1 INFO-VAX	Sat, 17 May 2003	Volume 2003 : Issue 271       Contents:G Re: (Very) Affordable VMS on older gear (was: "VMS will be around ...") G Re: (Very) Affordable VMS on older gear (was: "VMS will be around ...") & Backspace on DECterm vs TPU (Xwindows)- Re: C++ V6.5 linker performance optimization? - Re: C++ V6.5 linker performance optimization? ' Re: creating licenses for my own demos? ' Re: creating licenses for my own demos? ' Re: creating licenses for my own demos? ' Re: creating licenses for my own demos? ' Re: creating licenses for my own demos? ' Re: creating licenses for my own demos? ' Re: creating licenses for my own demos? ( Re: Damned power spike. Need new monitor( Re: Damned power spike. Need new monitor( Re: Damned power spike. Need new monitor) Re: DEC TCP/IP Services 5.3 for Hobbyist? ) Re: DEC TCP/IP Services 5.3 for Hobbyist? P Re: Does Kermit have a data size limit? [was RE: getting data off an OpenVMS AlpP Re: Does Kermit have a data size limit? [was RE: getting data off an OpenVMS AlpP Re: Does Kermit have a data size limit? [was RE: getting data off an OpenVMS Alp Error message help needed  Re: Error message help needed  Re: Error message help needed  Re: Error message help needed  RE: Error message help needed  Re: Error message help needed  Re: Error message help needed  Re: Error message help needed ' Re: From Systems and Options Catalogue: : Re: getting data off an OpenVMS Alpha to Microsoft Windows: Re: getting data off an OpenVMS Alpha to Microsoft Windows: RE: getting data off an OpenVMS Alpha to Microsoft Windows: RE: getting data off an OpenVMS Alpha to Microsoft Windows* Re: How to determine boot device from DCL?, Re: howto get a parameter (p1) to an ftp job, Re: howto get a parameter (p1) to an ftp job Re: Java "Unknown host" problem * Re: Logicals Lost When Process Is Detached* Re: Logicals Lost When Process Is Detached0 New Auction for OpenVMS Alpha and VAX OS and SPL4 Re: New Auction for OpenVMS Alpha and VAX OS and SPL4 Re: New Auction for OpenVMS Alpha and VAX OS and SPL Re: next VMS versions % Re: Running VWS software on X-windows 3 Re: Sparky is losing the race Andrew ... and badly! + Re: TCPIP Services Telnet problem [I think] + Re: TCPware NETCP.LOG file - can I move it?  Re: VMS 7.1H1 and 7.1-2 ! Re: VMS Admins with too much time   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 14:09:07 -0400 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>P Subject: Re: (Very) Affordable VMS on older gear (was: "VMS will be around ...")) Message-ID: <3EC52942.516CF6E0@istop.com>    John Smith wrote: F > If I were a big VMS shop, I'd call my local university and arrange a ... E > and tell the dean that I'd hire either on a co-op or part-time/full E > time basis any students they could ship my way who had hands-on VMS 
 > experience.     I Unless your higher ups have declared VMS to be dying and want you to hire M young guns who know today,s technologies: eg: policy to build anything enw on E new systems, and just maintain the old VMS systems until all apps are ' gradually ported over to new platforms.   F In that case, you don't need a university to spew out VMS-saavy folks.   ------------------------------    Date: 16 May 2003 18:31:47 -0000= From: Doc.Cypher <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]> P Subject: Re: (Very) Affordable VMS on older gear (was: "VMS will be around ...")6 Message-ID: <20030516183147.19779.qmail@nym.alias.net>  @ On Fri, 16 May 2003, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com> wrote: >John Smith wrote:G >> If I were a big VMS shop, I'd call my local university and arrange a  >...F >> and tell the dean that I'd hire either on a co-op or part-time/fullF >> time basis any students they could ship my way who had hands-on VMS >> experience. >  > J >Unless your higher ups have declared VMS to be dying and want you to hireN >young guns who know today,s technologies: eg: policy to build anything enw onF >new systems, and just maintain the old VMS systems until all apps are( >gradually ported over to new platforms. > G >In that case, you don't need a university to spew out VMS-saavy folks.   B As far as I can tell, one of the big problems is that people leaveI university with no VMS exposure, or a negative opinion of the OS.  I like H John's suggestion for handling that, and I wish a few people in HP would# encourage just this sort of thing.       Doc. --  K OpenVMS:  Eight out of ten hackers                    http://vmsbox.cjb.net K           prefer *other* operating systems.        http://althacker.cjb.net    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 22:59:41 -0400 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>/ Subject: Backspace on DECterm vs TPU (Xwindows) ) Message-ID: <3EC5A577.E2BD8F69@istop.com>   M On a Xserver (the MI-X on mac), I can run the DECTerm fine with the backspace   key acting as the VMS backspace.  I However, if I start a TPU window on the same Xserver, the use of the same / backspace key generates the <CTRL-H> behaviour.    Any idea why ?   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 21:19:06 -0000 , From: seibel_r@rich.ociweb.com (Rich Seibel)6 Subject: Re: C++ V6.5 linker performance optimization?5 Message-ID: <slrnbcale5.5j8.seibel_r@rich.ociweb.com>   P On Thu, 15 May 2003 18:59:56 -0300, Rodman S. Regier <rsr@hfx.andara.com> wrote:C >On Thu, 15 May 2003 14:00:07 -0000, seibel_r@rich.ociweb.com (Rich  >Seibel) wrote:  > R >>On Tue, 13 May 2003 20:58:29 -0300, Rodman S. Regier <rsr@hfx.andara.com> wrote: >>>  >>> G >>>We are currently using HP (Compaq) C++ V6.5-004, to compile and link = >>>our C++ programs on a DS10/466 w/ 1.1Gby main mem, running = >>>OpenVMS/Alpha V7.1-2 w/patches.  We are finding that these D >>>compile+link runs are taking from 10-30 minutes elapsed time in aE >>>batch queue to complete with 90-95% of the time being spent on the  >>>link phase. >>> I >>I have experienced similar performance.  I have a fairly large library  J >>and an even larger repository.  I found that the majority of the problemG >>was with the repo.  If I sucked the repo into the library then it cut  >>link times in half or better.  >  >Repo?H Shorthand for repository.  The mechanism that is used to hold the object build from templates.    Rich   --  D --------------------------------------------------------------------D Rich Seibel, Software Engineer                 (314)579-0066 ext 211D Object Computing, Inc.                           seibel_r@ociweb.comD Need ACE training?                      See http://www.theaceorb.comD --------------------------------------------------------------------   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 23:57:42 +0200 6 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= <arne@vajhoej.dk>6 Subject: Re: C++ V6.5 linker performance optimization?' Message-ID: <3EC55ED6.80605@vajhoej.dk>    Rodman S. Regier wrote: F > We are currently using HP (Compaq) C++ V6.5-004, to compile and link< > our C++ programs on a DS10/466 w/ 1.1Gby main mem, running< > OpenVMS/Alpha V7.1-2 w/patches.  We are finding that theseC > compile+link runs are taking from 10-30 minutes elapsed time in a D > batch queue to complete with 90-95% of the time being spent on the
 > link phase.  > B > We are looking for ways to optimize the C++ linker to reduce theD > amount of time our compile and link sequences take.  We are fairlyC > certain that the problem is with disk accesses and not CPU cycles B > (from information gleaned from SHOW PROCESS/ACCOUNTING).  We areA > upgrading our system soon to faster disks so we are looking for D > software solutions to help with the problem as opposed to hardware > related solutions.  " Have you checked the very basics ?  : Defragmentation of disks (I have seen a link go from 30 toA 5 minutes as a result of that - OK it is 15 years since but ...).   9 Memory quotas high enough to avoid too much page faulting 8 (the linker can require a lot of memory during linking).   Arne   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 19:46:15 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> 0 Subject: Re: creating licenses for my own demos?' Message-ID: <3EC58657.E4F1F848@fsi.net>    Larry Kilgallen wrote: > ] > In article <Zc7xa.936$_N3.935@news.cpqcorp.net>, Mark Schafer <mark.schafer@hp.com> writes: D > > Yes, registration may not be possible with Mozilla.  The programK > > supports Netscape 4.0 (or later) and IE 4.0 (or later).  Javascript and E > > stylesheets must be enabled and your browser must accept cookies.  > H > There must be something else you could do to discourage participation, > but I can't think of it.   Mark,   @ Please arrange to meet with Larry Kilgallen and your managers. IG strongly believe he has something very important to say about security.    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 19:48:23 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> 0 Subject: Re: creating licenses for my own demos?' Message-ID: <3EC586D7.3CA82840@fsi.net>   ! VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:  > e > In article <r$i$161ARDHq@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes: ^ > >In article <Zc7xa.936$_N3.935@news.cpqcorp.net>, Mark Schafer <mark.schafer@hp.com> writes:E > >> Yes, registration may not be possible with Mozilla.  The program L > >> supports Netscape 4.0 (or later) and IE 4.0 (or later).  Javascript andF > >> stylesheets must be enabled and your browser must accept cookies. > > I > >There must be something else you could do to discourage participation,  > >but I can't think of it.  > I > Riddle the pages with proprietary Micro$oft front page extensions comes  > to mind... > J > Giving up VMS and software altogether, and opening a brew-pub is looking  B Many here have tried to espouse the idea of "life after VMS" to usA die-hards. I still like the idea of Linux-centric computer store, 	 myself...    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 19:49:20 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> 0 Subject: Re: creating licenses for my own demos?' Message-ID: <3EC58710.D731149E@fsi.net>   ! VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:  > a > In article <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIIEFBHDAA.tom@kednos.com>, "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> writes:  > >FWIW, works with Opera 6.05 > / > Where can I get Opera 6.05 for OpenVMS Alpha?   F I seem to recall you posting a similar response last time he did that.' Don't recall ever seeing a follow-up...    --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 19:54:43 -0400 ( From: David Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com>0 Subject: Re: creating licenses for my own demos?, Message-ID: <3EC57A43.3000309@tsoft-inc.com>   Larry Kilgallen wrote:  ] > In article <Zc7xa.936$_N3.935@news.cpqcorp.net>, Mark Schafer <mark.schafer@hp.com> writes:  > C >>Yes, registration may not be possible with Mozilla.  The program  J >>supports Netscape 4.0 (or later) and IE 4.0 (or later).  Javascript and C >>stylesheets must be enabled and your browser must accept cookies.  >> > H > There must be something else you could do to discourage participation, > but I can't think of it.       Larry, Larry, Larry,  N You're just going to have to get with the program and learn to adopt new ways.  P You get a windoz system, not connected to anything important, for your internet L browsing, and e-mail.  Now this should be a system that contains nothing of J value, and each evening, after finishing with all operations, you fire up K stand-alone backup and do an image restore of the system from a known good  L backup image, and presto, anything that may have happened during the day is P instantly erased (along with anything of value you may have acquired during the  day).   P The first step is to have an image copy of the PeeCee system disk.  However, in L their infinite wisdom, Microsloth has done a good job of hiding the utility M which allows you to do this.  As soon as I find where they have hidden it, I  M will be able to tell you how to optain the restorable image copy of the disk.   M Then you boot standalone backup so you can restore the possibly (assureidly)  Q hacked system disk with the secure copy you have.  (Well, you'll have it as soon  Q as I can find the hidden utility that creates such a copy.)  I haven't found the  N stand-alone backup application either, but I'm sure that when NT is ready for @ the enterprise, someone will be able to find these applications.  Q So, when you are set up with all the above, you'll be ready to surf the internet  L with no security worries, using javascript and ASP and all that other great O stuff that Microsloth has provided, whether you want it or not, confident that  P you can wipe out all problems, (and work), with the surpurb backup capabilities Q that MS has not only provided, but hid well (to avoid hackers) so that they have   not yet been found.      Dave     --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com6 T-Soft, Inc.  170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 19:56:43 -0400 ( From: David Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com>0 Subject: Re: creating licenses for my own demos?, Message-ID: <3EC57ABB.4090300@tsoft-inc.com>   VAXman- wrote:  a > In article <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIIEFBHDAA.tom@kednos.com>, "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> writes:  >  >>FWIW, works with Opera 6.05  >> > / > Where can I get Opera 6.05 for OpenVMS Alpha?     P The same place the stand-alone backup and image backup utilities for windoz are  hidden.        --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com6 T-Soft, Inc.  170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 03:00:05 GMT L From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU ("Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr")0 Subject: Re: creating licenses for my own demos?6 Message-ID: <00A1FF6E.357F89FE@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  V In article <3EC59EC1.2784B9DC@istop.com>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com> writes: >David Froble wrote:L >> value, and each evening, after finishing with all operations, you fire upM >> stand-alone backup and do an image restore of the system from a known good N >> backup image, and presto, anything that may have happened during the day is >> instantly erased  > G >Along with any bookmarks you have added,  cookies registerd, status of , >newsgroup (which posts have been read etc). > L >What is really needed is for browsers to have a list of trusted sites whereM >javascript is allowed, very trusted sites where you also allow java, and all Y >the rest get a basic browser unless you press a button "reload with javascript enabled".  > = >For as much as Mr Kilgallen hates me, I am with him on this.   E I think you have the trustworthiness of Java and Javascript reversed.    -- Alan  --  O =============================================================================== 0  Alan Winston --- WINSTON@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDUM  Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:  650/926-3056 M  Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA   94025 O ===============================================================================    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 22:31:01 -0400 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>0 Subject: Re: creating licenses for my own demos?) Message-ID: <3EC59EC1.2784B9DC@istop.com>    David Froble wrote: K > value, and each evening, after finishing with all operations, you fire up L > stand-alone backup and do an image restore of the system from a known goodM > backup image, and presto, anything that may have happened during the day is  > instantly erased  F Along with any bookmarks you have added,  cookies registerd, status of+ newsgroup (which posts have been read etc).   K What is really needed is for browsers to have a list of trusted sites where L javascript is allowed, very trusted sites where you also allow java, and allX the rest get a basic browser unless you press a button "reload with javascript enabled".  < For as much as Mr Kilgallen hates me, I am with him on this.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 18:07:58 -0400   From: w_tom <w_tom1@hotmail.com>1 Subject: Re: Damned power spike. Need new monitor + Message-ID: <3EC5613E.BDAF19E1@hotmail.com>   <   That plug-in UPS fails to tell the whole truth.  Such half: truths are often called lying.  They claim protection from4 surges that don't typically exist.  They don't claim> protection from surges that typically damage transistors.  Not< to be confused with a properly installed 'building wide' UPS) that should provide effective protection.   ;   A surge protector (provides same circuit found in plug-in : UPSes) is not surge protection.  Surge protection is earth> ground.   A surge protector is only effective when it connects; a surge typically 'less than 10 feet' to single point earth = ground.  Plug-in UPSes and power strip surge protector cannot 6 do that earthing.  Therefore they avoid all mention of> essential earthing so that the naive will assume a 'protector'= is 'protection'.  As noted, the building wide UPS should have 9 been installed with the 'less than 10 foot' connection to 9 central earth ground.  Therefore a building wide UPS will  provide protection.   >   Returning to the OP's problem.  That flashing VCR is not due> to the surge.  It may be due to utility power loss as a result= of the surge.  But if a surge had adversely affected the VCR, > then it found a destructive path to earth ground via the VCR.  VCR would no longer function.   <   Why are some things damaged and others not?  Depended what= made and did not make a good connection to earth.  Surges are 8 electricity.  They seek earth ground.  An adjacent surge< protector does not nor cannot stop, block, or absorb surges.9 Lightning seeks earth ground.  Effective protector simply = shunts (which is why they are called shunt mode protectors).  > It connects a surge to all other wires.  If one of those other> wires is less than 10 feet to central earth ground, then surge> protection earths the surge.  But if adjacent to the microVax,8 then a surge is simply provided more paths to find earth: ground, destructively, via the microVax by the protector. < Yes, a plug-in protector can even contribute to damage of an adjacent, powered off computer.   =   How much for a plug-in surge protector?  $20 $50 or $75 per = protected appliance?  'Whole house' protector for residential = AC electric costs about $1 per protected appliance.  Yes - 10 9 or 50 times more money for an overhyped, ineffective, and : typically undersized plug-in surge protector.  That Curtis< power bar at 1240 joules (assuming all joules are used on AC4 electric) is a classic example of undersized.  To be< equivalent to a minimally sized 'whole house' protector, the> Curtis need be at least 3000 joules.  How much did they charge4 for a so undersized product?  The answer is probably
 embarrassing.   <   How important and effective are 'whole house' protectors? 7 So important that the telco installs them both at their > $multi-million switching computer building AND on your premise: interface.  Your NID connects less than 10 feet to central; earth ground via a 10 AWG wire - for surge protection.  But < the source of most destructive surges is AC electric - wires* highest on the pole and most often struck.  7   We still build new homes as if the transistor did not > exist.  We provide and do not connect to one of the best earth; grounds in the facility (see Ufer grounding).  And we still 5 don't install 'whole house' protectors standard on AC = electric.  Two effective protectors are sold in Home Depot as = Intermatic EG240RC and Siemens QSA2020.  Other more expensive ; and often advocated protectors are manufactured by Square D 4 and Leviton.  A long list of effective 'whole house'5 protectors exist.  However I have never seen a single 9 effective protector sold in Walmart, Kmart, Lowes, Sears, > OfficeMax, Staples, or Target.  The most important sentence of9 this post. "A surge protector is only as effective as its  earth ground."   John Smith wrote: C > Also a good idea to get a small UPS or at the very least a decent H > power bar with high joule spike ratings. I bought a Curtis Power-7 barA > (SP700-7TN) at a clearance store yesterday for $14. It has 1240 F > joule/65,000 amp  rating and also does surge suppression on Ethernet > (10/100) and POTS lines.   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 22:52:43 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> 1 Subject: Re: Damned power spike. Need new monitor J Message-ID: <%Ydxa.191013$w7k.181989@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>  - "w_tom" <w_tom1@hotmail.com> wrote in message % news:3EC5613E.BDAF19E1@hotmail.com... > >   That plug-in UPS fails to tell the whole truth.  Such half< > truths are often called lying.  They claim protection from6 > surges that don't typically exist.  They don't claim@ > protection from surges that typically damage transistors.  Not> > to be confused with a properly installed 'building wide' UPS+ > that should provide effective protection.  > = >   A surge protector (provides same circuit found in plug-in < > UPSes) is not surge protection.  Surge protection is earth@ > ground.   A surge protector is only effective when it connects= > a surge typically 'less than 10 feet' to single point earth ? > ground.  Plug-in UPSes and power strip surge protector cannot 8 > do that earthing.  Therefore they avoid all mention of@ > essential earthing so that the naive will assume a 'protector'? > is 'protection'.  As noted, the building wide UPS should have ; > been installed with the 'less than 10 foot' connection to ; > central earth ground.  Therefore a building wide UPS will  > provide protection.  > @ >   Returning to the OP's problem.  That flashing VCR is not due@ > to the surge.  It may be due to utility power loss as a result? > of the surge.  But if a surge had adversely affected the VCR, ? > then it found a destructive path to earth ground via the VCR.  > VCR would no longer function.  > > >   Why are some things damaged and others not?  Depended what? > made and did not make a good connection to earth.  Surges are : > electricity.  They seek earth ground.  An adjacent surge> > protector does not nor cannot stop, block, or absorb surges.; > Lightning seeks earth ground.  Effective protector simply > > shunts (which is why they are called shunt mode protectors).@ > It connects a surge to all other wires.  If one of those other@ > wires is less than 10 feet to central earth ground, then surge@ > protection earths the surge.  But if adjacent to the microVax,: > then a surge is simply provided more paths to find earth; > ground, destructively, via the microVax by the protector. > > Yes, a plug-in protector can even contribute to damage of an! > adjacent, powered off computer.  > ? >   How much for a plug-in surge protector?  $20 $50 or $75 per ? > protected appliance?  'Whole house' protector for residential ? > AC electric costs about $1 per protected appliance.  Yes - 10 ; > or 50 times more money for an overhyped, ineffective, and < > typically undersized plug-in surge protector.  That Curtis> > power bar at 1240 joules (assuming all joules are used on AC6 > electric) is a classic example of undersized.  To be> > equivalent to a minimally sized 'whole house' protector, the@ > Curtis need be at least 3000 joules.  How much did they charge6 > for a so undersized product?  The answer is probably > embarrassing.  > = >   How important and effective are 'whole house' protectors? 9 > So important that the telco installs them both at their @ > $multi-million switching computer building AND on your premise< > interface.  Your NID connects less than 10 feet to central= > earth ground via a 10 AWG wire - for surge protection.  But > > the source of most destructive surges is AC electric - wires, > highest on the pole and most often struck. > 9 >   We still build new homes as if the transistor did not @ > exist.  We provide and do not connect to one of the best earth= > grounds in the facility (see Ufer grounding).  And we still 7 > don't install 'whole house' protectors standard on AC ? > electric.  Two effective protectors are sold in Home Depot as ? > Intermatic EG240RC and Siemens QSA2020.  Other more expensive = > and often advocated protectors are manufactured by Square D 6 > and Leviton.  A long list of effective 'whole house'7 > protectors exist.  However I have never seen a single ; > effective protector sold in Walmart, Kmart, Lowes, Sears, @ > OfficeMax, Staples, or Target.  The most important sentence of; > this post. "A surge protector is only as effective as its  > earth ground."    A Did I leave out that we have rather large surge protection device D attached to the main, after the meter but before power is fed to theF transfer switch/distribution panel? And that our system is grounded toD rather lengthy (100+ feet) interconnected large diameter copper rodsF buried in the ground below the frost line? The generator also has someA circuitry built-in to do surge protection. We use the point surge F protection to save us from any variability/transients in the generatorA output. And the local UPS'es handle over/under voltages and short A interruptions quite well. We've never been down except when we've  wanted to be down.             >  > John Smith wrote: E > > Also a good idea to get a small UPS or at the very least a decent F > > power bar with high joule spike ratings. I bought a Curtis Power-7 bar C > > (SP700-7TN) at a clearance store yesterday for $14. It has 1240 ? > > joule/65,000 amp  rating and also does surge suppression on  Ethernet > > (10/100) and POTS lines.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 22:25:09 -0400 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>1 Subject: Re: Damned power spike. Need new monitor ( Message-ID: <3EC59D61.3F4852F@istop.com>   w_tom wrote:< > UPSes) is not surge protection.  Surge protection is earth	 > ground.   J What about when, in my case 24 hours ago, power went out for 2 seconds and returned "with a vengeance" ?   H Something happened in the neighbourhood to cause that. I have called theM utility company to place a complaint, they have a department for that type of L complaint. Maybe I can get a bit of money back. It was, after a rare monitor? which isn't made anymore.... the 19" b/W digital monitor... :-)   M Anyhow, I have found some wharehouse in montreal full of used equipment and I M suspect I'll be able to get a nice deal. Ruins the weekend, but I may go this ; saturday. Perhaps a new definition for "hardware store" :-)   : (Seems like "raw" equipment that hasn't been refurbished).   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 19:57:16 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> 2 Subject: Re: DEC TCP/IP Services 5.3 for Hobbyist?' Message-ID: <3EC588EC.49832083@fsi.net>    Mike Rechtman wrote: >  > David J. Dachtera wrote: > > "Andreas W. Wylach" wrote: > >  > >>Hello everybody, > >>G > >>I am just in the process to build up my private VMS environment und : > >>was asking myself, why the Hobbyist CD just got TCP/IP > >>Version 5.1 (OpenVMS VAX).P > >>Does anybody know, when the 5.3 Version is available for the Hobbyist peops?N > >>Or is there probably a upgrade download somewhere to get the newest TCP/IP > >>Version? > >  > > L > > hp remains rather set against downloadables. Guess LMF hacks have become > > too well known.  > > K > > I posted some time ago about a bunch of DCL that I cooked up to build a K > > hobbyists' LP distro. from the standard-issue SPL. Any interest? E-mail L > > me privately. How to demung the reply-to should be obvious. If you don'tH > > get a reply, try using dls.net instead of fsi.net. Somewhere betweenI > > forwarding and spam filtering, I think I may be losing some messages.  > > J > Got bounced from both versions of your email address, so NG readers will. > please excuse my trying to contact you here.  A You *DID* remember to do the rather obvious de-mung thing, right?   - Sent myself mail from work to both addresses.   ? ...but be advised that if your post-office's IP address doesn't 6 back-translate, the spam filters may bounce it anyway.  < > could you please  post the DCL OR post or email a pointer?  D MUCH too big to post. My freeware link (if it's still) in the FAQ is still valid:  # http://www.djesys.com/freeware/vms/    Look for hbyspl010.zip  H Read the README file carefully. Especially, you'll need BYPASS privilegeH due to the way some things are done. It's not real polished, but it does work.   . Whaddaya want fer nuthin? ...a rubber biscuit?   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 20:00:29 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> 2 Subject: Re: DEC TCP/IP Services 5.3 for Hobbyist?' Message-ID: <3EC589AD.301ECA4B@fsi.net>    Martin Vorlaender wrote: > [snip]& > Works perfectly. Many thanks, David.  G It's not as polished as I would have liked it to be before I posted it. G I'm still trying to cook up a decent install-directly-from-the-CD Samba 8 distro, too. So, I didn't want to throw more time at it.   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------   Date: 16 May 2003 12:39 CDT ' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins) Y Subject: Re: Does Kermit have a data size limit? [was RE: getting data off an OpenVMS Alp - Message-ID: <16MAY200312390081@gerg.tamu.edu>   ' "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes... 5 }"Carl Perkins" <carl@gerg.tamu.edu> wrote in message ( }news:16MAY200310535217@gerg.tamu.edu...G }> <nCWwa.209586$kYH.11302@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>, "John " }Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes...< }> }"Steve Spires" <Steve.Spires@torex.com> wrote in messageC }> }news:91947A84607D9D48B8E674A5FAB54DA6854546@tahiti.tinuk.com... A }> }Just wondering if Kermit might be the answer to my problem of  }copyingD }> }large files [6GB and larger] from VMS toTru64, which seems to beB }> }defeating all the other things I've tried. Does anyone know if }there }> }isA }> }any file size limit? Is Kermit truly a 64-bit application? Of 	 }course I A }> }have yet to overcome the limitation of only having a 2MB pipe  }betweenG }> }the systems [geographically distant] which everything else is using  }as D }> }well, but I might be able to overcome that by using a spare DS10 }and& }> }physically moving the data closer. }> } }> }G }> }Attach a USB 2.0/Firewire drive (NTFS format on the USB drive files @ }> }system) to a PC which is local to the VMS box and copy using	 }whatever : }> }mechanism at your disposal (ftp, Pathworks, etc). Then }bring/courier@ }> }the USB drive to a PC local to the Tru64 box and reverse the	 }process.  }>A }> If you are going to send a physical object with the data, save 	 }yourself C }> the trouble of using 2 PCs and just burn it on a CD-R on the VMS  }system,0 }> send the CD, and read it on the Tru64 system. }  } 3 }He has 40Gb of data to move. That's a lot of CD's.   A True. But a box of 65 or so CDs is pretty cheap and durable. (VMS ? doesn't come with an easy way to split the files though, making  this harder to do.)   < On the other hand, if he can do the transfers easily between> the systems a PCs local to each, your solution may be better -2 especially if he is going to do it more than once.  C As it is now, as long as he doesn't have to transfer this much data B very often, FTP or Kermit sound like his best bet even though theyD will tie up the slow network connection for quite a while (somethingB like a day and a half, if I recall what he said correctly: 40GB atA 2.5 megabits/sec is 128000 seconds, using decimal GB, or a littleg over 35.5 hours).   D On the other other hand there are programs that you can get for UnixB that will read a VMS backup saveset off of a tape. This might work- OK - drop tar and go with Backup. One source: < http://www.ee.freebsd.org/ports/emulators.html#vmsbackup-3.0  @ There is also some commercial software that can do this too (and; some other stuff) available from Boston Business Computing:   http://www.bosbc.com/vbackup.htm  ? So if the VMS system and the Tru64 system have the same type ofeB tape drive available to them, this could work. (I assume that they@ do as the tar files would have to have been transfered somehow.)   --- Carl   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 21:11:46 GMTC# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> Y Subject: Re: Does Kermit have a data size limit? [was RE: getting data off an OpenVMS AlpiI Message-ID: <mucxa.190547$w7k.92130@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>s  4 "Carl Perkins" <carl@gerg.tamu.edu> wrote in message' news:16MAY200312390081@gerg.tamu.edu...e) > "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes...o7 > }"Carl Perkins" <carl@gerg.tamu.edu> wrote in messageE* > }news:16MAY200310535217@gerg.tamu.edu...C > }> <nCWwa.209586$kYH.11302@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>,e "Johne$ > }Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes...> > }> }"Steve Spires" <Steve.Spires@torex.com> wrote in messageE > }> }news:91947A84607D9D48B8E674A5FAB54DA6854546@tahiti.tinuk.com...tC > }> }Just wondering if Kermit might be the answer to my problem ofo
 > }copyingF > }> }large files [6GB and larger] from VMS toTru64, which seems to beD > }> }defeating all the other things I've tried. Does anyone know if > }there > }> }isC > }> }any file size limit? Is Kermit truly a 64-bit application? OfI > }course IeC > }> }have yet to overcome the limitation of only having a 2MB pipeh
 > }betweenC > }> }the systems [geographically distant] which everything else ise usingo > }aspF > }> }well, but I might be able to overcome that by using a spare DS10 > }and( > }> }physically moving the data closer. > }> } > }> }C > }> }Attach a USB 2.0/Firewire drive (NTFS format on the USB drive  filesOB > }> }system) to a PC which is local to the VMS box and copy using > }whatevert< > }> }mechanism at your disposal (ftp, Pathworks, etc). Then > }bring/courierB > }> }the USB drive to a PC local to the Tru64 box and reverse the > }process.o > }>C > }> If you are going to send a physical object with the data, saveu > }yourselfsE > }> the trouble of using 2 PCs and just burn it on a CD-R on the VMSr
 > }system,2 > }> send the CD, and read it on the Tru64 system. > }  > }e5 > }He has 40Gb of data to move. That's a lot of CD's.e >lC > True. But a box of 65 or so CDs is pretty cheap and durable. (VMS A > doesn't come with an easy way to split the files though, makingt > this harder to do.)  >h> > On the other hand, if he can do the transfers easily between@ > the systems a PCs local to each, your solution may be better -4 > especially if he is going to do it more than once. >pE > As it is now, as long as he doesn't have to transfer this much data-D > very often, FTP or Kermit sound like his best bet even though theyF > will tie up the slow network connection for quite a while (somethingD > like a day and a half, if I recall what he said correctly: 40GB atC > 2.5 megabits/sec is 128000 seconds, using decimal GB, or a littlee > over 35.5 hours).2 >,F > On the other other hand there are programs that you can get for UnixD > that will read a VMS backup saveset off of a tape. This might work/ > OK - drop tar and go with Backup. One source:a> > http://www.ee.freebsd.org/ports/emulators.html#vmsbackup-3.0 >pB > There is also some commercial software that can do this too (and= > some other stuff) available from Boston Business Computing:y" > http://www.bosbc.com/vbackup.htm >:A > So if the VMS system and the Tru64 system have the same type ofiD > tape drive available to them, this could work. (I assume that theyB > do as the tar files would have to have been transfered somehow.)    F 4mm DDS-4 DAT tape drive should work too. But the USB disk solution isA cheaper and possibly faster (assuming that he has to purchase onei device or the other).    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 20:26:32 -0500 1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> Y Subject: Re: Does Kermit have a data size limit? [was RE: getting data off an OpenVMS Alpr' Message-ID: <3EC58FC8.4FC12D99@fsi.net>t   Steve Spires wrote:  > G > The problem I have is getting the data OFF the tape on the Tru64 box.rH > I've tried various tools for that, including VMSTAR and VMSBACKUP, andH > can't find anything that'll handle the large files - I have about 40GBF > of data to get across. The files are DSM volume sets and After-Image > journal files.   Little known secret:  C If the file will fit entirely on one tape volume (TK87, TK88, TK89,k SDLT, etc.):   On VMS:C  > $ MOUNT/FOREIGN ddcu:	! (the tape drive with cartridge loaded)5 $ COPY filespec ddcu:	! Does *NOT* write ANSI labels!e $ DISMOUNT/UNLOAD ddcu:i   On UN*X:  . $ dd if=/dev/raw_tape_device of=/path/filespec  D You might need to know block counts and such, and that may take some? experimentation. Start with a small file until you work it out.   G Caveat: Contiguity of the target file may be an issue on the UN*X side.   E > I'm considering at the moment trying to get the data on the tape aseG > ANSI, and using dd to get the data off the other end, but have yet toPF > get around to testing this method. Currently putting the data on theG > DS10 and using FTP locally looks like the way I'll have to go, but of J > course I'm then relying on FTP to be able to handle the file size, which > again I need to test...t  G Should not be a problem, but yes, you'll need to check that to be sure.h   -- > David J. Dachterae dba DJE Systemso http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------    Date: 16 May 2003 13:13:59 -0500' From: "Glen G." <acme@aodontspamme.net>o" Subject: Error message help needed1 Message-ID: <01c31bd6$73be2ba0$2d8f4f3f@thegoodw>h   Hello all --  D I'm new to VMS.  I recently acquired a VaxStation 3100 m76 which was running NetBSD (yuck).  I-E got the VMS 7.3 disk and license, loaded the OS, made sure the system1 booted okay, then installed , the C compiler and license.  So far so good.  K I then created a file -- hello.c -- in a temporary directory named SCRATCH.-   #include <stdio.h>   void main(void)- {- 	printf("hello, world"); }-  8 The program compiled okay, so I next invoked the linker:   LINK HELLO.OBJ  > and sure enough, the linker created an output file HELLO.EXE;1  & Problem is, when I execute the command  % @SYS$COMMON:[SYSMGR.SCRATCH]HELLO.EXEr  ( the following error message is produced:  : %RMS-W-RTB, 512 byte record is too large for user's buffer  F I am assuming that the linker knew which libraries to link in, since I didn't get an "undefined9 external reference" error regarding the call to printf().i  K I'd certainly appreciate any help in deciphering this.  Please bear in mind  I have about four hoursa experience with VMS.   TIA --   Glen 0/0r    > -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----A http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!a> -----==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 18:18:09 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG& Subject: Re: Error message help needed0 Message-ID: <00A1FF3E.70DD9CB3@SendSpamHere.ORG>  [ In article <01c31bd6$73be2ba0$2d8f4f3f@thegoodw>, "Glen G." <acme@aodontspamme.net> writes:s
 >Hello all --a > E >I'm new to VMS.  I recently acquired a VaxStation 3100 m76 which wasd >running NetBSD (yuck).  IF >got the VMS 7.3 disk and license, loaded the OS, made sure the system >booted okay, then installed- >the C compiler and license.  So far so good.v >JL >I then created a file -- hello.c -- in a temporary directory named SCRATCH. >e >#include <stdio.h>C >5 >void main(void) >{ >	printf("hello, world");  >} >a9 >The program compiled okay, so I next invoked the linker:m >. >LINK HELLO.OBJr >s? >and sure enough, the linker created an output file HELLO.EXE;1p >r' >Problem is, when I execute the commanda >I& >@SYS$COMMON:[SYSMGR.SCRATCH]HELLO.EXE  * $ RUN SYS$COMMON:[SYSMGR.SCRATCH]HELLO.EXE   --O VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMt             5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 19:31:46 +0100e+ From: John Laird <john@laird-towers.org.uk> & Subject: Re: Error message help needed8 Message-ID: <8ebacvo3sg11rkhlo7dbj5mv86uikgvnt7@4ax.com>  G On 16 May 2003 13:13:59 -0500, "Glen G." <acme@aodontspamme.net> wrote:-   >I'm new to VMS.  & That's okay.  Everyone was new once...  , You RUN images and you @ command procedures.  ' So, if you create HELLO.COM containing:e $ RUN HELLOC  J Then @HELLO will execute the procedure, which will RUN the image.  (By wayH of explanation - there is nothing stopping you RUNing it interactively.)  J If you have a fairly recent version of VMS, then it has a path ability andG you could probably just type HELLO at the $ prompt too.  I don't recallo? offhand the hierarchy between .com and .exe files in this case.r     	John    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 19:05:52 GMTy9 From: "Fred Kleinsorge" <my-last-name@stardotzko.dec.com>m& Subject: Re: Error message help needed0 Message-ID: <kEaxa.962$Q84.377@news.cpqcorp.net>   $ run hellog  . It is an image (hence RUN) not a command file.  K You can also get more UNIX-like behavior by defining DCL$PATH, for example:g  / $ define dcl$path [], sys$system, decw$exampless  H Now when you type "hello" it will try to find HELLO.EXE (and if it can't" HELLO.COM) and do the right thing.      2 "Glen G." <acme@aodontspamme.net> wrote in message+ news:01c31bd6$73be2ba0$2d8f4f3f@thegoodw...  > Hello all -- > F > I'm new to VMS.  I recently acquired a VaxStation 3100 m76 which was > running NetBSD (yuck).  I G > got the VMS 7.3 disk and license, loaded the OS, made sure the systemc > booted okay, then installedo. > the C compiler and license.  So far so good. >mD > I then created a file -- hello.c -- in a temporary directory named SCRATCH. >k > #include <stdio.h> >< > void main(void)t > {  > printf("hello, world");. > }  > : > The program compiled okay, so I next invoked the linker: >a > LINK HELLO.OBJ >l@ > and sure enough, the linker created an output file HELLO.EXE;1 >-( > Problem is, when I execute the command >y' > @SYS$COMMON:[SYSMGR.SCRATCH]HELLO.EXEi >A* > the following error message is produced: >.< > %RMS-W-RTB, 512 byte record is too large for user's buffer > H > I am assuming that the linker knew which libraries to link in, since I > didn't get an "undefined; > external reference" error regarding the call to printf().  >aH > I'd certainly appreciate any help in deciphering this.  Please bear in mind > I have about four hoursm > experience with VMS. >s > TIA -- >o > Glen > 0/0i >M >l@ > -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----C > http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!b@ > -----==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 12:17:15 -0700 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com>s& Subject: RE: Error message help needed9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJIIEFLHDAA.tom@kednos.com>t   It would be nice to sayr  
 $ which hellot   >-----Original Message-----N? >From: Fred Kleinsorge [mailto:my-last-name@stardotzko.dec.com]e$ >Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 12:06 PM >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com' >Subject: Re: Error message help neededo >h >y >$ run hello > / >It is an image (hence RUN) not a command file.a >aL >You can also get more UNIX-like behavior by defining DCL$PATH, for example: >u0 >$ define dcl$path [], sys$system, decw$examples >tI >Now when you type "hello" it will try to find HELLO.EXE (and if it can't # >HELLO.COM) and do the right thing.a >o >o >f3 >"Glen G." <acme@aodontspamme.net> wrote in messages, >news:01c31bd6$73be2ba0$2d8f4f3f@thegoodw... >> Hello all --  >>G >> I'm new to VMS.  I recently acquired a VaxStation 3100 m76 which waso >> running NetBSD (yuck).  IH >> got the VMS 7.3 disk and license, loaded the OS, made sure the system >> booted okay, then installed/ >> the C compiler and license.  So far so good.t >>E >> I then created a file -- hello.c -- in a temporary directory nameda	 >SCRATCH., >> >> #include <stdio.h>i >> >> void main(void) >> { >> printf("hello, world"); >> } >>; >> The program compiled okay, so I next invoked the linker:' >> >> LINK HELLO.OBJ  >>A >> and sure enough, the linker created an output file HELLO.EXE;1t >>) >> Problem is, when I execute the commandv >>( >> @SYS$COMMON:[SYSMGR.SCRATCH]HELLO.EXE >>+ >> the following error message is produced:w >>= >> %RMS-W-RTB, 512 byte record is too large for user's buffer, >>I >> I am assuming that the linker knew which libraries to link in, since I  >> didn't get an "undefined < >> external reference" error regarding the call to printf(). >>I >> I'd certainly appreciate any help in deciphering this.  Please bear inf >mindi >> I have about four hours >> experience with VMS.P >>	 >> TIA --- >> >> Glen- >> 0/0 >> >>A >> -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----sD >> http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!A >> -----==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----t >e >I >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.m; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).eA >Version: 6.0.480 / Virus Database: 276 - Release Date: 5/12/2003  >  ---a& Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).@ Version: 6.0.480 / Virus Database: 276 - Release Date: 5/12/2003   ------------------------------   Date: 16 May 2003 14:21 CDT ' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)o& Subject: Re: Error message help needed- Message-ID: <16MAY200314211330@gerg.tamu.edu>   W In article <00A1FF3E.70DD9CB3@SendSpamHere.ORG>,   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG writes... \ }In article <01c31bd6$73be2ba0$2d8f4f3f@thegoodw>, "Glen G." <acme@aodontspamme.net> writes: }>Hello all -- }>F }>I'm new to VMS.  I recently acquired a VaxStation 3100 m76 which was }>running NetBSD (yuck).  IeG }>got the VMS 7.3 disk and license, loaded the OS, made sure the systemh }>booted okay, then installed>. }>the C compiler and license.  So far so good. }>M }>I then created a file -- hello.c -- in a temporary directory named SCRATCH.a }> }>#include <stdio.h> }> }>void main(void)  }>{o }>	printf("hello, world"); }>}d }>: }>The program compiled okay, so I next invoked the linker: }> }>LINK HELLO.OBJ }>@ }>and sure enough, the linker created an output file HELLO.EXE;1 }>( }>Problem is, when I execute the command }>' }>@SYS$COMMON:[SYSMGR.SCRATCH]HELLO.EXEe } + }$ RUN SYS$COMMON:[SYSMGR.SCRATCH]HELLO.EXEo }  }-- P }VAXman- OpenVMS APE certification number: AAA-0001     VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM }           6 }  "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"    Or justs   $ run hello   > since in order for the link command to have worked without the? device and directory being specified that directory must be theO current default directory.  ? You can also leave the extension off for the link and compile -m  
 $ cc hello $ link hello  E since the CC command knows it normally works on .C files and the LINK=. command knows it normally works on .OBJ files.   --- Carl   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 16:03:22 -0400F* From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>& Subject: Re: Error message help needed) Message-ID: <3EC54401.AEBB5315@istop.com>    If you have hello.exe ,    At the dollar sign, you can:   $ RUN HELLOl  L This is quick and easy, but will not allow hello.exe to access any arguments* you have passed (with the arc/argv stuff).    # $ HELLO :== "$[directory]hello.exe"  $hello chocolate cake fantasy   L The second way is called a "foreign command" You set a symbol to contain theN full path of the .exe file, preceded by the dollar sign. This allows hello.exe9 to access the arguments with the standard arc-argv stuff.i  K However, if you want to preserve case sensitivity, you need to enclose eacha" argument in double quotes such as:  ! $hello "Chocolate cake" "Fantasy".  ) The first argument is  =>Chocolate Cake<=m" the second argument is =>Fantasy<=   if you : $hello chocolate cake fantasy1 you get 3 argyments:  
 =>CHOCOLATE<=m =>CAKE<= =>FANTASY<=D   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 16:55:21 -0400l! From: Jim Agnew <jpagnew@vcu.edu>t& Subject: Re: Error message help needed' Message-ID: <3EC55039.85A60879@vcu.edu>o  " hee hee...  glad to see a newbie..; the @ sign is for text-mode script commands written in DCL.i   you'll typea  
 RUN HELLO.EXEo   to get what you want.r   the @ would be used for:  	 @this.como   where this.com contains:   $ CC HELLO.C $ LINK HELLO.OBJ $ EXIT  F and that would automate your playing...  you are at the right place to
 ask for help.    jim    "Glen G." wrote: >  > Hello all -- > F > I'm new to VMS.  I recently acquired a VaxStation 3100 m76 which was > running NetBSD (yuck).  IpG > got the VMS 7.3 disk and license, loaded the OS, made sure the systemi > booted okay, then installedt. > the C compiler and license.  So far so good. > M > I then created a file -- hello.c -- in a temporary directory named SCRATCH.t >  > #include <stdio.h> >  > void main(void)  > { ! >         printf("hello, world");U > }l > : > The program compiled okay, so I next invoked the linker: >  > LINK HELLO.OBJ > @ > and sure enough, the linker created an output file HELLO.EXE;1 > ( > Problem is, when I execute the command > ' > @SYS$COMMON:[SYSMGR.SCRATCH]HELLO.EXE  > * > the following error message is produced: > < > %RMS-W-RTB, 512 byte record is too large for user's buffer > H > I am assuming that the linker knew which libraries to link in, since I > didn't get an "undefined; > external reference" error regarding the call to printf().o > M > I'd certainly appreciate any help in deciphering this.  Please bear in mindr > I have about four hoursw > experience with VMS. >  > TIA -- >  > Glen > 0/0  > @ > -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----C > http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!u@ > -----==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----   -- oF "4,000 years ago I made a mistake."  Elrond Half-Elven, in "Fellowship of the Ring"   ------------------------------   Date: 17 May 2003 04:44:52 GMT2 From: "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh@shell1.aracnet.com>0 Subject: Re: From Systems and Options Catalogue:, Message-ID: <ba4eo401q0l@enews1.newsguy.com>  / mist dragon <mistdragon@zdnetonebox.com> wrote:p< >> Were theye ever some X-server softwrae for MS-DOS ?????    E > Of course. I even used it, but it didnt really cut the cake becausetB > networks were slow at that time and it was wery expensive. Can't" > remember the manufacturers thou.  L The best that I'm aware of was Desqview/X, I wanted a copy *BAD* back in theJ early 90's, but couldn't afford it.  Using it, you could retarget DOS and I MS Windows apps to another system running X-Windows.  Of course you couldnE also retarget X-Windows apps running on another system back to the PC 6 running Desqview/X, but that wasn't as interesting :^)  H Actually, come to think of it, Desqview/X is the only X-Windows softwareI that I'm aware of for MS-DOS, there were numerous companies making it for. Windows at one time.   			Zanec   ------------------------------    Date: 16 May 2003 12:24:04 -0700. From: zcsessions@visionair.com (Zack Sessions)C Subject: Re: getting data off an OpenVMS Alpha to Microsoft Windows = Message-ID: <db13d9fb.0305161124.49c232e9@posting.google.com>A  C Thanks for all the responses so far, both here and email. Now for al returning newbie question.  E The workstation is an Alpha 1000A 4/266 running OpenVMS 6.2. How do I B know if I should download the OpenVMS AXP version of a tool or the OpenVMS version?  8 I know, I said it was going to be newbie question!!! :-)   Zack   ------------------------------    Date: 16 May 2003 12:27:10 -0700. From: zcsessions@visionair.com (Zack Sessions)C Subject: Re: getting data off an OpenVMS Alpha to Microsoft Windowsr= Message-ID: <db13d9fb.0305161127.578daf85@posting.google.com>i  E Oh, crap, I just answered my own question. The difference between AXPd? and not AXP was when you download the objects as opposed to thetC source. Of course, AXP objects would be needed for any Alpha box as > opposed to a VAX, if you don't have the source compiler handy.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 12:30:29 -0700-# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com>2C Subject: RE: getting data off an OpenVMS Alpha to Microsoft Windowso9 Message-ID: <CIEJLCMNHNNDLLOOGNJICEFMHDAA.tom@kednos.com>.   $ help anal/images   >-----Original Message-----m6 >From: Zack Sessions [mailto:zcsessions@visionair.com]$ >Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 12:24 PM >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComD >Subject: Re: getting data off an OpenVMS Alpha to Microsoft Windows >e >oD >Thanks for all the responses so far, both here and email. Now for a >returning newbie question.a > F >The workstation is an Alpha 1000A 4/266 running OpenVMS 6.2. How do IC >know if I should download the OpenVMS AXP version of a tool or the  >OpenVMS version?  >o9 >I know, I said it was going to be newbie question!!! :-)  >t >Zack  >r >---' >Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.t; >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). A >Version: 6.0.480 / Virus Database: 276 - Release Date: 5/12/2003s >d ---r& Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).@ Version: 6.0.480 / Virus Database: 276 - Release Date: 5/12/2003   ------------------------------   Date: 16 May 2003 16:56 CDTs' From: carl@gerg.tamu.edu (Carl Perkins)cC Subject: RE: getting data off an OpenVMS Alpha to Microsoft Windows - Message-ID: <16MAY200316561980@gerg.tamu.edu>t  ' "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> writes...d }$ help anal/image    A The /SELECT qualifier doesn't seem to be in the help (on V7.2-1).i  ) Does the /SELECT qualifier exist on V6.2?    $ ana/image/select=arch *.exet  F This will tell you the architecture of every .EXE file in your default5 directory, at least for versions with this qualifier.t   --- Carl   }>-----Original Message-----7 }>From: Zack Sessions [mailto:zcsessions@visionair.com]r% }>Sent: Friday, May 16, 2003 12:24 PMo }>To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com,E }>Subject: Re: getting data off an OpenVMS Alpha to Microsoft Windowsr }> }>E }>Thanks for all the responses so far, both here and email. Now for ac }>returning newbie question. }>G }>The workstation is an Alpha 1000A 4/266 running OpenVMS 6.2. How do IrD }>know if I should download the OpenVMS AXP version of a tool or the }>OpenVMS version? }>: }>I know, I said it was going to be newbie question!!! :-) }> }>Zack }> }>---m( }>Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.< }>Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).B }>Version: 6.0.480 / Virus Database: 276 - Release Date: 5/12/2003 }> }---' }Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.W; }Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).bA }Version: 6.0.480 / Virus Database: 276 - Release Date: 5/12/2003y }    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 19:50:58 -0500e1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>u3 Subject: Re: How to determine boot device from DCL?s' Message-ID: <3EC58772.3693D83D@fsi.net>a   John Santos wrote: > / > On Thu, 15 May 2003, David J. Dachtera wrote:  >  > > Steve Spires wrote:d > > > K > > > This would be nice, but we don't have the ability to use the /ANALYZEgL > > > qualifier, and site are unlikely to fork out for the DIAGNOSE license. > >aJ > > I believe all you need is a valid support contract to get the license. > C > Yes, but I think you don't need the license.  The license enablessD > lots of extra functionality, but just looking at error log entries > doesn't require it.h   My point exactly.r  ? > However, many of the newer CPU's aren't supported by DECeventtD > (aka DIAGNOSE)  I think you need Availability Manager (or whatever > it is called these days.)e  D Actually, it's CA - Compaq Analyze ... I suppose now they'll call it HPanalyze, huh?n   -- d David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systemsu http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/n   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 15:54:15 -0400d0 From: "Brian Tillman" <Tillman@sparkingwire.com>5 Subject: Re: howto get a parameter (p1) to an ftp job $ Message-ID: <3ec541ec$1@news.si.com>  < >$COPY/FTP 'p1 machine"username password"::"/some/dir/''p1'"  > Leave off the "''p1'" on the end, just like on any other copy:  8 $ copy/ftp 'p1' machine"username password"::"/some/dir/" -- cI Brian Tillman         Internet: Brian.Tillman at smiths-aerospace dot comg5 Smiths Aerospace  Addresses modified to prevent SPAM. D 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS 1B3 Replace "at" with "@", "dot" with "." Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991s8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 16:15:06 -0400n* From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>5 Subject: Re: howto get a parameter (p1) to an ftp jobn) Message-ID: <3EC546C0.13AA8C2F@istop.com>    Brian Tillman wrote: > > > >$COPY/FTP 'p1 machine"username password"::"/some/dir/''p1'" > @ > Leave off the "''p1'" on the end, just like on any other copy:   if you have:   $myfile = "wEiRd_UnIx.FiLe" : $copy/ftp 'myfile machine"username password"::"/some/dir/"  H will it create wEiRd_UnIx.FiLe or WEIRD_UNIX.FILE on the remote system ?  M If it depends which version of VMS you have, then you are better off puttting4J the ''p1' at the end to ensure that the target file is created properly no$ matter what version of VMS you have.   ------------------------------  + Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 20:20:44 +0000 (UTC)M, From: lewis@PROBE.mitre.org (Keith A. Lewis)( Subject: Re: Java "Unknown host" problem. Message-ID: <ba3h6s$sgn$1@newslocal.mitre.org>   ashoffman@comcast.net (Alan Hoffman) writes in article <838d7cb0.0305151329.1c251b0f@posting.google.com> dated 15 May 2003 14:29:04 -0700:C >I've also checked the decw$private_server_setup.com file and founddE >that decw$server_transports did not have TCPIP in it's list (it does B >now) on all the machines. I assume that this file is being called >somewhere.I  A Yes, it gets called during decwindows startup (i.e. boot time).  '  E >Thanks for all the suggestions and information. Now on to how to fixfE >the failure of "localhost". A co-worker has a program that is trying D >to use multicasting but it isn't working (it works on a system in aE >different building). Is the multicasting problem related to my TCPIPs >problems???  9 We had to add explicit routes to get multicast working.  -  + --Keith Lewis              klewis$mitre.org0> The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------   Date: 16 MAY 2003 17:58:30 GMT+ From: Dave Greenwood <greenwoodde@ornl.gov> 3 Subject: Re: Logicals Lost When Process Is Detached 2 Message-ID: <16MAY03.17583073@feda34.fed.ornl.gov>  6 In a previous article, briggs@encompasserve.org wrote:t > In article <6449213e.0305151044.78ee9d4f@posting.google.com>, fmattison@ssd5.nrl.navy.mil (Frank Mattison) writes:H > > Switching from RUN image to RUN/DETACHED image, the detached process0 > > is no longer able to reference the logicals. >  w > Which logicals?s >   B > Yes, RUN/DETACHED will not have access to /PROCESS logical namesG > associated with the creating process.  And it will not have access toaD > /JOB logical names associated with the creating process.  It will,C > however, have access to /GROUP logical names in its own UIC groupp > and to /SYSTEM logical names.-  G Well, actually the new process can have access to the creating process'eG job and process logical names - IF the new process knows the job numberiH of the creating process and the logical name table protections allow it.E One way to pass the job number to the new process is to put it in theoE job name of the new process.  Here's an extract from a .com that doesn that:,  0  $ define/job/nolog myxterm_display "''display'"H  $ jobnum = f$element(1,"_",f$trnlnm("lnm$job","lnm$process_directory"))>  $ run /detached /process_name="MyX_''jobnum'" /output=nla0: -=       /input='f$environment("procedure")' sys$system:loginoutH  G This is part of a .com to create a detached process running xterm usingiD the same X display as the current process.  It just resubmits itself/ and executes a section of code that looks like:'  .  $ if f$mode() .eqs. "OTHER" .and. p1 .eqs. ""  $ thenn5  $    jobnum = f$element(1,"_",f$getjpi("","prcnam"))a?  $    display = f$trnlnm("MYXTERM_DISPLAY","LNM$JOB_''jobnum'")r  ...  $ endif  C You have to ensure that the new (detached) process changes its name:E before the creating process tries to create a newer detached process. D Or use a unique prefix (the "MyX_" above) for each new process name.   Dave --------------9 Dave Greenwood                Email: Greenwoodde@ORNL.GOVDH Oak Ridge National Lab        %STD-W-DISCLAIMER, I only speak for myself   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 20:15:15 -0500l1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>g3 Subject: Re: Logicals Lost When Process Is Detachedb' Message-ID: <3EC58D23.A733CAA7@fsi.net>o   Dave Greenwood wrote:  > 8 > In a previous article, briggs@encompasserve.org wrote:v > > In article <6449213e.0305151044.78ee9d4f@posting.google.com>, fmattison@ssd5.nrl.navy.mil (Frank Mattison) writes:J > > > Switching from RUN image to RUN/DETACHED image, the detached process2 > > > is no longer able to reference the logicals. > >  > > Which logicals?l > >eD > > Yes, RUN/DETACHED will not have access to /PROCESS logical namesI > > associated with the creating process.  And it will not have access to F > > /JOB logical names associated with the creating process.  It will,E > > however, have access to /GROUP logical names in its own UIC groupi! > > and to /SYSTEM logical names.p > I > Well, actually the new process can have access to the creating process'4I > job and process logical names - IF the new process knows the job number J > of the creating process and the logical name table protections allow it.  G Not process logical names. That table is in process-private space localoE to that job tree. The detached process is in a separate job tree with6F its own process-private space. The actual LNM$JOB_xxxxxxxx table is inF system space and is visible to the "world", caveat for protection mask and ACL.   -- e David J. Dachteras dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/c   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 22:53:08 GMTh3 From: "George Samuelson" <samuelsong@insightbb.com>l9 Subject: New Auction for OpenVMS Alpha and VAX OS and SPLt/ Message-ID: <oZdxa.861071$3D1.490233@sccrnsc01>g   All,  K Just to let you know I have (2) more OpenVMS packages for sale on eBay. The & seller id is robins-nest-collectibles.   Regards,   George   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 00:04:25 GMT 4 From: brad@.gateway.2wire.net (Bradford J. Hamilton)= Subject: Re: New Auction for OpenVMS Alpha and VAX OS and SPLh? Message-ID: <c0fxa.351044$Si4.292167@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att.net>   e In article <oZdxa.861071$3D1.490233@sccrnsc01>, "George Samuelson" <samuelsong@insightbb.com> writes:o >All,  >nL >Just to let you know I have (2) more OpenVMS packages for sale on eBay. The' >seller id is robins-nest-collectibles.r  " Don't see it; can you post a link?   > 	 >Regards,  >s >Georgew >s >n  A _________________________________________________________________K0 Bradford J. Hamilton			"All opinions are my own"/ bMradAhamiPltSon@atMtAbi.cPoSm		"Lose the MAPS"    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 00:30:30 GMTl3 From: "George Samuelson" <samuelsong@insightbb.com> = Subject: Re: New Auction for OpenVMS Alpha and VAX OS and SPLh/ Message-ID: <Gofxa.861914$3D1.491527@sccrnsc01>n   Here you go:  = http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3024169213   = http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3024170307oA "Bradford J. Hamilton" <brad@.gateway.2wire.net> wrote in messageo9 news:c0fxa.351044$Si4.292167@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att.net...lD > In article <oZdxa.861071$3D1.490233@sccrnsc01>, "George Samuelson"" <samuelsong@insightbb.com> writes: > >All,a > >eJ > >Just to let you know I have (2) more OpenVMS packages for sale on eBay. They) > >seller id is robins-nest-collectibles.e >r$ > Don't see it; can you post a link? >- > >- > >Regards,- > > 	 > >George1 > >  > >2 >1C > _________________________________________________________________m0 > Bradford J. Hamilton "All opinions are my own"0 > bMradAhamiPltSon@atMtAbi.cPoSm "Lose the MAPS"   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 16:14:21 -0400a0 From: "Brian Tillman" <Tillman@sparkingwire.com> Subject: Re: next VMS versions$ Message-ID: <3ec546a2$1@news.si.com>  C >What you "can" do and what is "supported" may be different things.5  J Since it was a stand-alone upgrade, I foresaw no problems.  I was correct. -- .I Brian Tillman         Internet: Brian.Tillman at smiths-aerospace dot com<5 Smiths Aerospace  Addresses modified to prevent SPAM.9D 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS 1B3 Replace "at" with "@", "dot" with "." Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991h8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 16:14:27 -0400h0 From: "Brian Tillman" <Tillman@sparkingwire.com>. Subject: Re: Running VWS software on X-windows$ Message-ID: <3ec546a8$1@news.si.com>  K >Has anyone ever used it ? Does this mean that one could again run the Moonp >lander game ??????>    I have it on our VMS V7.2 VAXes. -- iI Brian Tillman         Internet: Brian.Tillman at smiths-aerospace dot como5 Smiths Aerospace  Addresses modified to prevent SPAM.cD 3290 Patterson Ave. SE, MS 1B3 Replace "at" with "@", "dot" with "." Grand Rapids, MI 49512-1991 8        This opinion doesn't represent that of my company   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 21:15:28 -0400p* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>< Subject: Re: Sparky is losing the race Andrew ... and badly!2 Message-ID: <RMidncV32ZKoEFijXTWcrg@metrocast.net>  K "Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy" <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com>b; wrote in message news:ba359d$6at$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com...s   ...   0 > Umm IBM has announced 1.7 GHz power 4 systems. > ) > They are shipping them later this year.t   Try later this month:   L http://www-1.ibm.com/servers/eserver/pseries/news/pressreleases/2003/may/ann
 c_506.html   - bill   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 23:23:00 GMTh6 From: "Andy Bustamante" <a_c_bustamante@earthlink.net>4 Subject: Re: TCPIP Services Telnet problem [I think]B Message-ID: <opexa.847$rO.102278@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net>  G There is an ECO4 that corrects some telnet issues.  I observed similiaryG problems at customer sites where Cisco Pix firewalls were installed.  IeE understand that Cisco also has updates for the Pix firmware/operatingd system.h   TCPIP 5.3 is out now.s   --     Andy Bustamante. Remove the ascii 95s to replys8 "Steve Spires" <Steve.Spires@torex.com> wrote in message? news:91947A84607D9D48B8E674A5FAB54DA63CAE92@tahiti.tinuk.com...oG I am seeing the following behaviour [not all the time - goes okay for aoD while, then starts to happen and gets more frequent until the systemG requires a reboot] so anyone tell me exactly where I should be looking;c   $c
 $ telnet 0- %TELNET-E-INETERROR, Internet interface error  -TELNET-I-INETCALL, socket()) -SYSTEM-F-EXQUOTA, process quota exceededp   and I also see this;   $t $ tcpip show protocol tcpe- socket: non-translatable vms error code: 0x1Ch) %system-f-exquota, process quota exceeded , %TCPIP-E-INETERROR, internet interface error' -SYSTEM-F-BADPARAM, bad parameter valuee   I have the following versions;   $ tcpip show version  ?   Compaq TCP/IP Services for OpenVMS Alpha Version V5.1 - ECO 3i,   on a AlphaServer ES40 running OpenVMS V7.3   Thanks   Steve Spires Technical Consultant Torex Health [P](44)01295 274388. [F](44)01295 275131j
 www.torex.come   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 20:09:26 -0500s1 From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net>s4 Subject: Re: TCPware NETCP.LOG file - can I move it?' Message-ID: <3EC58BC6.DE6E4EFB@fsi.net>t   "Mark E. Levy" wrote:a > > > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@fsi.net> wrote in message# > news:3EC450DD.63ACB962@fsi.net...u > > Michael Corbett wrote: > L > > ...or find where the TCPWARE lnm gets DEFINEd at system startup time and@ > > move the entire tree to another disk. Then, it won't matter. > F > I wouldn't recommend that, unless you plan on replicating the entire: > sys$specific/sys$common/sys$sysroot structure elsewhere.  * From an Alpha cluster known to both of us:   $ sh log tcpware:    "TCPWARE" = "TCPWARE_ROOT:[TCPWARE]" (LNM$SYSTEM_TABLE) $ sh log tcpware_rootc5    "TCPWARE_ROOT" = "SYS$SYSROOT:" (LNM$SYSTEM_TABLE).: 1  "SYS$SYSROOT" = "$1$DKA101:[SYS10.]" (LNM$SYSTEM_TABLE)         = "SYS$COMMON:"fC 2  "SYS$COMMON" = "$1$DKA101:[SYS10.SYSCOMMON.]" (LNM$SYSTEM_TABLE)m  @ What's to prevent you from moving the TCPWARE directory to, say,A $1$DKA103:[TCPIP], and changing the definition of TCPWARE_ROOT toe $1$DKA103:[TCPIP.]/TRANS=CONC?   -- e David J. Dachtera0 dba DJE Systemsc http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/l   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 23:01:19 GMTb3 From: "George Samuelson" <samuelsong@insightbb.com>   Subject: Re: VMS 7.1H1 and 7.1-2. Message-ID: <35exa.622557$Zo.134068@sccrnsc03>  D John is correct. V7.1-1h1 is an interim hardware release version. InL addition, it was released before V7.1-2. Therefore, you can upgrade ro 7.2-x	 or 7.3.x.o   Regards,   George5 "John Brandon" <brandon@dalsemi.com> wrote in messagee+ news:03051611422646@dscis6-0.dalsemi.com...'? > > I'm planning a disk upgrade to an AlphaServer 1200 which iss@ > > running VMS 7.1-2.   The vendor tells me that I need 7.1-1H1 > >tB > > Is it safe to assume that 7.1-2 includes all the functionality > > of 7.1-1H1 ? >SL > Typically the H is representative of a new hardware platform introduced at thedL > current OS rev.  In this case, the hardware (1200) was released after V7.1 and : > required patches to allow the OS to run on the platform. > J > Those patches are typically rolled into the next version level so V7.1-2 will! > most likely have those patches.c >aI > However, as Charlie Hammond stated,   Check with your vendor.  It would  seem6 > odd that the disk drives would only run on v7.1-1h1. >' >uL > I suggest V7.3-1 or better.  Going through the hassle of an upgrade, might as > well do it right!d >x > John Brandon > VMS Systems Administrator  > Dallas Semiconductor > first.last@dalsemi.com > 972.371.4172 wk    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 14:03:54 -0400 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>* Subject: Re: VMS Admins with too much time) Message-ID: <3EC52809.903B4875@istop.com>e   Paul Sture wrote: L > Well, I tried openvmsdoc@hp.com, and it didn't bounce. No response so far,$ > so I don't know if anyone read it.  K In my experience, the folks at ____vmsdoc@compaq.com have alread responded,sH but it takes days or a couple of weeks. They generally track down who is9 responsible for the manual/file and then get back to you.m   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2003.271 ************************