In this statement, the identifier "atoi" is# >implicitly declared as a function.> >at line number 25 in file5 >MOSSUSERS_DEV01:[USERS.TAYLOR.BIN.C]CSV_COMPARE.C;18  >>   $ help cc run atoi   <SNIP>=             #include <stdlib.h>           <------------------i  '             int atoi(const char *nptr);r   >Heres the code :t >lK >#include <stdio.h>                    <----- missing   #include <stdlib.h>l >#include <string.h> >#include <ctype.h>h >w   Regards,   David Mathog mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.edub? Manager, sequence analysis facility, biology division, Caltech n   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 17:42:57 +0200o= From: Arne =?iso-8859-1?Q?Vajh=F8j?= <arne.vajhoej@gtech.com>  Subject: Re: VMS C Compilere) Message-ID: <39EF1681.21749A9E@gtech.com>a   Robert Taylor wrote:G > I have decided just to do my own file comparison utility in C on VMS.  > - > I'm having problems with the atoi routine :, > & > DAXPS2::RTaylor 1-> cc csv_compare.c > % >         ignore_col = atoi(argv[3]);  > .....................^A > %CC-I-IMPLICITFUNC, In this statement, the identifier "atoi" ist$ > implicitly declared as a function. > at line number 25 in file>6 > MOSSUSERS_DEV01:[USERS.TAYLOR.BIN.C]CSV_COMPARE.C;18 >  > Heres the code : >  > #include <stdio.h> > #include <string.h>t > #include <ctype.h>  9 As HELP CC RUN ATOI tell you, then atoi are in stdlib.h !7   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 13:24:00 -0400a- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@videotron.ca>e Subject: Re: VMS C Compilere, Message-ID: <39EF2E2F.5D129446@videotron.ca>   Robert Taylor wrote:E > > > %CC-I-IMPLICITFUNC, In this statement, the identifier "atoi" is      $help cc run atoiu  I Yields a basic description of the run time function, and most importantlyy9 which module needs to be included to please the compiler.-  I Remember that the compiler is the master and you're the slave. And if youiK don't behave, the compiler may decide to inflict a very obscure bug on your F program, one which may surface years later and take you weeks to find.    Treat the compiler with respect.   :-)a   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2000 10:55:52 -0400v- From: John Reagan <reagan@hiyall.zko.dec.com> # Subject: Re: VMS Pascal 5.7 vs. gpc 2 Message-ID: <39E6EA38.34EF170B@hiyall.zko.dec.com>   David Mathog wrote:  > E > Some Pascal code I've just encountered was built using gpc on otheroI > platforms but VMS Pascal (5.7, on Alpha) is distinctly unhappy with it.nG > I've tried a bunch of different /standard= settings, but none make itf > happy. > G > The problem is that this code uses lines like this (in a single file)T >  > MODULE seq interface;b > MODULE seq implementation; > H > but VMS Pascal just doesn't know what to do with that - it expects the" > MODULE line to stop after "seq". > L > I know essentially nothing about Pascal - what needs to be done to convert@ > this section of code into something VMS Pascal will recognize?  E As Larry has mentioned, Compaq Pascal doesn't support all of ExtendedmD Pascal (ISO 10206).  We added most of the major features of ExtendedC Pascal that did not have existing Compaq Pascal extensions to coverd= them.  The separate compilation feature of Extended Pascal isuA essentially covered by the inherit and environment attributes (ast( mentioned by Chris) so we didn't bother.  E Does the file have both the interface part and implementation part in @ the same file?  Does is use any Extended Pascal EXPORT or IMPORT? clauses?  (those are the ones that map almost directly onto ourrH ENVIRONMENT and INHERIT attributes).  If its just in a single file, thenG you should just be able to merge the interface and implementation parts E together.  Its mostly syntatic sugar when used in the same file.  The0: constants/type/variables in the interface part just becomeF program/module-level declarations.  Any procedure/function definitionsD in the interface part are just FORWARD declarations for their bodies. which should appear in the implemenation part.  E If you have explicit questions or want to send me code, I'll give you ; detailed editting instructions to merge the parts together.   D Question to all Pascal users, should Compaq Pascal add more ExtendedH Pascal features (like this one) to make it more compatible with gpc?  DoG people see this as something that will increase?  For the Pascal sourcerG to have implementation and interface parts, means that it was developed G on gpc (or Prospero's Pascal which also supports the feature).  My view ? has been that not many new applications are written in Pascal.  F Extending existing ones on a particular platform, yes, but total brandE new applications, I would have expected them to be in C++/Java, etc.,  not Pascal.t   -- t John Reagant Compaq Pascal Project Leader   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 13:54:13 -0200H) From: fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br- Subject: VMSINSTALL QuestionL Message-ID: <OF6AF87170.620CCB9B-ON8325697D.00572692@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>  K Is there a document / internet link describing how to develop a "script" or1
 similar toD install an application under OVMS using VMSINSTAL?. We have a lot of in-houseD developed applications and some of them the  installation process is complex.   Regards,   FC   ------------------------------   Date: 19 Oct 2000 15:58:01 GMT3 From: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann)o  Subject: Re: VMSINSTALL Question0 Message-ID: <8sn5m9$7b0$1@n.ruf.uni-freiburg.de>  x In article <OF6AF87170.620CCB9B-ON8325697D.00572692@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br>, fabio_compaq@ep-bc.petrobras.com.br writes:L >Is there a document / internet link describing how to develop a "script" or >similar to E >install an application under OVMS using VMSINSTAL?. We have a lot oft	 >in-houseAE >developed applications and some of them the  installation process isp	 >complex.   5 There is an "OpenVMS Developer's Guide to VMSINSTAL".N   Regards,    Christoph Gartmanne  H -----------------------------------------------------------------------+H | Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452 |H | Immunbiologie                                                        |H | Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio.mpg.de     |H | D-79011  Freiburg, FRG                                               |H +--------- http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/english/menue.html ---------+   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 18:05:29 +040014 From: Valentin Likoum <valentin.likoum@ncc.volga.ru>B Subject: What connector to use to interconnect X.25 and DECNet V ?4 Message-ID: <8435797639.20001019180529@ncc.volga.ru>  	    Hello,-  5 We are looking for a way to change our current setup::     )                                     Alphau4    DECNIS|       GAP      +------------------------+4    or    |----------------|X.25 client + DECNet IV |4    DEMSA |                +------------------------+   to something like:(                                    Alpha7  connector|      LLC2     +---------------------------+X7    CISCO? |---------------|X.25 for VMS/AXP + DECNet V|e7           |               +---------------------------+t  < The last setup is pretty new for us. Could you recommend anyA connector node and share your expirience with this configuration?m
 Thank you.   --  
 Best regards,kF  Valentin                          mailto:valentin.likoum@ncc.volga.ru   ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 07:51:02 +0000 (UTC).' From: Osmo Kujala <kujala@tukki.jyu.fi> L Subject: Re: What would be your ultimate dream VMS machine (desktop/tower) ?, Message-ID: <8sm956$nen$1@mordred.cc.jyu.fi>  1 Richard B. Gilbert <DRAGON@compuserve.com> wrote:iM >         If Compaq did that, we would have the same situatation that obtainsGF > in the PC world, zillions of different hardware configurations!  VMSF > wouldn't support most, or perhaps any, of these configurations.  VMSK > wouldn't work at all on some and might be flaky on configurations that itu > worked on.  - NO! Alphas already use commodity PC parts andiH Alphas can be crippled with whatever crappy PC devices. Why would anyoneF use untested unsupported devices when Compaq says which are supported?F Of course because Compaq wants to keep secret what is the exact deviceI model from PC market that it has renamed to something else and put tripled price tag on it.    K >         You can get almost anything at a lower price than Compaq charges," > but will it work?    Yes, if you choose right.   : >  Something like thirteen years of reading this newsgroup? > tells me that third party hardware is a crapshoot at best.      F Hey! There are no DEC made devices any more and my 15 years experienceG with Digital vs. third party hardware says that there is no statisticalf$ difference in quality between them.   	 > Even if6K > something appears to work, you may find that there is that tragic, fatal, / > flaw that turns up when you least need it to.s  I >         VMS can identify the I/O devices that it supports.  Suppose you=K > install some brand X card that *almost* emulates the Compaq product?  VMS.J > believes it's a supported device, loads the driver, and ZAP!  If you areK > lucky the failure will be immediate and unmistakable.  If not, you may belH > ZAPped for months before you discover that months of work has produced > useless crap!V  J Not possible. There are parity and ECC checks etc. and VMS is high quality, and doesn't produce crap ever.           ;-)  H Remember that there are malfuntions in supported devices too. Seems that% you suggest VMS is not very reliable.d  3 >         Like it or not, you get what you pay for!n  F Yes, but at the low end Alphas the extra price is too high. IMHO it isD the main reason why VMS disappeared from universities and such. Non-E opennes was another, but as we see now even universities are going toa
 Windows...  E I agree that there must be high quality and strict hardware policy atEE high end and critical installations and there it is reasonabe to pay eC the extra price. BUT if there is no low cost VMS Alpha level we areCF killing the culture medium of VMS. There may remain a VMS niche for 10C years maybe more, but I don't regard that as interesting future. We-I would have wasted one of highlights of VMS, its suitability to every sizen$ and form of computer installations.   C Compaq can do low cost VMS Alphas very easily if they want, but on EH contrary Compaq and Digital have actively done tricks to prevent running VMS in cheap Alpha's.  :-(   regardsn            Osmo Kujala  @ > Message text written by INTERNET:mathog@seqaxp.bio.caltech.eduH >> It would be nice if the Q got completely out of the business of finalJ >> assembly of low end Alphas - and did so by providing an ATX form factorG >> Alpha motherboard and the processors for it for sale to OEMs.  (And  I >> that motherboard would support faster CPUs and field upgrades.  What a J >> novel concept!)  That way the smaller resellers/vendors, or even an endM >> user, could slap these into standard ATX cases and add third party memory, J >> an intraserver scsi controller, and disks - and the final product wouldL >> cost less than the Q boxes do because it wouldn't have their 3X markup onN >> all of these items. Anyway, then you could finally get a DS10 class machineK >> in as big a case as you wanted, instead of the BS that the Q pulls where J >> they force you to either buy a storageworks shelf or a DS20 if you want >> more than 3 drives. C   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 07:50:07 +0200 2 From: martin@radiogaga.harz.de (Martin Vorlaender) Subject: Re: X Desktop; Message-ID: <39ee8b8f.524144494f47414741@radiogaga.harz.de>e  1 Robert Taylor (taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com) wrote:pH : I have Exceed X-Server running on my PC. I have invoked the X debuggerE : before and have also managed to create a decterm ( X ) on my PC. Is 8 : there a way of getting an X Desktop started on my PC ?   The "old" session manager:  !   $ @sys$manager:decw$startsm.com:  + The "new" CDE (caution: full-screen only!):n  .   $ run cde$system_defaults:[bin]dtsession.exe  ? : Also what other X applications do people find useful on VMS ?   E AMDS, Netscape, XV, GhostScript (? never used it), Flight, XPilot ;-)  (just brainstorming)   cu,t   Martin --J One OS to rule them all       | Martin Vorlaender  |  VMS & WNT programmer7 One OS to find them           | work: mv@pdv-systeme.deCN One OS to bring them all      |       http://www.pdv-systeme.de/users/martinv/> And in the Darkness bind them.| home: martin@radiogaga.harz.de   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 09:35:26 +0100d0 From: Robert Taylor <taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com> Subject: Re: X Desktop, Message-ID: <39EEB24E.9090B89D@jpmorgan.com>  Q I ran the 'new' desktop but nothing happened. It just sat there , busy , I had to-
 ctrl+c it.    - > The "new" CDE (caution: full-screen only!):i >e0 >   $ run cde$system_defaults:[bin]dtsession.exe >e   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 09:35:44 +0100.0 From: Robert Taylor <taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com> Subject: Re: X Desktop, Message-ID: <39EEB260.37F42761@jpmorgan.com>  Q I ran the 'new' desktop but nothing happened. It just sat there , busy , I had to3
 ctrl+c it.    - > The "new" CDE (caution: full-screen only!):t > 0 >   $ run cde$system_defaults:[bin]dtsession.exe >r   ------------------------------    Date: 19 Oct 2000 08:58:34 -0500, From: koehler@eisner.decus.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: X Desktop+ Message-ID: <62vNOyx3nvJl@eisner.decus.org>   _ In article <39EDBC52.E8D711A0@jpmorgan.com>, Robert Taylor <taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com> writes:. [...]. >Also what other X- > applications do people find useful on VMS ?  >   E    vue$master (aka FileView, I have heavily modified and extended thep#    built in file actions and menus)       windows version of TPUo  B    Netscape, BNU (and therefor BookReader), mail (yes, it could be    better), calendar  6    IMHO keep away from CDE, use the old DECwindows MWM  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------? Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporationh= Hubble Space Telescope Payload  | Federal Sector, Civil GroupbE  Flight Software Team           | please remove ".aspm" when replyingo   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 19 Oct 2000 13:48:40 +0100-0 From: Robert Taylor <taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com> Subject: Re: X Desktop+ Message-ID: <39EEEDA8.218B5B9@jpmorgan.com>:  N I can't get either of the options to work ( as specified in an earlier post ).  * I'm running Exceed on a Windows NT client.^ When I log into VMS ( Reflection Telnet ) , I use set display/create/node with my IP and TCPIP setting.   Bob Koehler wrote:  a > In article <39EDBC52.E8D711A0@jpmorgan.com>, Robert Taylor <taylor_robert@jpmorgan.com> writes:  > [...]T > >Also what other X/ > > applications do people find useful on VMS ?) > >  >.G >    vue$master (aka FileView, I have heavily modified and extended thet% >    built in file actions and menus)  >c >    windows version of TPU< >iD >    Netscape, BNU (and therefor BookReader), mail (yes, it could be >    better), calendar >u8 >    IMHO keep away from CDE, use the old DECwindows MWM >pH > ----------------------------------------------------------------------A > Bob Koehler                     | Computer Sciences Corporation-? > Hubble Space Telescope Payload  | Federal Sector, Civil Group G >  Flight Software Team           | please remove ".aspm" when replyings   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2000.585 ************************