INFO-VAX Mon, 07 Jan 2008 Volume 2008 : Issue 13 Contents: Re: Anyone interested in building a vms-like OS? Re: Anyone interested in building a vms-like OS? Re: dial up modem gnutar was (Re: Porting Subversion to VMS) Re: gnutar was (Re: Porting Subversion to VMS) Re: How to set "From:" address in VMS MAIL Re: How to set "From:" address in VMS MAIL Re: How to set "From:" address in VMS MAIL Re: Island Computers is moving Re: Island Computers is moving Re: Island Computers is moving Re: Island Computers is moving Re: Island Computers is moving Re: Island Computers is moving Re: OpenVMS Alpha CDs Re: OpenVMS Alpha CDs Re: OT: The penultimate legal schmuckery of 2007. Re: Porting Subversion to VMS Re: Porting Subversion to VMS Re: Setting Reflection 2 window titles from VMS SOT: (somewhat off topic) driver for LK250 keyboard Re: SOT: (somewhat off topic) driver for LK250 keyboard Re: SOT: (somewhat off topic) driver for LK250 keyboard Re: SOT: (somewhat off topic) driver for LK250 keyboard Re: SOT: (somewhat off topic) driver for LK250 keyboard Re: SOT: (somewhat off topic) driver for LK250 keyboard Re: SOT: (somewhat off topic) driver for LK250 keyboard Support for ODS-2 disks on OS-X ? Re: Support for ODS-2 disks on OS-X ? Re: Support for ODS-2 disks on OS-X ? Re: Support for ODS-2 disks on OS-X ? Re: this declaration may not have extern "C" linkage while porting C++ C++C++ Re: VMS job going in Perth ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2008 22:47:31 +0100 From: "Dr. Dweeb" Subject: Re: Anyone interested in building a vms-like OS? Message-ID: <47814c73$0$7607$157c6196@dreader2.cybercity.dk> gaoshan.wang@gmail.com wrote: > I have been working on openvms for about 20 years, and know this is a > rock solid os, unfortunately HP doesn't care too much and unlikely to > invest. It's sad that vms market is shrinking for different reasons. > I know there are lots openvms talents here and are afraid too loose > their jobs for forseeable future. But I have a idea, can we form a > company that focus on a clustering operating system which provide > basic os functionaility , memory management, scheduing, process > management, clustering etc and a optimized java compiler, anyway a > robut os. > > I am in china right now, and have been talking with venture capitals > recently, probably can get 100m us$ to start up provided we have the > ability. There is a big OS market developing in china right now, > people hate crappy micro$oft products, often refering to toxic waste > with tainted blue screen:) The middle class population is estimated > about 10B in next 5-10years, this is true from my observation. If > everyone spend 100 bucks on a robust OS, the total market is 300B us$ > if os refreshes every 3 years. There are huge demand for high-avalible > OS in every segmant, manufactuing, hospital, telecommunications, high- > speed railway, investment institutions, banks, government, military > you name it. Shanghai stock exchange (probably will be biggest trading > house in next 10 years ) now is builing one of the biggest trading > engine from transaction perspective in human history base on openvms > to replace carppy hp-ux and wintels, but they are not happy with HP > now. > > If you are interested, please send me your resumes etc, we can talk > from there, don't worry about compensation stuff ( we can pay you as > much as you could imagine as long as you can delivery ) telecommunting > should be fine as well. my email address > gaoshan.wang_no_spam_please@gmail.com I thought GNU/Limux was the answer to world hunger? I must be mistaken. Dweeb ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 19:55:39 -0600 From: David J Dachtera Subject: Re: Anyone interested in building a vms-like OS? Message-ID: <4781869B.FA5DD8F1@spam.comcast.net> gaoshan.wang@gmail.com wrote: > > I have been working on openvms for about 20 years, and know this is a > rock solid os, unfortunately HP doesn't care too much and unlikely to > invest. It's sad that vms market is shrinking for different reasons. > I know there are lots openvms talents here and are afraid too loose > their jobs for forseeable future. But I have a idea, can we form a > company that focus on a clustering operating system which provide > basic os functionaility , memory management, scheduing, process > management, clustering etc and a optimized java compiler, anyway a > robut os. > > I am in china right now, and have been talking with venture capitals > recently, probably can get 100m us$ to start up provided we have the > ability. There is a big OS market developing in china right now [snip] There is a Free VMS project around. Haven't heard much about it lately, though. Google this group for the Free VMS project. For $100 million, I think even HP would be willing to talk to you about some kind of arrangement. They're not REAL big on new VMS customers, but they don't seem to mind taking money from paying customers. If you do try to partner with HP, be *VERY* sure to keep them on a *VERY* short leash! ...and be sure to maintain 100% control of the relationship at all times. Make sure your legal agreements with them have enough serious teeth that even The Hydra would be envious/intimidated! David J Dachtera DJE Systems ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2008 00:48:19 GMT From: Tad Winters Subject: Re: dial up modem Message-ID: "Richard B. Gilbert" wrote in news:4780FF89.6050004@comcast.net: > rexdale1050@yahoo.ca wrote: >> I need help ! >> I would like like to use command prompt on windows xp software >> to dial up using atdt modem commands to connect with my modem on my >> alpha server ds - 10 running vms 7 . 3 >> and use as a vt teminal >> >> Thank you for any help >> Neil > > You need some sort of software on your PC to do that. I think Windows > has some sort of a dumb terminal built in but I can't recall what it's > called. > > For a VT100, or better, terminal emulation, you'll need something like > Reflection 2 or Reflection 4 (graphics terminal). Even terminal > emulation software is not totally satisfactory since the standard PC > KeyPad is one key short of a VT100 keypad. Once upon a time you could > get the LK250 or LK450 keyboard but those were never plentiful and are > now quire rare! You could try e-Bay but don't get your hopes up. . . . > > I use an LK46W-A2 for my keyboard. It works well. I think it's Hoff who mentions Multia VT320e as being on one of the freeware distributions, right? I don't know how it does on the torture test, but it does have features that I'm conditioned to having, which are lacking in the VT100. I do miss some minor things, like having the cursor be an underscore, rather than a block. Tad ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 23:09:45 GMT From: "John E. Malmberg" Subject: gnutar was (Re: Porting Subversion to VMS) Message-ID: Steven M. Schweda wrote: > From: "John E. Malmberg" > >> I am currently working on getting GNU TAR 1.19 to run on VMS as I am >> starting to find tarballs that the existing VMSTAR and GNUTAR can not >> handle. > > Unofficial, and not seriously tested, but potentially useful: > > http://antinode.org/ftp/vmstar/v3r5_pre2_src.zip > > I'd build it using something like "MMS LARGE=1". It's intended to deal > with GNU-style long names, symlinks, and large files. No bets, but feel > free to wake me when it breaks down. (There's also a "pre1" edition in > the same place which uses older builders. Not much difference in the > actual code, though.) > > GNU "tar" 1.19 seems to have build problems on some UNIX systems. > I'd stick with 1.18 (or wait for 1.20), unless I had a good reason to > use 1.19. Since I do not have a working gnu tar at the moment, I have nothing to fall back to. And 1.19 is building for me now on VMS without the VMS specific stuff for fork(), pipe(), and lib$initialize special sauce, I have no reason to fall back to 1.19. I plan to add the same code that I used in bash. Once a current gnutar is fully functional on VMS, I would like to see what could be done to put a wrapper around it to produce VMSTAR functionality. -John wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Only ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2008 07:44:09 +0100 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jean-Fran=E7ois_Pi=E9ronne?= Subject: Re: gnutar was (Re: Porting Subversion to VMS) Message-ID: <4781ca38$0$22665$426a74cc@news.free.fr> John E. Malmberg wrote: > Steven M. Schweda wrote: >> From: "John E. Malmberg" >> >>> I am currently working on getting GNU TAR 1.19 to run on VMS as I am >>> starting to find tarballs that the existing VMSTAR and GNUTAR can not >>> handle. >> >> Unofficial, and not seriously tested, but potentially useful: >> >> http://antinode.org/ftp/vmstar/v3r5_pre2_src.zip >> >> I'd build it using something like "MMS LARGE=1". It's intended to deal >> with GNU-style long names, symlinks, and large files. No bets, but feel >> free to wake me when it breaks down. (There's also a "pre1" edition in >> the same place which uses older builders. Not much difference in the >> actual code, though.) >> >> GNU "tar" 1.19 seems to have build problems on some UNIX systems. >> I'd stick with 1.18 (or wait for 1.20), unless I had a good reason to >> use 1.19. > > Since I do not have a working gnu tar at the moment, I have nothing to > fall back to. > To extract tar file (or compressed tar file) I use without any problem Python which include a tarfile module (http://docs.python.org/lib/module-tarfile.html) something like import tarfile f=tarfile.open('foo.tgz,'r') f.extractall() I succesfully extract Python, MySQL (which is fairly large) and many others tools. > And 1.19 is building for me now on VMS without the VMS specific stuff > for fork(), pipe(), and lib$initialize special sauce, I have no reason > to fall back to 1.19. I plan to add the same code that I used in bash. > > Once a current gnutar is fully functional on VMS, I would like to see > what could be done to put a wrapper around it to produce VMSTAR > functionality. > > -John > wb8tyw@qsl.network > Personal Opinion Only ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 18:31:39 -0500 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: How to set "From:" address in VMS MAIL Message-ID: <478164d5$0$90276$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> Jean-François Piéronne wrote: > Craig A. Berry wrote: >> I use Perl with the MIME::Lite module: >> >> http://search.cpan.org/~rjbs/MIME-Lite-3.021/lib/MIME/Lite.pm >> >> You can create a complicated multi-part message with the parts in >> various and sundry encodings in about a dozen lines of code. And yes, >> you can say it's from whoever you want it to be from. > > Python also include an email module to do this sort of things, I use it > extensively in some of my tools. > http://docs.python.org/lib/module-email.html > http://docs.python.org/lib/netdata.html Java too. It is more or less a "must have" today. Arne ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 23:45:55 GMT From: Tad Winters Subject: Re: How to set "From:" address in VMS MAIL Message-ID: Ken.Fairfield@gmail.com wrote in news:5138d915-cc4b-4f19-b10d- d016355c0eeb@e6g2000prf.googlegroups.com: > This built-in clearly (at least to me) is an interface to > Callable_Mail and allows the caller to specify the sender, > or "From:" address. > > Due to a variety of issues that were exposed by a recent > upgrade of our Exchange Server (yes, this is the real world > and MS dominates), I found I could avoid the call to the > built-in and use VMS Mail to send the reports in a way that > didn't corrupt them. However, I have not found a way to > override/set the From header. > > Off-list, David Dachtera pointed me to the Multinet logical > names, and I've tried with MULTINET_SMTP_ENVELOPE_FROM_HOST. > This doesn't quite do the job because (a) it only sets the > host, not user & host, and (b) it seems to set the Return-Path > header which doesn't show up in the reader's OutHouse view of > the message, nor is it used when replying to the message. There is a logical called MULTINET_SMTP_REPLY_TO which might give you what you need. I've used it many times to keep people from sending replies to VMS systems which don't have MX records in DNS and aren't referenced by the common mail servers. > Are there any other suggestions? "Hidden" Multinet logical > names. Some other freely available interface to Callable_Mail? > > Thanks, Ken > -- > Ken & Ann Fairfield > What: Ken dot And dot Ann > Where: Gmail dot Com Tad ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 22:08:19 -0500 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: How to set "From:" address in VMS MAIL Message-ID: <4781979d$0$90262$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> jo jimbo wrote: >> Are there any other suggestions? "Hidden" Multinet logical >> names. Some other freely available interface to Callable_Mail? >> > You can write your own interface to callable mail. The routines are > still in VMS and documented.. I haven't personally done this for > at least 20 years, DEC internally ? (I belive it was introduced with VMS 5.0 which was released to the public in April 1988) Arne ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2008 12:57:33 -0600 (CST) From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) Subject: Re: Island Computers is moving Message-ID: <08010612573318_206002CA@antinode.org> From: JF Mezei > Main, Kerry wrote: > > > What was the report or log number of the issue(s) when you reported each of > > these to HP? > > Give me an email address where a non customer can report problems and I > will gladly do it. It's a Web form, not actual e-mail, but you may get an e-mail response: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/fb_business.html Sometimes it's worth the effort. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Steven M. Schweda sms@antinode-org 382 South Warwick Street (+1) 651-699-9818 Saint Paul MN 55105-2547 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 14:24:38 -0500 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: Island Computers is moving Message-ID: <47812b7f$0$16174$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com> Steven M. Schweda wrote: > http://h71000.www7.hp.com/fb_business.html > > Sometimes it's worth the effort. I just posted it. I would have NEVER guessed that this generic web-form was the correct way to submit bug reports. I didn't know what to put into the required "URL" field, so I put www.disney.com I'll report if I get anything back from a human. (Got an automated response already). ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2008 13:39:26 -0600 (CST) From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) Subject: Re: Island Computers is moving Message-ID: <08010613392643_206002CA@antinode.org> From: JF Mezei > > http://h71000.www7.hp.com/fb_business.html > [...] I would have NEVER guessed that this generic web-form > was the correct way to submit bug reports. On the main VMS Web page (http://h71000.www7.hp.com/), there's a link for "Feedback to webmaster" (http://h71000.www7.hp.com/fb_web.html). On that page, there's a link for "product business comments" (http://h71000.www7.hp.com/fb_business.html). It's not _that_ well hidden, and it does say, "Please use the following form to submit product or business questions or comments about HP OpenVMS." I'd say that "product questions" covers bug reports and similar complaints. (I assume that paying victims have a better path, but some old saying about beggars and choosers does come to mind in a situation like this.) > I didn't know what to put > into the required "URL" field, so I put www.disney.com That's one way to try to convey the seriousness of your report to the recipients. SMS. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 15:15:54 -0500 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" Subject: Re: Island Computers is moving Message-ID: <478136FA.5080608@comcast.net> Steven M. Schweda wrote: > From: JF Mezei > >>> http://h71000.www7.hp.com/fb_business.html >> > >>[...] I would have NEVER guessed that this generic web-form >>was the correct way to submit bug reports. > > > On the main VMS Web page (http://h71000.www7.hp.com/), there's a link > for "Feedback to webmaster" (http://h71000.www7.hp.com/fb_web.html). On > that page, there's a link for "product business comments" > (http://h71000.www7.hp.com/fb_business.html). It's not _that_ well > hidden, and it does say, "Please use the following form to submit > product or business questions or comments about HP OpenVMS." I'd say > that "product questions" covers bug reports and similar complaints. (I > assume that paying victims have a better path, but some old saying about > beggars and choosers does come to mind in a situation like this.) > > >> I didn't know what to put >>into the required "URL" field, so I put www.disney.com > > > That's one way to try to convey the seriousness of your report to the > recipients. > > SMS. If the people who designed the form were serious, they might have provided a clue as to what the "URL" field was intended for. Based on what I've seen in this thread I can't think of anything more reasonable than "www.disney.com" to put there! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2008 21:42:12 -0600 (CST) From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) Subject: Re: Island Computers is moving Message-ID: <08010621421266_206002CA@antinode.org> From: "Richard B. Gilbert" > > From: JF Mezei > > > >>> http://h71000.www7.hp.com/fb_business.html > > > >>[...] I would have NEVER guessed that this generic web-form > >>was the correct way to submit bug reports. > [...] > >> I didn't know what to put > >>into the required "URL" field, so I put www.disney.com > > > > That's one way to try to convey the seriousness of your report to the > > recipients. > > If the people who designed the form were serious, they might have > provided a clue as to what the "URL" field was intended for. Based on > what I've seen in this thread I can't think of anything more reasonable > than "www.disney.com" to put there! Does this thread does encompass all possible uses of the form in question? I doubt it. I assumed that the product feedback form was simply (perhaps too simply) adapted from the Web site feedback form, and didn't get too excited about a potentially useless required field. On the other hand, when I submitted a complaint about some lameness in HP's GnuPG builder, it was a convenient place to reference HP's "GnuPG for OpenVMS" Web page, and my "GnuPG for VMS" Web page. Perhaps I'm just too easy-going, but I'd worry less about the form itself, and more about what happens after a complaint is submitted there. But if it bothers you so much, there is that "OpenVMS Systems web site feedback" form at "http://h71000.www7.hp.com/fb_web.html", where, I'm sure, you could submit a complaint about it to someone who might care more about it than I. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Steven M. Schweda sms@antinode-org 382 South Warwick Street (+1) 651-699-9818 Saint Paul MN 55105-2547 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2008 21:19:18 -0800 (PST) From: Doug Phillips Subject: Re: Island Computers is moving Message-ID: <0060b969-cccd-4426-beca-1b6ec86db58a@1g2000hsl.googlegroups.com> On Jan 6, 12:24 pm, JF Mezei wrote: > Main, Kerry wrote: > > What was the report or log number of the issue(s) when you reported each of > > these to HP? > > Give me an email address where a non customer can report problems and I > will gladly do it. > > However, in other environments, someone publically reporting a problem > would have been picked up by employees and reported internally and fix > provided fairly quickly. > > Instead, we are now debating on excuses for HP not taking proactive > action to plug holes in its software. There is a Security Issues submission form here: http://welcome.hp.com/country/us/en/sftware_security Following links from the ITRC home page "Maintenance and Support for Compaq Products -> Collaborate->email support" gets you a tiny window that lets you select "Country." Selecting United States steps through other tiny windows where "Other questions/feedback" offers a "Report a software security issue" link to the above page. Choosing Canada or UK didn't show the security issue link. Choosing "Philippines" gets a "Register a complaint" option that just hangs (that would seem like a "Feedback to Webmaster" issue, or maybe that page is very busy?) I didn't check any other countries. I guess you're not supposed to have security issues;-) note: You might have to log into your ITRC account (or set one up) to access it (the same free account you use to post to the ITRC forum) but that need doesn't seem to be consistent. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2008 15:33:50 -0800 (PST) From: John Subject: Re: OpenVMS Alpha CDs Message-ID: On Jan 6, 1:41=A0am, John wrote: > I just picked up an AlphaStation 250 and would now like to install > VMS, but unfortunately I don't have the Alpha install CDs. The > hobbyist web site makes it sound like they won't have Alpha kits until > May, so even if I was to order one of those I'd be stuck sitting on > this box for months. > Does someone mind letting me download an install image for OpenVMS > Alpha? I guess any version would be fine, but the more recent the > better. > > John Well, I found VMS 8.3 for Alpha, but now it seems I must update my firmware, but I don't have any floppies and the machine is not yet on the network (I lack the cables). Can someone point me to the Firmware CD version 6.8? I can't seem to find it on the HP sites. Thanks John ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 17:59:02 -0700 From: Jeff Campbell Subject: Re: OpenVMS Alpha CDs Message-ID: <1199666912_22799@sp12lax.superfeed.net> John wrote: > On Jan 6, 1:41 am, John wrote: >> I just picked up an AlphaStation 250 and would now like to install >> VMS, but unfortunately I don't have the Alpha install CDs. The >> hobbyist web site makes it sound like they won't have Alpha kits until >> May, so even if I was to order one of those I'd be stuck sitting on >> this box for months. >> Does someone mind letting me download an install image for OpenVMS >> Alpha? I guess any version would be fine, but the more recent the >> better. >> >> John > > Well, I found VMS 8.3 for Alpha, but now it seems I must update my > firmware, but I don't have any floppies and the machine is not yet on > the network (I lack the cables). Can someone point me to the Firmware > CD version 6.8? I can't seem to find it on the HP sites. > Thanks > > John Have a look at: HTH, Jeff ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2008 22:43:33 +0100 From: "Dr. Dweeb" Subject: Re: OT: The penultimate legal schmuckery of 2007. Message-ID: <47814b85$0$7603$157c6196@dreader2.cybercity.dk> JF Mezei wrote: > Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply wrote: > >> contract. My point was that, in contrast to even 10 years ago, >> anyone who wants to distribute his recordings via the internet can >> do so, without a record company. > > Not quite. Most well known artists are locked into contracts with the > major record companies which prevent them from releasing material on > their own. > > And when you leave a record company, you might be able to distribute > low quality MP3s on the net, but you'll have a hard time getting your > high quality CDs into stores and into every radio station in the > world. > > > What would be needed is some "youtube" style of web site where > independant artists could publish low quality songs and a pointer to > their own web site where you can get the high quality version. Plenty of attempts - here is one http://mindawn.com the artists page here http://mindawn.com/artists.php Dweeb ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 21:00:47 -0500 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: Porting Subversion to VMS Message-ID: <478187c9$0$90266$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> Jeffrey H. Coffield wrote: > I know there is a port of the CVS client to OpenVMS, but CVS appears to > be replaced by Subversion SVN has realy taken off well. But there are still a lot of CVS users out there. I would even estimate that there are more CVS users than SVN users, but that will likely change within the next few years. But anyway - CVS is still a usable alternative. Arne ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 21:05:36 -0500 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: Porting Subversion to VMS Message-ID: <478188ea$0$90266$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> palmipede wrote: > Jeffrey H. Coffield a écrit : >> I am attempting (with what little knowledge of c that I have) to port >> Subversion to OpenVMS. > > Have you noticed that Mercurial is available for Vms ? > http://vmspython.dyndns.org/DownloadAndInstallationMercurial > > Do you absolutely need Subversion or a control version tool available on > Vms ? > If you go to > http://hg.vmspython.dyndns.org/vmspython/ > you can see the recent activity And related to the original poster - there are a NetBeans plugin. And since the NetBeans team is switching to Mercurial themselves, then it is a good assumption that it will work ! Arne ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 23:22:34 GMT From: "John E. Malmberg" Subject: Re: Setting Reflection 2 window titles from VMS Message-ID: <_odgj.288527$Fc.132368@attbi_s21> Bob Koehler wrote: > In article , "John E. Malmberg" writes: >> I am trying to find a way that I can set the titles of my R2 terminal >> emulation session from VMS. >> >> I am running Reflection R2 version 5.20 >> >> This is so that after the frequent reboots of the PC, I can reconnect to >> the existing sessions on VMS and then just run a script or program to >> fix the titles. >> >> Ideally I would want to identify the terminal emulator in use so that I >> can have one script work for what ever is in use. >> > > Properly written terminal emulators will respond correctly to > set terminal/inquire, which should fix the real problem you seem to > be up against. Set Term/Inquire does not know about many of the terminal emulators out there, and does not probe for the many of the capabilities. Many of the terminal emulators are configured by default or by their users to lie about what they really are. -John wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Only ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 21:43:11 GMT From: VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: SOT: (somewhat off topic) driver for LK250 keyboard Message-ID: Several years ago, I did a stint on-site for a company that had no real VT terminals. I had to use an emulator on one of those 'Redmond' boxes. I obtained an LK250 keyboard because it couldn't stand not being able to delete character in EDT on the PeeCee keyboard. There was a _driver_ on a 3.5" floppy that needed to be installed to use the LK250. I no longer know where this is. I may have need to use this keyboard again. Does anyone here have this driver? IIRC, the driver worked on Weendoze 95/98 and 2K. -- VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" http://tmesis.com/drat.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 22:18:53 GMT From: "John E. Malmberg" Subject: Re: SOT: (somewhat off topic) driver for LK250 keyboard Message-ID: VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: > Several years ago, I did a stint on-site for a company that had no real > VT terminals. I had to use an emulator on one of those 'Redmond' boxes. > I obtained an LK250 keyboard because it couldn't stand not being able to > delete character in EDT on the PeeCee keyboard. There was a _driver_ on > a 3.5" floppy that needed to be installed to use the LK250. I no longer > know where this is. > I may have need to use this keyboard again. Does anyone here have this > driver? IIRC, the driver worked on Weendoze 95/98 and 2K. The scan codes for the "delete" keys are the same on both, so I do not see why you needed a different driver for them. I just plug the same LK keyboards from my Alpha into the PC, and they just worked. The extra keys were ignored by PC applications, except by Powerterm, which recognized them. It appeared that there might have been a driver from Reflection to use the extra keys with their emulators. I could not find it for download for Windows XP. The differences that I can see between the current PC keyboards and the VMS LK keyboards is that the VMS LK keyboards have some extra keys which are ignored by PCs, and the VMS keyboards are missing the indicator for NUM-LOCK. I posted an article on Encompasserve about my using an LK keyboard on an KVM between a PC and a DS10, and listed how to map the keys. None of the other members of my family realized that I had put a non-PC keyboard on the device. Currently I am using a Logitech G11 keyboard on the PC. It has 18 keys that can be programmed on a per application to send any keystroke combination. So now I can have all the LK keys with any terminal emulator. -John wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Only ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 23:50:19 GMT From: Roger Ivie Subject: Re: SOT: (somewhat off topic) driver for LK250 keyboard Message-ID: On 2008-01-06, John E. Malmberg wrote: > VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: >> Several years ago, I did a stint on-site for a company that had no real >> VT terminals. I had to use an emulator on one of those 'Redmond' boxes. >> I obtained an LK250 keyboard because it couldn't stand not being able to >> delete character in EDT on the PeeCee keyboard. > > The scan codes for the "delete" keys are the same on both, so I do not > see why you needed a different driver for them. He's talking about delete character, which is the extra key in the keypad. > It appeared that there might have been a driver from Reflection to use > the extra keys with their emulators. I could not find it for download > for Windows XP. http://www.laca.org/Usergroups/Fiscal/lk450_keyboard_XP.html Found by googling lk450 xp. -- roger ivie rivie@ridgenet.net ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2008 00:47:53 GMT From: VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: Re: SOT: (somewhat off topic) driver for LK250 keyboard Message-ID: In article , "John E. Malmberg" writes: > > >VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: >> Several years ago, I did a stint on-site for a company that had no real >> VT terminals. I had to use an emulator on one of those 'Redmond' boxes. >> I obtained an LK250 keyboard because it couldn't stand not being able to >> delete character in EDT on the PeeCee keyboard. There was a _driver_ on >> a 3.5" floppy that needed to be installed to use the LK250. I no longer >> know where this is. > >> I may have need to use this keyboard again. Does anyone here have this >> driver? IIRC, the driver worked on Weendoze 95/98 and 2K. > >The scan codes for the "delete" keys are the same on both, so I do not >see why you needed a different driver for them. > >I just plug the same LK keyboards from my Alpha into the PC, and they >just worked. The extra keys were ignored by PC applications, except by >Powerterm, which recognized them. > >It appeared that there might have been a driver from Reflection to use >the extra keys with their emulators. I could not find it for download >for Windows XP. > >The differences that I can see between the current PC keyboards and the >VMS LK keyboards is that the VMS LK keyboards have some extra keys which >are ignored by PCs, and the VMS keyboards are missing the indicator for >NUM-LOCK. > >I posted an article on Encompasserve about my using an LK keyboard on an >KVM between a PC and a DS10, and listed how to map the keys. > >None of the other members of my family realized that I had put a non-PC >keyboard on the device. > >Currently I am using a Logitech G11 keyboard on the PC. It has 18 keys >that can be programmed on a per application to send any keystroke >combination. So now I can have all the LK keys with any terminal emulator. Well, this particular PeeCee had PowerTerm and Reflection installed. With PowerTerm, I would get digits when pressing the arrow keys and the 'gold' key always output and escape. The [,] would delete a charater in EDT but 'gold' [,] would output [Ol. The Ol is correct but not useful when the 'gold' [PF1] does not first output [OP. I found a CD in my stash of polycarbonate with KEAterm. It has drivers for the LK250, LK411, LK461. I can't seem to make the LK250 function; however, the LK410 from my VT425 works fine. I'd rather the LK250 work -- freeing up my LK411 for use with the VT425. -- VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" http://tmesis.com/drat.html ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2008 00:53:55 GMT From: VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: Re: SOT: (somewhat off topic) driver for LK250 keyboard Message-ID: In article , Roger Ivie writes: > > >On 2008-01-06, John E. Malmberg wrote: >> VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: >>> Several years ago, I did a stint on-site for a company that had no real >>> VT terminals. I had to use an emulator on one of those 'Redmond' boxes. >>> I obtained an LK250 keyboard because it couldn't stand not being able to >>> delete character in EDT on the PeeCee keyboard. >> >> The scan codes for the "delete" keys are the same on both, so I do not >> see why you needed a different driver for them. > >He's talking about delete character, which is the extra key in the >keypad. Extra? There's no _extra_ delete key in my keypad. The > It appeared that there might have been a driver from Reflection to use >> the extra keys with their emulators. I could not find it for download >> for Windows XP. > >http://www.laca.org/Usergroups/Fiscal/lk450_keyboard_XP.html I have an LK250. Drivers for the LK450 do not work with it; thought, I wish that they would. -- VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" http://tmesis.com/drat.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 20:10:58 -0500 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: SOT: (somewhat off topic) driver for LK250 keyboard Message-ID: <47817cb8$0$4332$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com> VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: > Extra? There's no _extra_ delete key in my keypad. The however, functions. It's the alternate keypad that is problematic. When I had to buy a Compaq keyboard for the DS10L, I couldn't find a french canadian with ALL-IN-1 mnemonics on the keys. So I kept a real LK201 with the proper keycaps nearby I could look at when I needed to find whcih key did what I needed. Now, I am on a mac and it is hopeless to get the keyboard to work properly. (So on an ALL-in-1 menu, I've learned to type OP for the gold key and then the appropriate key (K to get to previous menu instead of PF10). I've pondered about this issue and I am starting to come to the conclusion that I shouldn't be wasting time to get the mac keyboard to emulate an LK201 and I should instead simply learn to live with the mac keyboard mentality and get used to it. AKA: instead of finding the MAC to be different, I should accept that the MAC one is the correct one and the old LK layout is the one that is different. Even if I still vastly prefer the LK layout (especially the SELECT key), in the end, since there is no future for this layout, is there really a point in fighting to get other keyboards to emulate it ? ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 20:06:35 -0600 From: David J Dachtera Subject: Re: SOT: (somewhat off topic) driver for LK250 keyboard Message-ID: <4781892B.F317A192@spam.comcast.net> JF Mezei wrote: > > VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: > > > Extra? There's no _extra_ delete key in my keypad. The > however, functions. It's the alternate keypad that is problematic. > > When I had to buy a Compaq keyboard for the DS10L, I couldn't find a > french canadian with ALL-IN-1 mnemonics on the keys. So I kept a real > LK201 with the proper keycaps nearby I could look at when I needed to > find whcih key did what I needed. > > Now, I am on a mac and it is hopeless to get the keyboard to work > properly. (So on an ALL-in-1 menu, I've learned to type OP for the > gold key and then the appropriate key (K to get to previous menu instead > of PF10). Search for a Mac version of Reflection. That might be helpful, I think. > I've pondered about this issue and I am starting to come to the > conclusion that I shouldn't be wasting time to get the mac keyboard to > emulate an LK201 and I should instead simply learn to live with the mac > keyboard mentality and get used to it. > > AKA: instead of finding the MAC to be different, I should accept that > the MAC one is the correct one and the old LK layout is the one that is > different. There never was a "standard" terminal keyboard, and every vendor from Hazeltine to Adds had their own special things. In PC-land, the 102-key keyboard became the more-or-less "gold" standard prior to the rise of W/9x and successors when the additional Windows keys appeared. I still use a 102-key DEC PCXAL-AA here on my Thinkpad and get spoiled going back to work. I also have a Honeywell 102-key that is very much like this one. It's taken me a while to get used to PC keyboards with Reflection, but once you get it, its not so bad. Like VAXman, I must remember that EDT's "DEL CHAR" key is the ALT+KP+ key. > Even if I still vastly prefer the LK layout (especially the SELECT key), > in the end, since there is no future for this layout, is there really a > point in fighting to get other keyboards to emulate it ? That depends on your terminal program and its default keyboard mapping. David J Dachtera DJE Systems ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 15:34:15 -0500 From: JF Mezei Subject: Support for ODS-2 disks on OS-X ? Message-ID: <47813bd0$0$28239$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com> Does anyone know if there are plug-ins/whatever that would allow OS-X to read the VMS documentation and layered products CDs ? I assume those CDs are in ODS-2 format. I realise that the MAC wouldn't be able to do much with those files, bu it could serve then via NFS or FTP to those who still need access to them. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 15:58:06 -0500 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" Subject: Re: Support for ODS-2 disks on OS-X ? Message-ID: <478140DE.1010501@comcast.net> JF Mezei wrote: > Does anyone know if there are plug-ins/whatever that would allow OS-X to > read the VMS documentation and layered products CDs ? > > I assume those CDs are in ODS-2 format. > > I realise that the MAC wouldn't be able to do much with those files, bu > it could serve then via NFS or FTP to those who still need access to them. The ODS-2 specification is available. You could write your own if noone else has. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2008 21:56:03 +0000 (UTC) From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk Subject: Re: Support for ODS-2 disks on OS-X ? Message-ID: In article <478140DE.1010501@comcast.net>, "Richard B. Gilbert" writes: >JF Mezei wrote: >> Does anyone know if there are plug-ins/whatever that would allow OS-X to >> read the VMS documentation and layered products CDs ? >> >> I assume those CDs are in ODS-2 format. >> >> I realise that the MAC wouldn't be able to do much with those files, bu >> it could serve then via NFS or FTP to those who still need access to them. > >The ODS-2 specification is available. You could write your own if noone >else has. > The online documentation CDs have been available in bookreader format on Windows readable CDs for years - together with a Microsoft Windows version of the bookreader program. Later releases came on ISO 9660 level 2 (ODL-ISO) compliant CD-ROM that could be read from both Microsoft Windows and HP OpenVMS platforms and contained newer material in HTML and PDF format as well as archived material in bookreader format. I have one such CD sitting in front of me here :- HP OpenVMS layered Products Online Documentation Library for HP OpenVMS Alpha Servers and Microsoft Windows Platforms September 2006 If you are stuck with ODS-2 format CDs then you would be better off serving them from a VMS system but if you must do it from the Mac then you could see whether you could port any of the ODS2 tools from http://www.vms2linux.de/ods2.html to OS-X unfortunately according to http://www.vms2linux.de/ods2fs.html only the binaries are currently available for download for linux version of the ods2 filesystem so you will probably need to mail the address at the bottom of that page and see whether you could get the sources from the author. David Webb Security team leader CCSS Middlesex University ------------------------------ Date: 7 Jan 2008 05:01:46 GMT From: "David Weatherall" Subject: Re: Support for ODS-2 disks on OS-X ? Message-ID: <5udq1qF1e2o47U1@mid.individual.net> JF Mezei wrote: > Does anyone know if there are plug-ins/whatever that would allow OS-X > to read the VMS documentation and layered products CDs ? > > I assume those CDs are in ODS-2 format. > > I realise that the MAC wouldn't be able to do much with those files, > bu it could serve then via NFS or FTP to those who still need access > to them. JF The ODS2 reader from Hunter's website includes sources. It's set up primarily for Dos/Windows and requires ASPI support from the OS (IIRC). How easy it would be to port to Mac, I've no idea but it could provide another starting point/point of view to the Linux one you've been referred to. Cheers - Dave -- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 20:57:54 -0500 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: this declaration may not have extern "C" linkage while porting C++ C++C++ Message-ID: <4781871c$0$90266$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> Bob Koehler wrote: > In article , writetosanjesh@gmail.com writes: >> Im porting a source code base from sunos to HP-UX. While compiling >> some sources, Im getting the errors like > > Which is relavent to VMS why? Not. But if you think HP-UX and VMS are approx. the same because both come from HP, then getting C++ to compiler may be a tough job ... Arne ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 06 Jan 2008 19:45:16 -0600 From: David J Dachtera Subject: Re: VMS job going in Perth Message-ID: <4781842B.D5567A0C@spam.comcast.net> Richard Maher wrote: > > Hi, > > http://it.seek.com.au/users/apply/index.ascx?Sequence=93&PageNumber=1&JobID=11440487 Obsolete website: "We are unable to complete your request as your browser is not set up to accept cookies. For information on adjusting your settings, please ." David J Dachtera DJE Systems ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2008.013 ************************