INFO-VAX Sat, 30 Jun 2007 Volume 2007 : Issue 353 Contents: Busyclock.com and Stop_Busyclock.com [was Re: IP Lease] Re: expanding shadow size Re: expanding shadow size Re: expanding shadow size Re: How to structure installation of TCPIP related products Re: IP Lease Re: IP Lease Re: IP Lease Re: OpenVMS - When downtime is not an option Re: OpenVMS - When downtime is not an option Re: Question on FCS vs RMS on PDP11 RSX Re: Search Largest Database of DEC VAX PDP Manuals Re: Tech support Re: VTJ V10 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 14:03:55 -0700 From: Fred Bach Subject: Busyclock.com and Stop_Busyclock.com [was Re: IP Lease] Message-ID: <468573BB.1020903@triumf.ca> Bob Koehler wrote: > > We used to have folks spawn a subprocess to do something like the > above slowly in the background. Just make sure the application > you're running can be used with "broadcast" messages on the screen. > Indeed. I used a modified copy of Peter Klammer's Busyclock for years on a VAX cluster that had an idle-process killer just waiting. Read over the code and see if it suits your needs. (See below). I have a symbol to start busyclock: BUSYC*LOCK == "@OPS$DIR:[COM]BUSYCLOCK.COM" And I have a symbol to stop busyclock: SBC == "@BACH$DIR:[COM]STOP_BUSYCLOCK.COM" !(also found in OPS$DIR:[COM]) First, here is STOP_BUSYCLOCK.COM : $! New STOP_BUSYCLOCK.COM $! Stops all subprocesses of process calling this routine but only if $! the sub process's process name has BUSYCLOCK in it. $! Replaces old stop_busyclock.com which wrote all subprocesses out to a $! file and then selected the ones to kill. The technique was very slow. $! This new one is very fast. $! written by Fred Bach, TRIUMF Operations 16-FEB-2001 $! called from BUSYCLOCK.COM $! $!Establish an error and Ctrl/Y handler $ $ on error then goto error $ on control_y then goto error $ pid = f$getjpi("","pid") $! $ ctx = "" $ temp = F$CONTEXT ("PROCESS", ctx, "MASTER_PID",PID,"EQL") $! $!Loop over all processes that meet the selection criteria. $! $LOOP: $ sub_pid = f$pid(ctx) $ if sub_pid .eqs. PID then goto loop !do not stop the MASTER process $ if sub_pid .eqs. "" $ then $ goto ENDLOOP $ else $ prcnam = F$GETJPI(sub_pid,"PRCNAM") $! SHOW SYMBOL sub_pid $! WRITE SYS$OUTPUT prcnam $ if f$locate("BUSYCLOCK",prcnam) .ne. f$length(prcnam) then stop/id='sub_pid' $ goto LOOP $ endif $!The loop over the processes has ended. $! $ENDLOOP: $ EXIT $! $!Error handler. Clean up the context's memory with $!the CANCEL selection item keyword. $! $ERROR: $ if F$TYPE(ctx) .eqs. "PROCESS_CONTEXT" then temp = F$CONTEXT ("PROCESS", ctx, "CANCEL") $ EXIT Next, here is BUSYCLOCK.COM (uses STOP_BUSYCLOCK.COM code first): $! BUSYCLOCK.COM -- post the time once in a while, keep watchdogs at bay. $ $ set symbol /scope=(nolocal,noglobal) ! avoid redefinitions of COPY etc. $ $ if p1 .eqs. "LAUNCHED" then goto LAUNCHED $ if f$mode() .nes. "INTERACTIVE" then exit $ $! the next few lines was my original attempt at stopping a running $! busyclock process. If this busyclock were the FIRST such process $! then we got into a bad loop where its name was just "busyclock" $! and the next DECTERM signed on would call BUSYCLOCK.COM and this $! would kill the BUSYCLOCK process for the PREVIOUS DECTERM. $! Later I wrote a routine called STOP_BUSYCLOCK.COM which keeps $! the process killing to the current process tree. I have adapted $! that STOP_BUSYCLOCK.COM routine and added it a few lines below. $! 19-DEC-2003 FWB. $!next 4 lines added to stop busyclock if already running 01-NOV-92 FWB $! message_status = f$environment("MESSAGE") $! set message/notext/noident/nosever/nofacil $! set noon $! stop busyclock $! set on $! set message'message_status' $! $! ******** start of new STOP_BUSYCLOCK routine 19-DEC-2003 $! $! New STOP_BUSYCLOCK.COM $! Stops all subprocesses of process calling this routine but only if $! the sub process's process name has BUSYCLOCK in it. $! Replaces old stop_busyclock.com which wrote all subprocesses out to a $! file and then selected the ones to kill. The technique was very slow. $! This new one is very fast. $! written by Fred Bach, TRIUMF Operations 16-FEB-2001 $! called from BUSYCLOCK.COM $! $!Establish an error and Ctrl/Y handler $ $ on error then goto SBC_ERROR $ on control_y then goto SBC_ERROR $ pid = f$getjpi("","pid") $! $ ctx = "" $ temp = F$CONTEXT ("PROCESS", ctx, "MASTER_PID",PID,"EQL") $! $!Loop over all processes that meet the selection criteria. $! $SBC_LOOP: $ sub_pid = f$pid(ctx) $ if sub_pid .eqs. PID then goto sbc_loop !do not stop the MASTER process $ if sub_pid .eqs. "" $ then $ goto SBC_ENDLOOP $ else $ prcnam = F$GETJPI(sub_pid,"PRCNAM") $! SHOW SYMBOL sub_pid $! WRITE SYS$OUTPUT prcnam $ if f$locate("BUSYCLOCK",prcnam) .ne. f$length(prcnam) then stop/id='sub_pid' $ goto SBC_LOOP $ endif $!The loop over the processes has ended. $! $SBC_ENDLOOP: $ CONTINUE $! $!SBC Error handler. Clean up the context's memory with $!the CANCEL selection item keyword. $! $SBC_ERROR: $ if F$TYPE(ctx) .eqs. "PROCESS_CONTEXT" then temp = F$CONTEXT ("PROCESS", ctx, "CANCEL") $ CONTINUE $! $! *********** end of new STOP_BUSYCLOCK.COM routine ********** $ $!if statement added to stop writing to bottom line at login 25-oct-92 FWB $! if f$trnlnm("sys$rem_node") .eqs. "PROG::" $! then $! set term/dev=vt100 $! assign/nolog VT100 TRIUMF_TERMINAL_TYPE $! endif $!end of 25-oct-92 if statement FWB $ if f$getjpi( "", "TERMINAL" ) .eqs. "" then - $ assign TT TERMINAL !fwb 26-SEP-92 $! exit commented out 26-SEP-92 FWB $ terminal_width = f$getdvi( f$getjpi( "", "TERMINAL" ), "DEVBUFSIZ" ) $ terminal_width = 'terminal_width' - 1 !for KI-DEKnet 26-SEP-92 FWB $ terminal_ansi = f$getdvi( f$getjpi( "", "TERMINAL" ), "tt_ansicrt" ) $ $ process_n = 0 $ processname := busyclock $process_again: $ on error then goto process_increment $ define/use sys$output nl: $ define/use sys$error nl: $ show proc 'processname' $ goto process_ok $process_increment: $ process_n = process_n + 1 $ processname = "BUSYCLOCK''process_n'" $ goto process_again $process_ok: $ $ spawn/nolog/nowait/input=nl:/proc='processname' - @'f$env("procedure")' LAUNCHED 'processname' 'terminal_width' 'terminal_ansi' 'p1' $ write sys$output "BUSYCLOCK is launched; type STOP ''processname' (or log out) to terminate it." $ exit $ $LAUNCHED: $ processname = p2 $ terminal_width = p3 $ terminal_ansi = p4 $ spawnlatency = p5 .eqs. "SPAWNLATENCY" $ esc[0,8] = %x1B $ savecursor = esc + "7" $ restorecursor = esc + "8" $ reverse = esc + "[7m" $ blink = esc + "[5m" $ normal = esc + "[0m" $ dummytext = " day dd-mmm-yyyy hh:mm " $ if spawnlatency then dummytext = dummytext + blink + "000" + " " $ display_length = f$length( dummytext ) $ column = terminal_width - 1 - display_length $ toprightcursor = esc + "[1;''column'H" $! statusline = esc + "[1$}" $! unstatusline = normal + esc + "[0$}" $ statusline = esc + "[1$" !26-SEP-92 FWB remove "}" $ unstatusline = normal + esc + "[0$" !26-SEP-92 FWB remove "}" $ $ if terminal_ansi then - goto do_ansi $ lead_in = "" $ bs[0,8] = %x08 $ lead_out = f$fao( "!#*''bs'", display_length ) $ goto done_ansi $do_ansi: $ lead_in = savecursor + toprightcursor + statusline + toprightcursor + reverse $ lead_out = unstatusline + normal + restorecursor $done_ansi: $ tmpfile := SYS$LOGIN:'processname'.tmp $ open/write file 'tmpfile' $ dummy = lead_in + dummytext + lead_out $ write file dummy $ close file $ SET FILE /VERSION_LIMIT=1 'tmpfile' $ convert/fdl=sys$input 'tmpfile' SYS$LOGIN:*.* RECORD CARRIAGE_CONTROL none $ $again: $ display_string = - f$extract( 0, 3, f$cvtime( , , "weekday" ) ) - + " " - + f$edit( f$extract( 0, 17, f$time() ), "trim" ) $ if spawnlatency then gosub spawnlatency $ gosub center_string $ file_string = lead_in + display_string + lead_out $ open/read/write file 'tmpfile' $ read file dummy $ write/update file file_string $ close file $ copy 'tmpfile' sys$output $ wait 0:00:10 !fwb $ goto again $ $! subroutine $spawnlatency: $ time = f$cvtime() $ todays_date = f$element( 0, " ", time ) $ gosub time_to_seconds $ seconds_before = seconds $ spawn/nolog /input=nl: $ time = f$cvtime() $ gosub time_to_seconds $ seconds_elapsed = f$fao( "!3SL", seconds - seconds_before ) $ alarm = " " $ highlight = reverse $ if seconds_elapsed .gt. 9 then alarm = "" $ if seconds_elapsed .gt. 9 then highlight = blink $ display_string = display_string + highlight + seconds_elapsed + alarm $ return $! $time_to_seconds: $! yyyy-mm-dd hh:mm:ss.00 $ date = f$element( 0, " ", time ) $ time = f$element( 1, " ", time ) $ seconds = f$element( 0, ":", time ) * 3600 - + f$element( 1, ":", time ) * 60 - + f$element( 0, ".", f$element( 2, ":", time ) ) $ hundreths = seconds * 100 + + f$element( 1, ".", f$element( 2, ":", time ) ) $ if date .eqs. todays_date then - return $ this_year = 0 + f$element( 0, "-", todays_date ) $ this_month = 0 + f$element( 1, "-", todays_date ) $ this_day = 0 + f$element( 2, "-", todays_date ) $ that_year = 0 + f$element( 0, "-", date ) $ that_month = 0 + f$element( 1, "-", date ) $ that_day = 0 + f$element( 2, "-", date ) $ days = ( that_year - this_year ) * 365 - + ( that_month - this_month ) * 31 - + ( that_day - this_day ) $ seconds = 86400 * days + seconds $ $ return $ $center_string: $ padding = display_length - f$length( display_string ) $ if padding .gt. 0 $ then $ leading = padding / 2 $ trailing = padding - leading $ display_string = f$fao( "!#* !AS!#* ", leading, display_string, trailing ) $ endif $return $ $end: $ exit $ $! REVISION HISTORY $! 19-DEC-2003 fwb Slight reformat. Comment out the node PROG:: stuff $! 19-DEC-2003 fwb Limit STOP BUSYCLOCK to subprocesses of current process $! 26-SEP-1992 fwb Assign TT to TERMINAL if req'd, & comment out "exit" $! 26-SEP-1992 fwb remove curly brace from statusline & unstatusline $! 26-SEP-1992 fwb shorten terminal width by 1 char for KI-DEKnet $! 26-SEP-1992 fwb change refresh time to every 10 seconds $! 4-Jun-1991 pfk merge Hugh Pritchard's centering $! 6-Dec-1990 pfk automatic terminal width detection $! 5-Dec-1990 pfk option SPAWNLATENCY posts spawn time, too. $! 4-Dec-1990 pfk write to host-writeable status line $! 8-Jun-1990 HAP Add weekday; center everything $! Hugh Pritchard, hapritch@MITRE.ORG $! The MITRE Corporation, McLean, Virginia, (703) 883-6616 $! 13-Mar-1990 PFK only top process with real TERMINAL can do this $! 15-Nov-1989 PFK Oops process name has group-wide scope; be unique $! 13-Mar-1989 PFK Zenith restore forgets video state, do a normal $! 19-Feb-1989 JM activate only for interactive process $! 19-Jan-1989 pfk be sensitive to non-DEC terminals $! 18-Jan-1989 pfk Ah-Hah! found a way (ugh) to write without CR/LF $! 20-Nov-1988 JM /INPUT=NL: prevents ^C from hitting us $! Jan Mandel, CU-Denver $! 1-Nov-1988 pfk (... or earlier) first version $! $!Peter F. Klammer, CCP, ACM, IEEE, HKN, TBP, LPF Stop software patents, $!(303)233-9485 fax:(303)556-4822 before they stop you! (Ask me how!) $!11221 West 27th Place PKLAMMER@CUDENVER.bitnet $!Lakewood, Colorado 80215 pklammer@cudnvr.Denver.Colorado.EDU $! $! END REVISION HISTORY ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 11:39:58 -0700 From: Bob Gezelter Subject: Re: expanding shadow size Message-ID: <1183142398.883986.128480@o61g2000hsh.googlegroups.com> On Jun 29, 9:16 am, "johnhreinha...@yahoo.com" wrote: > On Jun 29, 8:48 am, "Klaus-D. Bohn" wrote: > > > > > "R.A.Omond" schrieb im Newsbeitragnews:f62tbq$f0h$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk... > > > > Klaus-D. Bohn wrote: > > > > Hello all together, > > > > > I have an existing problem with a shadow disk. I would like to increase > > the > > > > shadow size without to dismount all the shadow members. > > > > [...snip...] > > > > The result on OpenVMS 7.3-2 and 8.3 (ALPHA) is the same. > > > > > Now, what i do wrong? Or, didn't i understand the technology? > > > > What must i do to get the full volume size 17773524? > > > > > Could anywhere help me? > > > > $ help init /limit > > > Sorry, that is a little bit to easy ;-). > > I have an existing old shadow set which i have to increase with a bigger > > disk. That is the starting point. > > > By the customer, i can't make a dismount of all the shadow member. > > Robert F. Gezelter has a PDF file of a presentation that explains how > to do this without causing a disruption to the users. You can find it > on his web site. The direct link ishttp://www.rlgsc.com/hptechnologyforum/2005/1146.html > > If you look in the ITRC OpenVMS forum (http://forums1.itrc.hp.com/service/forums/familyhome.do?familyId=288) > and search on "Dynamic Volume Expansion" you will find several threads > which may help you with the initialize /limit command. > > You can also search this group for the same thing and find a number of > threads. > > John H. Reinhardt John, Thank you for the reference to my session entitled "Migrating OpenVMS Storage Environments without Interruption/Disruption". Indeed, I gave it at the HP Technology Forum in 2005 (Orlando) and was repeated an updated version of it last week in Las Vegas (the slides from Las Vegas can be found on my www site at http://www.rlgsc.com/hptechnologyforum/2007/1512.html . A recent discussion in the HP ITRC Forum for OpenVMS covered the fact that while I was aware of it, I had not updated the slides to reflect two details relevant to existing volumes that were not covered in the presentation slides: - doing a SET VOLUME/LIMIT on an existing, privately mounted disk; and - turning an existing non-shadowed disk into a shadow set I hope that the above is helpful. - Bob Gezelter, http://www.rlgsc.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 11:46:31 -0700 From: Bob Gezelter Subject: Re: expanding shadow size Message-ID: <1183142791.425734.111840@q75g2000hsh.googlegroups.com> To all, My previous posting was intended to include the exact citation to the recent discussion in the HP ITRC Forum. The correct citation is: "Expanding the size of a shadow set", by Carleen Nutter, http://forums1.itrc.hp.com/service/forums/questionanswer.do?threadId=1139928 - Bob Gezelter, http://www.rlgsc.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 19:55:10 -0500 From: David J Dachtera Subject: Re: expanding shadow size Message-ID: <4685A9EE.2BDD3389@spam.comcast.net> "Klaus-D. Bohn" wrote: > > Hello all together, > > I have an existing problem with a shadow disk. I would like to increase the > shadow size without to dismount all the shadow members. > [snip] > What must i do to get the full volume size 17773524? As Hoff pointed out, can't be done without downtime. You'll need to negotiate a scheduled downtime with your customer. Be sure to explain that this is necessary if they want to realize the desired benefit. -- David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems http://www.djesys.com/ Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/ Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/ Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/ Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 15:17:12 -0400 From: "Richard Whalen" Subject: Re: How to structure installation of TCPIP related products Message-ID: Another way to determine which stack might be in use, this requires that the stack actually be running, not just installed: $ if (f$logical("TCPWARE_NETCP_MBX") .nes. "") then goto TCPware_setup $ if (f$logical("MULTINET_NETWORK_IMAGE") .nes. "") then goto MultiNet_setup $ if (f$logical("TCPIP$INTERNET_SERVICES") .nes. "") then goto UCX_setup ------------------------------ Date: 29 Jun 2007 13:40:53 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: IP Lease Message-ID: In article , "Tom Linden" writes: > This is somewhat OT. > > From home I use PuTTY SSH on an XP laptop through a wireless router > attached to > Comcast cable to access the VMS cluster. If I go to another window for a > while > and return to the VMS session the connection gets closed, so I tried > opening > another window and ran a script which just loops endlessly > $ start: > $ sho time > $ wait 00:01 > $ goto start > > but it only keeps that window alive, so I guess that the two sessions have > different IPs. Don't suppose there is any way of doing this? Not two different IP's. Two different ports. Each port has its own inactivity timer. Looks like you're lucky they're timing all activity. Some systems only time input activity so the above won't work. We used to have folks spawn a subprocess to do something like the above slowly in the background. Just make sure the application you're running can be used with "broadcast" messages on the screen. ------------------------------ Date: 29 Jun 2007 13:43:25 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: IP Lease Message-ID: In article , "Tom Linden" writes: > > BTW, If I submit as batch, how do I get the output to my terminal? > 1) OPER privilege and REPLY 2) We once installed a program with OPER privilege that only did $BROADCAST (now $BRKTHRU). You could roll one in PL/I ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 21:22:51 -0400 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: IP Lease Message-ID: <26493$4685b090$cef8887a$21685@TEKSAVVY.COM> Tom Linden wrote: >> but it only keeps that window alive, so I guess that the two sessions >> have >> different IPs. Don't suppose there is any way of doing this? > > BTW, If I submit as batch, how do I get the output to my terminal? > When host A connects to host B for say telnet, the connection will exist between a random port on host A to port 23 on Host B. Netstat will show you existing connections on this host, the local and the remote ports as well as local and remote IP. When you establish a second session, then a totally different connection is made from another random port on A to port 23 on B. The two are independant from each other. If your script which did a show time every minute maintained the connecttion on that session, but at the same time, another session without the script failed, then it is quite likely an idle timeout. Does the dying session's window disapear ? There might be some information in there such as "remote host terminated the connection", or "HITMAN: we are killing your process because it has been idle for x minutes". If it is done at the tcpip level, you can take a look at: TCPIP SHOW SERV SSH By default, there is an inactiity timer of 5 minutes. There is also a SET SERV SSH/PROTOCOL=PROBE_TIMER=x (seconds). This sends a probe packet to make the connection look active. There is also SET SERV SSH/SOCKET=KEEPALIVE Note that set SERVICE SSH/INACTIVITY=x minutes is not documented in help but is accepted by the CLI but doesn't appear to have immediate effect. Perhaps it requires restart of the service to take effect, ------------------------------ Date: 29 Jun 2007 13:34:02 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: OpenVMS - When downtime is not an option Message-ID: In article <5ekdm1F38esk5U1@mid.individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: > > And that is a management problem and not a Windows problem. Management > should mandate who can do what on any machine and what is not to be done > on a server. Management mandates are not a good tool for overcoming poor quality. Management may mandate no surfing from the server console, but that won't stop it from happening. If an admin needs to get to the MS website to look at a problem he's having with a server, is that "surfing"? He might be looking around other resources and accidentally trip over a virus. I've personnaly found Google to be a much better tool for finding solutions to MS problems than the MS websites, even when the answer is posted on an MS website. And that's assuming management understands the issue well enough to make such a mandate. In most businesses managers are expected to deal with employee, customer, schedule, and other issues that aren't always the strong points of technical folks. Poor quality in Microsoft's product is a Microsoft problem and a problem for each of thier products, the only fault on the part of management is failing to block its use. ------------------------------ Date: 29 Jun 2007 19:06:41 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: OpenVMS - When downtime is not an option Message-ID: <5el3i1F3854s8U1@mid.individual.net> In article , koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes: > In article <5ekdm1F38esk5U1@mid.individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: >> >> And that is a management problem and not a Windows problem. Management >> should mandate who can do what on any machine and what is not to be done >> on a server. > > Management mandates are not a good tool for overcoming poor quality. > Management may mandate no surfing from the server console, but that > won't stop it from happening. It will if you counsel him the first time and fire him the second time. :-) > If an admin needs to get to the MS > website to look at a problem he's having with a server, is that > "surfing"? He might be looking around other resources and > accidentally trip over a virus. He shouldn't be doing it from the server. He should go back to his desk with all the pertinent information and "surf" from there. When I need a new printer driver for one of the printers I serve do you think I go to HP's website with the server? Hell no. I go to my desk get the needed driver and move it to the server by hand. If IE were not so tightly integrated into Windows I would remove it from the servers. But, one way or the other, there is no excuse for deliberately exposing the servers to danger when you know the danger is there. That's what good sys admining is all about. And, not just on Windows although it it not as likely to cause problems from other platforms. > > I've personnaly found Google to be a much better tool for finding > solutions to MS problems than the MS websites, even when the answer > is posted on an MS website. And you can't google from your desktop rather than the server? Persponally, since they sold their integrity, while I still use google, I certainly don't trust them. > > And that's assuming management understands the issue well enough to > make such a mandate. Weren't you the one who just told me yesterday that when you speak, management listens? > In most businesses managers are expected to > deal with employee, customer, schedule, and other issues that aren't > always the strong points of technical folks. And one of the responsibilities of the data center manager should be to establish the policies necessary to keep the data dcenter running. Hopefully, with input from the more experienced and competent techies. That should include "does and don'ts" like don't surf the web from the servers. > > Poor quality in Microsoft's product is a Microsoft problem and a > problem for each of thier products, the only fault on the part of > management is failing to block its use. Bull crap. Just because some people have an axe to grind doesn't mean the fault is all MS's. The products have come a long way (as have other products, like Linux). They can be used securely and efficiently and they can be made stable. And, that is the job of the sys admin. Otherwise, why have them? Why not just let the secretary do it? What's that old adage about a workman and his tools? Just how secure would a VMS system be if the sys admin just turned on all the ports and services, needed or not. The SYSTEM account had no password. And everyone who used the machine just logged in as SYSTEM anyway. You would never consider running a VMS system like this, so why accept it with Windows and then blame MS for the problems? bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 17:09:38 -0700 From: Jeff Cameron Subject: Re: Question on FCS vs RMS on PDP11 RSX Message-ID: On 6/28/07 7:37 PM, in article 46846fdf$0$3177$4c368faf@roadrunner.com, "Lee K. Gleason" wrote: What exactly are you contemplating doing to these files? Just copying them? Yes, just FTP access. We want to make sure that moving the files off the PDP-11 and then moving them back, they will retain their format and readability. The file types are of two basic formats. Normal sequential text files and unformatted direct access binary files. If The TCPWare stack uses RMS, wont that pose a problem running on a system that does not have RMS SYSGENed in? Jeff Cameron > > "Jeff Cameron" wrote in message > news:C2A9A972.29221%roktsci@ca.rr.com... >> I would like some clarification on FCS (File Control Services) and RMS >> (Record Management System) in RSX 11M+ for the PDP-11. >> >> I have been told by one of the original MACRO-11 developers for our PDP-11 >> system that our file system on the RSX systems only supports FCS files and >> not RMS files. While I fully understand that support for RMS files is a >> Sysgen option, I don't believe that the files are either in FCS format or >> RMS format. I had always thought that FCS was a set of basic file control >> services for manipulating, reading and writing files in RSX, and NOT a > file >> format. Further more, I was under the impression that RMS record > management >> was layered on top of FCS. >> >> Our old Macro developer was quite vehement that the format of the two > types >> of files are very different, specifically the file headers. This seemed > very >> wrong to me since the format of file headers are a Files-11 volume >> attribute. >> >> Now this macro developer is an older man who is not to familiar with newer >> technologies, who often replies with "It is not true just because you want >> it to be true." for things I already know to be true. For example we had >> quite an argument concerning file headers on a Files-11 disk (even ODS1 > for >> RSX); It was my position that the actual header information was stored in >> the volume index file, while he insisted that it was actually a reserved >> block at the beginning of the physical file. >> >> So, if any of you have any information concerning the FCS/RMS issue, if > you >> could site some resource, it would be extremely valuable. >> >> The point of contention is that I am considering using the Process > Software >> TCP Stack, TCPWare. The TCPWare SPD says it supports RMS files, but says >> nothing about FCS, and our developer says it will not work because our > files >> are all FCS format. I need irrefutable evidence that it will work, since > he >> is the roadblock to my proceeding with this plan. >> >> Jeff Cameron >> > > The format of FCS and RMS sequential files, very compatible. FCS can open, > read and write an RMS sequential file just fine, and vice versa. RMS Indexed > and Relative files, not so compatible with FCS routines - I don't know if > it's still true, but there was a time when simply opening and closing an RMS > indexed file with FCS routines was enough to corrupt it beyond use. Even if > opening and closing doesn;'t destroy them anymore, you certainly won't be > reading and writing them with any useful results from FCs code. But, you're > going the other way, FCS files manipulated by RMS code. > > RMS is not layered on top of FCS - both of them do their own QIOs to read > and write blocks. > > However, I'm thinking, in regards to your question, that the Process > Sotware stack, since it uses RMS, should be able to handle FCS created files > just fine. What exactly are you contemplating doing to these files? Just > copying them? Reading and writing records/blocks? Access via NFS? Given a > little more detail, we might be able to come closer to a definitive answer. > -- > Lee K. Gleason N5ZMR > Control-G Consultants > lgleason@houston.rr.com > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 19:52:48 -0500 From: David J Dachtera Subject: Re: Search Largest Database of DEC VAX PDP Manuals Message-ID: <4685A960.E81FAF3A@spam.comcast.net> Headley Sappleton wrote: > > www.vaxennet.com > Search Largest Database of DEC VAX PDP Manuals. In searchable Acrobat pdf > format. New manuals will be added periodically. Good for educational > purpose, for collectors and even Ebay sellers Needs a "List All Documents" (by category?) option. Searching with "*" produced no results. -- David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems http://www.djesys.com/ Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/ Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/ Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/ Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/ ------------------------------ Date: 29 Jun 2007 18:02:13 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: Tech support Message-ID: <5ekvp5F38jiuvU1@mid.individual.net> In article , Thierry Dussuet writes: > Hi > > On 2007-06-29, Paul Raulerson wrote: >> >> The interesting part if the new "immigration" bill was just defeated, and= >> the "Software Industry" is very "upset" about it. They claim there will = >> be a horrific shortage of trained and talented workers, and that we will = >> loose the international competition for those workers. >> Pure undiluted bull-hockey. The truth is we have more talent here in the = >> U.S. than anywhwere else in the world, period. Virtual every major comput= >> er innovation, hardware and software has came from here. > > Wake up, Paul, it's 2007, not 1977 anymore. > What does that have to do with anything? The fact is we have more workers here than we have jobs. Trust me. I have been trying to find a new position for over a year. I have 30+ years of experience in IT. I have been an computer operator, a programmer, a systems analyst, a computer enginer, a computer systems designer, a network manager, a network designer (going all the way back to broadband). You name it, I have done it. I started at the bottom and worked my way up through all the normal progressions. So, if there are lots of jobs and so few workers that we need to start importing them why do I continuously get back messages saying, "You are not in the pool of best qualified." I asked about it once. I was told there were over 800 applicants for the job. And those were all Americans because the job required US Citizenship. People think it is only at the low end where immigrants are taking away jobs from Americans, even here in AMerica, but it isn't. It is pretty much in everything except management. bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 21:29:54 +0200 From: Michael Unger Subject: Re: VTJ V10 Message-ID: <5el52sF396g9nU1@mid.individual.net> On 2007-06-29 18:19, "Paul Anderson" wrote: > Bart.Zorn@gmail.com wrote: > >> The PostScript version of the VTJ does not print on a HP8100 Series >> printer using DCPS V2.5. > >> It hangs somewhere around page 11. We had to power cylcle the printer >> to get it operational again. > > Some printers have trouble printing this file, hanging after page 10. > > [...] Adobe's Distiller (out of "Acrobat 6 Standard for Windows") had no (serious) problems converting the PS file to PDF -- except of missing ("Helvetica" and "Helvetica-Bold") fonts of course which is quite common for HP's PDF documents as well. (Strange enough, the members of the "Futura Book" font family which are requested for this document are embedded within the PS file but not within the PDF file HP provides.) Michael -- Real names enhance the probability of getting real answers. My e-mail account at DECUS Munich is no longer valid. ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2007.353 ************************