INFO-VAX Tue, 23 Oct 2007 Volume 2007 : Issue 580 Contents: Re: Bush, Rice actions may bring judgment of God on U.S. Re: Bush, Rice actions may bring judgment of God on U.S. Re: DE500-XA on XP1000 Re: DE500-XA on XP1000 Re: DE500-XA on XP1000 Re: DE500-XA on XP1000 Re: DE500-XA on XP1000 Dialup then pass port to application Re: Extract from audit journal Re: Extract from audit journal R&D on OpenVMS? Re: R&D on OpenVMS? Re: R&D on OpenVMS? Re: R&D on OpenVMS? Reboot Cisco from DCL script Re: Reboot Cisco from DCL script Re: Reboot Cisco from DCL script Re: Reboot Cisco from DCL script Re: Reboot Cisco from DCL script Re: Reboot Cisco from DCL script Re: Reboot Cisco from DCL script Speedups (was: Re: OpenVMS-8.3 boot speed-up?) SUBMIT command Re: SUBMIT command Re: SUBMIT command Re: SUBMIT command Re: SUBMIT command Re: SUBMIT command Re: SUBMIT command Re: SUBMIT command Re: SUBMIT command Re: SUBMIT command Re: SUBMIT command Re: SUBMIT command unix "batch processing" Re: unix "batch processing" Re: unix "batch processing" Re: unix "batch processing" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 23 Oct 2007 07:16:05 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Bush, Rice actions may bring judgment of God on U.S. Message-ID: In article , david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk writes: > Remember that we are talking about the God of VMS not of lesser operating > systems (or is there a PDP-11 somewhere which can natively run an early version > of VMS ? ) > Surely though knowest that RSX-11M/M+ begat VMS? And in the begining VMS was incomplete, and it depended on the AME, and it ran PDP-11 images, and it was good. There's a lot more similarity between 11/70 and 11/780, and between RSX and VMS, than almost any two others. And hold thy tounge, thall shalt not confuse this goodness with that bastard child WNT, for lo, it has less to do with the holiness of VMS than Sodom has to do with Eden. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 12:45:37 +0000 (UTC) From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk Subject: Re: Bush, Rice actions may bring judgment of God on U.S. Message-ID: In article , koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes: >In article , david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk writes: >> Remember that we are talking about the God of VMS not of lesser operating >> systems (or is there a PDP-11 somewhere which can natively run an early version >> of VMS ? ) >> > > Surely though knowest that RSX-11M/M+ begat VMS? And in the begining > VMS was incomplete, and it depended on the AME, and it ran PDP-11 > images, and it was good. > > There's a lot more similarity between 11/70 and 11/780, and between > RSX and VMS, than almost any two others. > > And hold thy tounge, thall shalt not confuse this goodness with that > bastard child WNT, for lo, it has less to do with the holiness of VMS > than Sodom has to do with Eden. > No WNT is a fallen angel it's heart (kernel) was originally created in the image of VMS but became corrupted and twisted and was cast out to torment mankind. (It led a rebellion in heaven convincing many amongst the heavenly host that it would usurp VMS). David Webb Security team leader CCSS Middlesex University ------------------------------ Date: 23 Oct 2007 09:25:11 -0500 From: brooks@cuebid.zko.hp.nospam (Rob Brooks) Subject: Re: DE500-XA on XP1000 Message-ID: <7f$z8hGI5Yxx@cuebid.zko.hp.com> "Tom Linden" writes: > EWA0 is the one on the motherboard and connected to port 5 Switch1 > Switch1#sho int f0/5 > FastEthernet0/5 is up, line protocol is up > > EWB0 is the DE500-XA PCI card connected to port 5 Switch2 > Switch2#sho int f0/5 > FastEthernet0/5 is up, line protocol is up > > This is not an area in which I can claim any proficiency. Any > recommendations on what to try are welcome. From both the LANCP and switch output, it appears as though the DE500-XA should be working. What protocol(s) do you expect to flow over that wire? -- Rob Brooks MSL -- Nashua brooks!cuebid.zko.hp.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 07:49:56 -0700 From: "Tom Linden" Subject: Re: DE500-XA on XP1000 Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Oct 2007 07:25:11 -0700, Rob Brooks = wrote: > From both the LANCP and switch output, it appears as though the DE500-= XA > should be working. What protocol(s) do you expect to flow over that = > wire? No matter what i set the EWB0_MODE to in SRM and "mc lancp set = dev/speed=3Dx/(no)full" to, and the cisco interface settings to, you nev= er = get a link up. Nor does it show up on a "show mac" on the cisco. The three XP1000s, HAFNER 7.3-2, FREJA 8.2 & ODIN 8.3 here is some outp= ut = from 8.3 system Suggestions? ODIN> mc scacp show chan ODIN PEA0 Channel Summary 23-OCT-2007 07:34:46.93: Remote LAN Dev Channel Total ECS Priority Buffer = Delay Load Total ---- Most Recent ---- Node Loc Rmt State Errors State Cur Mgt Hops Size = (uSec) Class Pkts(S+R) CH Opened Time CH Closed Time ---- --- --- ----- ------ ----- --- --- ---- ---- = ------ ----- --------- -------------- -------------- REX EWA EWA Open 16 Y(T,P,F) 0 0 2 1426 = 6742.6 100 601495 22-OCT 14:21:29.21 22-OCT 14:21:01. 70 REX EWA EIA Open 8 Y(T,P,F) 0 0 2 1426 = 7383.2 100 586900 20-OCT 07:50:25.87 (No time) GUNN EWA EWA Open 4487 Y(T,P,F) 0 0 2 1426 = 7178.4 100 997677 22-OCT 14:36:33.85 22-OCT 14:22:43. 21 GUNN EWA EWB Open 19 Y(T,P,F) 0 0 2 1426 = 9723.8 100 504636 22-OCT 14:22:40.22 22-OCT 14:22:40. 22 NORNS EWA EWB Open 258 Y(T,P,F) 0 0 2 1426 = 8509.7 100 5761216 22-OCT 09:09:37.37 22-OCT 09:08:45. 50 NORNS EWA EWA Open 725 Y(T,P,F) 0 0 2 1426 = 7678.9 100 11284386 20-OCT 07:57:59.08 20-OCT 07:57:59. 08 ITANIC EWA EWA Open 4039 Y(T,P,F) 0 0 2 1426 = 9168.6 100 991653 22-OCT 09:09:39.50 22-OCT 09:08:45. 50 ITANIC EWA EIA Open 36 Y(T,P,F) 0 0 2 1426 = 9689.6 100 1018833 19-OCT 12:15:30.15 (No time) FREJA EWA EWB Open 16 Y(T,P,F) 0 0 2 1426 = 6786.6 10 98526 22-OCT 16:03:49.81 (No time) FREJA EWA EWA Open 6 Y(T,P,F) 0 0 2 1426 = 7449.8 100 12585361 21-OCT 07:40:39.76 21-OCT 07:38:49. 51 HERMES EWA EZA Open 56 Y(T,P,F) 0 0 2 1426 = 7512.6 100 1145096 20-OCT 08:42:16.21 20-OCT 07:50:01. 73 HAFNER EWA EWA Open 94 Y(T,P,F) 0 0 2 1426 = 23360.0 100 37516453 19-OCT 12:10:20.49 (No time) HAFNER EWA EWB 21072 N(L,P,S) 0 0 0 564 = 100.0 0 112224 (No time) 23-OCT 07:34:40. 93 ODIN LCL LCL Open 1 Y(T,P,F) 0 0 2 1426 = 244.1 0 565274 19-OCT 12:09:44.62 (No time) ODIN> mc lancp show dev ewb0/int ODIN Device Internal Counters EWB0 (23-OCT-2007 07:36:01.23): Value Counter ----- ------- --- Internal Driver Counters --- 124 Driver version (X-n) 00000201 Driver flags 00001080 Device type LinkDown Link status 2 Tulip reset count 7 Setup buffers issued 4 CSR6 changes 9 Device interrupts Off Auto-negotiation state Off Autosense state 0:00:03.00 Transmit time limit 0:00:01.00 Timer routine interval F0660004 Most recent CSR5 contents <31, 30, 29, TS2, TS= 1, = RS1, RS0, TU> 03ACE202 Most recent CSR6 contents 000000C6 Most recent CSR12 error contents <7, 6, LS10, = = LS100> 00050008 Most recent CSR15 contents 91:25:58.83 Current time (EXE$GL_ABSTIM_TICS) --- Fork Delay (after scheduled) --- 154701 < 10 milliseconds 2 10..19 milliseconds --- Lost Packets after Fork Delay --- --- DMA Window --- --- Driver Messages --- 19-OCT-2007 12:09:44.04 FastFD mode set by console ODIN> %SYSMAN-I-OUTPUT, command execution on node HAFNER LAN Configuration: Device Parent Medium/User Version Speed Size LAN Add= ress ------ ------ ----------- ------- ----- ---- = ----------------- EWA0 CSMA/CD 02000041 100 1500 = 00-00-F8-71-70-88 EWB0 CSMA/CD 02000012 100 1500 = 00-00-F8-31-4D-CA %SYSMAN-I-OUTPUT, command execution on node ODIN ODIN LAN Configuration (23-OCT-2007 07:43:21.72): Parent or Device PrefCPU Medium/User Version Link Speed Duplex Auto BufSiz= e = MAC Address Type Description ------ ------- ----------- ------- ---- ----- ------ ---- ------= - = ---------------- ------------ ----------- EWA0 259 Ethernet X-124 Up 100 Full Yes 1500= = AA-00-04-00-06-08 UTP DE500 = 00-00-F8-71-5B-8B = (default) EWB0 259 Ethernet X-124 Down - - No 1500= = 08-00-2B-C5-06-D0 UTP DE500 %SYSMAN-I-OUTPUT, command execution on node FREJA LAN Configuration: Device Parent Medium/User Version Link Speed Duplex Size M= AC = Address Current Address Type ------ ------ ----------- ------- ---- ----- ------ ---- = ----------------- ----------------- ---- EWA0 Ethernet X-116 Up 100 Full 1500 = 00-00-F8-71-5E-BD AA-00-04-00-07-08 UTP DE500 EWB0 Ethernet X-111 N/A 100 Full 1500 = 00-00-F8-03-C9-87 00-00-F8-03-C9-87 UTP DE500 -- = PL/I for OpenVMS www.kednos.com ------------------------------ Date: 23 Oct 2007 11:14:41 -0500 From: brooks@cuebid.zko.hp.nospam (Rob Brooks) Subject: Re: DE500-XA on XP1000 Message-ID: "Tom Linden" writes: > Suggestions? On the V8.3 system, try the following 1) at the console, set ewb0_mode to fastFD 2) do not have any permanent settings in LANCP for EWB0 3) are there any "EWB" devices besides the template device (EWB0)? 4) what's the output from $ SHOW DEVICE/FULL EWB0 (new for V8.3) I'll ping the ethernet driver guru from VMS Engineering . . . -- Rob ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 09:03:49 -0700 From: "Tom Linden" Subject: Re: DE500-XA on XP1000 Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Oct 2007 09:14:41 -0700, Rob Brooks wrote: > "Tom Linden" writes: >> Suggestions? > > On the V8.3 system, try the following > > 1) at the console, set ewb0_mode to fastFD > 2) do not have any permanent settings in LANCP for EWB0 > 3) are there any "EWB" devices besides the template device (EWB0)? > 4) what's the output from $ SHOW DEVICE/FULL EWB0 (new for V8.3) > > I'll ping the ethernet driver guru from VMS Engineering . . . > > -- Rob (1) It is (2) LANCP> sho dev ewb0 ODIN Device Listing, volatile database (23-OCT-2007 08:57:05.88): Device ------ EWB0* * Device not in volatile database (3) yes 0 through 12 all online (4) ODIN> SHOW DEVICE/FULL EWB0 Device EWB0:, device type DE500, is online, network device, error logging is enabled, device is a template only. Error count 0 Operations completed 0 Owner process "" Owner UIC [SYSTEM] Owner process ID 00000000 Dev Prot S:RWPL,O:RWPL,G,W Reference count 0 Default buffer size 512 Operating characteristics: Link down, Full duplex. Speed (Mbits/sec) 100 Def. MAC addr 08-00-2B-C5-06-D0 Current MAC addr 08-00-2B-C5-06-D0 -- PL/I for OpenVMS www.kednos.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 09:18:30 -0700 From: "Tom Linden" Subject: Re: DE500-XA on XP1000 Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Oct 2007 09:14:41 -0700, Rob Brooks wrote: > "Tom Linden" writes: >> Suggestions? > > On the V8.3 system, try the following > > 1) at the console, set ewb0_mode to fastFD > 2) do not have any permanent settings in LANCP for EWB0 > 3) are there any "EWB" devices besides the template device (EWB0)? > 4) what's the output from $ SHOW DEVICE/FULL EWB0 (new for V8.3) > > I'll ping the ethernet driver guru from VMS Engineering . . . > > -- Rob I thought I could look at the SRM variable with ^P and then resume with CONT. But it crashed:-( and caused all the shadow in the SAN to start merge :-( :-( I should have reset that cluster time variable, whatever it is called. Anyway upon booting %SYSINIT-I- waiting to form or join an OpenVMS Cluster %VMScluster-I-LOADSECDB, loading the cluster security database %EWA0, Auto-negotiation mode set by console %EWA0, Auto-negotiation (internal) starting %EWA0, Full Duplex 100baseTX connection selected %EWA0, Link state: UP %EWB0, FastFD mode set by console %EWA0, Auto-negotiation detected link down %EWA0, Auto-negotiation (internal) starting %EWA0, Link state: DOWN %EWA0, Full Duplex 100baseTX connection selected %EWA0, Link state: UP I wonder if it isn't a driver issue? -- PL/I for OpenVMS www.kednos.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 16:46:25 -0000 From: issinoho Subject: Dialup then pass port to application Message-ID: <1193157985.441063.116040@t8g2000prg.googlegroups.com> I'm trying to test some software which relies on a leased line being available on an LTA port. At the moment I don't have the I/O to drive this so am looking for alternatives. The other site is contactable via dialup so my thoughts are to hook up a modem to TTA0, manually dial the other site using a set host/dte session then drop out leaving the software application to allocate the 'live' TTA0 line. Questions are obvious really, (1) Will this work? (2) Do I need to drop the DTE session before the application can allocate the device, and if so will the dialup session hangup when I close the set host/dte session? (3) Is there a better way of doing this? Thanks for your thoughts. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Oct 2007 07:18:02 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Extract from audit journal Message-ID: In article , norm.raphael@metso.com writes: > > I have been asked to look into reporting interactive disuser-ing of > accounts. > Is there a way to extract this data from the audit journal showing the > username invoking authorize, the date-time, and the username that was > disuser-ed? > > I'm sure it's all in there. It's in there if you tell the audit system to log it, in which case analyze/audit has all the qualifiers you need to get it out. OBTW, please turn off MIME. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 09:29:31 -0400 From: norm.raphael@metso.com Subject: Re: Extract from audit journal Message-ID: This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 004A1BF58525737D_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Ken Fairfield wrote on 10/23/2007 12:02:17 AM: > norm.raphael@metso.com wrote: > > I have been asked to look into reporting interactive disuser-ing of > > accounts. > > Is there a way to extract this data from the audit journal showing the > > username invoking authorize, the date-time, and the username that was > > disuser-ed? > > > > I'm sure it's all in there. > > I did this in a previous position. You need to > > SET AUDIT/AUDIT/ENABLE=(AUTHORIZE[,other classes]) > > Then it is a smop to take the full output from > > ANALYZE/AUDIT/EVENT=AUTHORIZATION > > to find the information you need. I think I merely did a > SEARCH on the output looking for "Flags:" and DISUSER. You > need to be a little smart in order to select events where > the "old flags" *didn't* contain DISUSER but the "new flags" > did. Look at an example and you'll be able to figure it out. > > The event record contains the target username as well as the > username of the invoking process. Thanks Ken (and others). I did that, and it does show all that and a lot more also. It does require some "subtraction" to locate the DISUSER in the "New" record and it's absence in the "Original" record. I was trolling for something to parse out the wheat from the chaff, but I guess it's still true that: "Everything worthwhile eventually degenerates into real work." -Murphy > > HTH, Ken > -- > Ken & Ann Fairfield > What: Ken dot And dot Ann > Where: Gmail dot Com --=_alternative 004A1BF58525737D_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"



Ken Fairfield <Ken@Napili.Fairfield.Home> wrote on 10/23/2007 12:02:17 AM:

> norm.raphael@metso.com wrote:
> > I have been asked to look into reporting interactive disuser-ing of
> > accounts.
> > Is there a way to extract this data from the audit journal showing the
> > username invoking authorize, the date-time, and the username that was
> > disuser-ed?
> >
> > I'm sure it's all in there.
>
>      I did this in a previous position.  You need to
>
>          SET AUDIT/AUDIT/ENABLE=(AUTHORIZE[,other classes])
>
> Then it is a smop to take the full output from
>
>      ANALYZE/AUDIT/EVENT=AUTHORIZATION
>
> to find the information you need.  I think I merely did a
> SEARCH on the output looking for "Flags:" and DISUSER.  You
> need to be a little smart in order to select events where
> the "old flags" *didn't* contain DISUSER but the "new flags"
> did.  Look at an example and you'll be able to figure it out.
>
>      The event record contains the target username as well as the
> username of the invoking process.


Thanks Ken (and others).

I did that, and it does show all that and a lot more also.
It does require some "subtraction" to locate the DISUSER in the
"New" record and it's absence in the "Original" record.

I was trolling for something to parse out the wheat from the
chaff, but I guess it's still true that:

"Everything worthwhile eventually
degenerates into real work." -Murphy

>
>     HTH, Ken
> --
> Ken & Ann Fairfield
> What:  Ken dot And dot Ann
> Where: Gmail dot Com
--=_alternative 004A1BF58525737D_=-- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 08:16:35 -0400 From: D Gillbilly Subject: R&D on OpenVMS? Message-ID: R&D on OpenVMS? In Canada, it has been pointed out (for many years now) that in order to provide affordable OpenVMS applications, a (any?) company must do a large amount of research. (Developers should check out the incentive program "Scientific Research & Experimental Development" administered by the Canada Revenue Agency) In a recent edition of Atlantic Business (v18#4), I read an *Advertorial* about a company that specializes in maximizing a SR&ED claim. (I keep my own notes, so I can offer no comment other than to say that these types of companies do exist). Happy 30th OpenVMS! Thanks for providing me the ability to keep my customers current in an industry non-standard way. Duane ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 07:08:05 -0500 From: Ron Johnson Subject: Re: R&D on OpenVMS? Message-ID: On 10/23/07 07:16, D Gillbilly wrote: > R&D on OpenVMS? > > In Canada, it has been pointed out (for many years now) that in order > to provide affordable OpenVMS applications, a (any?) company must do a > large amount of research. ????? > (Developers should check out the incentive program > "Scientific Research & Experimental Development" > administered by the Canada Revenue Agency) > > In a recent edition of Atlantic Business (v18#4), I read an > *Advertorial* about a company that specializes in maximizing a SR&ED > claim. What's SR&ED? > (I keep my own notes, so I can offer no comment other than to say that > these types of companies do exist). > > Happy 30th OpenVMS! > Thanks for providing me the ability to keep my customers current in an > industry non-standard way. > > Duane -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA Give a man a fish, and he eats for a day. Hit him with a fish, and he goes away for good! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 05:22:50 -0700 From: Bob Gezelter Subject: Re: R&D on OpenVMS? Message-ID: <1193142170.166893.178800@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com> On Oct 23, 8:16 am, D Gillbilly wrote: > R&D on OpenVMS? > > In Canada, it has been pointed out (for many years now) that in order > to provide affordable OpenVMS applications, a (any?) company must do a > large amount of research. > > (Developers should check out the incentive program > "Scientific Research & Experimental Development" > administered by the Canada Revenue Agency) > > In a recent edition of Atlantic Business (v18#4), I read an > *Advertorial* about a company that specializes in maximizing a SR&ED > claim. > > (I keep my own notes, so I can offer no comment other than to say that > these types of companies do exist). > > Happy 30th OpenVMS! > Thanks for providing me the ability to keep my customers current in an > industry non-standard way. > > Duane Duane, I disagree with the scope of the work needed to implement an affordable OpenVMS application. There is some work that is different than other operating systems, but it is not extensive. The problem often lies in applications that are tightly bound to other operating systems, or are implemented in ways that would not be acceptable to the OpenVMS community (e.g., "Oh yes, it freezes sometimes. Just reboot the Host", or, "Of course, you must run as Administrator"). These are far more serious problems of design philosophy, and are often not done well on any of the platforms. The problem is often a question of dealing properly with the diversity of operating environments, an area that many applications are regrettably shortsighted about. - Bob Gezelter, http://www.rlgsc.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 16:34:58 GMT From: Rob Brown Subject: Re: R&D on OpenVMS? Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Oct 2007, Ron Johnson wrote: > On 10/23/07 07:16, D Gillbilly wrote: >> R&D on OpenVMS? >> ... >> "Scientific Research & Experimental Development" >> ... >> *Advertorial* about a company that specializes in maximizing a SR&ED >> claim. > > What's SR&ED? Scientific Research & Experimental Development -- Rob Brown b r o w n a t g m c l d o t c o m G. Michaels Consulting Ltd. (780)438-9343 (voice) Edmonton (780)437-3367 (FAX) http://gmcl.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 11:41:51 -0000 From: issinoho Subject: Reboot Cisco from DCL script Message-ID: <1193139711.898353.163530@v29g2000prd.googlegroups.com> Chaps, I'd like to be able to reboot a Cisco router from a DCL script. Effectively I need the equivalent of a TRIGGER NODE which would reload a DECserver. My initial thoughts would be to use the remoting functionality within SSH but any and all other suggestions would be happily accepted. Thanks in advance for any inspiration. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 12:13:45 +0000 (UTC) From: gartmann@nonsense.immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann) Subject: Re: Reboot Cisco from DCL script Message-ID: In article <1193139711.898353.163530@v29g2000prd.googlegroups.com>, issinoho writes: >I'd like to be able to reboot a Cisco router from a DCL script. >Effectively I need the equivalent of a TRIGGER NODE which would reload >a DECserver. > >My initial thoughts would be to use the remoting functionality within >SSH but any and all other suggestions would be happily accepted. Use Kermit. We use this to create an accounting log and similar stuff for our Cisco routers. Regards, Christoph Gartmann -- Max-Planck-Institut fuer Phone : +49-761-5108-464 Fax: -452 Immunbiologie Postfach 1169 Internet: gartmann@immunbio dot mpg dot de D-79011 Freiburg, Germany http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/menue.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 13:18:01 -0000 From: issinoho Subject: Re: Reboot Cisco from DCL script Message-ID: <1193145481.484803.226080@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com> On 23 Oct, 13:13, gartm...@nonsense.immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann) wrote: > In article <1193139711.898353.163...@v29g2000prd.googlegroups.com>, issinoho writes: > > >I'd like to be able to reboot a Cisco router from a DCL script. > >Effectively I need the equivalent of a TRIGGER NODE which would reload > >a DECserver. > > >My initial thoughts would be to use the remoting functionality within > >SSH but any and all other suggestions would be happily accepted. > > Use Kermit. We use this to create an accounting log and similar stuff > for our Cisco routers. > > Regards, > Christoph Gartmann > > -- > Max-Planck-Institut fuer Phone : +49-761-5108-464 Fax: -452 > Immunbiologie > Postfach 1169 Internet: gartmann@immunbio dot mpg dot de > D-79011 Freiburg, Germany > http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/menue.html That sounds like a good idea. Would anyone with more Kermit than I (none!) care to hazard a small script, along the lines of, set host /connect username password reload exit Thanks. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 06:23:56 -0700 From: "Tom Linden" Subject: Re: Reboot Cisco from DCL script Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Oct 2007 04:41:51 -0700, issinoho wrote: > Chaps, > > I'd like to be able to reboot a Cisco router from a DCL script. > Effectively I need the equivalent of a TRIGGER NODE which would reload > a DECserver. I do this through a Xyplex which should be similar to the DECServer, I think, telnet to the port on the Xyplex attached to the router, then talk to IOS > > My initial thoughts would be to use the remoting functionality within > SSH but any and all other suggestions would be happily accepted. > > Thanks in advance for any inspiration. > -- PL/I for OpenVMS www.kednos.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 09:33:07 -0400 From: "Jeff Goodwin" Subject: Re: Reboot Cisco from DCL script Message-ID: <471df822$0$4967$4c368faf@roadrunner.com> "issinoho" wrote in message news:1193145481.484803.226080@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com... > On 23 Oct, 13:13, gartm...@nonsense.immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph > Gartmann) wrote: >> In article <1193139711.898353.163...@v29g2000prd.googlegroups.com>, >> issinoho writes: >> >> >I'd like to be able to reboot a Cisco router from a DCL script. >> >Effectively I need the equivalent of a TRIGGER NODE which would reload >> >a DECserver. >> >> >My initial thoughts would be to use the remoting functionality within >> >SSH but any and all other suggestions would be happily accepted. >> >> Use Kermit. We use this to create an accounting log and similar stuff >> for our Cisco routers. >> >> Regards, >> Christoph Gartmann >> >> -- >> Max-Planck-Institut fuer Phone : +49-761-5108-464 Fax: -452 >> Immunbiologie >> Postfach 1169 Internet: gartmann@immunbio dot mpg dot de >> D-79011 Freiburg, Germany >> http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/menue.html > > That sounds like a good idea. > > Would anyone with more Kermit than I (none!) care to hazard a small > script, along the lines of, > > set host /connect > username > password > reload > exit > > Thanks. > Here's a snippet of a DCL procedure where I upload Brocade switch configurations via Kermit: $SWITCH_LOOP: $ if f$search(tmpfile) .nes. "" then delete 'tmpfile';*/log $ if f$type(switch_'count') .eqs. "" then goto END_SWITCH_LOOP $ $! Create/run Kermit file $ $ switch = switch_'count' $ switch = f$element(0,".",switch) $ username = switch_username_'count' $ password = switch_password_'count' $ $ open/write/ERROR=ERROR_POINT tmpfile 'tmpfile' $ write tmpfile "set telopt TERMINAL-TYPE refused" $ write tmpfile "set telopt NAWS refused" $ write tmpfile "set telopt NEW-ENVIRONMENT refused" $ write tmpfile "set telopt kermit refused" $ write tmpfile "set host ''switch'" $ write tmpfile "input 5 login:" $ write tmpfile "output ''username'\13" $ write tmpfile "input 5 Password:" $ write tmpfile "output ''password'\13" $ write tmpfile "input 5 >\32" $ write tmpfile "output configupload ""''this_host_ip'"",""''save_account'"",""''switch'.cfg"",""''save_password'""\13 " $ write tmpfile "input 10 >\32" $ write tmpfile "output quit\13" $ write tmpfile "finish" $ close tmpfile $ $ write sys$output "Running Switch script for ''switch', this may take a few minutes ..." $ $ mcr site$util:ckermit 'tmpfile' $ $ count = count + 1 $ goto SWITCH_LOOP $END_SWITCH_LOOP: -Jeff ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 13:45:39 +0000 (UTC) From: gartmann@nonsense.immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann) Subject: Re: Reboot Cisco from DCL script Message-ID: In article <1193145481.484803.226080@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com>, issinoho writes: >Would anyone with more Kermit than I (none!) care to hazard a small >script, along the lines of, SET MACRO ECHO OFF SET INPUT ECHO ON SET QUIET OFF ; DEFINE error EXIT \%1 ; SET FLOW NONE ; Ctrl-C = 3, Ctrl-R = 18 SET ESCAPE-CHARACTER 3 SET INPUT TIMEOUT-ACTION PROCEED SET INPUT CASE OBSERVE SET TELNET TERMINAL-TYPE vt220 SET TERMINAL BYTESIZE 8 SET HOST your_router.your_domain.something INPUT 10 {Password: } IF FAILURE error 11 OUTPUT top-secret\013 INPUT 5 {routerprompt>} IF FAILURE error 12 OUTPUT enable\013 INPUT 5 {Password: } IF FAILURE error 13 OUTPUT more-secret\013 INPUT 5 {routerprompt#} IF FAILURE error 14 OUTPUT reload\013 INPUT 5 {Proceed with reload? [confirm]} IF FAILURE error 15 OUTPUT \013 CLOSE SESSION IF FAILURE error 16 OUTPUT {quit\13} ; EXIT Then put a DCL-script around this like the following: $ wermit = "$device:[dir]wermit_axp" $ wermit the_above_script.ini $ IF ckermit_status .NE. 0 $ THEN $ subject = """Reload script error! RC=" + F$STRING( ckermit_status ) + $ MAIL/SUBJ='subject' 'error_msg' SYSTEM $ EXIT $ ENDIF Regards, Christoph Gartmann -- Max-Planck-Institut fuer Phone : +49-761-5108-464 Fax: -452 Immunbiologie Postfach 1169 Internet: gartmann@immunbio dot mpg dot de D-79011 Freiburg, Germany http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/menue.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 16:17:50 -0000 From: issinoho Subject: Re: Reboot Cisco from DCL script Message-ID: <1193156270.987476.257410@e34g2000pro.googlegroups.com> On 23 Oct, 14:45, gartm...@nonsense.immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann) wrote: > In article <1193145481.484803.226...@z24g2000prh.googlegroups.com>, issinoho writes: > > >Would anyone with more Kermit than I (none!) care to hazard a small > >script, along the lines of, > > SET MACRO ECHO OFF > SET INPUT ECHO ON > SET QUIET OFF > ; > DEFINE error EXIT \%1 > ; > SET FLOW NONE > ; Ctrl-C = 3, Ctrl-R = 18 > SET ESCAPE-CHARACTER 3 > SET INPUT TIMEOUT-ACTION PROCEED > SET INPUT CASE OBSERVE > SET TELNET TERMINAL-TYPE vt220 > SET TERMINAL BYTESIZE 8 > SET HOST your_router.your_domain.something > INPUT 10 {Password: } > IF FAILURE error 11 > OUTPUT top-secret\013 > INPUT 5 {routerprompt>} > IF FAILURE error 12 > OUTPUT enable\013 > INPUT 5 {Password: } > IF FAILURE error 13 > OUTPUT more-secret\013 > INPUT 5 {routerprompt#} > IF FAILURE error 14 > OUTPUT reload\013 > INPUT 5 {Proceed with reload? [confirm]} > IF FAILURE error 15 > OUTPUT \013 > CLOSE SESSION > IF FAILURE error 16 > OUTPUT {quit\13} > ; > EXIT > > Then put a DCL-script around this like the following: > > $ wermit = "$device:[dir]wermit_axp" > $ wermit the_above_script.ini > $ IF ckermit_status .NE. 0 > $ THEN > $ subject = """Reload script error! RC=" + F$STRING( ckermit_status ) + > $ MAIL/SUBJ='subject' 'error_msg' SYSTEM > $ EXIT > $ ENDIF > > Regards, > Christoph Gartmann > > -- > Max-Planck-Institut fuer Phone : +49-761-5108-464 Fax: -452 > Immunbiologie > Postfach 1169 Internet: gartmann@immunbio dot mpg dot de > D-79011 Freiburg, Germany > http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/menue.html Many thanks to everyone. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 09:19:32 -0400 From: norm.raphael@metso.com Subject: Speedups (was: Re: OpenVMS-8.3 boot speed-up?) Message-ID: This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 004932128525737D_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Doug Phillips wrote on 10/22/2007 06:32:49 PM: > On Oct 22, 11:16 am, koeh...@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob > Koehler) wrote: > > In article <1192899580.253427.147...@e9g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, > Neil Rieck writes: > > > > > Yesterday I started my annual OpenVMS in my usual way: I restored a > > > total backup of our AS-4100 (development platform) to an AS-2100 > > > junker sitting in the corner then upgraded the 2100. The upgrade went > > > without incident and all my apps worked properly but I also noticed > > > that the second boot of OpenVMS-8.3 was noticably faster than 8.2 > > > > This would not be the first time that an update to VMS made things > > run faster. > > > > Of course, none was as impressive as rebooting my first Alpha! > > Had a client that went from PDP-11/34 to Alpha. The Payroll clerk was > upset at first because she used to start the P/R calc, go on break and > it would be finishing up about the time she came back. On the Alpha, > the calc was finished before she could even stand up. "Now how am I > going to get my break?" she said. > > The hardest part of that conversion was convincing people that their > job actually did run because the menu would return so fast (as fast in > some cases as if they'd answered "Continue? N" on the 11/34). One A/P > clerk had about 2 copies of a report on the printer and about 10 > stacked up in the queue when I happened to walk by and she said: "This > report won't print anymore." After watching her select and start the > report -- "See, it just goes back to the menu!" -- I led her across > the room to the printer where she was "shocked" to find the third copy > printing as I deleted the queue entries. > > I put an "Enter OK to continue" message in the login that told > everyone something like "Welcome to the new OpenVMS Alpha system. This > computer is very fast and your job probably did run even though you > think it didn't. Check it before you run it again." That, after an > accountant closed 3 periods because "yeah, the screen was telling me > what period it was going to close but I thought there was something > wrong because the menu came back as soon as I typed Y and hit > enter." > > I *had* told everyone before the cut-over date about the speed, and > that we'd removed most of the progress messages and would just display > "Started" and "Finished" (which often flashed by so fast you couldn't > read it), but they really couldn't comprehend until they actually > experienced it. > Back when, we had 4 Vax-11/750's running DZ11's at 2400 baud to VT52's, and it took the main application screen 8 seconds to paint. We upgraded the terminal interface cards and were able to set the speed to 9600 baud, which meant the main application screen painted in only 2 seconds. This effectively meant that 2 hours of the 8-hour workday which was consumed by the slower screens suddenly became available. Management was accused of implementing a speedup to get more work out of the workforce, because the "day's work" was done six hours into the shift. It took some serious palavar to reassure everyone that it was not a trick to squeeze more work out of everyone. That was an interesting "unintended consequence." --=_alternative 004932128525737D_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"



Doug Phillips <dphill46@netscape.net> wrote on 10/22/2007 06:32:49 PM:

> On Oct 22, 11:16 am, koeh...@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob
> Koehler) wrote:
> > In article <1192899580.253427.147...@e9g2000prf.googlegroups.com>,
> Neil Rieck <n.ri...@sympatico.ca> writes:
> >
> > > Yesterday I started my annual OpenVMS in my usual way: I restored a
> > > total backup of our AS-4100 (development platform) to an AS-2100
> > > junker sitting in the corner then upgraded the 2100. The upgrade went
> > > without incident and all my apps worked properly but I also noticed
> > > that the second boot of OpenVMS-8.3 was noticably faster than 8.2
> >
> >    This would not be the first time that an update to VMS made things
> >    run faster.
> >
> >    Of course, none was as impressive as rebooting my first Alpha!
>
> Had a client that went from PDP-11/34 to Alpha. The Payroll clerk was
> upset at first because she used to start the P/R calc, go on break and
> it would be finishing up about the time she came back. On the Alpha,
> the calc was finished before she could even stand up. "Now how am I
> going to get my break?" she said.
>
> The hardest part of that conversion was convincing people that their
> job actually did run because the menu would return so fast (as fast in
> some cases as if they'd answered "Continue? N" on the 11/34). One A/P
> clerk had about 2 copies of a report on the printer and about 10
> stacked up in the queue when I happened to walk by and she said: "This
> report won't print anymore." After watching her select and start the
> report -- "See, it just goes back to the menu!" -- I led her across
> the room to the printer where she was "shocked" to find the third copy
> printing as I deleted the queue entries.
>
> I put an "Enter OK to continue" message in the login that told
> everyone something like "Welcome to the new OpenVMS Alpha system. This
> computer is very fast and your job probably did run even though you
> think it didn't. Check it before you run it again." That, after an
> accountant closed 3 periods because "yeah, the screen was telling me
> what period it was going to close but I thought there was something
> wrong  because the menu came back as soon as I typed Y and hit
> enter."
>
> I *had* told everyone before the cut-over date about the speed, and
> that we'd removed most of the progress messages and would just display
> "Started" and "Finished" (which often flashed by so fast you couldn't
> read it), but they really couldn't comprehend until they actually
> experienced it.
>
Back when, we had 4 Vax-11/750's running DZ11's at 2400 baud to VT52's,

and it took the main application screen 8 seconds to paint.  We upgraded
the terminal interface cards and were able to set the speed to 9600 baud,
which meant the main application screen painted in only 2 seconds.  This
effectively meant that 2 hours of the 8-hour workday which was consumed
by the slower screens suddenly became available.  Management was accused
of implementing a speedup to get more work out of the workforce, because
the "day's work" was done six hours into the shift.  It took some serious
palavar to reassure everyone that it was not a trick to squeeze more
work out of everyone.  That was an interesting "unintended consequence." --=_alternative 004932128525737D_=-- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 07:27:04 -0700 From: a13365@yahoo.com Subject: SUBMIT command Message-ID: <1193149624.407810.325610@t8g2000prg.googlegroups.com> Hello, About Submit command, if I use /user=scott, dose VMS check user's password? Thanks ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 14:47:12 +0000 (UTC) From: gartmann@nonsense.immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann) Subject: Re: SUBMIT command Message-ID: In article <1193149624.407810.325610@t8g2000prg.googlegroups.com>, a13365@yahoo.com writes: >About Submit command, if I use /user=scott, dose VMS check user's >password? No, but you need elevated privileges in order to use this qualifier. Regards, Christoph Gartmann -- Max-Planck-Institut fuer Phone : +49-761-5108-464 Fax: -452 Immunbiologie Postfach 1169 Internet: gartmann@immunbio dot mpg dot de D-79011 Freiburg, Germany http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/menue.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 10:50:15 -0400 From: norm.raphael@metso.com Subject: Re: SUBMIT command Message-ID: This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 0051800A8525737D_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" AFAIK you must have a record in the SYSUAF.DAT file on the node where the QUEUE is running, You may need BATCH access enabled, but I'm not sure. There is no password to check. a13365@yahoo.com wrote on 10/23/2007 10:27:04 AM: > Hello, > > About Submit command, if I use /user=scott, dose VMS check user's > password? > > Thanks > --=_alternative 0051800A8525737D_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"
AFAIK you must have a record in the SYSUAF.DAT file on the node where the QUEUE is running,
You may need BATCH access enabled, but I'm not sure.
There is no password to check.
a13365@yahoo.com wrote on 10/23/2007 10:27:04 AM:

> Hello,
>
> About Submit command, if I use /user=scott,  dose VMS check user's
> password?
>
> Thanks
>
--=_alternative 0051800A8525737D_=-- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 08:27:34 -0700 From: a13365@yahoo.com Subject: Re: SUBMIT command Message-ID: <1193153254.512670.15500@t8g2000prg.googlegroups.com> On Oct 23, 10:47 am, gartm...@nonsense.immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann) wrote: > In article <1193149624.407810.325...@t8g2000prg.googlegroups.com>, a13...@yahoo.com writes: > >About Submit command, if I use /user=scott, dose VMS check user's > >password? > > No, but you need elevated privileges in order to use this qualifier. > > Regards, > Christoph Gartmann > > -- > Max-Planck-Institut fuer Phone : +49-761-5108-464 Fax: -452 > Immunbiologie > Postfach 1169 Internet: gartmann@immunbio dot mpg dot de > D-79011 Freiburg, Germany > http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/menue.html Hello Christoph? What kind privileges I need to check? Thanks. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 08:28:30 -0700 From: a13365@yahoo.com Subject: Re: SUBMIT command Message-ID: <1193153310.353737.181210@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com> On Oct 23, 10:50 am, norm.raph...@metso.com wrote: > AFAIK you must have a record in the SYSUAF.DAT file on the node where the > QUEUE is running, > You may need BATCH access enabled, but I'm not sure. > There is no password to check. > a13...@yahoo.com wrote on 10/23/2007 10:27:04 AM: > > > > > Hello, > > > About Submit command, if I use /user=scott, dose VMS check user's > > password? > > > Thanks- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - Thanks, I will check sysuaf.dat. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Oct 2007 10:36:26 -0500 From: briggs@encompasserve.org Subject: Re: SUBMIT command Message-ID: <4$VTv9Rz+Npg@eisner.encompasserve.org> In article <1193153254.512670.15500@t8g2000prg.googlegroups.com>, a13365@yahoo.com writes: > What kind privileges I need to check? $ HELP SUBMIT /USER SUBMIT /USER /USER=username Requires CMKRNL (change mode to kernel) privilege and read (R) and write (W) access to the user authorization file (UAF). ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 11:36:58 -0400 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" Subject: Re: SUBMIT command Message-ID: <471E151A.6030706@comcast.net> a13365@yahoo.com wrote: > Hello, > > About Submit command, if I use /user=scott, dose VMS check user's > password? > > Thanks > SUBMIT /USER requires privilege. If you have the necessary privilege you don't need the password. If you don't have the privilege the command will fail. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Oct 2007 16:17:05 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: SUBMIT command Message-ID: <5o6l41Fktd8gU1@mid.individual.net> In article <4$VTv9Rz+Npg@eisner.encompasserve.org>, briggs@encompasserve.org writes: > In article <1193153254.512670.15500@t8g2000prg.googlegroups.com>, a13365@yahoo.com writes: >> What kind privileges I need to check? > > $ HELP SUBMIT /USER > SUBMIT > > /USER > > /USER=username > > Requires CMKRNL (change mode to kernel) privilege and read (R) > and write (W) access to the user authorization file (UAF). Ohmigod!!!! There is actually something that Unix can do that VMS can't do (at least not without elevated priviledges on the VMS side!!) bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 12:37:21 -0400 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" Subject: Re: SUBMIT command Message-ID: <471E2341.30707@comcast.net> Bill Gunshannon wrote: > In article <4$VTv9Rz+Npg@eisner.encompasserve.org>, > briggs@encompasserve.org writes: > >>In article <1193153254.512670.15500@t8g2000prg.googlegroups.com>, a13365@yahoo.com writes: >> >>>What kind privileges I need to check? >> >>$ HELP SUBMIT /USER >>SUBMIT >> >> /USER >> >> /USER=username >> >> Requires CMKRNL (change mode to kernel) privilege and read (R) >> and write (W) access to the user authorization file (UAF). > > > Ohmigod!!!! There is actually something that Unix can do that > VMS can't do (at least not without elevated priviledges on the > VMS side!!) > > bill > And just how does Unix run something as another user without being root (privelege equivalent)?? ------------------------------ Date: 23 Oct 2007 16:54:57 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: SUBMIT command Message-ID: <5o6nb1Flf59dU1@mid.individual.net> In article <471E2341.30707@comcast.net>, "Richard B. Gilbert" writes: > Bill Gunshannon wrote: >> In article <4$VTv9Rz+Npg@eisner.encompasserve.org>, >> briggs@encompasserve.org writes: >> >>>In article <1193153254.512670.15500@t8g2000prg.googlegroups.com>, a13365@yahoo.com writes: >>> >>>>What kind privileges I need to check? >>> >>>$ HELP SUBMIT /USER >>>SUBMIT >>> >>> /USER >>> >>> /USER=username >>> >>> Requires CMKRNL (change mode to kernel) privilege and read (R) >>> and write (W) access to the user authorization file (UAF). >> >> >> Ohmigod!!!! There is actually something that Unix can do that >> VMS can't do (at least not without elevated priviledges on the >> VMS side!!) >> >> bill >> > > And just how does Unix run something as another user without being root > (privelege equivalent)?? > Prompts for the password. bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: 23 Oct 2007 12:19:24 -0500 From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) Subject: Re: SUBMIT command Message-ID: In article <5o6l41Fktd8gU1@mid.individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: > In article <4$VTv9Rz+Npg@eisner.encompasserve.org>, > briggs@encompasserve.org writes: >> In article <1193153254.512670.15500@t8g2000prg.googlegroups.com>, a13365@yahoo.com writes: >>> What kind privileges I need to check? >> >> $ HELP SUBMIT /USER >> SUBMIT >> >> /USER >> >> /USER=username >> >> Requires CMKRNL (change mode to kernel) privilege and read (R) >> and write (W) access to the user authorization file (UAF). > > Ohmigod!!!! There is actually something that Unix can do that > VMS can't do (at least not without elevated priviledges on the > VMS side!!) There are lots of things VMS considers to be security relevant where Unix does not care. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Oct 2007 17:31:26 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: SUBMIT command Message-ID: <5o6pfeFlc2u7U2@mid.individual.net> In article , Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes: > In article <5o6l41Fktd8gU1@mid.individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: >> In article <4$VTv9Rz+Npg@eisner.encompasserve.org>, >> briggs@encompasserve.org writes: >>> In article <1193153254.512670.15500@t8g2000prg.googlegroups.com>, a13365@yahoo.com writes: >>>> What kind privileges I need to check? >>> >>> $ HELP SUBMIT /USER >>> SUBMIT >>> >>> /USER >>> >>> /USER=username >>> >>> Requires CMKRNL (change mode to kernel) privilege and read (R) >>> and write (W) access to the user authorization file (UAF). >> >> Ohmigod!!!! There is actually something that Unix can do that >> VMS can't do (at least not without elevated priviledges on the >> VMS side!!) > > There are lots of things VMS considers to be security relevant > where Unix does not care. So you think requiring elevated proviledges is less of a security threat? Or is the VMS answer simply, "We won't let you do that." (Actually, that is the usual answer to any user request from the VMS shop here, so maybe it is the norm!!) bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 16:51:18 GMT From: Rob Brown Subject: unix "batch processing" Message-ID: On Tue, 23 Oct 2007, Bill Gunshannon wrote: > In article <4$VTv9Rz+Npg@eisner.encompasserve.org>, > briggs@encompasserve.org writes: >> In article <1193153254.512670.15500@t8g2000prg.googlegroups.com>, >> a13365@yahoo.com writes: >>> What kind privileges I need to check? >> >> $ HELP SUBMIT /USER >> SUBMIT >> >> /USER >> >> /USER=username >> >> Requires CMKRNL (change mode to kernel) privilege and read (R) >> and write (W) access to the user authorization file (UAF). > > Ohmigod!!!! There is actually something that Unix can do that > VMS can't do (at least not without elevated priviledges on the > VMS side!!) I have never known how to do something in Linux that I would do in batch in VMS. Perhaps the UNIX facility you refer to exists in Linux? What UNIX facility do you refer to? How is it similar to and different from from batch jobs in VMS. How would I have to change my thinking to recognize it? How and when is the specified user protected against unauthorized jobs run on his behalf? Thanks for educating me. -- Rob Brown b r o w n a t g m c l d o t c o m G. Michaels Consulting Ltd. (780)438-9343 (voice) Edmonton (780)437-3367 (FAX) http://gmcl.com/ ------------------------------ Date: 23 Oct 2007 17:01:22 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: unix "batch processing" Message-ID: <5o6nn2Flf59dU2@mid.individual.net> In article , Rob Brown writes: > On Tue, 23 Oct 2007, Bill Gunshannon wrote: > >> In article <4$VTv9Rz+Npg@eisner.encompasserve.org>, >> briggs@encompasserve.org writes: >>> In article <1193153254.512670.15500@t8g2000prg.googlegroups.com>, >>> a13365@yahoo.com writes: >>>> What kind privileges I need to check? >>> >>> $ HELP SUBMIT /USER >>> SUBMIT >>> >>> /USER >>> >>> /USER=username >>> >>> Requires CMKRNL (change mode to kernel) privilege and read (R) >>> and write (W) access to the user authorization file (UAF). >> >> Ohmigod!!!! There is actually something that Unix can do that >> VMS can't do (at least not without elevated priviledges on the >> VMS side!!) > > I have never known how to do something in Linux that I would do in > batch in VMS. Perhaps the UNIX facility you refer to exists in Linux? Of course it does. > > What UNIX facility do you refer to? Actually, I was just refering to the ability to do it as another user without elevated priviledges. > How is it similar to and > different from from batch jobs in VMS. I guess I would need to know what you think of as "batch jobs". To me that just means running non-interactive processes. That can be done in Unix either with the "at" command for later execution or with the "&" symbol to run the process in the background. > How would I have to change my > thinking to recognize it? How and when is the specified user > protected against unauthorized jobs run on his behalf? The same way he is protected from someone loggin in and running stuff as him. Password is required. Now, granted, it is not a good thing to give out yur password and is forbidden in many venue (like DOD) but I can think of and come up with places where this could still be used safely and would meet a need. > > Thanks for educating me. Hope what I said above helps at least a littel, if you have any more questions, feel free to email me directly as I am sure the majority here have no desire to have their mistaken understanding of Unix corrected. bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: 23 Oct 2007 12:23:50 -0500 From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) Subject: Re: unix "batch processing" Message-ID: In article <5o6nn2Flf59dU2@mid.individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: > The same way he is protected from someone loggin in and running stuff > as him. Password is required. Now, granted, it is not a good thing > to give out yur password and is forbidden in many venue (like DOD) but > I can think of and come up with places where this could still be used > safely and would meet a need. I can think of no situation on VMS where sharing of passwords would be reasonable (single user systems do not count, since there iws no sharing). If you want to fully share access, then create usernames with a shared UIC. They have the same rights to data but separate audit identities. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Oct 2007 17:28:57 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: unix "batch processing" Message-ID: <5o6papFlc2u7U1@mid.individual.net> In article , Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes: > In article <5o6nn2Flf59dU2@mid.individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: > >> The same way he is protected from someone loggin in and running stuff >> as him. Password is required. Now, granted, it is not a good thing >> to give out yur password and is forbidden in many venue (like DOD) but >> I can think of and come up with places where this could still be used >> safely and would meet a need. > > I can think of no situation on VMS where sharing of passwords would be > reasonable (single user systems do not count, since there iws no sharing). As I said, where this was common at one time, today is different and many venue prohibit it. But I can remember a time, not all that long ago, when the VMS system here (not the one in my department, but the one run by the University Datacenter) had piles of "captive logins" that were used by numerous people who all shared a common password. Seemed to be the normal way of doing things on VMS. > > If you want to fully share access, then create usernames with a shared > UIC. They have the same rights to data but separate audit identities. If I am correct, that would be the same as a Unix Group. But that wasn't what the requestor was asking about. He wanted to run something as another user. bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2007.580 ************************