INFO-VAX Tue, 12 Aug 2008 Volume 2008 : Issue 439 Contents: Re: CD written on Alpha won't mount on Integrity DVD ROM Re: DEFCON 16 and Hacking OpenVMS Re: DEFCON 16 and Hacking OpenVMS Re: DEFCON 16 and Hacking OpenVMS Re: DEFCON 16 and Hacking OpenVMS Re: DEFCON 16 and Hacking OpenVMS Re: DEFCON 16 and Hacking OpenVMS Re: DEFCON 16 and Hacking OpenVMS Re: Memory Usage Re: Memory Usage RE: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, Britain from Above, 10/ Re: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, Britain from Above, 10/ Re: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, Britain from Above, 10/ Re: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, Britain from Above, 10/ Re: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, Britain from Above, 10/ Re: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, Britain from Above, 10 Re: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, Britain from Above, 10 Re: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, Britain from Above, 10/ Re: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, Britain from Above, 10/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 12 Aug 2008 07:48:28 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Message-ID: Just realised this, the help under monitor monitor /ending: "Observe the syntax rules for time values described in the DCL Help topic SPECIFY." But going back to about VMS 6, that help was moved to Help topic DCL_hints. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 10:59:51 +0200 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: CD written on Alpha won't mount on Integrity DVD ROM Message-ID: In article , Jose Baars wrote: > > > > What other media are people using (I am using RITEK (=TRAXDATA among > > other brands) > > > > I didn't use DVD's but I have used Imation CD's without a lot of > success, the CD-RW was a Philips one. > The r+ and r- discussion was only for DVD's wasn't it? > If I find the time I'll try a TDK color CD tomorrow, that'll make a > nicer coaster anyway :-) > Jose I had a bad experience with Imation CDs a couple of years ago, and went a-Googling to find recommendations. Verbatim Datalife and Datalife Plus came up regularly in terms of success in both burning and reading on a variety of drives. May I suggest asking on a forum or newsgroup specializing in CD & DVD technology? -- Paul Sture ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 01:01:55 -0500 From: patrick jankowiak Subject: Re: DEFCON 16 and Hacking OpenVMS Message-ID: William Webb wrote: > > > On Mon, Aug 11, 2008 at 10:47 PM, patrick jankowiak > wrote: > > I guess they are still "challenged" by the "rout of '01", delivered > handily by OpenVMS on Alpha courtesy of The Wiz, Coremac, and Opcom; > the legend of which is chronicled here: > http://www.bunkerofdoom.com/defcon/defcon9.html > > -or maybe they forgot about it and this is completely new. > The rules of the 'game' were changed forever. But never mind; > > > > By the time I saw it, it was too late to get in the truck and drive > to the DEFCON by myself. > > Patrick J. > > > Mark Daniel wrote: > > http://www.defcon.org/html/defcon-16/dc-16-speakers.html#Oberg > > is due to be presented this Sunday, Aug 10th 2008 > > > Hi, Pat- > > Good to see you posting. "What I Did On My Summer Vacation" is one of > the funniest VMS stories I've ever heard, and I've heard some Real Funny > Ones at "Magic Night" at the last two bootcamps. > > WWWebb Hi William, Thank you and I guess I need to show up to the party from time to time. I guess I sort of navigated past the edge of the known world, and found more worlds and adventures to explore. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 06:58:40 -0700 (PDT) From: sampsal@gmail.com Subject: Re: DEFCON 16 and Hacking OpenVMS Message-ID: <6419afac-bb99-4d7d-b61c-2e29234dfb26@z72g2000hsb.googlegroups.com> Guys, I just finished reading the presenation slides from DEFCON and fortunately it doesn't to be anything earth-shattering, two exploits are described: 1. A format string vulnerability in the FINGER client (VAX only). The example shellcode is stored on a remote system's .plan file and forces the victim FINGER client to modify SYSUAF. 2. A CLI buffer overflow on Alphas. Basically any input over 511 characters causes an overflow, it seems to be possible to have a privileged process execute arbitrary code. Anyway, this is from a 10 minute reading of the slides, I might have missed something, but the important thing (IMHO) is that neither of these exploits are possible from remote but require a malicious user to already have an account on the targeted system. Sampsa ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 14:49:51 +0000 (UTC) From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk Subject: Re: DEFCON 16 and Hacking OpenVMS Message-ID: In article <6419afac-bb99-4d7d-b61c-2e29234dfb26@z72g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>, sampsal@gmail.com writes: >Guys, > >I just finished reading the presenation slides from DEFCON and >fortunately it doesn't to be anything earth-shattering, two exploits >are described: > >1. A format string vulnerability in the FINGER client (VAX only). The >example shellcode is stored on a remote system's .plan file and forces >the victim FINGER client to modify SYSUAF. > Is this with DEC TCPIP services or is it something to do with the Multinet finger vulnerability ? see http://www.multinet.process.com/scripts/eco/eco_tlb.com?FINGER-010_A052 >2. A CLI buffer overflow on Alphas. Basically any input over 511 >characters causes an overflow, it seems to be possible to have a >privileged process execute arbitrary code. > Can you explain this one in a bit more detail ? Is this an attack against DCL itself, images installed with privileges or something else ? David Webb Security team leader CCSS Middlesex University >Anyway, this is from a 10 minute reading of the slides, I might have >missed something, but the important thing (IMHO) is that neither of >these exploits are possible from remote but require a malicious user >to already have an account on the targeted system. > >Sampsa > > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 08:27:47 -0700 (PDT) From: sampsal@gmail.com Subject: Re: DEFCON 16 and Hacking OpenVMS Message-ID: <06e883fe-9af0-4665-8956-b87216b18f80@w7g2000hsa.googlegroups.com> > >1. A format string vulnerability in the FINGER client (VAX only). The > >example shellcode is stored on a remote system's .plan file and forces > >the victim FINGER client to modify SYSUAF. > > Is this with DEC TCPIP services or is it something to do with the > Multinet finger vulnerability ? It appears to be something separate, since it seems to have to do with a format string vulnerability. Basically someone puts a bunch of % strings and shellcode in their .plan on a remote host, fingers that user from the target host, and the FINGER client executes the shellcode due to the format string vulnerability in the client. > >2. A CLI buffer overflow on Alphas. Basically any input over 511 > >characters causes an overflow, it seems to be possible to have a > >privileged process execute arbitrary code. > > Can you explain this one in a bit more detail ? > Is this an attack against DCL itself, images installed with privileges > or something else ? I think this might be a DCL issue, it seems to work across a number of different images. Not had a chance to play with this as my own VMS box is down at the moment. Sampsa ------------------------------ Date: 12 Aug 2008 11:58:47 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: DEFCON 16 and Hacking OpenVMS Message-ID: In article <6419afac-bb99-4d7d-b61c-2e29234dfb26@z72g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>, sampsal@gmail.com writes: > Guys, > > 1. A format string vulnerability in the FINGER client (VAX only). The > example shellcode is stored on a remote system's .plan file and forces > the victim FINGER client to modify SYSUAF. Do they say which finger client? HPs? ------------------------------ Date: 12 Aug 2008 12:00:02 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: DEFCON 16 and Hacking OpenVMS Message-ID: <1AWNucr6PqYj@eisner.encompasserve.org> In article <6419afac-bb99-4d7d-b61c-2e29234dfb26@z72g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>, sampsal@gmail.com writes: > Guys, > > I just finished reading the presenation slides from DEFCON and > fortunately it doesn't to be anything earth-shattering, two exploits > are described: Are these publically available? (If there is anything in them, I'd like to review my systems). ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 10:26:13 -0700 (PDT) From: sampsal@gmail.com Subject: Re: DEFCON 16 and Hacking OpenVMS Message-ID: On Aug 12, 6:00=A0pm, koeh...@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) wrote: > In article <6419afac-bb99-4d7d-b61c-2e29234df...@z72g2000hsb.googlegroups= .com>, samp...@gmail.com writes: > > > Guys, > > > I just finished reading the presenation slides from DEFCON and > > fortunately it doesn't to be anything earth-shattering, two exploits > > are described: > > =A0 =A0Are these publically available? =A0(If there is anything in them, = I'd > =A0 =A0like to review my systems). I got them from a friend who's colleague was at DEFCON - I don't know what the distribution/copyright issues are with the document so I daren't host them on my web page. Sampsa ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 03:18:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Bob Gezelter Subject: Re: Memory Usage Message-ID: On Aug 11, 2:52 pm, "James J. O'Shea" wrote: > What is the best way to find out memory usage on an > OpenVMS machine? > > I'm currently using f$getsiy("free_pages") but was > wondering if I could use the MONITOR tool to record a > works worth of data. What command would I use in > that case? > > Thanks, > Jim O'Shea > Chicago, IL Jim, I would also recommend using the T4 package. The CPU related portions of the data recorded are recorded using MONITOR/RECORD. However, it is easier to capture the entire suite of data using the pre-packaged T4 command procedures, and then analyze it with the tools, than it is to piece it together yourself. - Bob Gezelter, http://www.rlgsc.com ------------------------------ Date: 12 Aug 2008 07:42:28 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Memory Usage Message-ID: <6LoCQS8QC+vw@eisner.encompasserve.org> In article <879084.47854.qm@web83904.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>, "James J. O'Shea" writes: > What is the best way to find out memory usage on an > OpenVMS machine? > > I'm currently using f$getsiy("free_pages") but was > wondering if I could use the MONITOR tool to record a > works worth of data. What command would I use in > that case? monitor memory/record/interval=you-pick-it/ending=you-pick-it I do the similar to the above either as a 24 hour self-resubmiting batch job, with the ending as midnight, or as a detached process started during system boot. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 13:03:18 +0000 From: "Main, Kerry" Subject: RE: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, Britain from Above, 10/ Message-ID: -----Original Message----- > From: AEF [mailto:spamsink2001@yahoo.com] > Sent: August 12, 2008 8:14 AM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com > Subject: Re: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, > Britain from Above, 10/08/08 Above, 10/08/08 Above, 10/08/08 > > On Aug 12, 4:20 am, maxoutr...@gmail.com wrote: > > This might not be too well known or in the media but over 50% of > > mobile text messages sent in the world are on OpenVMS systems. > > > > --Peter. > > On Aug 11, 12:04 am, urbancamo wrote: > > > > > Spotted an LK201 and an LK401 at the console of the controller at > the > > > National Grid Control Centre in the programme 'Britain From Above' > > > broadcast on BBC1 in the UK on 10/08/08. > > > > > The National Grid Control Centre is responsible for providing the > UK's > > > electricity supply. The programme focussed on the unique problem in > > > the UK of supplying the peak demands of power required after > > > mainstream TV programmes such as East Enders. The controller had > > > direct influence at an instant over several hydroelectric power > plants > > > dotted round the UK that are solely used for providing temporary > extra > > > power to satisfy peak demand. The controller monitored a display > > > showing the mains frequency which required action when it dropped > to > > > 49.8 Hz - the normal in the UK being 50 Hz. > > > > > I found it absolutely fascinating that hydroelectric dams are > opened > > > temporarily because East Enders has finished and a large portion of > > > the UK public are making a brew! > > > > > OpenVMS was not mentioned in the programme but it can be assumed > that > > > it is used in some major capacity at the control centre. > > > > > Can anyone provide more details? > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Mark. > > Hi, > > I'm not challenging your claim, but it would be great if you could > provide a reference for this. > > Thanks! > > AEF PDF Testimonial: http://h71028.www7.hp.com/ERC/downloads/4AA1-7999ENW.pdf ""We built our SMS service on top of HP BladeSystem and the HP OpenVMS operating system because of the high availability and clustering capabilities of the solution. We've been able to scale our system to become an industry leader while providing continuous service to our customers." -Steven van Zeanen, Vice President of Marketing, Acision Video Testimonial: http://tinyurl.com/6ybkgg - translates to:(beware wraps) http://hp.feedroom.com/?fr_story=3Df155197e00e8a915606b1eedddd2008298621394= &rf=3Dbm Regards Kerry Main Senior Consultant HP Services Canada Voice: 613-254-8911 Fax: 613-591-4477 kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT) OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works. Regards ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 01:20:50 -0700 (PDT) From: maxoutrage@gmail.com Subject: Re: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, Britain from Above, 10/ Message-ID: <4578da0b-54de-4823-974d-3cd03f546fa9@2g2000hsn.googlegroups.com> This might not be too well known or in the media but over 50% of mobile text messages sent in the world are on OpenVMS systems. --Peter. On Aug 11, 12:04 am, urbancamo wrote: > Spotted an LK201 and an LK401 at the console of the controller at the > National Grid Control Centre in the programme 'Britain From Above' > broadcast on BBC1 in the UK on 10/08/08. > > The National Grid Control Centre is responsible for providing the UK's > electricity supply. The programme focussed on the unique problem in > the UK of supplying the peak demands of power required after > mainstream TV programmes such as East Enders. The controller had > direct influence at an instant over several hydroelectric power plants > dotted round the UK that are solely used for providing temporary extra > power to satisfy peak demand. The controller monitored a display > showing the mains frequency which required action when it dropped to > 49.8 Hz - the normal in the UK being 50 Hz. > > I found it absolutely fascinating that hydroelectric dams are opened > temporarily because East Enders has finished and a large portion of > the UK public are making a brew! > > OpenVMS was not mentioned in the programme but it can be assumed that > it is used in some major capacity at the control centre. > > Can anyone provide more details? > > Regards, > > Mark. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 05:13:54 -0700 (PDT) From: AEF Subject: Re: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, Britain from Above, 10/ Message-ID: On Aug 12, 4:20 am, maxoutr...@gmail.com wrote: > This might not be too well known or in the media but over 50% of > mobile text messages sent in the world are on OpenVMS systems. > > --Peter. > On Aug 11, 12:04 am, urbancamo wrote: > > > Spotted an LK201 and an LK401 at the console of the controller at the > > National Grid Control Centre in the programme 'Britain From Above' > > broadcast on BBC1 in the UK on 10/08/08. > > > The National Grid Control Centre is responsible for providing the UK's > > electricity supply. The programme focussed on the unique problem in > > the UK of supplying the peak demands of power required after > > mainstream TV programmes such as East Enders. The controller had > > direct influence at an instant over several hydroelectric power plants > > dotted round the UK that are solely used for providing temporary extra > > power to satisfy peak demand. The controller monitored a display > > showing the mains frequency which required action when it dropped to > > 49.8 Hz - the normal in the UK being 50 Hz. > > > I found it absolutely fascinating that hydroelectric dams are opened > > temporarily because East Enders has finished and a large portion of > > the UK public are making a brew! > > > OpenVMS was not mentioned in the programme but it can be assumed that > > it is used in some major capacity at the control centre. > > > Can anyone provide more details? > > > Regards, > > > Mark. Hi, I'm not challenging your claim, but it would be great if you could provide a reference for this. Thanks! AEF ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 06:55:09 -0700 (PDT) From: johnwallace4@yahoo.co.uk Subject: Re: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, Britain from Above, 10/ Message-ID: <789fb2a3-6bae-4ef5-8c94-d9bdf683ddfe@f63g2000hsf.googlegroups.com> On Aug 12, 2:08 pm, "Tom Linden" wrote: > On Tue, 12 Aug 2008 05:13:54 -0700, AEF wrote: > > On Aug 12, 4:20 am, maxoutr...@gmail.com wrote: > >> This might not be too well known or in the media but over 50% of > >> mobile text messages sent in the world are on OpenVMS systems. > > >> --Peter. > >> On Aug 11, 12:04 am, urbancamo wrote: > > >> > Spotted an LK201 and an LK401 at the console of the controller at the > >> > National Grid Control Centre in the programme 'Britain From Above' > >> > broadcast on BBC1 in the UK on 10/08/08. > > >> > The National Grid Control Centre is responsible for providing the UK's > >> > electricity supply. The programme focussed on the unique problem in > >> > the UK of supplying the peak demands of power required after > >> > mainstream TV programmes such as East Enders. The controller had > >> > direct influence at an instant over several hydroelectric power plants > >> > dotted round the UK that are solely used for providing temporary extra > >> > power to satisfy peak demand. The controller monitored a display > >> > showing the mains frequency which required action when it dropped to > >> > 49.8 Hz - the normal in the UK being 50 Hz. > > >> > I found it absolutely fascinating that hydroelectric dams are opened > >> > temporarily because East Enders has finished and a large portion of > >> > the UK public are making a brew! > > >> > OpenVMS was not mentioned in the programme but it can be assumed that > >> > it is used in some major capacity at the control centre. > > >> > Can anyone provide more details? > > >> > Regards, > > >> > Mark. > > > Hi, > > > I'm not challenging your claim, but it would be great if you could > > provide a reference for this. > > > Thanks! > > > AEF > > I use Verizon as my outgoing SMTP and I have been having troubles with it > for > about a month. It becomes unavailable and then it also has troubles with > authentication. I would imagine these are also used for texting. I wonder > what they are using? > > -- > PL/I for OpenVMSwww.kednos.com The systems a cellphone operator would use for SMS (text messages) are entirely unrelated (in software terms) to what they would use for SMTP. Aiui, VMS's role in the SMS picture dates back to the days when Logica picked VMS as the underlying platform for their SMS service centre package. In those days, Logica (and thus VMS) would have had not far off 100% ownership of that market. Times change though, and Logica have changed hands and the new owners have sold off that part of the business (including the Telepath product), because it has become commoditised (presumably commodity = Windows/Linux). http://news.zdnet.co.uk/communications/0,1000000085,39286015,00.htm ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 07:00:13 -0700 (PDT) From: johnwallace4@yahoo.co.uk Subject: Re: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, Britain from Above, 10/ Message-ID: <74d26dd0-d9b9-471c-9432-dd3ba2a999b7@v57g2000hse.googlegroups.com> On Aug 12, 2:03 pm, "Main, Kerry" wrote: > -----Original Message----- > > From: AEF [mailto:spamsink2...@yahoo.com] > > Sent: August 12, 2008 8:14 AM > > To: Info-...@Mvb.Saic.Com > > Subject: Re: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, > > Britain from Above, 10/08/08 Above, 10/08/08 Above, 10/08/08 > > > On Aug 12, 4:20 am, maxoutr...@gmail.com wrote: > > > This might not be too well known or in the media but over 50% of > > > mobile text messages sent in the world are on OpenVMS systems. > > > > --Peter. > > > On Aug 11, 12:04 am, urbancamo wrote: > > > > > Spotted an LK201 and an LK401 at the console of the controller at > > the > > > > National Grid Control Centre in the programme 'Britain From Above' > > > > broadcast on BBC1 in the UK on 10/08/08. > > > > > The National Grid Control Centre is responsible for providing the > > UK's > > > > electricity supply. The programme focussed on the unique problem in > > > > the UK of supplying the peak demands of power required after > > > > mainstream TV programmes such as East Enders. The controller had > > > > direct influence at an instant over several hydroelectric power > > plants > > > > dotted round the UK that are solely used for providing temporary > > extra > > > > power to satisfy peak demand. The controller monitored a display > > > > showing the mains frequency which required action when it dropped > > to > > > > 49.8 Hz - the normal in the UK being 50 Hz. > > > > > I found it absolutely fascinating that hydroelectric dams are > > opened > > > > temporarily because East Enders has finished and a large portion of > > > > the UK public are making a brew! > > > > > OpenVMS was not mentioned in the programme but it can be assumed > > that > > > > it is used in some major capacity at the control centre. > > > > > Can anyone provide more details? > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Mark. > > > Hi, > > > I'm not challenging your claim, but it would be great if you could > > provide a reference for this. > > > Thanks! > > > AEF > > PDF Testimonial:http://h71028.www7.hp.com/ERC/downloads/4AA1-7999ENW.pdf > ""We built our SMS service on top of HP BladeSystem and the HP > OpenVMS operating system because of the high availability and > clustering capabilities of the solution. We've been able to scale > our system to become an industry leader while providing continuous > service to our customers." > > -Steven van Zeanen, Vice President of Marketing, Acision > > Video Testimonial:http://tinyurl.com/6ybkgg- translates to:(beware wraps)http://hp.feedroom.com/?fr_story=f155197e00e8a915606b1eedddd200829862... > > Regards > > Kerry Main > Senior Consultant > HP Services Canada > Voice: 613-254-8911 > Fax: 613-591-4477 > kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom > (remove the DOT's and AT) > > OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works. > > Regards Acision is the new name for the former Logica Telecoms organisation, which is something I should have mentioned in my post a few minutes ago when I mentioned Logica. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 18:29:54 +0100 From: Ashley Shepherd Subject: Re: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, Britain from Above, 10 Message-ID: Where to start? I worked for a regional electricity company in the 90's. Everything technical was based on VMS, all the inter-company and national grid billing, all of the planning and strategy of supply & demand, and of course the control of the ENTIRE grid network was managed by....... PDP11's. And old ones at that. The year 2K planning was interesting, when I said "are these Y2K compliant" there was just silence. When I pushed it was a case of "well, the programs were written 20-30 years ago, nothing was documented and we suspect all the programmers have died of old age, certainly we know of none of them. All we know is that it all works, even though we don't know how. If your can boil your kettle on New Years Day, you'll know everything was Y2K compliant!" It was a classic case of "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" As for today, I suspect VMS is still embedded in the electricity companies, for the very same reason it was chosen. In 5 years (except for when an over zealous system admin typed DEL *.* whilst in SYS$SYSTEM and ensured that 2,000 users had an extra half-day holiday), we never had a single day of unplanned downtime of any application. Regarding the SMS systems, I also worked for a mobile company, and VMS is indeed embedded in those organisations too. As with most companies, there is an edict that VMS is "non strategic" and that it needs to be replaced, but when you get down to it, nothing else can touch the reliability and scalability of VMS IMHO, if Ken Olson had the vision to release prior versions of VMS as open source, we would see VMS everywhere that we now see Unix and Linux. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 13:51:01 -0400 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" Subject: Re: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, Britain from Above, 10 Message-ID: <0uKdnT1Qz677UzzVnZ2dnUVZ_iydnZ2d@comcast.com> Ashley Shepherd wrote: > Where to start? > > I worked for a regional electricity company in the 90's. Everything > technical was based on VMS, all the inter-company and national grid > billing, all of the planning and strategy of supply & demand, and of > course the control of the ENTIRE grid network was managed by....... > PDP11's. And old ones at that. The year 2K planning was interesting, > when I said "are these Y2K compliant" there was just silence. When I > pushed it was a case of "well, the programs were written 20-30 years > ago, nothing was documented and we suspect all the programmers have > died of old age, certainly we know of none of them. All we know is > that it all works, even though we don't know how. If your can boil > your kettle on New Years Day, you'll know everything was Y2K > compliant!" It was a classic case of "if it ain't broke, don't fix > it" > > As for today, I suspect VMS is still embedded in the electricity > companies, for the very same reason it was chosen. In 5 years (except > for when an over zealous system admin typed DEL *.* whilst in > SYS$SYSTEM and ensured that 2,000 users had an extra half-day > holiday), we never had a single day of unplanned downtime of any > application. > > Regarding the SMS systems, I also worked for a mobile company, and VMS > is indeed embedded in those organisations too. As with most > companies, there is an edict that VMS is "non strategic" and that it > needs to be replaced, but when you get down to it, nothing else can > touch the reliability and scalability of VMS > > IMHO, if Ken Olson had the vision to release prior versions of VMS as > open source, we would see VMS everywhere that we now see Unix and > Linux. Wouldn't the reliability, usability, etc. be about the same as Unix/Linux, or worse? IOW, thank God that Ken Olson did NOT release the source "as open source". ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 06:08:34 -0700 From: "Tom Linden" Subject: Re: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, Britain from Above, 10/ Message-ID: On Tue, 12 Aug 2008 05:13:54 -0700, AEF wrote: > On Aug 12, 4:20 am, maxoutr...@gmail.com wrote: >> This might not be too well known or in the media but over 50% of >> mobile text messages sent in the world are on OpenVMS systems. >> >> --Peter. >> On Aug 11, 12:04 am, urbancamo wrote: >> >> > Spotted an LK201 and an LK401 at the console of the controller at the >> > National Grid Control Centre in the programme 'Britain From Above' >> > broadcast on BBC1 in the UK on 10/08/08. >> >> > The National Grid Control Centre is responsible for providing the UK's >> > electricity supply. The programme focussed on the unique problem in >> > the UK of supplying the peak demands of power required after >> > mainstream TV programmes such as East Enders. The controller had >> > direct influence at an instant over several hydroelectric power plants >> > dotted round the UK that are solely used for providing temporary extra >> > power to satisfy peak demand. The controller monitored a display >> > showing the mains frequency which required action when it dropped to >> > 49.8 Hz - the normal in the UK being 50 Hz. >> >> > I found it absolutely fascinating that hydroelectric dams are opened >> > temporarily because East Enders has finished and a large portion of >> > the UK public are making a brew! >> >> > OpenVMS was not mentioned in the programme but it can be assumed that >> > it is used in some major capacity at the control centre. >> >> > Can anyone provide more details? >> >> > Regards, >> >> > Mark. > > Hi, > > I'm not challenging your claim, but it would be great if you could > provide a reference for this. > > Thanks! > > AEF I use Verizon as my outgoing SMTP and I have been having troubles with it for about a month. It becomes unavailable and then it also has troubles with authentication. I would imagine these are also used for texting. I wonder what they are using? -- PL/I for OpenVMS www.kednos.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2008 10:05:30 -0400 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" Subject: Re: OpenVMS in the media - National Grid Control Centre, Britain from Above, 10/ Message-ID: Tom Linden wrote: > On Tue, 12 Aug 2008 05:13:54 -0700, AEF wrote: > >> On Aug 12, 4:20 am, maxoutr...@gmail.com wrote: >>> This might not be too well known or in the media but over 50% of >>> mobile text messages sent in the world are on OpenVMS systems. >>> >>> --Peter. >>> On Aug 11, 12:04 am, urbancamo wrote: >>> >>> > Spotted an LK201 and an LK401 at the console of the controller at the >>> > National Grid Control Centre in the programme 'Britain From Above' >>> > broadcast on BBC1 in the UK on 10/08/08. >>> >>> > The National Grid Control Centre is responsible for providing the UK's >>> > electricity supply. The programme focussed on the unique problem in >>> > the UK of supplying the peak demands of power required after >>> > mainstream TV programmes such as East Enders. The controller had >>> > direct influence at an instant over several hydroelectric power plants >>> > dotted round the UK that are solely used for providing temporary extra >>> > power to satisfy peak demand. The controller monitored a display >>> > showing the mains frequency which required action when it dropped to >>> > 49.8 Hz - the normal in the UK being 50 Hz. >>> >>> > I found it absolutely fascinating that hydroelectric dams are opened >>> > temporarily because East Enders has finished and a large portion of >>> > the UK public are making a brew! >>> >>> > OpenVMS was not mentioned in the programme but it can be assumed that >>> > it is used in some major capacity at the control centre. >>> >>> > Can anyone provide more details? >>> >>> > Regards, >>> >>> > Mark. >> >> Hi, >> >> I'm not challenging your claim, but it would be great if you could >> provide a reference for this. >> >> Thanks! >> >> AEF > > I use Verizon as my outgoing SMTP and I have been having troubles with > it for > about a month. It becomes unavailable and then it also has troubles with > authentication. I would imagine these are also used for texting. I wonder > what they are using? > Probably the same thing Comcast is using! I have periodically had problems with Comcast being unable to authenticate. . . . ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2008.439 ************************