INFO-VAX Thu, 13 Dec 2007 Volume 2007 : Issue 681 Contents: Re: "snapshot" backup and HBVS Re: "snapshot" backup and HBVS Re: "snapshot" backup and HBVS Re: "snapshot" backup and HBVS Re: -SYSTEM-F-EXQUOTA, process quota exceeded Re: -SYSTEM-F-EXQUOTA, process quota exceeded Re: Amazing RUNOFF defect? Re: Amazing RUNOFF defect? Re: Compiling ANU-NEWS on Alpha? Re: DE500 failure, looking for advice Re: DE500 failure, looking for advice Educational License Delay HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Re: Installation of DEGPA-TA on VMS 7.2-1 system Re: One Laptop per Child Re: One Laptop per Child Re: OT: One Laptop per Child Re: OT: One Laptop per Child Re: OT: One Laptop per Child Re: OT: One Laptop per Child Re: OT: One Laptop per Child Re: OT: One Laptop per Child Re: OT: One Laptop per Child Re: Picking nits Re: Picking nits Re: Removing blank lines in a file... Re: Removing blank lines in a file... Re: Removing blank lines in a file... Re: Removing blank lines in a file... Re: Removing blank lines in a file... Re: Removing blank lines in a file... Re: Removing blank lines in a file... Re: Self-extracting archives for I64? (Who's got the stub?) SSRVEXCEPT, Unexpected system service exception Re: SSRVEXCEPT, Unexpected system service exception Re: TCPware and MIME (again) Re: TCPware and MIME (again) Re: TCPware and MIME (again) Re: TECOing blank lines out of a file Re: TECOing blank lines out of a file Re: TECOing blank lines out of a file ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 07:23:32 +0200 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Uusim=E4ki?= Subject: Re: "snapshot" backup and HBVS Message-ID: <475e1e27$0$3216$9b536df3@news.fv.fi> Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply wrote: > In article , helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de > (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) writes: > >> However, if I have to go back to this nightly snapshot backup, then I >> have the choice betwwen a full shadow copy and living with one >> shadow-set, member, neither of which is acceptable. > > That should be: living with a one-member shadow set > > I don't think there is a way to do this with VMS out of the box. > However, it would be great to learn that there is. > > What about low-level stuff to hack the SCB? > Is it out of the question to use an intelligent disk array (or maybe two) to produce a snapshot or clone or split mirror? With that there would be several ways to do it. The con is of course cost, which seems to be more important than data security in many companies nowadays. Regards, Kari ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 08:46:07 +0000 (UTC) From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) Subject: Re: "snapshot" backup and HBVS Message-ID: In article <6db9ef31-8aa6-47cb-8aba-a8577cee1d79@p69g2000hsa.googlegroups.com>, Rob writes: > Phillip, it sounds like you're using a HSG or EVA array for your data > already, as you use the term 'Snapshot'. Don't read too much into that. The question is quite general and could just as well apply to my hobbyist system with physical SCSI disks connected to VAXstations. I just used the term "snapshot" to indicate that I don't need a backup which is restorable to an arbitrary point in time, but rather one which is restorable to a daily "snapshot". > If so, I don't understand why you don't use the array to create the > copy for you? Let me phrase it another way. This is ALMOST what I want: Once a day, mount a third member into the shadow set, let it get updated via minicopy, then dismount it (at this special time, a clean dismount is possible). That's my "snapshot". A day later, repeat. Since the changes get updated via minicopy, it's fast enough. This is OK as far as it goes, but it doesn't go far enough---because the snapshot backup is just one disk. Yes, I could make a copy of that, but that would be a full copy and would thus take too long. Also, depending on how I do it, the next minicopy update might no longer work. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 08:52:57 -0500 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" Subject: Re: "snapshot" backup and HBVS Message-ID: <475E9639.5060303@comcast.net> Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply wrote: > In article > <6db9ef31-8aa6-47cb-8aba-a8577cee1d79@p69g2000hsa.googlegroups.com>, Rob > writes: > > >>Phillip, it sounds like you're using a HSG or EVA array for your data >>already, as you use the term 'Snapshot'. > > > Don't read too much into that. The question is quite general and could > just as well apply to my hobbyist system with physical SCSI disks > connected to VAXstations. I just used the term "snapshot" to indicate > that I don't need a backup which is restorable to an arbitrary point in > time, but rather one which is restorable to a daily "snapshot". > > >>If so, I don't understand why you don't use the array to create the >>copy for you? > > > Let me phrase it another way. This is ALMOST what I want: Once a day, > mount a third member into the shadow set, let it get updated via > minicopy, then dismount it (at this special time, a clean dismount is > possible). That's my "snapshot". A day later, repeat. Since the > changes get updated via minicopy, it's fast enough. This is OK as far > as it goes, but it doesn't go far enough---because the snapshot backup > is just one disk. Yes, I could make a copy of that, but that would be a > full copy and would thus take too long. Also, depending on how I do it, > the next minicopy update might no longer work. > This does NOT look like a backup to me! No form of RAID is equivalent to a backup unless you can take it off site. You just have a third member of the shadow set that you play with occasionally! You could take that snapshot offline and make a backup to tape without worrying about the volume being written while the backup is happening. The ultimate corollary to Murphy's law: "If nothing goes wrong, it would have been better if something had gone wrong!" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 15:57:47 -0500 From: norm.raphael@metso.com Subject: Re: "snapshot" backup and HBVS Message-ID: This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 007327F0852573AF_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) wrote on 12/11/2007 03:46:07 AM: > In article > <6db9ef31-8aa6-47cb-8aba-a8577cee1d79@p69g2000hsa.googlegroups.com>, Rob > writes: > > > Phillip, it sounds like you're using a HSG or EVA array for your data > > already, as you use the term 'Snapshot'. > > Don't read too much into that. The question is quite general and could > just as well apply to my hobbyist system with physical SCSI disks > connected to VAXstations. I just used the term "snapshot" to indicate > that I don't need a backup which is restorable to an arbitrary point in > time, but rather one which is restorable to a daily "snapshot". > > > If so, I don't understand why you don't use the array to create the > > copy for you? > > Let me phrase it another way. This is ALMOST what I want: Once a day, > mount a third member into the shadow set, let it get updated via > minicopy, then dismount it (at this special time, a clean dismount is > possible). That's my "snapshot". A day later, repeat. Since the > changes get updated via minicopy, it's fast enough. This is OK as far > as it goes, but it doesn't go far enough---because the snapshot backup > is just one disk. Yes, I could make a copy of that, but that would be a > full copy and would thus take too long. Also, depending on how I do it, > the next minicopy update might no longer work. > ITSM it was suggested that the third member cosist of a 2-spindle mirror-set from the SAN. Then, if you need to use the third volume, you split it into two separate 1-spindle LUNs and mount them as a shadow-set pair. Now you have recovered with a shadowset, and your only problem is getting a new 2-spindle mirror-set from the SAN copied into the shadow-set, and that seems to require a full copy, but you have your 2-disk shadow set back. That's really close to what you seem to need. --=_alternative 007327F0852573AF_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"



helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) wrote on 12/11/2007 03:46:07 AM:

> In article
> <6db9ef31-8aa6-47cb-8aba-a8577cee1d79@p69g2000hsa.googlegroups.com>, Rob
> <ratkinson@tbs-ltd.co.uk> writes:
>
> > Phillip, it sounds like you're using a HSG or EVA array for your data
> > already, as you use the term 'Snapshot'.
>
> Don't read too much into that.  The question is quite general and could
> just as well apply to my hobbyist system with physical SCSI disks
> connected to VAXstations.  I just used the term "snapshot" to indicate
> that I don't need a backup which is restorable to an arbitrary point in
> time, but rather one which is restorable to a daily "snapshot".
>
> > If so, I don't understand why you don't use the array to create the
> > copy for you?
>
> Let me phrase it another way.  This is ALMOST what I want: Once a day,
> mount a third member into the shadow set, let it get updated via
> minicopy, then dismount it (at this special time, a clean dismount is
> possible).  That's my "snapshot".  A day later, repeat.  Since the
> changes get updated via minicopy, it's fast enough.  This is OK as far
> as it goes, but it doesn't go far enough---because the snapshot backup
> is just one disk.  Yes, I could make a copy of that, but that would be a
> full copy and would thus take too long.  Also, depending on how I do it,
> the next minicopy update might no longer work.
>
ITSM it was suggested that the third member cosist of a 2-spindle mirror-set
from the SAN.  Then, if you need to use the third volume, you split it into
two separate 1-spindle LUNs and mount them as a shadow-set pair.  Now you
have recovered with a shadowset, and your only problem is getting a new
2-spindle mirror-set from the SAN copied into the shadow-set, and that seems
to require a full copy, but you have your 2-disk shadow set back.
That's really close to what you seem to need. --=_alternative 007327F0852573AF_=-- ------------------------------ Date: 11 Dec 2007 13:32:27 +0200 From: Alexander Horn Subject: Re: -SYSTEM-F-EXQUOTA, process quota exceeded Message-ID: <475e835b@news.arcor-ip.de> Hi VMS-Guys, in Article <475acbe1@news.arcor-ip.de>, I wrote: > [...] > I've compiled and installed David L. Jones's VMS-Port of SSH-1.5, > but I got a "-SYSTEM-F-EXQUOTA, process quota exceeded" in the > SSH_SERVER.LOG -- Strange is, when I start in interactive or TEST-mode, > the bootstrap works fine [...] I've solved the problem with the following Entries in MODPARAMS.DAT: MIN_GBLSECTIONS=600 MIN_GBLPAGES=27000 ADD_NPAGEDYN=500000 ADD_NPAGEVIR=500000 MIN_INTSTKPAGES=12 MIN_SPTREQ=6000 ADD_GBLPAGES=10000 ADD_GBLSECTIONS=100 ADD_NPAGEDYN=800000 ADD_NPAGEVIR=800000 ! ! Process Quotas ! MIN_PQL_DPGFLQUOTA=32768 MIN_PQL_MASTLM=100 MIN_PQL_MBIOLM=100 MIN_PQL_MDIOLM=100 MIN_PQL_MPRCLM=8 MIN_PQL_MFILLM=100 MIN_PQL_MBYTLM=40000 MIN_PQL_MENQLM=200 MIN_PQL_MWSDEFAULT=512 MIN_PQL_MWSQUOTA=1024 MIN_PQL_MWSEXTENT=2048 [...] My $ @DUA2:[HOME.VAXIMA.SSH_SERVER]SSH_SERVER_STARTUP.COM in VMS-Startup works now! :-) The SSH Server operates w/o ANY problems, on very different Installations: 16 MB, 128 MB, 512 MB Main Memory. (First, a MV3100/m80 -- The rest, all KA655X-B simh-VAX Installations) Thanks for helping me, -Vaxima -- Alexander Horn, Hostmaster (of staff) | OpenVMS (TM) rocks! 10 Bruckner, Sindelfingen 71065 Germany | http://www.marway.org/ eMail: vaxima@marway.org | Trouble w/ Windows? Reboot! vaxima@openvms-rocks.com | Trouble w/ UNIX? Be root! vaxima@vaxima.net | $ TELNET to [85.214.95.107] ... ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2007 11:58:01 +0200 From: Alexander Horn Subject: Re: -SYSTEM-F-EXQUOTA, process quota exceeded Message-ID: <475fbeb9@news.arcor-ip.de> Hi Mark, In de.comp.os.vms urbancamo you wrote: > Congratulations! > > Two questions: > > 1. Can you do X-Window port forwarding with this version of SSH? Not "tested" yet :-) > 2. Can you post a binary package for OpenVMS VAX? You can ``FTP-it'' (OpenVMS VAX binaries included) from: FTP vril.marway.org:/pub/openvms/vax/ssh: vril:/home/ftp/pub/openvms/vax/ssh# ls -l total 7984 -rw-r--r-- 1 vaxima vaxima 9616 Dec 12 11:42 README -rw-r--r-- 1 vaxima vaxima 9616 Dec 12 11:43 README.TXT -rw-r--r-- 1 vaxima vaxima 5128704 Dec 12 11:04 SSH_SERVER.BCK -rw-r--r-- 1 vaxima vaxima 751782 Dec 12 10:58 SSH_SERVER.ZIP drwxr-xr-x 2 vaxima vaxima 8192 Dec 12 11:11 files drwxr-xr-x 3 vaxima vaxima 4096 Dec 12 11:35 openssl -rw-r--r-- 1 vaxima vaxima 849920 Dec 12 10:58 ssh_server.tar -rw-r--r-- 1 vaxima vaxima 717528 Dec 12 10:58 ssh_server.tar.bz2 -rw-r--r-- 1 vaxima vaxima 650792 Dec 12 10:58 ssh_server.tar.gz Also, I've included the single files in subdirectory "files"... Regards, -Vaxima (VMS-User since 1983 :-) -- Alexander Horn, Hostmaster (of staff) | OpenVMS (TM) rocks! 10 Bruckner, Sindelfingen 71065 Germany | http://www.openvms.org/ eMail: vaxima@marway.org | Trouble w/ Windows? Reboot! vaxima@openvms-rocks.com | Trouble w/ UNIX? Be root! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 08:40:59 +0100 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: Amazing RUNOFF defect? Message-ID: In article <07120600562608_202002AB@antinode.org>, sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) wrote: > Directory ALP$DKA0:[SMS.RUNOFF] > > LC.MEM;1 142 <--- Hmmm. > UC.MEM;1 138 <--- > VMS_ZIP.RNH;1 131 Duplicated on another .RNH file here. The resulting .MEM has page numbers and form feeds, hence the larger size. The setting of SET PROCESS/PARSE doesn't make any difference here. This on Alpha V8.3. -- Paul Sture Sue's OpenVMS bookmarks: http://eisner.encompasserve.org/~sture/ovms-bookmarks.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 14:32:18 -0600 (CST) From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) Subject: Re: Amazing RUNOFF defect? Message-ID: <07121214321866_202647DE@antinode.org> From: "P. Sture" > In article <07120600562608_202002AB@antinode.org>, > sms@antinode-org (Steven M. Schweda) wrote: > > > Directory ALP$DKA0:[SMS.RUNOFF] > > > > LC.MEM;1 142 <--- Hmmm. > > UC.MEM;1 138 <--- > > VMS_ZIP.RNH;1 131 > > Duplicated on another .RNH file here. The resulting .MEM has page > numbers and form feeds, hence the larger size. > > The setting of SET PROCESS/PARSE doesn't make any difference here. > > This on Alpha V8.3. It's a trend. I submitted a "product business feedback" complaint to HP (http://h71000.www7.hp.com/fb_business.html), and got a thanks-but-it's-old-code response. Conspicuously missing was any suggestion that the problem would ever be fixed. (But, optimists may be encouraged, in that there was also no promise never to fix it.) In any case, future Info-ZIP source kits should contain only ".RNH", not ".rnh", files. Be sure to complain if you see a policy violation after now. SMS. ------------------------------ Date: 11 Dec 07 17:03:22 EST From: cook@wvnvms.wvnet.edu (George Cook) Subject: Re: Compiling ANU-NEWS on Alpha? Message-ID: In article , gartmann@nonsense.immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann) writes: > In article , cook@wvnvms.wvnet.edu (George Cook) writes: >>I last built ANU-NEWS (V6.2.0) on Alpha with Multinet under VMS V7.1. >>Your best bet is to compile it directly against Multinet. > > This produced more errors than the compile against UCX. > ... > __in_addr_t htonl (__in_addr_t); > ................^ > %CC-E-NOTCOMPAT, In this declaration, the type of "multinet_htonl" is not > compat > ible with the type of a previous declaration of "multinet_htonl" at line number > 296 in file MULTINET_COMMON_ROOT:[MULTINET.INCLUDE.SYS]SOCKET.H;9. > at line number 375 in module IN of text library > SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]DECC$RTLDEF.T > LB;1 > ... That brings back unpleasant memories. In the early years of supporting Mosaic on VMS, it was a constant struggle to keep the build working because DEC C and Multinet were constantly changing their header files in incompatible ways. I probably just got lucky (or did some hacking) with the particular DEC C and Multinet versions I last built ANU-NEWS with. If you need it just for reading news via NNTP, I have a NEWS.EXE for Alpha built on 7.1 which I could put out for ftp. George Cook WVNET ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 17:10:38 +0200 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Uusim=E4ki?= Subject: Re: DE500 failure, looking for advice Message-ID: <475ff945$0$3217$9b536df3@news.fv.fi> H Vlems wrote: > Good morning, yesterday I switched on my AlphaServer 800 5/500 and > tried to set up an Xwindows session. It failed, and pinging the system > didn't work either. The system was unreachable on all three protocols > (DECnet phase V, IP and LAT). This system usually runs Tru64 V5.0A (it > is my only unix box, ok) and I have no clue how its diagnostics work. > Provided there are any other than ifconfig. Anyway, I swapped its > disks and booted VMS which I understand a little better and runs > DECnet phase IV. > Conclusion: the DE500 is dead. I'm not sure whether it is the DE500-FA > listed in the Systems&Options Guide, it may very well be a DE500-BA. I > haven't opened the system yet, that'll have to wait until Wednesday. > Two questions: > - can I use a DE600 instead of a DE500? > - if so, do I need to reinstall Tru64 (which I rather didn't since > it's a royal pain? > Thanks > Hans Quick answer: First question: Yes, you can use DE60x instead of DE500. How you configure it depends somewhat on which Tru64 version (V4.x or V5.x) you are doing it. If you can tell more about that, then I can give you a more detailed answer. Second question: No, a reinstall is absolutely not needed. Only a reconfiguration. Btw. The DE500-FA is an adapter with a fiber optic interface. The DE500-AA/AX/BA's have a twisted pair interface. Regards, Kari ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 15:26:05 -0500 From: "David Turner, Island Computers" Subject: Re: DE500 failure, looking for advice Message-ID: <13m0h2n2tvg81a3@news.supernews.com> news to me learn something old every day dt -- David B Turner Island Computers US Corp 2700 Gregory St, Suite 180 Savannah GA 31404 T: 877-6364332 x201 Intl: 001 912 447 6622 E: dturner@islandco.com F: 912 201 0402 W: http://www.islandco.com The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential, proprietary, and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from all computers. "Ebinger . Eric" wrote in message news:B3C98F093EDF2146ADB62CDBD5B7FB060FEC97@andexch01.drc.com... I have a DE600 working in my Digital Server 3305. From the Alphaserver 800 5.8 Firmware update release notes: "(Alphaserver 800 and Digital Server 3300 ONLY) Console has boot support for the DE600-AA, DE600-FA, DE602-AA Ethernet cards. These cards use the Intel 82559 Ethernet chip. Note that non-Compaq Ethernet cards which use either the 82558 or 82559 Ethernet chip will be recognized from SRM console [a]s "Intel 8255x Ethernet" cards. Note the DE600 cards are translated to Compaq Product names as follows. Refer to: http://www.compaq.com/products/networking/nics/index.html DE600-AA = DE602-AA = DE602-TA = DE602-FA = NC3123 NC3131 NC3132 NC3133 ________________________________ From: David Turner, Island Computers [mailto:dturner@no-spam-islandco.com] Sent: Tue 12/11/2007 11:41 AM To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com Subject: Re: DE500 failure, looking for advice I didn't think the DE600 worked on the AS800 We have the DE500-BA for $50 DT -- David B Turner Island Computers US Corp 2700 Gregory St, Suite 180 Savannah GA 31404 T: 877-6364332 x201 Intl: 001 912 447 6622 E: dturner@islandco.com F: 912 201 0402 W: http://www.islandco.com The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential, proprietary, and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from all computers. "Carl Friedberg" wrote in message news:890539d90712110534p40bf24c7wa314eb143cb6f26f@mail.gmail.com... > Hi Hans, > >> Two questions: >> - can I use a DE600 instead of a DE500? > > I'd get a DE602; they run around USD 20 + shipping on EBay. > > >> - if so, do I need to reinstall Tru64 (which I rather didn't since >> it's a royal pain? > > For VMS, you will see the device letter change from EWA0 to EIA0 > and EIB0. I haven't a clue about four-letter OS. > > You could also consider a Gigabit interface like a DEGXA. > > Carl ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 10:06:10 +0000 From: Gary Parker Subject: Educational License Delay Message-ID: <2007121210061016807-@tamphex.lboro.ac.uk> Morning all, anyone tried to get Educational Licenses from http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvmsedu/licrequest_1.html recently? I already have our institution setup on there so have a 'School ID' but I'm still waiting for VAX-VMS and Layered Products PAKs after filling the forms in yesterday. Is this length of delay to be expected? Gary ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 14:55:44 -0500 From: "B H" Subject: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Message-ID: http://www.nashuatelegraph.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071212/NEWS01/312120101 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 15:25:51 -0500 From: "Ken Robinson" Subject: Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Message-ID: <7dd80f60712121225x54449de9qb1c450adaa7c6457@mail.gmail.com> On Dec 12, 2007 2:55 PM, B H wrote: > http://www.nashuatelegraph.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071212/NEWS01/312120101 What's this going to do to the location for the VMS Technical Boot Camp? It's my understanding that the location was picked to be close to the VMS engineers in Nashua. At least the article indicated that there would be no jobs eliminated by the move. Ken ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2007 20:37:59 GMT From: billg999@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Message-ID: <5sav57F17jvt4U2@mid.individual.net> In article <7dd80f60712121225x54449de9qb1c450adaa7c6457@mail.gmail.com>, "Ken Robinson" writes: > On Dec 12, 2007 2:55 PM, B H wrote: >> http://www.nashuatelegraph.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071212/NEWS01/312120101 > > What's this going to do to the location for the VMS Technical Boot > Camp? It's my understanding that the location was picked to be close > to the VMS engineers in Nashua. > > At least the article indicated that there would be no jobs eliminated > by the move. Unless it turns out that HP offers them enough to take early(?) retirement that they all opt to leave on their own. The result for VMS would be pretty much the same as a layoff. bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2007 16:13:35 -0500 From: brooks@cuebid.zko.hp.nospam (Rob Brooks) Subject: Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Message-ID: billg999@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: > "Ken Robinson" writes: >> What's this going to do to the location for the VMS Technical Boot >> Camp? It's my understanding that the location was picked to be close >> to the VMS engineers in Nashua. >> >> At least the article indicated that there would be no jobs eliminated >> by the move. > > Unless it turns out that HP offers them enough to take early(?) > retirement that they all opt to leave on their own. The result > for VMS would be pretty much the same as a layoff. There is no early retirement being offered. As many VMS engineers live in NH (and pay no income tax), I expect a large number of VMS engineering will telecommute, rather than work in MA and pay a 5.3% income tax. -- Rob Brooks MSL -- Nashua brooks!cuebid.zko.hp.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 21:16:45 GMT From: VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Message-ID: <1dY7j.1$Vh2.0@newsfe09.lga> In article <7dd80f60712121225x54449de9qb1c450adaa7c6457@mail.gmail.com>, "Ken Robinson" writes: > > >On Dec 12, 2007 2:55 PM, B H wrote: >> http://www.nashuatelegraph.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071212/NEWS01/312120101 > >What's this going to do to the location for the VMS Technical Boot >Camp? It's my understanding that the location was picked to be close >to the VMS engineers in Nashua. > >At least the article indicated that there would be no jobs eliminated >by the move. What about the labs. All that equipment! That is NOT going to be an easy move. The article was right. It would have been better to move the Mass. facilities to Nashua. Will the non-paged pool be drained and that water used to fill one of the pot holes in Mass? -- VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" http://tmesis.com/drat.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 16:19:40 -0500 From: John Reagan Subject: Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Message-ID: Ken Robinson wrote: > What's this going to do to the location for the VMS Technical Boot > Camp? It's my understanding that the location was picked to be close > to the VMS engineers in Nashua. > The move isn't scheduled until after the Bootcamp. There should be no change (I believe that is what I heard). -- John ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2007 15:41:01 -0600 From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) Subject: Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Message-ID: In article <7dd80f60712121225x54449de9qb1c450adaa7c6457@mail.gmail.com>, "Ken Robinson" writes: > On Dec 12, 2007 2:55 PM, B H wrote: >> http://www.nashuatelegraph.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071212/NEWS01/312120101 > > What's this going to do to the location for the VMS Technical Boot > Camp? It's my understanding that the location was picked to be close > to the VMS engineers in Nashua. Marlborough Massachusetts and adjacent Westborough Massachusetts both have hotels. I did not see an effective date in the article, so it might be there is one year of disconnect. ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2007 15:41:49 -0600 From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) Subject: Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Message-ID: In article <5sav57F17jvt4U2@mid.individual.net>, billg999@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: > In article <7dd80f60712121225x54449de9qb1c450adaa7c6457@mail.gmail.com>, > "Ken Robinson" writes: >> On Dec 12, 2007 2:55 PM, B H wrote: >>> http://www.nashuatelegraph.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071212/NEWS01/312120101 >> >> What's this going to do to the location for the VMS Technical Boot >> Camp? It's my understanding that the location was picked to be close >> to the VMS engineers in Nashua. >> >> At least the article indicated that there would be no jobs eliminated >> by the move. > > Unless it turns out that HP offers them enough to take early(?) > retirement that they all opt to leave on their own. The result > for VMS would be pretty much the same as a layoff. For at least one very senior VMS engineer, Marlborough is incredibly closer. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 14:04:46 -0800 (PST) From: Rich Jordan Subject: Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Message-ID: <20694d72-05f4-4234-a638-56cba3d3dd4d@i3g2000hsf.googlegroups.com> On Dec 12, 1:55 pm, "B H" wrote: > http://www.nashuatelegraph.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071212/NE... Thats just too bad. Given a choice between New Hampshire and taxachussetts, a state that gives Ill-annoy a run for the "most incompetent and corrupt" title, I know where I'd prefer to live and work... That and I got to visit that facility a couple of times... it feels like more of a loss because of those trips. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 17:45:44 -0500 From: "Carl Friedberg" Subject: Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Message-ID: <890539d90712121445m61bd847at197ae94c30a6d8b1@mail.gmail.com> Hi, > ... That and I got to visit that facility a couple of times... it > feels like more of a loss because of those trips. I visited Digital Equipment hq twice in my life. The first time, I was in college in the early 60's, and I needed to fabricate some printed circuit boards which would go into the Digital modular backplane (same layout as the PDP-1 hardware). I received an invitation to come to Maynard and tour the mill, to see their printed circuit fabrication facilities. You can't imagine how I felt seeing a wave soldering machine for the first time -- I was a budding physicist, and seeing how printed circuit boards were manufactured was a real eye-opening experience. I went on to fabricate my own boards to the Digital specs, and they worked (I had six gates on a board, compared to the one gate they were selling). The second, and last, trip, was to Marlboro, mid 1977. I visited the VMS engineering group, which consisted of about 10 people. I had to test out a fortran image processing program for Mass General; they later bought the first VAX in Boston. I did the tests on VAX/VMS (defintely not Open) 0.5. I've never been to Spitbrook, but I'm sorry to see yet another piece of VMS history going down... Carl Friedberg ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2007 23:19:06 GMT From: billg999@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Message-ID: <5sb8jaF18c6q7U1@mid.individual.net> In article , brooks@cuebid.zko.hp.nospam (Rob Brooks) writes: > billg999@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: >> "Ken Robinson" writes: > >>> What's this going to do to the location for the VMS Technical Boot >>> Camp? It's my understanding that the location was picked to be close >>> to the VMS engineers in Nashua. >>> >>> At least the article indicated that there would be no jobs eliminated >>> by the move. >> >> Unless it turns out that HP offers them enough to take early(?) >> retirement that they all opt to leave on their own. The result >> for VMS would be pretty much the same as a layoff. > > There is no early retirement being offered. > > As many VMS engineers live in NH (and pay no income tax), I expect > a large number of VMS engineering will telecommute, rather than work > in MA and pay a 5.3% income tax. If their place of employment is in MA won't MA get to tax them anyway? I know that was the way it worked around here. Before PA had things lime "occupational priviledge" taxes people who worked over the border in NY had to pay it to NY. That was one of the reasons why PA started doing it. If the tax had to be paid anyway, why shouldn;t they be the one collecting (and profiting from) it. bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 19:31:45 -0500 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" Subject: Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Message-ID: <47607D71.2040505@comcast.net> Rich Jordan wrote: > On Dec 12, 1:55 pm, "B H" wrote: > >>http://www.nashuatelegraph.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071212/NE... > > > Thats just too bad. Given a choice between New Hampshire and > taxachussetts, a state that gives Ill-annoy a run for the "most > incompetent and corrupt" title, I know where I'd prefer to live and > work... That and I got to visit that facility a couple of times... it > feels like more of a loss because of those trips. I thought everyone knew that New Jersey is the "most incompetent and corrupt"! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2007 00:54:50 GMT From: VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Message-ID: In article <47607D71.2040505@comcast.net>, "Richard B. Gilbert" writes: > > >Rich Jordan wrote: >> On Dec 12, 1:55 pm, "B H" wrote: >> >>>http://www.nashuatelegraph.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071212/NE... >> >> >> Thats just too bad. Given a choice between New Hampshire and >> taxachussetts, a state that gives Ill-annoy a run for the "most >> incompetent and corrupt" title, I know where I'd prefer to live and >> work... That and I got to visit that facility a couple of times... it >> feels like more of a loss because of those trips. > >I thought everyone knew that New Jersey is the "most incompetent and >corrupt"! I wasn't going to bring it up. ;) -- VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" http://tmesis.com/drat.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2007 01:10:35 GMT From: Bob Harris Subject: Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Message-ID: In article <7dd80f60712121225x54449de9qb1c450adaa7c6457@mail.gmail.com>, "Ken Robinson" wrote: > On Dec 12, 2007 2:55 PM, B H wrote: > > http://www.nashuatelegraph.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071212/NEWS01/31 > > 2120101 > > What's this going to do to the location for the VMS Technical Boot > Camp? It's my understanding that the location was picked to be close > to the VMS engineers in Nashua. > > At least the article indicated that there would be no jobs eliminated > by the move. > > Ken Think about it. If you have a layoff or early retirement package, you have to pay severance, and since many of the VMS engineers would get close to the maximum severance package, it is much cheaper to move them to an office where they would rather not commute, and wait for them to resign. Much cheaper that way. Bob Harris Former ZK resident. Now I just look across the parking lot at ZK. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 20:21:31 -0500 From: bradhamilton Subject: Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Message-ID: <4760891B.5060209@comcast.net> Bill Gunshannon wrote: > In article , > brooks@cuebid.zko.hp.nospam (Rob Brooks) writes: >> billg999@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: >>> "Ken Robinson" writes: >>>> What's this going to do to the location for the VMS Technical Boot >>>> Camp? It's my understanding that the location was picked to be close >>>> to the VMS engineers in Nashua. >>>> >>>> At least the article indicated that there would be no jobs eliminated >>>> by the move. >>> Unless it turns out that HP offers them enough to take early(?) >>> retirement that they all opt to leave on their own. The result >>> for VMS would be pretty much the same as a layoff. >> There is no early retirement being offered. >> >> As many VMS engineers live in NH (and pay no income tax), I expect >> a large number of VMS engineering will telecommute, rather than work >> in MA and pay a 5.3% income tax. > > If their place of employment is in MA won't MA get to tax them anyway? > I know that was the way it worked around here. Before PA had things > lime "occupational priviledge" taxes people who worked over the border > in NY had to pay it to NY. That was one of the reasons why PA started > doing it. If the tax had to be paid anyway, why shouldn;t they be the > one collecting (and profiting from) it. I think so - as a former Fidelity employee working in Marlborough, (we shared the "campus" with Compaq/HP) one of my managers commuted from Manchester, NH, and paid income tax - since NH has none, I'm assuming he paid MA income tax. Perhaps there was some kind of "arrangement" between the two states that I'm unaware of. He did gripe about paying tax, but perhaps he got a break on his property tax (NH property taxes are "high", probably to "compensate" for the lack of income tax - not something that the state publicizes readily). Well, perhaps the boot camps will take place in Marlborough - much easier for *me* to get to! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 18:33:56 -0700 From: Dan O'Reilly Subject: Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.2.20071212183206.025c7be0@raptor.psccos.com> At 06:21 PM 12/12/2007, bradhamilton wrote: >Bill Gunshannon wrote: >>In article , >> brooks@cuebid.zko.hp.nospam (Rob Brooks) writes: >>>billg999@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: >>>> "Ken Robinson" writes: >>>>>What's this going to do to the location for the VMS Technical Boot >>>>>Camp? It's my understanding that the location was picked to be close >>>>>to the VMS engineers in Nashua. >>>>> >>>>>At least the article indicated that there would be no jobs eliminated >>>>>by the move. >>>>Unless it turns out that HP offers them enough to take early(?) >>>>retirement that they all opt to leave on their own. The result >>>>for VMS would be pretty much the same as a layoff. >>>There is no early retirement being offered. >>> >>>As many VMS engineers live in NH (and pay no income tax), I expect >>>a large number of VMS engineering will telecommute, rather than work >>>in MA and pay a 5.3% income tax. >>If their place of employment is in MA won't MA get to tax them anyway? >>I know that was the way it worked around here. Before PA had things >>lime "occupational priviledge" taxes people who worked over the border >>in NY had to pay it to NY. That was one of the reasons why PA started >>doing it. If the tax had to be paid anyway, why shouldn;t they be the >>one collecting (and profiting from) it. > >I think so - as a former Fidelity employee working in Marlborough, (we >shared the "campus" with Compaq/HP) one of my managers commuted from >Manchester, NH, and paid income tax - since NH has none, I'm assuming he >paid MA income tax. Perhaps there was some kind of "arrangement" between >the two states that I'm unaware of. I doubt that was the case. I live in CO and telecommute to MA (Process Software). I pay CO taxes, not MA taxes. The interesting thing is, there are some MA labor laws that affect me here in CO, although paying taxes isn't one of them. ------ +-------------------------------+----------------------------------------+ | Dan O'Reilly | "There are 10 types of people in this | | Principal Engineer | world: those who understand binary | | Process Software | and those who don't." | | http://www.process.com | | +-------------------------------+----------------------------------------+ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 21:07:37 -0500 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" Subject: Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Message-ID: <476093E9.8030909@comcast.net> Dan O'Reilly wrote: > At 06:21 PM 12/12/2007, bradhamilton wrote: > >> Bill Gunshannon wrote: >> >>> In article , >>> brooks@cuebid.zko.hp.nospam (Rob Brooks) writes: >>> >>>> billg999@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: >>>> >>>>> "Ken Robinson" writes: >>>>> >>>>>> What's this going to do to the location for the VMS Technical Boot >>>>>> Camp? It's my understanding that the location was picked to be close >>>>>> to the VMS engineers in Nashua. >>>>>> >>>>>> At least the article indicated that there would be no jobs eliminated >>>>>> by the move. >>>>> >>>>> Unless it turns out that HP offers them enough to take early(?) >>>>> retirement that they all opt to leave on their own. The result >>>>> for VMS would be pretty much the same as a layoff. >>>> >>>> There is no early retirement being offered. >>>> >>>> As many VMS engineers live in NH (and pay no income tax), I expect >>>> a large number of VMS engineering will telecommute, rather than work >>>> in MA and pay a 5.3% income tax. >>> >>> If their place of employment is in MA won't MA get to tax them anyway? >>> I know that was the way it worked around here. Before PA had things >>> lime "occupational priviledge" taxes people who worked over the border >>> in NY had to pay it to NY. That was one of the reasons why PA started >>> doing it. If the tax had to be paid anyway, why shouldn;t they be the >>> one collecting (and profiting from) it. >> >> >> I think so - as a former Fidelity employee working in Marlborough, (we >> shared the "campus" with Compaq/HP) one of my managers commuted from >> Manchester, NH, and paid income tax - since NH has none, I'm assuming >> he paid MA income tax. Perhaps there was some kind of "arrangement" >> between the two states that I'm unaware of. > > > I doubt that was the case. I live in CO and telecommute to MA (Process > Software). I pay CO taxes, not MA taxes. The interesting thing is, > there are some MA labor laws that affect me here in CO, although paying > taxes isn't one of them. Massachusetts laws may affect you but they can't be enforced against you since you are not in their jurisdiction! Massachusetts can enforce their laws against an employer who is within their jurisdiction. I used to work in Pennsylvania but paid no Pennsylvania income taxes because I was employed and paid by a company in New Jersey. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 21:42:45 -0500 From: norm.raphael@metso.com Subject: Re: HP to close Nashua (ZKO) Message-ID: This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 000EE72B852573B0_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Dan O'Reilly wrote on 12/12/2007 08:33:56 PM: > At 06:21 PM 12/12/2007, bradhamilton wrote: > >Bill Gunshannon wrote: > >>In article , > >> brooks@cuebid.zko.hp.nospam (Rob Brooks) writes: > >>>billg999@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: > >>>> "Ken Robinson" writes: > >>>>>What's this going to do to the location for the VMS Technical Boot > >>>>>Camp? It's my understanding that the location was picked to be close > >>>>>to the VMS engineers in Nashua. > >>>>> > >>>>>At least the article indicated that there would be no jobs eliminated > >>>>>by the move. > >>>>Unless it turns out that HP offers them enough to take early(?) > >>>>retirement that they all opt to leave on their own. The result > >>>>for VMS would be pretty much the same as a layoff. > >>>There is no early retirement being offered. > >>> > >>>As many VMS engineers live in NH (and pay no income tax), I expect > >>>a large number of VMS engineering will telecommute, rather than work > >>>in MA and pay a 5.3% income tax. > >>If their place of employment is in MA won't MA get to tax them anyway? > >>I know that was the way it worked around here. Before PA had things > >>lime "occupational priviledge" taxes people who worked over the border > >>in NY had to pay it to NY. That was one of the reasons why PA started > >>doing it. If the tax had to be paid anyway, why shouldn;t they be the > >>one collecting (and profiting from) it. > > > >I think so - as a former Fidelity employee working in Marlborough, (we > >shared the "campus" with Compaq/HP) one of my managers commuted from > >Manchester, NH, and paid income tax - since NH has none, I'm assuming he > >paid MA income tax. Perhaps there was some kind of "arrangement" between > >the two states that I'm unaware of. > > I doubt that was the case. I live in CO and telecommute to MA (Process > Software). I pay CO taxes, not MA taxes. (Since Col. has income taxes, your case is not analogous.) The thing if it is: Since N.H. has no income tax, Mass. can and does collect Non-Resident State Income Tax from those living in N.H., but working in Mass. > The interesting thing is, there > are some MA labor laws that affect me here in CO, although paying taxes > isn't one of them. > > ------ > +-------------------------------+----------------------------------------+ > | Dan O'Reilly | "There are 10 types of people in this | > | Principal Engineer | world: those who understand binary | > | Process Software | and those who don't." | > | http://www.process.com | | > +-------------------------------+----------------------------------------+ > --=_alternative 000EE72B852573B0_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"



Dan O'Reilly <dano@process.com> wrote on 12/12/2007 08:33:56 PM:

> At 06:21 PM 12/12/2007, bradhamilton wrote:
> >Bill Gunshannon wrote:
> >>In article <qVSI4iux1tuj@cuebid.zko.hp.com>,
> >>         brooks@cuebid.zko.hp.nospam (Rob Brooks) writes:
> >>>billg999@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:
> >>>>         "Ken Robinson" <kenrbnsn@gmail.com> writes:
> >>>>>What's this going to do to the location for the VMS Technical Boot
> >>>>>Camp? It's my understanding that the location was picked to be close
> >>>>>to the VMS engineers in Nashua.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>At least the article indicated that there would be no jobs eliminated
> >>>>>by the move.
> >>>>Unless it turns out that HP offers them enough to take early(?)
> >>>>retirement that they all opt to leave on their own.  The result
> >>>>for VMS would be pretty much the same as a layoff.
> >>>There is no early retirement being offered.
> >>>
> >>>As many VMS engineers live in NH (and pay no income tax), I expect
> >>>a large number of VMS engineering will telecommute, rather than work
> >>>in MA and pay a 5.3% income tax.
> >>If their place of employment is in MA won't MA get to tax them anyway?
> >>I know that was the way it worked around here.  Before PA had things
> >>lime "occupational priviledge" taxes people who worked over the border
> >>in NY had to pay it to NY.  That was one of the reasons why PA started
> >>doing it.  If the tax had to be paid anyway, why shouldn;t they be the
> >>one collecting (and profiting from) it.
> >
> >I think so - as a former Fidelity employee working in Marlborough, (we
> >shared the "campus" with Compaq/HP) one of my managers commuted from
> >Manchester, NH, and paid income tax - since NH has none, I'm assuming he
> >paid MA income tax.  Perhaps there was some kind of "arrangement" between
> >the two states that I'm unaware of.
>
> I doubt that was the case.  I live in CO and telecommute to MA (Process
> Software).  I pay CO taxes, not MA taxes.  


(Since Col. has income taxes, your case is not analogous.)
The thing if it is:  Since N.H. has no income tax, Mass. can and does
collect Non-Resident State Income Tax from those living in N.H., but
working in Mass.

>                                           The interesting thing is, there
> are some MA labor laws that affect me here in CO, although paying taxes
> isn't one of them.
>
> ------
> +-------------------------------+----------------------------------------+
> | Dan O'Reilly                  |  "There are 10 types of people in this |
> | Principal Engineer            |   world: those who understand binary   |
> | Process Software              |   and those who don't."                |
> | http://www.process.com        |                                        |
> +-------------------------------+----------------------------------------+
>
--=_alternative 000EE72B852573B0_=-- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 11:44:51 -0500 From: "David Turner, Island Computers" Subject: Re: Installation of DEGPA-TA on VMS 7.2-1 system Message-ID: <13ltfntc3i0i908@news.supernews.com> The problem my customer is having is that TCPIPCONFIG (?)does not see the card - I think there is a patch download requirement. He is running VMS 7.2-1 -- David B Turner Island Computers US Corp 2700 Gregory St, Suite 180 Savannah GA 31404 T: 877-6364332 x201 Intl: 001 912 447 6622 E: dturner@islandco.com F: 912 201 0402 W: http://www.islandco.com The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential, proprietary, and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from all computers. "Ed Wilts" wrote in message news:f0c360fd-ea29-44ff-a80b-4bc7a3c09cb2@i29g2000prf.googlegroups.com... > On Dec 6, 9:28 am, "David Turner, Island Computers" islandco.com> wrote: >> Customer is having a problem with installation of DEGPA-TA copper Gigabit >> card (old style) in a ES40 >> Can anyone PLEASE send an install guide (I can't find one anywhere in our >> docs) and or user guide to dtur...@islandco.com > > I've got one in my ES40 running V7.3-2 (the docs say you must be > running 7.1-2 or later). I do have the paper doc but don't have an > electronic version. It's marked: > COMPAQ PCI to Gigabit Ethernet Adapter > Installation and Configuration Guide > Revised Edition October 2000 > Part Number EK-DEGPA-IN.B01 > > There's not much for installation instructions in the doc... > > What seems to be the problem? David, feel free to drop me email > directly to my address below - I don't check comp.os.vms as often as I > should these days. > > .../Ed > > Ed Wilts, RHCE, BCFP, BCSD > Sr. IT Architect, Storage Services, Merrill Corporation > mailto:ewilts@ewilts.org ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 15:28:25 -0500 From: "David Turner, Island Computers" Subject: Re: One Laptop per Child Message-ID: <13m0h73ppgdnb0b@news.supernews.com> What is the going rate of a 3rd world child? 1 x OLPC laptop? 1 x Goat? Less maybe? -- David B Turner Island Computers US Corp 2700 Gregory St, Suite 180 Savannah GA 31404 T: 877-6364332 x201 Intl: 001 912 447 6622 E: dturner@islandco.com F: 912 201 0402 W: http://www.islandco.com The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential, proprietary, and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from all computers. "Bill Gunshannon" wrote in message news:5s82u9F17juq8U1@mid.individual.net... > In article <13ltfkgjv4vqbe@news.supernews.com>, > "David Turner, Island Computers" writes: >> I wonder how long it will be before we see stolen OLPC laptops on >> Ebay!?!? > > Knowing who the target market is why wold they need to be stolen? The > residents of most of these third world countries sell their kids do you > think they won't sell the free PC someone gives them? > > bill > > -- > Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves > bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. > University of Scranton | > Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2007 20:35:40 GMT From: billg999@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: One Laptop per Child Message-ID: <5sav0rF17jvt4U1@mid.individual.net> In article <13m0h73ppgdnb0b@news.supernews.com>, "David Turner, Island Computers" writes: > What is the going rate of a 3rd world child? > 1 x OLPC laptop? 1 x Goat? > Less maybe? Well, I am pretty sure when the story of the French "charitable" agency trying to get out of the country with a bus load of kids to be "adopted" in France the news said the "adopters" had payed several thousand Euros each for their future "children". What did Madonna pay? bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2007 20:40:55 -0500 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: OT: One Laptop per Child Message-ID: <475deaa0$0$90267$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> Larry Kilgallen wrote: > Not keeping up with Java and Javascript seems a benefit to me. Java applet are becoming rare, but without JavaScript there will be a lot of nonusable pages. > But I do not know what "official" means in the context of free > software. Free does not preclude something being official. But I don't think official is that relevant. The important part is the support aspect. The OLPC project probably want something where it is possible to buy support. Arne ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 01:32:08 +0100 From: Michael Kraemer Subject: Re: OT: One Laptop per Child Message-ID: Larry Kilgallen schrieb: > Not keeping up with Java and Javascript seems a benefit to me. > > I am less impressed by not keeping up with cascading style sheets, > but I don't know enough about those to see any security implications. well, if your browser doesn't support these, you are simply locked out from am increasingly large part of modern communication. > But I do not know what "official" means in the context of free > software. "official" in this context means that once upon a time there was a dedicated group of individuals at NCSA who took care of developing Mosaic for a variety of platforms. Nowadays Mosaic is abandonware (with the latest release 2.7 you can't even render NCSA's home page properly), apart from Mr Cooks appreciated efforts to keep it alive at least on VMS. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 06:05:45 -0500 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: OT: One Laptop per Child Message-ID: <33caa$475e6f0a$cef8887a$32523@TEKSAVVY.COM> Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply wrote: > Again, will having learned current computer technology help 30 years > from now, when this technology will probably be quite different? How do you now learn about new stuff ? By using current browsers on the current internet. These people are given tools to not only learn the basics abouta computer, but also learn new stuff by using the computer as a tool to learn. Remember that they do not have amazon.com or any large book store that sells new books at affordable prices. But if they can download books on their laptops, then can then learn by using materials supplied by the school/government. Furthermore, by knowing about the internet, it also helps ensure proper democratisation because the kids, when growing up, will not rely exclusively on what their government is telling them, and this forces governments to be more honest with the people. Contrary to what Rumsfeld/Cheney/Wolfowitz promised, you cannot impose freedom of choice and democracy on a country just like that. It has to grow from within and evolve. And providing people with access to information is a very good way to move the process forwards. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 11:35:51 +0000 (UTC) From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) Subject: Re: OT: One Laptop per Child Message-ID: In article <33caa$475e6f0a$cef8887a$32523@TEKSAVVY.COM>, JF Mezei writes: > Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply wrote: > > Again, will having learned current computer technology help 30 years > > from now, when this technology will probably be quite different? > > How do you now learn about new stuff ? By using current browsers on the > current internet. True, to some extent. However, I doubt that learning from the internet is at the top of the list of priorities for most pupils. > These people are given tools to not only learn the basics abouta > computer, but also learn new stuff by using the computer as a tool to learn. OK, but they will tend to get tied to that platform. This problem exists already, of course (how many pages have you seen which say "best viewed with Internet Explorer"?), but will exist in much larger form if all children have the same laptop. If they can't learn something else later, then this is a reason to avoid OLPC. If they can, then OLPC isn't necessary. > Remember that they do not have amazon.com or any large book store that > sells new books at affordable prices. But if they can download books on > their laptops, then can then learn by using materials supplied by the > school/government. I don't know if that is possible with these things. > Furthermore, by knowing about the internet, it also helps ensure proper > democratisation because the kids, when growing up, will not rely > exclusively on what their government is telling them, and this forces > governments to be more honest with the people. I doubt that. If a country has problems with what its people read, it will take steps to stop them from doing so. See China. > Contrary to what Rumsfeld/Cheney/Wolfowitz promised, you cannot impose > freedom of choice and democracy on a country just like that. It has to > grow from within and evolve. And providing people with access to > information is a very good way to move the process forwards. I agree. What bothers me the most is the emphasis on the laptop. A better approach would be public web access. ------------------------------ Date: 11 Dec 2007 14:43:03 -0600 From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) Subject: Re: OT: One Laptop per Child Message-ID: <147wNAKCs10l@eisner.encompasserve.org> In article , Michael Kraemer writes: > Larry Kilgallen schrieb: > >> Not keeping up with Java and Javascript seems a benefit to me. >> >> I am less impressed by not keeping up with cascading style sheets, >> but I don't know enough about those to see any security implications. > > well, if your browser doesn't support these, > you are simply locked out from am increasingly > large part of modern communication. That does not seem responsive to the security question I raised. >> But I do not know what "official" means in the context of free >> software. > > "official" in this context means that once upon a time > there was a dedicated group of individuals at NCSA > who took care of developing Mosaic for a variety of platforms. > Nowadays Mosaic is abandonware (with the latest release 2.7 > you can't even render NCSA's home page properly), > apart from Mr Cooks appreciated efforts to keep it alive > at least on VMS. Why should I care whether it is on other platforms ? ------------------------------ Date: 11 Dec 2007 14:44:07 -0600 From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) Subject: Re: OT: One Laptop per Child Message-ID: In article , Michael Kraemer writes: > JF Mezei schrieb: > >> Remember that if a couple of people in a village get jobs, the spending >> they do in that village will greatly help the rest of the village. > > Provided said village has electricity at all > (preferably generated by solar panels), > otherwise the cool laptop would be just an > expensive door stop. You seem to have not been paying attention to the part about being able to charge the laptop yourself with a hand crank. You should really make arrangements to see the 60 Minutes episode. ------------------------------ Date: 11 Dec 2007 18:42:42 -0600 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: OT: One Laptop per Child Message-ID: In article <475de9e9$0$90267$14726298@news.sunsite.dk>, =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= writes: > > We are over 50000 for Windows I believe. > Over 150,000. Of which the typical anti-virus tool protects you against 50,000 to 75,000. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 19:49:38 GMT From: VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: Re: Picking nits Message-ID: In article <3f119ada0712120924v74540227sf9c9763af8c6923b@mail.gmail.com>, DeanW writes: > > >On Dec 12, 2007 8:44 AM, Mark Daniel wrote: >> A hobbyist (note the spelling Steven) with an RX2600? ;-) > >Intel Developer Forum, where I was lucky enough to meet VAXman, Bob >Gezelter, and a couple other notables. Hi Dean! I remember that IDF... at some hotel in northern proNJ. Is your rx2600 still running? -- VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" http://tmesis.com/drat.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2007 06:40:00 GMT From: Malcolm Dunnett Subject: Re: Picking nits Message-ID: <4t48j.2799$UZ4.592@edtnps89> DeanW wrote: > On Dec 12, 2007 8:44 AM, Mark Daniel wrote: >> A hobbyist (note the spelling Steven) with an RX2600? ;-) > > Intel Developer Forum, where I was lucky enough to meet VAXman, Bob > Gezelter, and a couple other notables. There's some nice ZX6000s (2 CPUs, 8GB) on eBay with a Buy-it-now price of $750. Not unreasonable for a semi-serious hobbyist. There was a lot of five of them went for $1600 a few days ago. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 10:07:57 -0500 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: Removing blank lines in a file... Message-ID: <7a4ea$475ff94d$cef8887a$5392@TEKSAVVY.COM> Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > And what did you get for writing that? A feeling that I may have helped someone and given him an image that people on C.O.V. are happy to welcome newbies and help them despite VMS' days being numbered. I am in the process of learning Unix, and I can tell you that I wish there the mac newsgroups had people of C.O.V.'s calibre to help guide me. The little DCL I gave the chap wasn't fancy, but it at least shows him it is possible to write a DCL script that can open a file and process records. He can then use help for each command to learn more. It can be daunting when you get to an OS and you know what you want to do, but have no clue on what commands can be used to do it. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 14:44:23 -0500 From: "Carl Friedberg" Subject: Re: Removing blank lines in a file... Message-ID: <890539d90712121144j39992e4jc107bd20d5f5046e@mail.gmail.com> Hi, gawk 3.1.6 was released this summer. $ ftp://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/gawk binary get gawk-3.1.6.tar.gz $ rename/log gawk-3^.1^.6^.tar.gz gawk-3_1_6_tar.gz $ gzip -dv gawk-3_1_6_tar.gz $ tar -xvf gawk-3_1_6_tar. $ set def [.gawk-3_1_6] $ type readme. $ type [.readme_d]readme.vms Follow those instructions; I used [.vms]vmsbuild.com. Run the tests as explained in [.vms]vmstest.com. Install if you wish. Many, many, many thanks to Pat Rankin and Arnold Robbins Carl Friedberg On Dec 11, 2007 9:37 PM, Hein RMS van den Heuvel wrote: > Yeah.. really can't figure that out? > Anyway, just to be cute... > > How about a truly minimalistic awk program: > > $ gawk "length" file.dat > > This executes the length function on the default input line $0 and > take the default action to print $0 if true ( != 0) > If you also want to get rid of lines with just spaces or tabs, change > to the even shorter: > > $ gawk "NF" file.dat > > That NF is a symbol representing the number of 'fields' on the default > input line, if true, take default action: print! > A more explicit way to write that: > > $ gawk "/[^ \t]/" file.dat /out=stripped.dat > > This uses a regular expresion to look for a string which contains > characters NOT (^) in the character set space and tab ([ \t]) > > In Perl that could be > > $ perl -ne "print if /\S/" file.dat > > in perl regexpr's the \s means 'whitespace', and \S means NOT > whitespace > > The test for an empty line in perl seems to be handicapped with the > new-line or not. > This works for me: > > $ perl -lne "print if length" file.dat > stripped.dat > > grins, > Hein. > ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2007 15:38:10 -0600 From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) Subject: Re: Removing blank lines in a file... Message-ID: In article , Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes: > In article <4b1a79c5-c94a-4927-a8c4-f1eedf447ca7@w40g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>, apogeusistemas@gmail.com writes: > >> Can You show me a simple procedure to remove all blank lines in a >> file ? > > $ EDIT/TECO file.ext > > $ > $;2r>ex$$ > > where all but the first "$" are the Escape character. In article <4760192f$0$25477$ba620dc5@text.nova.planet.nl>, Wilm Boerhout writes: > on 11-12-2007 21:48 apogeusistemas@gmail.com wrote... >> Hi: >> Can You show me a simple procedure to remove all blank lines in a >> file ? >> Thank You in advance... > > Yeah, don't follow the TECO examples given. They just work on the first > TECO "page" of a file (everything up to the first FF or until TECO's > memory is full, whichever comes first). There should be a Yank loop > around the commands given IMO. Your opinion is not correct. The difference between FN and FS is that FN provides an automatic Yank whenever required. A difference between various TECO posts in this topic is whether one is to count line containing space characters as "blank". A person writing TECO can decide for themselves (unlike languages that consider a null character to implicitly terminate a string). ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 00:15:31 -0000 From: "John Wallace" Subject: Re: Removing blank lines in a file... Message-ID: <13lua2anumufe5a@corp.supernews.com> "Larry Kilgallen" wrote in message news:WZKRSFU7PPMq@eisner.encompasserve.org... > In article <4b1a79c5-c94a-4927-a8c4-f1eedf447ca7@w40g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>, apogeusistemas@gmail.com writes: > > > Can You show me a simple procedure to remove all blank lines in a > > file ? > > $ EDIT/TECO file.ext > > $ > $;2r>ex$$ > > where all but the first "$" are the Escape character. How about $ EDIT /TECO file.ext <@:fn/S //;> where is control-E, and is Escape. control-E followed by S followed by return matches whitespace followed by "new line", and replaces text matching that pattern with (nothing). This may need minor adjustment depending on exactly what was meant by "blank lines". It's been a while so this may not be quite right (it's not been tested by me just now), but anyone who wants to see whether it is right or not can Read The Fine Manual, the Standard TECO User's Guide, vintage 1985, at http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/academic/computer-science/history/pdp-11/teco/doc/teco.doc and elsewhere. Also available in trendy new PDF format, with updates for native TECO32 on VMS V5, vintage 1990, at http://h71000.www7.hp.com/doc/73final/documentation/pdf/teco.pdf Regards John ------------------------------ Date: 11 Dec 2007 18:45:03 -0600 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Removing blank lines in a file... Message-ID: In article <4b1a79c5-c94a-4927-a8c4-f1eedf447ca7@w40g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>, apogeusistemas@gmail.com writes: > Hi: > Can You show me a simple procedure to remove all blank lines in a > file ? > Thank You in advance... Yes. Is there some reason why should help you with such a trivial task? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 19:44:38 -0600 From: "Craig A. Berry" Subject: Re: Removing blank lines in a file... Message-ID: In article <4b1a79c5-c94a-4927-a8c4-f1eedf447ca7@w40g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>, apogeusistemas@gmail.com wrote: > Hi: > Can You show me a simple procedure to remove all blank lines in a > file ? > Thank You in advance... There are probably a dozen different ways to do this in Perl. Here's one of the more verbose ones: $ perl -i -ne "chomp; print qq/$_\n/ if length $_;" foo.txt -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 21:31:36 -0500 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: Removing blank lines in a file... Message-ID: <475f47fd$0$90269$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> JF Mezei wrote: > Richard B. Gilbert wrote: >> I'll write one if you pay me! It's cheaper to do your own homework and >> you'll learn more!!!!! > > Watch out for that newfangled thing called open source, it can ruin your > revenu source ! > > $OPEN/read input myfile.txt > $OPEN/write output yourfile.txt > $! > $LOOP: > $ READ/END=ENDLOOP input buffer > $ test = F$EDIT(buffer,"COLLAPSE") ! removes all spaces/tabs > $ IF test .eqs. "" then goto LOOP > $ write output buffer > $ goto loop: > $! > $endloop: > $close input > $close output > $write sys$output "Done" > $exit Is the code GPL or LGPL or Apache licensed ? :-) Arne ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 19:51:45 -0500 From: "William Webb" Subject: Re: Self-extracting archives for I64? (Who's got the stub?) Message-ID: <8660a3a10712121651i5130959euc251a3a407987b3@mail.gmail.com> On Dec 10, 2007 5:42 PM, Steven M. Schweda wrote: > From: WWWebb > > > I have the executable stub that is needed for creating self-extracting > > archive files for VMS Alpha. > > > > Does anybody have one or know of one for VMS I64? 8.3, if it matters. > > In "ftp://ftp.process.com/vms-freeware/fileserv/unzip.zip", among other > things, I see: > > [.vms-binaries]unzipsfx.axp_exe > [.vms-binaries]unzipsfx.ia64_exe > [.vms-binaries]unzipsfx.vax_decc_exe > [.vms-binaries]unzipsfx.vax_vaxc_exe > [.vms-binaries]unzipsfx_cli.axp_exe > [.vms-binaries]unzipsfx_cli.ia64_exe > [.vms-binaries]unzipsfx_cli.vax_decc_exe > [.vms-binaries]unzipsfx_cli.vax_vaxc_exe > > Blame Mr. Goatley. > > SMS. > Thank y'all, got it, thanks, linked successfully, and tested it. WWWebb ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 19:46:47 -0500 From: bradhamilton Subject: SSRVEXCEPT, Unexpected system service exception Message-ID: <476080F7.6090301@comcast.net> Hi Folks, I'm a Hobbyist; is there someplace I can "report" a system crash? V8.3 Alpha V5.7-2 TCPware latest patches: DEC AXPVMS VMS83A_SHADOWING V1.0 Patch Install Val 25-NOV-2007 DEC AXPVMS VMS83A_FIBRE_SCSI V3.0 Patch Install Val 25-NOV-2007 DEC AXPVMS VMS83A_SYS V5.0 Patch Install Val 14-NOV-2007 DEC AXPVMS VMS83A_LAN V2.0 Patch Install Val 11-NOV-2007 DEC AXPVMS VMS83A_UPDATE V4.0 Patch Install Val 11-NOV-2007 WASD Web server System crashed this morning - The Clue listing file says: OpenVMS Operating System, Version V8.3 -- System Dump Analysis 12-DEC-2007 10:33:04.96 Page 1 Crashdump Summary Information: Crash Time: 12-DEC-2007 10:33:04.96 Bugcheck Type: SSRVEXCEPT, Unexpected system service exception Node: RABBIT (Standalone) CPU Type: Digital Personal WorkStation VMS Version: V8.3 Current Process: HyperSPI$agent Current Image: DSA1:[HT_ROOT.][AXP]HYPERSPI$AGENT.EXE;4 Failing PC: 00000000.00000000 Failing PS: 00000000.00000003 Module: Offset: 00000000 The "current process" is a component of the WASD Web server. The total listing is 12 pages, and I think I have a full memory dump. Should I/can I "report" this in ITRC? TIA ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 22:36:11 -0800 (PST) From: Volker Halle Subject: Re: SSRVEXCEPT, Unexpected system service exception Message-ID: Brad, could you mail me the full CLUE file (CLUE$COLLECT:CLUE $RABBIT_121207_1033.LIS) ? Then I'll have a look and tell you more about the crash. As the failing PC is zero, this is most likely stack corruption, but we'll see. --- Volker Halle, Invenate GmbH, OpenVMS Support An OpenVMS crashdump analysis a day makes the Windows headaches go away. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2007 17:55:43 -0800 (PST) From: ultradwc@gmail.com Subject: Re: TCPware and MIME (again) Message-ID: On Dec 10, 8:44 pm, Neil Rieck wrote: > I was recently poking around the web trying to solve another "MIME > send" problem in TCPware when I stumbled upon the following paragraph > in the Multinet release notes: > > ### > > MultiNet V5.2 Release Notes - April 2007 > > 2.10.16 SMTP > > Two new SMTP logicals were added to allow sending the output of the > OpenVMS MIME utility with MultiNet mail: MULTINET_SMTP_ALLOW_MIME_SEND > (value is Y/T/1 to enable the new behavior, anything else to disable > it) MULTINET_SMTP_MIME_TAG (value is what to look for at the start of > the first line of the message. Optional. Defaults to "Mime-version:" > > Without the SMTP_ALLOW_MIME_SEND defined, the behavior will be as > before. WIth it, if the first line of the message file being sent is > the mime tag, the blank line at the end of the header output will be > suppressed so that the header lines in the message will be seen as > header lines rather than message body. [9147] > > ### > > So does anyone know if these changes will make it into TCPware anytime > soon? > > Neil Rieck > Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge, > Ontario, Canada.http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/ sometimes TCPware recognizes multinet logicals, esp. with mail ... did you read the FREE manuals on Process site to find out what logical if any exists? do you have support so you can call Process and get an answer within minutes instead of poking around for days not finding an answer? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2007 21:18:19 -0500 From: "Neil Rieck" Subject: Re: TCPware and MIME (again) Message-ID: <475de78d$0$26100$88260bb3@free.teranews.com> > > sometimes TCPware recognizes multinet logicals, esp. > with mail ... > > did you read the FREE manuals on Process site to find > out what logical if any exists? > > do you have support so you can call Process and get an > answer within minutes instead of poking around for days > not finding an answer? I do have a support contract and will call them tomorrow. However, I just noticed the Multinet release notes thing about an hour ago from home. Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge Canada. -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com ------------------------------ Date: 11 Dec 2007 08:26:47 +0100 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOeGER) Subject: Re: TCPware and MIME (again) Message-ID: <475e49c7@news.langstoeger.at> In article , Neil Rieck writes: >I was recently poking around the web trying to solve another "MIME >send" problem in TCPware when I stumbled upon the following paragraph >in the Multinet release notes: > >So does anyone know if these changes will make it into TCPware anytime >soon? 1) IIRC, SMTP is common for TCPware and Multinet for quite some versions now 2) TCPware V5.8 is currently in beta (released maybe in 2008H1) 3) I use MX, so I have no TCPware (or Multinet or UCX/TCPIP) SMTP experience HIH -- Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER Network and OpenVMS system specialist E-mail peter@langstoeger.at A-1030 VIENNA AUSTRIA I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 21:39:41 -0000 From: "John Wallace" Subject: Re: TECOing blank lines out of a file Message-ID: <13m0l90jpmnal6b@corp.supernews.com> "Wilm Boerhout" wrote in message news:4760192f$0$25477$ba620dc5@text.nova.planet.nl... > on 11-12-2007 21:48 apogeusistemas@gmail.com wrote... > > Hi: > > Can You show me a simple procedure to remove all blank lines in a > > file ? > > Thank You in advance... > > Yeah, don't follow the TECO examples given. They just work on the first > TECO "page" of a file (everything up to the first FF or until TECO's > memory is full, whichever comes first). There should be a Yank loop > around the commands given IMO. > > -- > Wilm Boerhout Zwolle, NL > remove OLD PAINT from return address to reply I realise it's a long time since most people used TECO in anger, and that these days most people probably view TECO as a historical curiousity rather than a useful text-processing tool, but you appear to be thinking of FS, rather than FN. If you follow the link I provided previously (and which is repeated below) and RTFM, you will find in table 5-13 of the FM that an "N" search "performs the same function as the S command except that the search is continued across page boundaries, if necessary, until the character string is found or the end of the input file is reached." So, IMHO, and in Larry's opinion, and in the opinion of the people who wrote the book, no need for Yanks. hth John FM: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/doc/73final/documentation/pdf/teco.pdf ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Dec 2007 19:28:40 -0500 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" Subject: Re: TECOing blank lines out of a file Message-ID: <47607CB8.7090705@comcast.net> John Wallace wrote: > "Wilm Boerhout" wrote in message > news:4760192f$0$25477$ba620dc5@text.nova.planet.nl... > >>on 11-12-2007 21:48 apogeusistemas@gmail.com wrote... >> >>>Hi: >>>Can You show me a simple procedure to remove all blank lines in a >>>file ? >>>Thank You in advance... >> >>Yeah, don't follow the TECO examples given. They just work on the first >>TECO "page" of a file (everything up to the first FF or until TECO's >>memory is full, whichever comes first). There should be a Yank loop >>around the commands given IMO. >> >>-- >>Wilm Boerhout Zwolle, NL >>remove OLD PAINT from return address to reply > > > I realise it's a long time since most people used TECO in anger, and that > these days most people probably view TECO as a historical curiousity rather > than a useful text-processing tool, but you appear to be thinking of FS, > rather than FN. > > If you follow the link I provided previously (and which is repeated below) > and RTFM, you will find in table 5-13 of the FM that an "N" search "performs > the same function as the S command except that the search is continued > across page boundaries, if necessary, > until the character string is found or the end of the input file is > reached." So, IMHO, and in Larry's opinion, and in the opinion of the people > who wrote the book, no need for Yanks. > > hth > John > > FM: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/doc/73final/documentation/pdf/teco.pdf > > I've only used TECO two or three times in my life but there are a few things that TECO can do quickly and easily; things that others cannot do or do only with great effort on your part. It is not an editor for the faint hearted and you're out of your mind if you don't backup your file before you start! An ill chosen keystroke can turn your file into garbage! ------------------------------ Date: 12 Dec 2007 21:42:40 -0600 From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) Subject: Re: TECOing blank lines out of a file Message-ID: In article <47607CB8.7090705@comcast.net>, "Richard B. Gilbert" writes: > I've only used TECO two or three times in my life but there are a few > things that TECO can do quickly and easily; things that others cannot do > or do only with great effort on your part. It is not an editor for the > faint hearted and you're out of your mind if you don't backup your file > before you start! An ill chosen keystroke can turn your file into garbage! But on VMS file system versioning takes care of backup automatically unless you go out of your way to defeat it. ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2007.681 ************************