0 INFO-VAX	Fri, 03 Feb 2006	Volume 2006 : Issue 67      Contents: Alpha Console Access Question ! Re: Alpha Console Access Question $ Re: Boot Error on Shadowed Sys Disk.$ Re: Boot Error on Shadowed Sys Disk.* Re: Cisco to sink: names Capellas to board Re: Cluster timeouts question  Re: Cluster timeouts question  Re: Cluster timeouts question  DECterm ReGIS clipping Re: DECterm ReGIS clipping Re: FOR070.DAT files appearing, Re: Here it is: OpenVMS/Alpha on a simulator& Re: Intel/Hp spend $10 billion on IA64& Re: Intel/Hp spend $10 billion on IA64& Re: Intel/Hp spend $10 billion on IA64& Re: Intel/Hp spend $10 billion on IA64 Re: null terminated strings  Re: null terminated strings  Re: null terminated strings  Re: null terminated strings  Re: null terminated strings  Re: Open VMS programing in C Re: Phaser 560 and DCPS problem  Re: Phaser 560 and DCPS problem - Re: Print to (Canon) ImageRunner from OpenVMS 6 Re: Print to (Canon) ImageRunner from OpenVMS [solved]6 Re: Print to (Canon) ImageRunner from OpenVMS [solved] Re: SimH V3.5-2 released Re: SimH V3.5-2 released Re: SimH V3.5-2 released Re: Splitting serial cables ?   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 21:27:56 -0600 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>& Subject: Alpha Console Access Question+ Message-ID: <43E2CDBC.3F2BAF74@comcast.net>   F O.k. Folks here have posted about using VCS/PCM and successors to this. day to manage their Alpha, HSx, etc. consoles.  C I'm wondering if anyone is doing this: Use PCM to access the MBM on F GS1280s via reverse-TELNET thru port mapping on the SMC Barricade, and- possibly thence to access OPA0: also via PCM?   A When I say "PCM", I'm implicitly including CA's Unicenter console $ product and ConsoleWorks from TDITX.   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  & Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page! http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/   ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/   ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2006 23:55:52 -0500' From: Ken Robinson <kenrbnsn@gmail.com> * Subject: Re: Alpha Console Access QuestionH Message-ID: <7dd80f60602022055w7fc544e9w46c439db0e801166@mail.gmail.com>  > On 2/2/06, David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> wrote:H > O.k. Folks here have posted about using VCS/PCM and successors to this0 > day to manage their Alpha, HSx, etc. consoles. > E > I'm wondering if anyone is doing this: Use PCM to access the MBM on H > GS1280s via reverse-TELNET thru port mapping on the SMC Barricade, and/ > possibly thence to access OPA0: also via PCM?   > At my previous job, we had the GS1280 opa0: ports hooked up toD Consoleworks and you could get to MBM by entering the correct escape1 sequence as long as you were at the ">>>" prompt.   / Do you mean access that way or a different way?    Ken    ------------------------------   Date: 2 Feb 2006 11:14:49 -0800 " From: dave.baxter@bannerhealth.com- Subject: Re: Boot Error on Shadowed Sys Disk. B Message-ID: <1138907689.648575.52530@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>  > I dont think the problem is a "path definition" issue, severalD successful boots had already been done, and even on the failed boot,A the booting system had a) found the device, b) read in the system E parameters and bootstrap code, and joined the cluster (as the correct  system).  G I do however, think your first sentence pinpoints the issue, i.e. "must E have access to all shadow members at boot time".   My logic goes like  this.   D At the lowest level, the boot path is just a path to a "raw device",@ and until the new node "joins" the cluster, the other nodes (andG processes running on them) are unaware of the new node.    Once the new C node is "a member", and the other nodes recognise his presence, the  situation changes.> For example, the node which is up and which is controlling theD shadowcopy, may recognize that some process  is trying to access theG system disk, but will not (or maybe cannot) concede access  because the = new node may not yet have a SHADOW_SERVER process to talk to. C This being the case, the controlling node might conceivably put the 7 disk in "Mount Verify" until the situation is resolved. ) The resolution would likely only occur if A 1)   The booting node time's out/bugchecks, hence stops trying to  access the disk.F 2)   The shadowcopy ends, taking away the restriction and allowing the booting node access.G 3)   The Mount Verify times out resulting in (probably) the ejection of > the disk which is the target of the copy and then to option 2.  @ does this make any sense, and more importantly, does it have any validity???    Dave   ------------------------------  * Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2006 22:28:20 +0000 (UTC)7 From: moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) - Subject: Re: Boot Error on Shadowed Sys Disk. ( Message-ID: <dru124$p3n$1@pcls4.std.com>  $ dave.baxter@bannerhealth.com writes:  E >At the lowest level, the boot path is just a path to a "raw device", A >and until the new node "joins" the cluster, the other nodes (and H >processes running on them) are unaware of the new node.    Once the newD >node is "a member", and the other nodes recognise his presence, the >situation changes.    Correct.  ? >For example, the node which is up and which is controlling the E >shadowcopy, may recognize that some process  is trying to access the H >system disk, but will not (or maybe cannot) concede access  because the> >new node may not yet have a SHADOW_SERVER process to talk to.  D SHADOW_SERVER and the other nodes are totally unaware of the bootingE node's access to the shadow set member, and are not interfered by its % accesses, until it joins the cluster.   D >This being the case, the controlling node might conceivably put the8 >disk in "Mount Verify" until the situation is resolved.* >The resolution would likely only occur ifB >1)   The booting node time's out/bugchecks, hence stops trying to >access the disk. G >2)   The shadowcopy ends, taking away the restriction and allowing the  >booting node access. H >3)   The Mount Verify times out resulting in (probably) the ejection of? >the disk which is the target of the copy and then to option 2.    None of this happens.   D At some point the booting node makes sanity checks, such as it's notE trying to boot from a full copy target, it can access all members (as D someone else mentioned) and its picture of the shadowset is the same as other cluster members'    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 21:19:15 -0600 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>3 Subject: Re: Cisco to sink: names Capellas to board + Message-ID: <43E2CBB2.3510C4EF@comcast.net>    JF Mezei wrote:  > ! > http://newsroom.cisco.com/dlls/  > ( > Curly has been named to Cisco's board. > - > At least they acknowledged his limitations:  > * > "Michael is a seasoned general manager". > H > That is about all he is. Hopefully Cisco will not let Curly damage theJ > company.   The message though is that Cisco is now opened for bids to be > taken over/dismantled.  G I don't see how the Cicso juggernaut could even remotely be compared to / the foundering messes that were DEC and Compaq.    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  & Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page! http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/   ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/   ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/   ------------------------------   Date: 2 Feb 2006 19:14:18 -0600 4 From: kuhrt.nospammy@encompasserve.org (Marty Kuhrt)& Subject: Re: Cluster timeouts question3 Message-ID: <jkx5NWNztM$k@eisner.encompasserve.org>   N In article <ops37xazx5zgicya@hyrrokkin>, "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> writes:M > On Mon, 30 Jan 2006 18:37:40 +0000 (UTC), Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES   3 > to reply <helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de> wrote:  > 8 >> In article <43DDDBA5.C4011CCE@teksavvy.com>, JF Mezei) >> <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes:  >> >>> Richard Brodie wrote: I >>> > > Also, which parameter determines how long a node can be without    >>> ethernetJ >>> > > heartbeats from other nodes before declaring itself alone in the  
 >>> cluster ?  >>> >  >>> > RECNXINTERVAL, mostly. >>>  >>> Mine is set to 20 seconds. >>> J >>> While changing ethernet cables, a "lost connection" message was issuedI >>> within about 6 seconds. But I did reconnect within 20 seconds and the 2 >>> node didn't crash as it regained connectivity. >>G >> VMS is robust.  I remember when I accidentally pulled the SCSI cable I >> from the box housing the system disk of a VAX.  Apart from a couple of 5 >> mount-verification messages, nothing bad happened.  >>J >> A couple of days later at work, while rearranging cables under my desk,E >> I accidentally pulled the mouse cable from a Windows PC.  I had to  >> reboot it.  :-| >> > I > Then explain this.  This morning I was getting excessive packet loss on H > one of my alpha nodes,  so I tried reseating the ethernet cable simplyJ > by sliding  it in an out.  The node crashed.  Now the router is a cisco,K > the orange light came on for some length of time which I interpreted to    > meanI > that it hadn't acquired sync, just a WAG.  It would be nice to have a   
 > function+ > like, "I am going to move you so hang on"   A I've done this by increasing the RECNXINTERVAL to a larger number ? than the default 20 seconds.  I did this clusterwide via SYSMAN B when I wanted to move a network cable, in the past, and it worked ? for me.  Since RECNXINTERVAL is dynamic it can be changed on a   running system.      YMMV,  Marty    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 21:40:58 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> & Subject: Re: Cluster timeouts question, Message-ID: <43E2C2A4.B682DA9D@teksavvy.com>   Marty Kuhrt wrote:C > I've done this by increasing the RECNXINTERVAL to a larger number A > than the default 20 seconds.  I did this clusterwide via SYSMAN C > when I wanted to move a network cable, in the past, and it worked @ > for me.  Since RECNXINTERVAL is dynamic it can be changed on a > running system.     F But that won't protect DECNET links, nor LAT links. TCPIP link tend to be more robust to delays.    ------------------------------   Date: 2 Feb 2006 19:03:43 -0800 / From: "David B Sneddon" <dbsneddon@bigpond.com> & Subject: Re: Cluster timeouts questionB Message-ID: <1138935822.973945.77850@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>  5 That is correct... wasn't the original question about  cluster timeouts?    Dave   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 03 Feb 2006 04:26:15 GMT % From: Roger Ivie <rivie@ridgenet.net>  Subject: DECterm ReGIS clipping 3 Message-ID: <slrndu5mr7.a2o.rivie@stench.no.domain>   H So, I'm working on this program, right? And in order to see what it's upG to during development, I'd like to draw a plot of the program state. At D home, where I'm running NetBSD, I've had good luck using the Tek4010E window of xterm for this sort of thing. Looking around, I notice that ) DECterm supports ReGIS. "Sweet!", says I.   G Since I have a large screen, I throw open a 132x66 DECterm, locate some B ReGIS info on the net (VT125 and VT340 manuals), and start playingB around, drawing lines and circles all over my nice, big DECterm. IF decide that an 800x800 area is good for my plot, as it gives me a niceF big plotting space with space for about 10 lines of text below. HavingC sorted out the ReGIS commands I need for my purposes, I design up a  handful of plotting routines.   H This morning I throw open my 132x66 DECterm, but find that I cannot plotH outside of an 800x480 region at the top of the window. I suspect that itC is no coincidence that this is the resolution supported by a VT340.   E Apparently, in my fiddling around yesterday I managed to accidentally C issue a command that allowed me to escape the VT340 box and use the   entire DECterm window for ReGIS.  E Does anyone know what this command was? I'd really like to be able to , make 800x800 plots instead of 800x480 plots.  D Additionally, is there a way to ask the terminal how large its ReGIS
 screen is?   Thanks!    --  
 roger ivie rivie@ridgenet.net   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 23:50:18 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> # Subject: Re: DECterm ReGIS clipping , Message-ID: <43E2E0ED.4376A86F@teksavvy.com>   Roger Ivie wrote: G > Apparently, in my fiddling around yesterday I managed to accidentally E > issue a command that allowed me to escape the VT340 box and use the " > entire DECterm window for ReGIS.    Not sure, but from a 240 manual:  E S(A[0,0][799,479])  Defines the screen as having coordinate values of ; [0,0] for upper left corner, and [799,479] for lower right.    S[0,0]  No scrolling selected.    E T (M[1,2]) Size multiplication facto of 1 for width and 2 for height.   G The manual talks about maintaining the same aspect ratio for the screen D size so that software design to draw a square on a VT240 will draw aM square (instead of a rectangle) on another device with different screen size.    ------------------------------   Date: 2 Feb 2006 13:10:37 -0600 ; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) ' Subject: Re: FOR070.DAT files appearing 3 Message-ID: <zG8A4fm2z8po@eisner.encompasserve.org>   Z In article <droll5$kav$1@news01.intel.com>, Ken Fairfield <my.full.name@intel.com> writes:  H >     I'm afraid both of you are *WAY* out of date...by almost 15 years.H > IMPLICIT NONE has been Standard Fortran since 1993 when the Fortran 90G > standard was formally approved.  When F90 was approved, it became the E > single, official, international Fortran standard.  Period.  I mean, J > we're not splitting hairs by referencing IBM's FORTRAN IV, the so-calledI > FORTRAN 66 which wasn't much of a standard, nor ANSI FORTRAN 77.  We're F > talking about THE Fortran STANDARD.  Which, by the way, presently isI > Fortran 95 (some minor edits/corrections to Fortran 90) and is about to G > by superseded by what is unofficially referred to as Fortran 2003 (or  > F2K3).  F    Is there a draft of the "2003" standard or synopsis of the changes     on the web somewhere?   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Feb 2006 07:29:38 +0100 3 From: Wilm Boerhout <w4OLD.boerhout@PAINTplanet.nl> 5 Subject: Re: Here it is: OpenVMS/Alpha on a simulator 5 Message-ID: <43e2f852$0$9353$ba620dc5@nova.planet.nl>   * Warren Spencer mailde op 1-2-2006 20:56...  $ > - Is OpenVMS clustering supported? > - Volume Shadowing? N > - Can it co-exist on my pc with it's own IP address, or does one of us have  > to give up the NIC? J > - There's some confusion as to whether it supports only 6.2, or 6.2 and   G All this can be derived from the hardware config it emulates; remember  > it emulates real Alpha hardware, more specifically a 4000-300:  I - Clustering is technically possible (LAVC). Normal cluster config rules   apply. - Disks may be shadowed.? - You have the option of sharing a NIC between Windows and VMS  . (promiscuous mode), or dedicating a NIC to VMSI - It requires/supports the same versions of VMS as the original hardware. H    I.e. if the original Alpha 4000-300 required VMS 6.2, Personal Alpha 
 also does.   /Wilm    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 20:59:56 -0600 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>/ Subject: Re: Intel/Hp spend $10 billion on IA64 + Message-ID: <43E2C72C.B1944AC2@comcast.net>    Bill Todd wrote: >  > FredK wrote: >  > ...  > % >    The costs and length of time for K > > OpenVMS to be ported to another architecture would not be a good thing.  > I > Well, it's already evident that the cost and length of time to port VMS J > to Itanic was not a good thing.  But the cost and length of time to port= > it to an architecture with better prospects still might be.    Indeed.   E Think of it this way: Folks who bought Cisco and Google at their IPOs G were hopeful, but had no way of knowing. To late to invest in those now  and expect such grand results.  G The IA32 gravy train passed VMS by. The x86-64 opportunity is knocking. * Will this train likewise be missed by VMS?   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  & Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page! http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/   ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/   ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 21:10:13 -0600 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>/ Subject: Re: Intel/Hp spend $10 billion on IA64 + Message-ID: <43E2C994.AFB3D8A8@comcast.net>    JF Mezei wrote:  >  > Bill Todd wrote:K > > Well, it's already evident that the cost and length of time to port VMS L > > to Itanic was not a good thing.  But the cost and length of time to port? > > it to an architecture with better prospects still might be.  > G > If the arguments used to murder Alpha and port VMS to that IA64 thing 7 > are still valid, then VMS must be ported to the 8086.   G Dunno, guy. If folks argue so vehemently against 32-bit VMS on x86, how > much more ardently will they argue against 8/16-bit VMS on the& antiquated, obsolescent 8086 chip? ;-)  D > -The 8086 shows greater performance improvement promises than IA64 > -The 8086 is truly industry   G Correction: "de-facto". IA32 (which is really what you mean, and not an G 8/16 bit CPU design) is not a specification held by or otherwise in the 5 custody of any acknowledged, accepted standards body.   : > standard and commodity and low priced due to competition. > -The 8086 spans from handheld to datacentre.; > -Would allow HP to truly simplify its hardware platforms. F > -IA64 is a low volume, expensive and proprietary single vendor  chip+ > with limited growth and market potential.  > ! > HP should simply bite ist lips,   F You're asking them to swallow their pride and admit a mistake. StudiesE show that people would rather die or speak in public before they will 8 admit a mistake, especially if they must do so publicly.  ' > admit IA64 isn't going to make it and G > spend the 10 billion on porting VMS, HP-UX and NSK to the 8086 and be A > done with any specualtion about the future of its systems. That : > speculation hurts sales, whether it is justified or not. > A > We are merely REPORTING on the speculation here, not making it.   
 Debatable.  
 > HP could% > stop that speculation if it wanted.   D I have it on good authority that they don't want to due to corporate policy.   F Besides, as many here have pointed out, it's all in how you "spin" it.  A If an effort to port VMS to x86-64 should suddenly come to light, H various pundits could "spin" it as an effort to expand HP's reach in theC server space by adding another "weapon" in their product "arsenal".    Optimistic SOB, ain't I? ;-)   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  & Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page! http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/   ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/   ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 21:12:44 -0600 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>/ Subject: Re: Intel/Hp spend $10 billion on IA64 * Message-ID: <43E2CA2C.68D478C@comcast.net>   Dave Froble wrote: >  > JF Mezei wrote:  > > Bill Todd wrote: > > K > >>Well, it's already evident that the cost and length of time to port VMS L > >>to Itanic was not a good thing.  But the cost and length of time to port? > >>it to an architecture with better prospects still might be.  > >  > > I > > If the arguments used to murder Alpha and port VMS to that IA64 thing 9 > > are still valid, then VMS must be ported to the 8086.  > > F > > -The 8086 shows greater performance improvement promises than IA64X > > -The 8086 is truly industry standard and commodity and low priced due to competition0 > > -The 8086 spans from handheld to datacentre.= > > -Would allow HP to truly simplify its hardware platforms. H > > -IA64 is a low volume, expensive and proprietary single vendor  chip- > > with limited growth and market potential.  > >  > > I > > HP should simply bite ist lips, admit IA64 isn't going to make it and I > > spend the 10 billion on porting VMS, HP-UX and NSK to the 8086 and be C > > done with any specualtion about the future of its systems. That < > > speculation hurts sales, whether it is justified or not. > > L > > We are merely REPORTING on the speculation here, not making it. HP could' > > stop that speculation if it wanted.  > I > The speculation is that long term HP may not want to be in the software " > business.  At least OS software. > J > Someone mentioned recently that when asked about the itanic not becomingH > 'industry standard', Mark Gorham replied, "that's not an option".  I'mH > thinking that HP doesn't have a contigency for the itanic not becoming > industry standard.    B As I read that, I found myself wondering which standards body IA644 should be submitted to: ANSI? IEEE? EIA? ISO? CCITT?   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  & Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page! http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/   ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/   ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 23:26:12 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> / Subject: Re: Intel/Hp spend $10 billion on IA64 * Message-ID: <43E2DB48.13E925@teksavvy.com>   David J Dachtera wrote: I > The IA32 gravy train passed VMS by. The x86-64 opportunity is knocking. , > Will this train likewise be missed by VMS?  F If the VMS engineers/management can't be convinced that porting vMS toE the 8086 would be a good thing, they certaintly aren't going to fight  for it at higher HP levels.   G Hopefully they statements here are simply reflective of self censorship H while internally, the VMS management is fighting very hard to get VMS to	 the 8086.   G If only we could get some indication that VMS management agree that VMS C would have much bigger market potential if it were available on the F 8086, we'd have some sense that they are foghting internally to get it to the 8086.  A As long as the VMS folks keep on denying the obvious, we can only H conclude that VMS management are against VMS on the 8086 and are puttingG VMS on a dead end just because they feel obligated to toe the corporate > line even though HP's core product is where we want VMS to go.  E If Windows and Linux can be on 8086 for high volume /profitable stuff : and on that IA64 for niche low volume stuff, so could VMS.   ------------------------------   Date: 2 Feb 2006 13:25:12 -0600 ; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) $ Subject: Re: null terminated strings3 Message-ID: <ROkA$FxLQvjb@eisner.encompasserve.org>   V In article <44epquF1rojsU2@individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:H > Just an interesting (at least it was to me!) little side note.  PeopleG > frequently attack C because of it's use of null terminated strings. I F > have pointed out int he pst that this was apparently not unique to CF > and Unix as the PDP-11 had a print routine in the Macro Library thatF > expected null terminated string.  As another interesting data point,G > I am in the process of examining the binary of a Z80 program from the G > late 70's or very early 80's and, surpirse, surprise, all the strings C > are null terminated.  Being as I know this program was built from E > Pascal source, it looks even more like null terminated strings were E > pretty much industry standard by the time Unix and C decided to use  > them.   B    Late 70s?  C is a product of the late 60s.  PASCAL came several    years after C.   G    PASCAL requires that the location and length of a string be tracked, E    but does not require an implementation.  Many PASCAL compilers use =    counted strings.  Descriptors work, too.  I think the full C    functionality of PASCAL has always required that the _allocated_     length be tracked.   F    This is different from C which requires the implementation be null .    termination and to track the _used_ length.  C    Nothing prevents a C compiler from tracking the allocated length C    (the implementation of "pointer: as address is nearly universal, @    but not required), but compiler writers don't add things that     the standard doesn't require.  F    I think there was a product marketed under the name of Safe C whichB    would track allocated length and prevent buffer overruns but it    didn't sell.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 14:26:58 -0500 ( From: Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net>$ Subject: Re: null terminated stringsG Message-ID: <C8ydnRYQ7LuTwH_enZ2dnUVZ_t-dnZ2d@metrocastcablevision.com>    Keith A. Lewis wrote:    ...   F   I used ASCIZ data in an assembly language course on LSI-11 machines, > so it's not unique to C.  B Not at all:  ASCIZ was a fine format to use for things like error H message strings whose length was statically defined (and you could even G define macros to check that their length was within the bounds of your   defined buffer IIRC).   B For strings passed into an application from the outside, however, # length-checks are pretty important.    - bill   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 20:42:38 GMT % From: Roger Ivie <rivie@ridgenet.net> $ Subject: Re: null terminated strings3 Message-ID: <slrndu4rlu.jje.rivie@stench.no.domain>   8 On 2006-02-02, Bill Gunshannon <bill@cs.uofs.edu> wrote:% >  As another interesting data point, G > I am in the process of examining the binary of a Z80 program from the G > late 70's or very early 80's and, surpirse, surprise, all the strings  > are null terminated.  G The Z80 Pascals I used tended to store strings as a count byte followed B by the string data. Not saying there weren't Z80 Pascals that usedH null-terminated strings, just that in my experience count/data was more ! popular amongst the Pascal crowd.   C In CP/M, the string terminator used by the operating system for the * Print String call was a dollar sign ('$'). --  
 roger ivie rivie@ridgenet.net   ------------------------------   Date: 2 Feb 2006 23:54:05 GMT ( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)$ Subject: Re: null terminated strings+ Message-ID: <44fkctF1vim6U1@individual.net>   3 In article <ROkA$FxLQvjb@eisner.encompasserve.org>, > 	koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:X > In article <44epquF1rojsU2@individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:I >> Just an interesting (at least it was to me!) little side note.  People H >> frequently attack C because of it's use of null terminated strings. IG >> have pointed out int he pst that this was apparently not unique to C G >> and Unix as the PDP-11 had a print routine in the Macro Library that G >> expected null terminated string.  As another interesting data point, H >> I am in the process of examining the binary of a Z80 program from theH >> late 70's or very early 80's and, surpirse, surprise, all the stringsD >> are null terminated.  Being as I know this program was built fromF >> Pascal source, it looks even more like null terminated strings wereF >> pretty much industry standard by the time Unix and C decided to use >> them. > D >    Late 70s?  C is a product of the late 60s.  PASCAL came several >    years after C.   E Sadly, no.  Jensen & Wirth are credited with creating Pascal in 1970. G While the "creation" of C is listed as 1971 the language known as K&R C G doesn't appear until 1978.  The whole language timeline is available on  the web.   > I >    PASCAL requires that the location and length of a string be tracked, G >    but does not require an implementation.  Many PASCAL compilers use ? >    counted strings.  Descriptors work, too.  I think the full E >    functionality of PASCAL has always required that the _allocated_  >    length be tracked.   D Apparently not.  :-)   Actually, early Pascals did not have a STRINGE type (Jensen & Wirth for instance).  I believe it was UCSD that began E the use of counted strings.  At least that was the first I saw and it + seemed most followers used the same method.    > H >    This is different from C which requires the implementation be null 0 >    termination and to track the _used_ length. > E >    Nothing prevents a C compiler from tracking the allocated length E >    (the implementation of "pointer: as address is nearly universal, B >    but not required), but compiler writers don't add things that" >    the standard doesn't require. > H >    I think there was a product marketed under the name of Safe C whichD >    would track allocated length and prevent buffer overruns but it >    didn't sell.   H Personally, I would have no problem with someone writing a new C libraryI that supported a better string concept.  But I don't figure there is much 
 chance of it.     bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------   Date: 2 Feb 2006 23:56:32 GMT ( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)$ Subject: Re: null terminated strings+ Message-ID: <44fkhgF1vim6U2@individual.net>   3 In article <slrndu4rlu.jje.rivie@stench.no.domain>, ( 	Roger Ivie <rivie@ridgenet.net> writes:: > On 2006-02-02, Bill Gunshannon <bill@cs.uofs.edu> wrote:& >>  As another interesting data point,H >> I am in the process of examining the binary of a Z80 program from theH >> late 70's or very early 80's and, surpirse, surprise, all the strings >> are null terminated.  > I > The Z80 Pascals I used tended to store strings as a count byte followed  > by the string data.    The UCSD String concept.  D >                     Not saying there weren't Z80 Pascals that usedJ > null-terminated strings, just that in my experience count/data was more # > popular amongst the Pascal crowd.   I The Pascal code I am dealing with doesn't have a string data type at all. < The null terminated strings I mentioned are string contants.   bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------   Date: 3 Feb 2006 00:25:57 -0600 2 From: "Dave Weatherall" <djw-nothere@nospam.nohow>% Subject: Re: Open VMS programing in C ? Message-ID: <DTiotGxQ0bj6-pn2-riuY3hr896BI@dave2_os2.home.ours>   D On Wed, 1 Feb 2006 14:08:08 UTC, Paul Sture <paul.sture@bluewin.ch>  wrote:   > Dave Weatherall wrote:J > > On Tue, 31 Jan 2006 12:24:45 UTC, "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> 
 > > wrote: Snip    > > J > > Nobody ever seems to get nostalgic about EDI as featured on RSX11-M.  H > > Line oriented editor with 66 (IIRC) lines per page - great fun (!). J > > OTOH it had a very small memory footprint and even with a priority of G > > 65 didn't bring a 128kw pdp-11/60 to its knees when running others  J > > things. 2 EDT sessions at priority 50 did. Some users were dis-chuffedH > > when I dropped EDT's to 49 so that the real-time test system didn't  > > suffer.  > >  > H > My first editor war! My introduction to VMS was with EDT, but the RSX G > die-hards still favoured EDI, and the documentation guy favoured SOS.  > # > Many heated discussions there :-)   F lol. I have to add, I did not miss EDI when we finally got to VMS :-) E ~I user Anker Berg-Sonne's SEDT all the time now. Even tho' it still  C has file-name storage limited to 128 chars. Must fix it one day...  B Yeah it does occaaionally crash when I'm deep in a directory tree.   --   Cheers - Dave W.   ------------------------------   Date: 2 Feb 2006 16:00:15 -0800 , From: "rcyoung" <rcyoung@aliconsultants.com>( Subject: Re: Phaser 560 and DCPS problemC Message-ID: <1138924815.597568.208640@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>    Here is the result of the logs   The FROM log is    <CTRL-D(IN)> <CTRL-D(IN)>' %%[ status: busy; source: AppSocket ]%% ' %%[ status: busy; source: AppSocket ]%% ' %%[ status: busy; source: AppSocket ]%%  <CTRL-D(IN)> <CTRL-D(IN)>- %%[ Error: undefined; OffendingCommand:  ]%% > %%[ Flushing: rest of job (to end-of-file) will be ignored ]%%* %%[ status: waiting; source: AppSocket ]%%* %%[ status: waiting; source: AppSocket ]%% <CTRL-D(IN)> %%[ status: idle ]%% <CTRL-D(IN)> <CTRL-D(IN)> <CTRL-D(IN)> %%[ status: idle ]%% <CTRL-D(IN)>- %%[ Error: undefined; OffendingCommand:  ]%% > %%[ Flushing: rest of job (to end-of-file) will be ignored ]%%* %%[ status: waiting; source: AppSocket ]%% <CTRL-D(IN)> %%[ status: idle ]%% %%[ status: idle ]%% <CTRL-D(IN)>- %%[ Error: undefined; OffendingCommand:  ]%% > %%[ Flushing: rest of job (to end-of-file) will be ignored ]%%* %%[ status: waiting; source: AppSocket ]%% <CTRL-D(IN)> %%[ status: idle ]%% %%[ status: idle ]%% <CTRL-D(IN)>     The TO  LOG is  
 <CTRL-T(OUT)> 
 <CTRL-D(OUT)> 
 <CTRL-T(OUT)> 
 <CTRL-T(OUT)> 	 %/4=7F0 
 <CTRL-T(OUT)> 
 <CTRL-D(OUT)> 
 <CTRL-T(OUT)> 
 <CTRL-C(OUT)> 
 <CTRL-D(OUT)> 
 <CTRL-T(OUT)> 	 %/4=7F0 
 <CTRL-T(OUT)> 
 <CTRL-T(OUT)> 
 <CTRL-C(OUT)> 
 <CTRL-D(OUT)> 
 <CTRL-T(OUT)> 	 %/4=7F0 
 <CTRL-T(OUT)> 
 <CTRL-T(OUT)> 
 <CTRL-C(OUT)> 
 <CTRL-D(OUT)> 
 <CTRL-T(OUT)>     Any ideas?    ------------------------------   Date: 2 Feb 2006 17:46:15 -0800 , From: "rcyoung" <rcyoung@aliconsultants.com>( Subject: Re: Phaser 560 and DCPS problemC Message-ID: <1138931175.608812.195260@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>   = Tried nosync, got  the following (no log files generated from 
 DPCS$TEST)     "DCPS$PHASER_NO_SYNC" = "1"     "DCPS$PHASER_PID" = "00000122"   "DCPS$TEST" = "1"         9 $ PRINT /PARAMETERS=DIAG=FILE=BOTH/queue=phaser login.com 4 Job LOGIN (queue PHASER, entry 17) started on PHASER $ 8 %%%%%%%%%%%  OPCOM   2-FEB-2006 20:34:36.14  %%%%%%%%%%%" Message from user SYSTEM on EMAC73D Queue PHASER: %DCPS-F-REQMODNOTFOUND, Required device control module LPS$$PRINTERTYPE not found   $   B %DCPS-I-RELEASE, $SET QUEUE/RELEASE/ENTRY=17 PHASER to release for printing@ -DCPS-I-JOB_ID, for job LOGIN (queue PHASER, entry 17) on PHASER $ 8 %%%%%%%%%%%  OPCOM   2-FEB-2006 20:34:38.78  %%%%%%%%%%%" Message from user SYSTEM on EMAC73E Queue PHASER: %DCPS-F-CONTERMINATED, Connection abnormally terminated     + Any idea what is missing? LPS$$PRINERTYPE??    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 17:06:25 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> 6 Subject: Re: Print to (Canon) ImageRunner from OpenVMS, Message-ID: <43E2825A.FED88C76@teksavvy.com>   norm.raphael@metso.com wrote: E > Someone in our shop just swapped an HPLJ5N for a Cannon ImageRunner  > xsomethingx,I > and is now surprised that print from VMS (Via MULTINET_STREAM_SYMBIONT)  > dies.     C Sorry to say this but RTFM :-)  You need to check the new printer's H manual to find out exactly what its capabilities are and compare them toH what the ols HP printer had, and look and how the HP one had been setup.  F It could be that your new printer doesn't support the same port numberA for the raw TCPIP connection. It isn't a standard and varies from  printer to printer.   ' Once you have a good idea, you can use:   C Try to TELNET/PORT=xxx ip.ad.re.ss of your printer, then <CTRL>[ to + access the TELNET> prompt and SET LINE_MODE   
 Then, type   hello world<CR><LF><FF>   F and see if your printer ejects a page with "hello world"  on it, or if% it spints out some error message etc.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 2 Feb 2006 16:59:51 -0500 From: norm.raphael@metso.com? Subject: Re: Print to (Canon) ImageRunner from OpenVMS [solved] Q Message-ID: <OF347635B8.6ECDCE44-ON85257109.00788B85-85257109.0078D63C@metso.com>   7 norm.raphael@metso.com wrote on 02/02/2006 01:50:28 PM:   E > Someone in our shop just swapped an HPLJ5N for a Cannon ImageRunner 7 > xsomethingx, and is now surprised that print from VMS & > (Via MULTINET_STREAM_SYMBIONT) dies. > I > Does anyone know how to get a simple text file to print to this device. F > If I need DCPS I can get it installed, but I have no experience with > it.  >  > OpenVMS V7.3-1  Alpha  >   @ It turns out I just had to change the printer module personality; setting from "AUTO" to "PCL" and the HPLJ files print fine. 9 Moreover, I can do it from HTTP to the device IP-address. B Very easy.  I'm surprised more folk here and at Process don't know	 about it.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 21:21:44 -0600 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>? Subject: Re: Print to (Canon) ImageRunner from OpenVMS [solved] + Message-ID: <43E2CC47.875C0F0F@comcast.net>    norm.raphael@metso.com wrote:  > 9 > norm.raphael@metso.com wrote on 02/02/2006 01:50:28 PM:  > G > > Someone in our shop just swapped an HPLJ5N for a Cannon ImageRunner 9 > > xsomethingx, and is now surprised that print from VMS ( > > (Via MULTINET_STREAM_SYMBIONT) dies. > > K > > Does anyone know how to get a simple text file to print to this device. H > > If I need DCPS I can get it installed, but I have no experience with > > it.  > >  > > OpenVMS V7.3-1  Alpha  > >  > B > It turns out I just had to change the printer module personality= > setting from "AUTO" to "PCL" and the HPLJ files print fine. ; > Moreover, I can do it from HTTP to the device IP-address. D > Very easy.  I'm surprised more folk here and at Process don't know > about it.   A Hey - we're CLI-based character-cell critters. We don't know from 
 HTTP/HTML/...    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  & Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page! http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/   ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/   ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 14:54:36 -0600 % From: Dan Foster <usenet@evilphb.org> ! Subject: Re: SimH V3.5-2 released 5 Message-ID: <slrndu4scc.vh2.usenet@zappy.catbert.org>   p In article <Xmhi92jRAhq1@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Bob Koehler <koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org> wrote: > E >    Can I configure the 11/780 with 1/2 MB of RAM and no FPA (that's  >    what we had)?  E Hmm. SIMH appears to allow memory ranging from 8 MB to 128 MB for the G 11/780 virtual machine. I don't see a way to make it any smaller, short * of perhaps some minor source code hacking.  F By default, the FPA is compiled in; you'd want to remove the vax_fpa.cI target from Makefile or DESCRIP.MMS and rebuild SIMH's BIN/vax780 target.   D (Not personally tested myself, but that's the only reference to it.)   -Dan   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 22:20:17 +0100 + From: Karsten Nyblad <nospam@nospam.nospam> ! Subject: Re: SimH V3.5-2 released = Message-ID: <43e2778a$0$67261$157c6196@dreader2.cybercity.dk>    Dan Foster wrote: r > In article <Xmhi92jRAhq1@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Bob Koehler <koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org> wrote: > E >>   Can I configure the 11/780 with 1/2 MB of RAM and no FPA (that's  >>   what we had)? >  > G > Hmm. SIMH appears to allow memory ranging from 8 MB to 128 MB for the I > 11/780 virtual machine. I don't see a way to make it any smaller, short , > of perhaps some minor source code hacking. > H > By default, the FPA is compiled in; you'd want to remove the vax_fpa.cK > target from Makefile or DESCRIP.MMS and rebuild SIMH's BIN/vax780 target.  > F > (Not personally tested myself, but that's the only reference to it.) >  > -DanI Those old versions of VMS had a special parameter were you could set the  I among of physical memory to use.  You can simply set that parameter with  F sysgen.  I think it starts with physical.  The parameter was intended @ for Digital so that they did not have to remove memory from the G computer, when testing configurations with little memory.  My guess is  < that it is also in the newest versions.  Try help in sysgen.   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 03 Feb 2006 00:30:59 GMT / From: Clay M. Denton <denton@orison.dsserv.com> ! Subject: Re: SimH V3.5-2 released 8 Message-ID: <ju85u15fkuhl82sh9eq6cmvm8vcvg58a1m@4ax.com>  
 PHYSICALPAGES    Clay  P On Thu, 02 Feb 2006 22:20:17 +0100, Karsten Nyblad <nospam@nospam.nospam> wrote:   >Dan Foster wrote:s >> In article <Xmhi92jRAhq1@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Bob Koehler <koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org> wrote:  >>  F >>>   Can I configure the 11/780 with 1/2 MB of RAM and no FPA (that's >>>   what we had)?  >>   >>  H >> Hmm. SIMH appears to allow memory ranging from 8 MB to 128 MB for theJ >> 11/780 virtual machine. I don't see a way to make it any smaller, short- >> of perhaps some minor source code hacking.  >>  I >> By default, the FPA is compiled in; you'd want to remove the vax_fpa.c L >> target from Makefile or DESCRIP.MMS and rebuild SIMH's BIN/vax780 target. >>  G >> (Not personally tested myself, but that's the only reference to it.)  >>   >> -Dan J >Those old versions of VMS had a special parameter were you could set the J >among of physical memory to use.  You can simply set that parameter with G >sysgen.  I think it starts with physical.  The parameter was intended  A >for Digital so that they did not have to remove memory from the  H >computer, when testing configurations with little memory.  My guess is = >that it is also in the newest versions.  Try help in sysgen.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 02 Feb 2006 14:59:35 -0600 / From: Chris Scheers <chris@applied-synergy.com> & Subject: Re: Splitting serial cables ?+ Message-ID: <44fa37F1v2i6U1@individual.net>    Neil Rieck wrote:  >> William Webb wrote:H >>> And various members of the DECserver 700 family can boot from flash  >>> memory. 1 >> The 700s still command a lot of money on Ebay.  >>I >> The cheaper 90s work with thinwire ethernet, an infrastructure which I - >> have just eliminated 2 days ago :-( :-( :-  >>N > It's funny you mentioned this because we needed to replace our DECserver-200N > boxes with DS-90 machines about four years ago and purchased some "10-base-TK > to thin-net" conversion widgets to do it. We are still using those things G > and I cringe every time I look at the little black power-supply cubes  > powering them.  F I have an Allied-Telesis MR122T Thinwire to 10BaseT repeater.  It's a B nice little box with no power brick because the power cable plugs  directly into it.   H What I would recommend now, however, is picking up a 10BaseT hub with a F Thinwire BNC connector on the back.  These are very inexpensive these D days and will do the job. (As well as giving you some extra 10BaseT G ports if you want them.)  Sometimes you can also find them with an AUI   port on the back.    --  G ----------------------------------------------------------------------- $ Chris Scheers, Applied Synergy, Inc.  B Voice: 817-237-3360            Internet: chris@applied-synergy.com    Fax: 817-237-3074   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2006.067 ************************